explosion at Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, UK

[Lucy Hamilton]

Just pointing out what many honest liberals are pointing out. Fortunately that number appears to be growing.
.

Let me ask this...before we further degenerate into mud slinging (maybe we can avert it).

ALL religions (of the book) have a lot of nasty crap in their written texts. The only salvation is their followers no longer follow it literally - they've either found ways to bypass it, ignore it, or interpret it. Yes or no? Islam is regularly accused of being unique in it's written nasty crap because everything they do is in their book. So is it "moral equivalence" to point out that is not true?

Your listing of points that you've directed at the "regressive left" also seems to be in play with the (what do you call the opposing team?) - certainly Points 3, 4, and 5.

You have people here calling for an extermination of Muslims, the killing of innocent people, stripping away their rights, magically making a 1200 year old world wide religion a non-religion for the purpose of persecuting them - all because extremists in that religion are committing vile acts. Don't you think this is a regressive mindset?

While your questions have nothing to do with what happened in Manchester, and would fall under the category of delfection, I'm still happy to answer.

Anyone who is calling for the extermination of Muslims, the killing of innocent people, and the other things you mention are definitely also wrong, guilty of terribly shallow thinking, and probably need to spend some serious personal time away from talk radio and internet "news" sites. If you want to use the term "regressive", great.

My use of the term "regressive" is specific to the term used by Mr. Nawaaz, the man who coined the term and who makes the specific case below, at the bottom.

I wish I could get you and others to give serious thought to the following videos by honest, civil, sincere liberals Dave Rubin, Maajid Nawaz and Sam Harris:

Maybe you oughta put a bit more time into taking some tiny bit of responsibility for the lies you've been plopping here, and less looking for irrelevant videos to deflect that responsibility away. Ain't nobody gonna sit and watch your film festival just because you can't articulate a point.

I wouldn't try to convince someone like you of anything.

Nor would I expect someone like you to demonstrate any respect for Nawaaz, Rubin or Harris.
.

Nawaaz, Rubin and Harris are completely irrelevant here, nor do they post here. YOU do. And you're using them a deflector shields because you can't take responsibility for your own lying.

Pogo you have posted in this thread since the other night, not one of your many posts has mentioned the innocent children and teenagers who were blown to pieces and the huge amount of those who survived but have life threatening injuries and still could die.

But you've had time to post multiple posts all deflecting away from the Islamist waste of human skin who in the name of his RELIGION Islam assembled and then strapped a suicide vest to himself and walked into a music venue and blew himself up in the name of his RELIGION Islam and committed this grotesque atrocity on these innocent children and teenagers.

Terrible, you have lost your moral compass like all the other Leftist Islamist Apologists.

 

[depotoo]

Coyote, you are aware of salafism. 20% of Egypt voted for the salafist candidate awhile back. There is a certain percentage of radicals in Islam, that practice it, and preach it everywhere. If we take 20% of the Muslim population worldwide, do you even realize how many that would be?
Until,the moderates speak up, it will not change. Just take a 1/2 percentage!

Rather than speaking here, denying there is a problem, or the rest of the world is the problem, the moderate Muslims here need to be speaking with their own communities and tell them they need to fight back with those sullying their moderate stand.
Fear needs to go out the door. Until then attitudes/perceptions overall will not change.

The Regressive Left and Islam -- What is happening here?

We're seeing the Regressive Left act out, right on cue, in this thread. Their standard reaction to the latest jihadist atrocity will follow at least one of the following strategies:

• Deflection ("the Crusades, the Crusades!")
• Moral Equivalence ("all religions are bad, Christianity is just as bad as jihadism")
• Personal Insults and name-calling (of course, lots of that on this thread)
• Completely change the subject & make it about other posters (as we see on this thread)
  
• Some combination therein

Whatever they can do to protect their pet constituent religion. That's how distorted and mutated that end of the spectrum has become. They don't care that they effectively align themselves with the most brutal, violent, hateful, illiberal group on the planet.
.

Oh stop spamming the same deflection. Come on Mac, you're doing the same thing here.

If someone objects to demonizing an entire religion as opposed to the acts of extremists you bring this out.

Just pointing out what many honest liberals are pointing out. Fortunately that number appears to be growing.
.

Let me ask this...before we further degenerate into mud slinging (maybe we can avert it).

ALL religions (of the book) have a lot of nasty crap in their written texts. The only salvation is their followers no longer follow it literally - they've either found ways to bypass it, ignore it, or interpret it. Yes or no? Islam is regularly accused of being unique in it's written nasty crap because everything they do is in their book. So is it "moral equivalence" to point out that is not true?

Your listing of points that you've directed at the "regressive left" also seems to be in play with the (what do you call the opposing team?) - certainly Points 3, 4, and 5.

You have people here calling for an extermination of Muslims, the killing of innocent people, stripping away their rights, magically making a 1200 year old world wide religion a non-religion for the purpose of persecuting them - all because extremists in that religion are committing vile acts. Don't you think this is a regressive mindset?

 

[Pogo]

God, you people are stupid. Full of hate and ignorance. Satan's children.

Yeah, these are the kind of people who would bomb little girls if they didn't share their world-view!

Eight year-old crusaders against the religion of peace is what they were!

That's exactly what the Klan did at the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham.

​

And yet ------ nobody started jumping up and down blaming "Christians", did they.

Why is that?

Oh, I see. Since the KKK did it 60 odd years ago, it's OK.

Oh I see. The laws of logic and fallacy change from year to year, do they?

Not at all. I was just pointing out that you're a low-life justifying the acts of one despicable group with the acts of another, snowflake or not.

Once again for the Illiterati who forget how English works when it's not around them, here's the point I've been hammering home since I got here.

IF having a religion in common makes a group's actions a causal result of that religion----

And IF that premise makes "Islam" responsible for a Muslim's bombing little girls....

Still with me?

THEN the same premise makes Christianism responsible for the Klan doing the same thing.

That's how it works, because you can't have it both ways.

You wanna blame "Islam", then you have to blame "Christianity". If you don't want to blame one, then you can't blame the other either. Both or nothing.

Long as you understand the terms, feel free to make either case. I don't care which one you go with, I just won't tolerate doing it dishonestly .

 

[Meathead]

While your questions have nothing to do with what happened in Manchester, and would fall under the category of delfection, I'm still happy to answer.

Anyone who is calling for the extermination of Muslims, the killing of innocent people, and the other things you mention are definitely also wrong, guilty of terribly shallow thinking, and probably need to spend some serious personal time away from talk radio and internet "news" sites. If you want to use the term "regressive", great.

My use of the term "regressive" is specific to the term used by Mr. Nawaaz, the man who coined the term and who makes the specific case below, at the bottom.

I wish I could get you and others to give serious thought to the following videos by honest, civil, sincere liberals Dave Rubin, Maajid Nawaz and Sam Harris:

Maybe you oughta put a bit more time into taking some tiny bit of responsibility for the lies you've been plopping here, and less looking for irrelevant videos to deflect that responsibility away. Ain't nobody gonna sit and watch your film festival just because you can't articulate a point.

I rest easy at night because I know when people get fed up and start killing, apologists like Pogo will die just as fast as the terrorists.

You go right ahead and quote me where I've "apologized" for anything here, Bubbles.

Go on --- be the first to actually back up your attack. No one else has been able to do it. You show 'em how it's done, Twinkletoes.

You're pond scum Pogo.

He's lower than pond scum. Parasite on whale dung is what I'm thinking.

We can debate whether dung beetle or pond scum are lower, but I'm sure we can agree that Pogo tops (or bottoms) them both.

 

[Ame®icano]

God, you people are stupid. Full of hate and ignorance. Satan's children.

Yeah, these are the kind of people who would bomb little girls if they didn't share their world-view!

Eight year-old crusaders against the religion of peace is what they were!

That's exactly what the Klan did at the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham.

​

And yet ------ nobody started jumping up and down blaming "Christians", did they.

Why is that?

Because they were Democrats?

 

[Marion Morrison]

Pogo I take solace in that after another terrorist attack or two, you're going down along with the terrorists.

Buh-bye!

 

[leftwinger]

Yeah, these are the kind of people who would bomb little girls if they didn't share their world-view!

Eight year-old crusaders against the religion of peace is what they were!

That's exactly what the Klan did at the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham.

​

And yet ------ nobody started jumping up and down blaming "Christians", did they.

Why is that?

Oh, I see. Since the KKK did it 60 odd years ago, it's OK.

Oh I see. The laws of logic and fallacy change from year to year, do they?

Not at all. I was just pointing out that you're a low-life justifying the acts of one despicable group with the acts of another, snowflake or not.

Once again for the Illiterati who forget how English works when it's not around them, here's the point I've been hammering home since I got here.

IF having a religion in common makes a group's actions a causal result of that religion----

And IF that premise makes "Islam" responsible for a Muslim's bombing little girls....

Still with me?

THEN the same premise makes Christianism responsible for the Klan doing the same thing.

That's how it works, because you can't have it both ways.

You wanna blame "Islam", then you have to blame "Christianity". If you don't want to blame one, then you can't blame the other either. Both or nothing.

Long as you understand the terms, feel free to make either case. I don't care which one you go with, I just won't tolerate doing it dishonestly .

nonsense (again). The good Christians put a stop to any bad Klan activities. What do the good muslims do? How many support suicide bombers? mass killings? uh.........more than 20% avg from what I read.

Mod Edit: Graphic image removed. Please don't post graphic imagery - post a link, and a warning that it's a graphic image.

































I have been to many concerts......higher than a kite. Can you imagine? 200 more attacks in APR 2017?

 

[Mac1958]

Let me ask this...before we further degenerate into mud slinging (maybe we can avert it).

ALL religions (of the book) have a lot of nasty crap in their written texts. The only salvation is their followers no longer follow it literally - they've either found ways to bypass it, ignore it, or interpret it. Yes or no? Islam is regularly accused of being unique in it's written nasty crap because everything they do is in their book. So is it "moral equivalence" to point out that is not true?

Your listing of points that you've directed at the "regressive left" also seems to be in play with the (what do you call the opposing team?) - certainly Points 3, 4, and 5.

You have people here calling for an extermination of Muslims, the killing of innocent people, stripping away their rights, magically making a 1200 year old world wide religion a non-religion for the purpose of persecuting them - all because extremists in that religion are committing vile acts. Don't you think this is a regressive mindset?

While your questions have nothing to do with what happened in Manchester, and would fall under the category of delfection, I'm still happy to answer.

Anyone who is calling for the extermination of Muslims, the killing of innocent people, and the other things you mention are definitely also wrong, guilty of terribly shallow thinking, and probably need to spend some serious personal time away from talk radio and internet "news" sites. If you want to use the term "regressive", great.

My use of the term "regressive" is specific to the term used by Mr. Nawaaz, the man who coined the term and who makes the specific case below, at the bottom.

I wish I could get you and others to give serious thought to the following videos by honest, civil, sincere liberals Dave Rubin, Maajid Nawaz and Sam Harris:

Maybe you oughta put a bit more time into taking some tiny bit of responsibility for the lies you've been plopping here, and less looking for irrelevant videos to deflect that responsibility away. Ain't nobody gonna sit and watch your film festival just because you can't articulate a point.

I wouldn't try to convince someone like you of anything.

Nor would I expect someone like you to demonstrate any respect for Nawaaz, Rubin or Harris.
.

Nawaaz, Rubin and Harris are completely irrelevant here, nor do they post here. YOU do. And you're using them a deflector shields because you can't take responsibility for your own lying.

Pogo you have posted in this thread since the other night, not one of your many posts has mentioned the innocent children and teenagers who were blown to pieces and the huge amount of those who survived but have life threatening injuries and still could die.

But you've had time to post multiple posts all deflecting away from the Islamist waste of human skin who in the name of his RELIGION Islam assembled and then strapped a suicide vest to himself and walked into a music venue and blew himself up in the name of his RELIGION Islam and committed this grotesque atrocity on these innocent children and teenagers.

Terrible, you have lost your moral compass like all the other Leftist Islamist Apologists.

These people have become so committed to protecting their pet constituent religion that you can no more easily communicate with them than you could with a wild-eyed teenage boy on the streets of Damascus.

Look at the various threads on this topic, they're all like this. Deflection and personal attacks. They can't even bring themselves to honestly confront what happened, because at some level they know what they're doing is illiberal and wrong.

Maybe that's why they get so damn mad.
.

 

[Pogo]

Pogo you have posted in this thread since the other night, not one of your many posts has mentioned the innocent children and teenagers who were blown to pieces and the huge amount of those who survived but have life threatening injuries and still could die.

True. Many other posts have reported on that, such as Dalia's right above. There's nothing to debate about it. I've been following it on the news. There isn't anything I can add, not being there.

So what I've addressed that DOES need desperately to be addressed, is the mob-mentality hatestorm generated by absurd fallacies. As I've noted to others, everything I've posted here has been about that abject logical failure. That's exactly why the emotional nutballs who try to paint me as "apologist", or "defending a religion" or having "pet constituent", immediately get challenged to prove it, and inevitably fail.

Because it doesn't exist. If it did --- they could quote it.

I don't know why they pull those lies out of their asses --- I would guess they're so enslaved to their own hate that they can't read.

But you've had time to post multiple posts all deflecting away from the Islamist waste of human skin who in the name of his RELIGION Islam assembled and then strapped a suicide vest to himself and walked into a music venue and blew himself up in the name of his RELIGION Islam and committed this grotesque atrocity on these innocent children and teenagers.

I don't know that that's true, but assuming it is, it doesn't equate to a causation---- see the Klan bombing post above for an example. THAT -- the false causation Composition Fallacy --- is what I've actually been posting about while the emotional basket cases go

Terrible, you have lost your moral compass like all the other Leftist Islamist Apologists.

Not at all. I'm demanding the same trait here that I applauded you for when you got here --- honesty. It's about 90 percent of what I do on this site. "Nuke Mecca" is not honest. Neither is "you're an apologist with pet fucking constituents". That's naught more than the bleating of the butthurt who have been called out for their dishonesty .

So my posts here have nothing to do with "Islam" or "the left" or "terrorists" or their victims. They have entirely to do with USMB posters. The dishonest ones.

 

[DigitalDrifter]

Pogo I take solace in that after another terrorist attack or two, you're going down along with the terrorists.

Buh-bye!

As long as the next terror attack is another garden variety Islamists attack, he'll just keep on deflecting and defending. It's simply now part of their DNA.

 

[Marion Morrison]

Pogo I take solace in that after another terrorist attack or two, you're going down along with the terrorists.

Buh-bye!

As long as the next terror attack is another garden variety Islamists attack, he'll just keep on deflecting and defending. It's simply now part of their DNA.

Until it is them they come for. I tell you what, the world would be a better place without Islamic terrorism and its apologists like Pogo.

Who disagrees?

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

While your questions have nothing to do with what happened in Manchester, and would fall under the category of delfection, I'm still happy to answer.

Anyone who is calling for the extermination of Muslims, the killing of innocent people, and the other things you mention are definitely also wrong, guilty of terribly shallow thinking, and probably need to spend some serious personal time away from talk radio and internet "news" sites. If you want to use the term "regressive", great.

My use of the term "regressive" is specific to the term used by Mr. Nawaaz, the man who coined the term and who makes the specific case below, at the bottom.

I wish I could get you and others to give serious thought to the following videos by honest, civil, sincere liberals Dave Rubin, Maajid Nawaz and Sam Harris:

Maybe you oughta put a bit more time into taking some tiny bit of responsibility for the lies you've been plopping here, and less looking for irrelevant videos to deflect that responsibility away. Ain't nobody gonna sit and watch your film festival just because you can't articulate a point.

I wouldn't try to convince someone like you of anything.

Nor would I expect someone like you to demonstrate any respect for Nawaaz, Rubin or Harris.
.

Nawaaz, Rubin and Harris are completely irrelevant here, nor do they post here. YOU do. And you're using them a deflector shields because you can't take responsibility for your own lying.

Pogo you have posted in this thread since the other night, not one of your many posts has mentioned the innocent children and teenagers who were blown to pieces and the huge amount of those who survived but have life threatening injuries and still could die.

But you've had time to post multiple posts all deflecting away from the Islamist waste of human skin who in the name of his RELIGION Islam assembled and then strapped a suicide vest to himself and walked into a music venue and blew himself up in the name of his RELIGION Islam and committed this grotesque atrocity on these innocent children and teenagers.

Terrible, you have lost your moral compass like all the other Leftist Islamist Apologists.

These people have become so committed to protecting their pet constituent religion that you can no more easily communicate with them than you could with a wild-eyed teenage boy on the streets of Damascus.

Look at the various threads on this topic, they're all like this. Deflection and personal attacks. They can't even bring themselves to honestly confront what happened, because at some level they know what they're doing is illiberal and wrong.

Maybe that's why they get so damn mad.
.

I have stopped long ago attempting to have any type of discussion with most of them, it's like attempting to talk to someone while being underwater, it's impossible.

They are a combination of brainwashed, in denial and also some are obviously deeply pro-Islam for the reason that like the Islamists they despise Western values so are attaching their Leftist Agenda to Islam as they think it's the best way to bring down Western values.

The whole thing is sick and perverted, they are sick and perverted.

They will not win, their Islamist pets won't win, when the SHTF as it's going to all this crowd better get out of the way because they are going to be in the firing line and taken down with their Islamist pets.

 

[Pogo]

That's exactly what the Klan did at the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham.

​

And yet ------ nobody started jumping up and down blaming "Christians", did they.

Why is that?

Oh, I see. Since the KKK did it 60 odd years ago, it's OK.

Oh I see. The laws of logic and fallacy change from year to year, do they?

Not at all. I was just pointing out that you're a low-life justifying the acts of one despicable group with the acts of another, snowflake or not.

Once again for the Illiterati who forget how English works when it's not around them, here's the point I've been hammering home since I got here.

IF having a religion in common makes a group's actions a causal result of that religion----

And IF that premise makes "Islam" responsible for a Muslim's bombing little girls....

Still with me?

THEN the same premise makes Christianism responsible for the Klan doing the same thing.

That's how it works, because you can't have it both ways.

You wanna blame "Islam", then you have to blame "Christianity". If you don't want to blame one, then you can't blame the other either. Both or nothing.

Long as you understand the terms, feel free to make either case. I don't care which one you go with, I just won't tolerate doing it dishonestly .

nonsense (again). The good Christians put a stop to any bad Klan activities.

Of course they did. With help from the good Jews, the good atheists, and whoever else.

That's because the Klan does not, and never did, become the official representative of Christianity. simply because they claim it as inspiration. And the idea that they did is a fallacy.

Now do the math.

 

[Pogo]

Pogo I take solace in that after another terrorist attack or two, you're going down along with the terrorists.

Buh-bye!

As long as the next terror attack is another garden variety Islamists attack, he'll just keep on deflecting and defending. It's simply now part of their DNA.

Until it is them they come for. I tell you what, the world would be a better place without Islamic terrorism and its apologists like Pogo.

Who disagrees?

Perfect demonstration --- you were one of the ones challenged to document this "apologism" with my own quotes. Even one.

And you can't do it.

Pulled out of your ass, QED.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Pogo I take solace in that after another terrorist attack or two, you're going down along with the terrorists.

Buh-bye!

As long as the next terror attack is another garden variety Islamists attack, he'll just keep on deflecting and defending. It's simply now part of their DNA.

Until it is them they come for. I tell you what, the world would be a better place without Islamic terrorism and its apologists like Pogo.

Who disagrees?

Exactly I commented that a few hours ago, the Leftist Islamist Apologists are so stupid they cannot see and/or refuse to see that once the Islamists have no more need for their Leftist Apologists the Islamists will dispose of them.

The Leftist Islamist Apologists are Useful Idiots, it's the same the way the Leftists defend Globalism, the Globalists know the Leftists are Useful Idiots, so if the Islamists don't dispose of the Leftist Useful Idiots when they don't need them anymore the Globalists will.

The Leftist Useful Idiots will be the first who are put to the wall.

 

[Dr Grump]

So it's slap to the faces of victims and their families. How to explain to them and to us that they know about bomber and still lost all those lives?

Depends on how he was known to them. Police and intelligence agencies touch base and know loads of dodgy characters. Most of them innocent. If this guy said "I'm gonna go and set off a bomb at the Ariana Grande concert" then yeah, they fucked up. However, if they saw some email traffic that said something along the lines of "I can see why ISIS do what they do"... then that's hardly anything to be arrested about. it's called free speech. It'll come down to how they knew him.

Definition of the free speech in UK is not the same as we have in US.

No, it's pretty much the same. They have a couple more laws around hate speech, but that's about it.

 

[Dr Grump]

My son works in the UK and he laughs at what they call free speech. You can say whatever you want as long as it doesn't offend anyone.

I've lived in the UK too. It wasn't an issue. I think the US idea of free speech is laughable. I mean, in statutes, it's fine, but in reality? Ha....

 

[Dr Grump]

I suppose there is some truth to that. Look at what is happening to Katie Hopkins just lately.

What happened to her?

 

[Marion Morrison]

Pogo I take solace in that after another terrorist attack or two, you're going down along with the terrorists.

Buh-bye!

As long as the next terror attack is another garden variety Islamists attack, he'll just keep on deflecting and defending. It's simply now part of their DNA.

Until it is them they come for. I tell you what, the world would be a better place without Islamic terrorism and its apologists like Pogo.

Who disagrees?

Perfect demonstration --- you were one of the ones challenged to document this "apologism" with my own quotes. Even one.

And you can't do it.

Pulled out of your ass, QED.

I have the solution:

Nuke Mecca and demolish the dome of the rock.

Dafuk does "Mecca" have to do with this?

Nobody can answer that.

Was anyone calling for "nuke the Vatican" after the Atlanta Olympics bombing?
Whelp ---- same thing.

Nahh just your own words, dipshit.

 

[Pogo]

Yet another study in abject ignorance:

Suicide bomber and co-conspirators were what religion again?

Eric Rudolph and Tim McVeigh and Robert Dear and the Klan were what religion again?

Oh wait -- we never asked that question. Because there was no reason to .

Dumbass.

This isn't rocket surgery.

Hey, that's MY line. I'd better have a royalty check in my mailbox by Monday.

"Moderate" Muslims just aren't devout enough to gear up and kill the Kafir.

However, they may kill their own in honor killings even if they don't want to go full jihad.

Doubling down on abject ignorance. "Honor killing" is a social construct. Has no religious function, and it's a cultural artifact way way WAY older than religion. When it happens it happens in spite of religion, not because of it.

Just thought I'd point that out since you seem to think religion is behind everything, except of course when it's your own.

A large percentage of mosques in America are used for terrorist activities.

A "large number" huh? Like what number? Link?

The problem is Islam.

No, the fundamental problem is the abject ignorance that Ignorami like you have been posting here.

Islam has declared war on the west.

Again ----------------------- link?