Desperate liberals still trying to pretend waterboarding and sleep deprivation is "torture"

[ABikerSailor]

Of course there are political biases as to when and why the report was released.

That doesn't mean that the report is a lie.

You are simply insisting the truth of the report without vetting the credulity of it. I don't see the objectivity in that reasoning. There is such a thing as twisting the truth, or reaching. I find such reports wanting.

Have you ever heard of Abu Ghraib? You know there are pictures and such involved with this right? Are you trying to say the CIA never used torture techniques? That's going to be a real stretch you know

Yeah...............and the reservists who were responsible for that were put on trial and punished.

Why does the CIA and the last admin get a free pass?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I think I could make a pretty strong argument that washing WTC dust out of my hair for days after is "more traumatizing" than watching it on TV.

Whether washing the dust out of your hair, or watching people commit suicide from 100+ stories with your very eyes, both experiences equally as traumatizing, Doc. Not the point. Agreed.

But that's really not my point - my point is that you're using that trauma as an emotional justification for your views - and if I can avoid doing that, you can too.

You've employed argumentum ab auctoritate. Just because a report issued by a group of elected officials says something occurred doesn't automatically mean it did. As such, I cannot trust nor justify a report released by just one side of the political spectrum.

The vote was 11-3 in favor of declassifying the report. The committee had 7 Democrats and 7 Republicans.

All 7 democrats and only 3 of 7 Republicans voted in favor, including one independent. Not very bipartisan now is it? Besides, given that, it wouldn't have mattered how the Republicans voted; given that the independent sided with the Democrats, the Republicans would have been in the minority even if ALL of them voted against it.

I don't think you understand what happened. The whole committee wrote the report.

11 of the people voted to de-classify it, 3 voted against.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Hey Doc!!

Fess up. Are you TK's uncle? I can't think of any other reason that you would have this much patience. You might be a saint.

Sometimes....the right people are asked to be mods.

 

[Interpol]

Title of this thread should be called, "Desperate Neo-Con Sympathizers Deflect from the Fact that Torture Gave Us No Actionable Intelligence".

Notice that what our conservative friends are saying isn't that torture worked and so here are some concrete examples of how it worked, but instead are attacking anyone who dares to question chickenhawks Bush and Dick.

Still to this day, there isn't actually one example any of these buffoons have given us that shows that torture worked.

What's especially despicable about what the neo-cons did is that they "led the witness" in torture situations in order to get the answer they wanted, which would then give them a license to go to Iraq.

What we now know is that under torture, some of these guys were being asked over and over again about Saddam supporting Al Qaeda. Is AQ working with Saddam? And of course, after several rounds of waterboarding and beatings and other cruel and unusual punishment, people were saying, "Yes! Yes! Saddam and Al Qaeda are working together to get America!".

What the neo-con morons did was fabricate a way to get into Iraq from getting faulty information precisely that way. Bush and Dick are lucky we don't put them on trial for war crimes.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Have you ever heard of Abu Ghraib?

Yes I have. I remember reacting with shock. But that happened 11 years ago. I assume the people responsible were punished. Such behavior as peeing and spitting on the prisoners is dishonorable by members of our military, and I was angry about it.

 

[TemplarKormac]

The whole committee wrote the report.

Then why are the Republicans on the committee planning to issue their own version of this report then?

 

[LoneLaugher]

Have you ever heard of Abu Ghraib?

Yes I have. I remember reacting with shock. But that happened 11 years ago. I assume the people responsible were punished. Such behavior as peeing and spitting on the prisoners is dishonorable by members of our military, and I was angry about it.

11 years ago! Meh......let's forget it.

 

[LoneLaugher]

The whole committee wrote the report.

Then why are the Republicans on the committee planning to issue their own version of this report then?

Politics. Duh!!

 

[Agit8r]

Yeah, man. The Spanish Inquisition was just a bunch of enhanced conversions.

 

[TemplarKormac]

11 of the people voted to de-classify it, 3 voted against.

Seven Democrats, one Independent and three Republicans. Like I said before, they were nothing but tokens. Even had all of the them voted against, it would have been declassified anyway.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Nevermind, found a link.


The GOP members of the committee aren't disputing that the torture took place, rather they're trying to claim that it worked.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Transparency is a bitch when you've got something to hide.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

11 of the people voted to de-classify it, 3 voted against.

Seven Democrats, one Independent and three Republicans. Like I said before, they were nothing but tokens. Even had all of the them voted against, it would have been declassified anyway.

So what?

If they disagreed with it, why would they have voted for releasing it, even if it would be released anyway?

Wouldn't it make more sense for them to vote against it, to be on record against it?

 

[TemplarKormac]

Nevermind, found a link.

The GOP members of the committee aren't disputing that the torture took place, rather they're trying to claim that it worked.

Of course they did, and it is inarguable that torture took place. It would be foolish

In fact, I have the PDF of that report here:

http://www.intelligence.senate.gov/study2014/sscistudy3.pdf

 

[jknowgood]

Waterboarding and sleep depravation are torture.

Repeating that they're not, over and over, doesn't make it true.

Saying "Waterboarding and sleep deprivation are torture" over and over doesn't make it true. Those men were terrorists. They gave not a second thought to the lives they took. They didn't consider the most humane way possible hurt or kill their victims, they just did it. They deserved whatever they got.

No one denies they are monsters but there is no need for America to be monstrous to fight them. We have the strength and power to do this without becoming what we condemn our enemies for.

Well we know liberal tactics, just kill them with no trial. Those drone attacks has killed thousands of innocent people.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Waterboarding and sleep depravation are torture.

Repeating that they're not, over and over, doesn't make it true.

Saying "Waterboarding and sleep deprivation are torture" over and over doesn't make it true. Those men were terrorists. They gave not a second thought to the lives they took. They didn't consider the most humane way possible hurt or kill their victims, they just did it. They deserved whatever they got.

No one denies they are monsters but there is no need for America to be monstrous to fight them. We have the strength and power to do this without becoming what we condemn our enemies for.

Well we know liberal tactics, just kill them with no trial. Those drone attacks has killed thousands of innocent people.

Oh look! It's a plane! It's a drone! It's a deflection!

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Nevermind, found a link.

The GOP members of the committee aren't disputing that the torture took place, rather they're trying to claim that it worked.

Of course they did, and it is inarguable that torture took place. It would be foolish

In fact, I have the PDF of that report here:

http://www.intelligence.senate.gov/study2014/sscistudy3.pdf

Wouldn't it make more sense for them to vote against it, to be on record against it?

As a matter of fact, six of them did:

Sens. Saxby Chambliss, Richard Burr, Jim Risch, Daniel Coats, Tom Coburn and Marco Rubio

You've spent this whole thread doubting the truth of the report, and now you say it's "inarguably" true.

 

[TemplarKormac]

In regards to the efficacy of the 'torture' read page 21 of the report, or page 55 on your slider bar.

 

[TemplarKormac]

You've spent this whole thread doubting the truth of the report, and now you say it's "inarguably" true.

I doubt that parts of that report were reported truthfully. The issue isn't the torture. It is the overall assertions made by that report I call into question.

But now that I have both reports in my hands, I am going to go through them now.

To say no torture took place at all, however is rather disingenuous. That part is undoubtedly true. But from my vantage point, I have no reason (as of the moment) to believe that either of the reports were reported accurately. Underlying political motivations have a way of twisting the truth.

 

[jknowgood]

Waterboarding and sleep depravation are torture.

Repeating that they're not, over and over, doesn't make it true.

Saying "Waterboarding and sleep deprivation are torture" over and over doesn't make it true. Those men were terrorists. They gave not a second thought to the lives they took. They didn't consider the most humane way possible hurt or kill their victims, they just did it. They deserved whatever they got.

No one denies they are monsters but there is no need for America to be monstrous to fight them. We have the strength and power to do this without becoming what we condemn our enemies for.

Well we know liberal tactics, just kill them with no trial. Those drone attacks has killed thousands of innocent people.

Oh look! It's a plane! It's a drone! It's a deflection!

So no drones has killed?