Ayn Rand is right. There is no higher state than

[Cuyo]

But that's just it, if JFK where on the Democrat ballot today he would not be electable. The Democrat party has shifted so far left these days Kennedy would be too conservative to be electable today.
Ask yourself this, would you vote JFK today? I know I would.

Are you insane?

Nope, JFK was almost as conservative as Reagan. He would in no way be elected today by the Democrat party, he would fit in more as a Republican in this day and age. Why do you ask?

Because if you think the Democratic party (yes, Democratic, 'Democrat' is not an adjective) has moved left, you must be. If anything, Republicans from Kennedy's time would be Democrats. Could Ike be a Republican in the current freak-show state of affairs in the Republican party? Probably not.

What leads you to believe JFK would be Republican? Because he cut taxes from 91% to 70%? Do you think he would advocate tax cuts now with the kind of deficits we have? Nah.

 

[sparky]

If Ayn Rand was on the titanic, she'd more than likely kick any of you overboard for your seat on a lifeboat

~S~

 

[Big Fitz]

People receiving it without paying into it makes it a socialist program. How exactly is it earned if someone receives it but never paid into it?

Socialism:

any of various social or political theories or movements in which the common welfare is to be achieved through the establishment of a socialist economic system

That's not socialism..that's charity.

So what your against is government charity.

You have just been nominated for the "Oxymoron of the Month" award for your entry "government charity."

Congratulations.

Charity is voluntary. Medicare funds are taken at gunpoint.

Government charity cannot exist because charity requires free will. Taxation is always created... ALWAYS... by force. Don't think so? Stop paying taxes.

 

[Big Fitz]

If Ayn Rand was on the titanic, she'd more than likely kick any of you overboard for your seat on a lifeboat

~S~

Actually, she'd kick out the one liable to give her the most problems. A looter and defender of slavery, like a liberal.

 

[Mustang]

a self serving state. Serving other people and a higher cause is bullshit.

Can we FINALLY call the concept of compassionate conservatism for what it was and is? It's a bullshit advertising slogan meant to soften the image of modern-day conservatives who don't really don't believe in helping anyone other than the wealthy campaign contributors who help them get elected.

One corrupting hand washes the other corrupt hand.

Blanket statement after blanket statement. Shame on you. You never profile or discriminate, right? You forgot to flush again.

Why do you think that Karl Rove and Bush cooked up the term, compassionate conservative, in the first place? It was to counter the general impression that conservatives didn't HAVE any compassion when it came to average, ordinary Americans who were not well-connected. The fact that people chose to believe it is kinda funny (not the ha ha kind) in retrospect. However, I suspect that nobody is going to fall for that again any time soon considering everything the GOP is saying and doing these days.

Yeah, see how ending Medicare works at the polls. And all this talk about withholding disaster relief is not going to win the GOP any converts.

 

[sparky]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TffW_pa2rOU&feature=player_detailpage]Ayn Rand: The Sociopathic "Heart" of the Teabaggers - YouTube[/ame]

 

[sparky]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTf6NK0wsiA&feature=player_detailpage]AYN RAND's message to AMERICA - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Greenbeard]

Having government provide any product or service is a disaster.
either the service is poor or the costs are astronomical. In the case of the VA, both results obtain.

Not only does the Veterans Health Administration score better on quality measures than virtually any other area of the American health care system (RAND, CBO), it rates considerably higher in patient satisfaction than do other payers or providers. In 2010, the VHA had an American Consumer Satisfaction Index score of 85 for inpatients at VA medical centers and 82 for outpatients at VA clinics. Hospitals nationwide had a rating of 73 that year and health insurance also had a rating of 73 (the highest scoring individual big name insurer, Blue Cross and Blue Shield, scored a 70).

Regarding their costs, that CBO report cites research showing that "if the federal government had tried to buy from providers in the private sector the same array of services and products delivered to veterans by the VHA in 1999, the cost to taxpayers would have been $3 billion more in that year. (That higher cost represents an increase of about 17 percent over VHA’s total budget of $18 billion for that year.)"

Indeed, the VHA's cost growth has been relatively tame compared to the rest of the health system:

"Adjusting for the changing mix of patients (using data on reliance and relative costs by priority group), CBO estimates that VHA’s budget authority per enrollee grew by 30 percent in nominal terms from 1999 to 2007. Although that estimate is not as low as the growth rate suggested by the unadjusted figures, it still indicates a substantial degree of cost control when compared with Medicare’s nominal rate of growth in costs per capita over that same period."​

For comparison, private insurance premiums grew by an average of more than 9 percent per year over that 8-year period (and national health expenditures grew by more than 7 percent per year).

Let me reiterate that: the VHA is associated with higher quality, higher customer satisfaction scores, and lower cost growth than the rest of the American health sector. They also remain ahead of the game on factors like care integration and use of electronic health records.

Perhaps the only practical solution is for the government to agree to pay a certain amount towards a veteran's premiums, like $7000/annum. Anything else is probably doomed to failure.

Again, practical solution to what? To repeat what I asked in my last post, what's the point of this exercise--what exactly are you trying to achieve by ending the VHA?

 

[Big Fitz]

Ayn Rand: The Sociopathic "Heart" of the Teabaggers - YouTube

I see. You don't endorse slavery to the 'needy' and you're a sociopath.

They'd have loved you in the south circa 1850.

 

[Big Fitz]

Wow. Liberals cannot stand this discussion and keep trying to derail it into their pet fetishes. I guess being completely unable to debunk the point of Objectivism being a codified descriptor of 'freedom to and from' drives them fucking buggy.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Medicare funds are taken at gunpoint.

Nonsense. The Medicare Act was passed by Congress representing the people and with the consent of the governed.

No one has ever challenged the constitutionality of the Act, and with good reason, as there are no grounds.

If you believe the Act is un-Constitutional, file suit in Federal court or stop whining about it.

 

[Greenbeard]

Wow. Liberals cannot stand this discussion and keep trying to derail it into their pet fetishes. I guess being completely unable to debunk the point of Objectivism being a codified descriptor of 'freedom to and from' drives them fucking buggy.

Are you an Objectivist? I don't know that I've ever really encountered one. Certainly I've encountered right-leaning folks who embrace Rand's political conclusions and some of her pronouncements, but those people haven't fully actually subscribed to Objectivism's metaphysics or the ethical foundation on which Rand builds her support for "full, pure, uncontrolled, unregulated laissez-faire capitalism."

I've found that most of them instead subscribe to what Rand called the "mystic theory of ethics"--that is, they're usually at least nominally people of faith and not outright atheists.

"The mystic theory of ethics is explicitly based on the premise that the standard of value of man's ethics is set beyond the grave, by the laws or requirements of another, supernatural dimension, that ethics is impossible for man to practice, that it is unsuited for and opposed to man's life on earth, and that man must take the blame for it and suffer through the whole of his earthly existence, to atone for the guilt of being unable to practice the impracticable."​

 

[Big Fitz]

Wow. Liberals cannot stand this discussion and keep trying to derail it into their pet fetishes. I guess being completely unable to debunk the point of Objectivism being a codified descriptor of 'freedom to and from' drives them fucking buggy.

Are you an Objectivist? I don't know that I've ever really encountered one. Certainly I've encountered right-leaning folks who embrace Rand's political conclusions and some of her pronouncements, but those people haven't fully actually subscribed to Objectivism's metaphysics or the ethical foundation on which Rand builds her support for "full, pure, uncontrolled, unregulated laissez-faire capitalism."

I've found that most of them instead subscribe to what Rand called the "mystic theory of ethics"--that is, they're usually at least nominally people of faith and not outright atheists.

"The mystic theory of ethics is explicitly based on the premise that the standard of value of man's ethics is set beyond the grave, by the laws or requirements of another, supernatural dimension, that ethics is impossible for man to practice, that it is unsuited for and opposed to man's life on earth, and that man must take the blame for it and suffer through the whole of his earthly existence, to atone for the guilt of being unable to practice the impracticable."​

I think that Objectivism has a lot of positive things to it's philosophy. But like all philosophies of man, it has flaws and is not perfect and can be abused. The OP is wrong in the dogmatic purity test he tried to apply.

 

[Big Fitz]

Medicare funds are taken at gunpoint.

Nonsense. The Medicare Act was passed by Congress representing the people and with the consent of the governed.

No one has ever challenged the constitutionality of the Act, and with good reason, as there are no grounds.

If you believe the Act is un-Constitutional, file suit in Federal court or stop whining about it.

Really? Try to tell the government 'no' to taking your taxes OR that they can't use your money to fund projects you don't want.

Show me a person who says that's not force and I'll show you a flaming idiot.

 

[HenryBHough]

The last time Our Kenyan President had a good idea resulted in their not having a third child.

Pity there were no free condoms in Kenya a few years earlier.

 

[Lakhota]

Ayn Rand, Hugely Popular Author and Inspiration to Right-Wing Leaders, Was a Big Admirer of Serial Killer

By Mark Ames

Her works are treated as gospel by right-wing powerhouses like Alan Greenspan and Clarence Thomas, but Ayn Rand found early inspiration in 1920's murderer William Hickman.

One reason most countries don't find the time to embrace Ayn Rand's thinking is that she is a textbook sociopath. In her notebooks Ayn Rand worshiped a notorious serial murderer-dismemberer, and used this killer as an early model for the type of "ideal man" she promoted in her more famous books. These ideas were later picked up on and put into play by major right-wing figures of the past half decade, including the key architects of America's most recent economic catastrophe -- former Fed Chair Alan Greenspan and SEC Commissioner Chris Cox -- along with other notable right-wing Republicans such as Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, Rush Limbaugh and South Carolina Gov. Mark Sanford.

More: Ayn Rand, Hugely Popular Author and Inspiration to Right-Wing Leaders, Was a Big Admirer of Serial Killer | Books | AlterNet

 

[ScienceRocks]

Ayn Rand, Hugely Popular Author and Inspiration to Right-Wing Leaders, Was a Big Admirer of Serial Killer

By Mark Ames

Her works are treated as gospel by right-wing powerhouses like Alan Greenspan and Clarence Thomas, but Ayn Rand found early inspiration in 1920's murderer William Hickman.

One reason most countries don't find the time to embrace Ayn Rand's thinking is that she is a textbook sociopath. In her notebooks Ayn Rand worshiped a notorious serial murderer-dismemberer, and used this killer as an early model for the type of "ideal man" she promoted in her more famous books. These ideas were later picked up on and put into play by major right-wing figures of the past half decade, including the key architects of America's most recent economic catastrophe -- former Fed Chair Alan Greenspan and SEC Commissioner Chris Cox -- along with other notable right-wing Republicans such as Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, Rush Limbaugh and South Carolina Gov. Mark Sanford.

More: Ayn Rand, Hugely Popular Author and Inspiration to Right-Wing Leaders, Was a Big Admirer of Serial Killer | Books | AlterNet

 

[HenryBHough]

Lenin was a small person suffering miserably from "Napoleonic Syndrome" - common among the vertically impaired. The topmost picture illustrates it precisely.

 

[Neotrotsky]

You, me and Irene..are all part of this nation. In any case, I put that up to illustrate that what you may consider "fair" hasn't always been the case.

Contrary to popular belief, if a situation becomes dire enough for a person, and their alternatives are few..they tend to act out. And not always in positive ways.

There are quite a few reasons for making sure people are healthy, well fed, sheltered and reasonably happy.

Like every revolution in every nation where there were huge gaps between rich and poor.

Those communist countries we all hate so much didn't become that way in a vaccuum.

Really

at the time of the American Revolution
Americans had a higher standard of living than the British citizen

Now that's just hogwash.

Really?
Your revolution "theory" is hogwash

look it up

By 1740, the American standard of living had surpassed Europe's, and the Colonies, with only 32% the population of Great Britain, reached 50% her productivity.
In comparison to the British, very few of whom owned any property, 70% of the Colonists owned enough property to have the voting franchise. By the latter half of the 18th century, American men were 2-3 inches taller than their English and European counterparts (largely due to more nutritive, higher protein diets).


The Left is almost always bad with history
Probably because they are so quick to attempt to rewrite it

Indeed
“Those who don't know history are destined to repeat it.”
which explains the Left's rush into the arms of statism


But hey
if you want to believe the American Revolution was caused
by a gap between rich and poor

it is you story and you can tell it anyway you want

 

[Neotrotsky]

Lenin was a small person suffering miserably from "Napoleonic Syndrome" - common among the vertically impaired. The topmost picture illustrates it precisely.

Lenin in the top most picture

is that not Karl Marx?

or are referring to some other post?