How do you detain a criminal at gun point?

[2aguy]

Most criminals are smart enough to run away, or surrender when faced with an armed victim.........about 200 a year are terminally stupid and end up in the morgue....

But...

If you are forced to defend yourself and you end up with one or more idiots at gun point as you wait for the police........how do you coral them so they can't continue to attack?

If they run away, that is one thing....do not shoot them as they run.....but you may be facing them for a few minutes or more until the police arrive....

Do you have them lay on the ground? Do you have them kneel? Hands on their head or if they are on the ground out to the side?

Just wondering...

For our European friends....you will simply be a victim, beaten, robbed, or raped, so this thread doesn't really apply to you....

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Most criminals are smart enough to run away, or surrender when faced with an armed victim.........about 200 a year are terminally stupid and end up in the morgue....

But...

If you are forced to defend yourself and you end up with one or more idiots at gun point as you wait for the police........how do you coral them so they can't continue to attack?

If they run away, that is one thing....do not shoot them as they run.....but you may be facing them for a few minutes or more until the police arrive....

Do you have them lay on the ground? Do you have them kneel? Hands on their head or if they are on the ground out to the side?

Just wondering...

For our European friends....you will simply be a victim, beaten, robbed, or raped, so this thread doesn't really apply to you....

Detain? I am not law enforcement, if i pull my weapon i will use it. Period.

 

[Woodznutz]

Best to just defend yourself and your property. Let the police track them down.

 

[ozro]

I don't pull out my weapon unless I intend to shoot it.
That said, I have used my dogs to detain those that trespassed and either threatened me , or the dogs, or were stealing/committing vandalism.
Of course, my dogs are trained for that, and one of them tracks.
That's right, I have a crazy white bitch that will track you down to bite you. (That's meant to be funny, but it's true)

 

[ReinyDays]

Pulling a gun out and NOT shooting ... that's a real bad idea ... that's a good way to get your gun taken from you ... and that's never pretty ...

 

[Shawnee_b]

Shoot said criminal in both knee caps, won't go anywhere.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Shoot said criminal in both knee caps, won't go anywhere.

Shoot a criminal in center mass, won't go anywhere.

 

[Zebra]

??


seriously?

 

[whitehall]

If you are a victim of home invasion or in fear of your life you should do the right thing. If it's an issue in public where others are in jeopardy you need to protect yourself and let the incident play out.

 

[NetJedi]

Most criminals are smart enough to run away, or surrender when faced with an armed victim.........about 200 a year are terminally stupid and end up in the morgue....

But...

If you are forced to defend yourself and you end up with one or more idiots at gun point as you wait for the police........how do you coral them so they can't continue to attack?

2 rounds center mass, check status, 1 round to the head if required.

After all, if you pulled your firearm, you're defending yourself from imminent death or great bodily harm, right?

 

[progressive hunter]

Detain? I am not law enforcement, if i pull my weapon i will use it. Period.

that may be well and fine,, but in some cases you would then be fighting the system and they are relentless nd have all the money in the world to put you in jail,,

its a tough call to decide to pull the trigger or just get them to end the threat by leaving or letting you leave,,

if they are inside your house its an easy decision,,

walking down the street is another matter,,

is a guarantee pulling the trigger will change your life forever,,

 

[NetJedi]

that may be well and fine,, but in some cases you would then be fighting the system and they are relentless nd have all the money in the world to put you in jail,,

its a tough call to decide to pull the trigger or just get them to end the threat by leaving or letting you leave,,

if they are inside your house its an easy decision,,

walking down the street is another matter,,

is a guarantee pulling the trigger will change your life forever,,

It's not a tough call to decide to pull the trigger, if you're drawing your firearm (which is the tough call), you better have already decided that.

Bottom line, you should only draw your firearm if you (or others) are faced with an imminent threat of death or great bodily harm, which means you should have already made the decision to pull that trigger and keep pulling it until the threat has ended. If you're drawing your firearm with the intention of detaining an attacker, you're making a big mistake and putting your (or others) life at risk.

I do agree pulling that trigger will change your life forever that's why pulling your firearm out of that holster is the tough call that you should be rehearsing in your head ahead of time (as well as becoming intimately familiar with self-defense laws in your state) and know very well what your red lines are for doing it.

That being said in the case of an invasion into your domicile where castle doctrine (rebuttable presumption of imminent threat of death or great bodily harm) applies where you want to identify the risk before pulling the trigger (don't shoot the neighborhood 3rd grader that wandered into your house) would be the only exception and even then you do not want to "detain" the attacker, you want to get them the hell out of your home (or automobile) ASAP.

 

[progressive hunter]

It's not a tough call to decide to pull the trigger, if you're drawing your firearm (which is the tough call), you better have already decided that.

Bottom line, you should only draw your firearm if you (or others) are faced with an imminent threat of death or great bodily harm, which means you should have already made the decision to pull that trigger and keep pulling it until the threat has ended. If you're drawing your firearm with the intention of detaining an attacker, you're making a big mistake and putting your (or others) life at risk.

I do agree pulling that trigger will change your life forever that's why pulling your firearm out of that holster is the tough call that you should be rehearsing in your head ahead of time (as well as becoming intimately familiar with self-defense laws in your state) and know very well what your red lines are for doing it.

That being said in the case of an invasion into your domicile where castle doctrine (rebuttable presumption of imminent threat of death or great bodily harm) applies where you want to identify the risk before pulling the trigger (don't shoot the neighborhood 3rd grader that wandered into your house) would be the only exception and even then you do not want to "detain" the attacker, you want to get them the hell out of your home (or automobile) ASAP.

a lot of people thought that that are currently sitting in jail,, or lost everything they own defending themselves in court,,

in some cases I fear the government more than a thug on the street,,

does daniel penny come to mind?? and he didnt even use a gun

I have drawn my gun 3 times in my life and all of them resulted in the threat removing themselves from the situation,,

 

[NetJedi]

a lot of people thought that that are currently sitting in jail,, or lost everything they own defending themselves in court,,

in some cases I fear the government more than a thug on the street,,

does daniel penny come to mind?? and he didnt even use a gun

I have drawn my gun 3 times in my life and all of them resulted in the threat removing themselves from the situation,,

Why carry a firearm if it isn't to defend yourself from imminent death or great bodily harm and if you believe you're facing imminent death or great bodily harm why would you draw your firearm and then not use it to stop the threat? If the threat is NOT imminent then escape and evasion is the best choice and you have no need to draw your firearm.

As far as the "threat removing itself", based on extensive work with a range timer, (for example) my average draw and a first shot from concealment is 1.06 seconds (probably a smidge longer under real world duress) so unless I'm facing The Flash no way is the threat going to have the opportunity to "remove itself", the threat had the opportunity to "remove itself" BEFORE I drew my firearm.

IMHO The best you can do is know your red lines (and state laws) ahead of time, don't just carry a firearm also carry a non-lethal in your EDC kit and have good carry insurance. Rehearse the scenarios in your head and get (and maintain) excellent self-defense training, so that you're prepared in case you're faced with needing to defend against an imminent threat of death or great bodily harm.

 

[progressive hunter]

Why carry a firearm if it isn't to defend yourself from imminent death or great bodily harm and if you believe you're facing imminent death or great bodily harm why would you draw your firearm and then not use it to stop the threat? If the threat is NOT imminent then escape and evasion is the best choice and you have no need to draw your firearm.

As far as the "threat removing itself", based on extensive work with a range timer, (for example) my average draw and a first shot from concealment is 1.06 seconds (probably a smidge longer under real world duress) so unless I'm facing The Flash no way is the threat going to have the opportunity to "remove itself", the threat had the opportunity to "remove itself" BEFORE I drew my firearm.

IMHO The best you can do is know your red lines (and state laws) ahead of time, don't just carry a firearm also carry a non-lethal in your EDC kit and have good carry insurance. Rehearse the scenarios in your head and get (and maintain) excellent self-defense training, so that you're prepared in case you're faced with needing to defend against an imminent threat of death or great bodily harm.

you think spending the rest of your life in jail because a rogue prosecutor got a hair up his ass and decided to make an example of you is worth it??

I dont,,

if having my gun out ends the threat and we both go on our way why is that a bad thing??

I am not saying I wouldnt pull the trigger if need be,, just sometimes you dont have to to end the threat,,

 

[NetJedi]

you think spending the rest of your life in jail because a rogue prosecutor got a hair up his ass and decided to make an example of you is worth it??

That's the risk you take when you decide to carry a firearm and take on the role as a self-defender.

I dont,,

if having my gun out ends the threat and we both go on our way why is that a bad thing??

Because brandishing your weapon is also illegal, it's aggravated assault which will also land you in jail (for a long stretch) and the prosecution is likely to argue that you were NOT facing imminent death or great bodily harm since you if you were why didn't you need pull the trigger to stop it? Not to mention the fact that you're using your firearm as an intimidation tool instead of a self-defense tool and it may not work in that capacity to save your life.

I am not saying I wouldnt pull the trigger if need be,, just sometimes you dont have to to end the threat,,

Every situation is different, but chances are if you didn't need to pull the trigger, you didn't need to draw your firearm in the first place. IMHO Good situational awareness, having a non-lethal and avoiding going to stupid places, at stupid times, with stupid people have a high probability of you never needing to draw your weapon in the first place. I've never had to draw my firearm but I'm very comfortable that I know under what circumstances I would need to.

 

[progressive hunter]

That's the risk you take when you decide to carry a firearm and take on the role as a self-defender.

Because brandishing your weapon is also illegal, it's aggravated assault which will also land you in jail (for a long stretch) and the prosecution is likely to argue that you were NOT facing imminent death or great bodily harm since you if you were why didn't you need pull the trigger to stop it? Not to mention the fact that you're using your firearm as an intimidation tool instead of a self-defense tool and it may not work in that capacity to save your life.

Every situation is different, but chances are if you didn't need to pull the trigger, you didn't need to draw your firearm in the first place. IMHO Good situational awareness, having a non-lethal and avoiding going to stupid places, at stupid times, with stupid people have a high probability of you never needing to draw your weapon in the first place. I've never had to draw my firearm but I'm very comfortable that I know under what circumstances I would need to.

no,, thats the risk you take if you decide to shoot instead of just ending the threat and going home,,

you are free to do as you please but I am not just going to disgrace the gun community by being rambo and just shooting people when I dont have to,,

 

[NetJedi]

no,, thats the risk you take if you decide to shoot instead of just ending the threat and going home,,

You're taking greater risks than I am, since you've already drawn your weapon THREE times, I never have, thus you're far more likely to end up in jail than I am.

you are free to do as you please but I am not just going to disgrace the gun community by being rambo and just shooting people when I dont have to,,

Who's the "Rambo"? The person that has to draw their firearm THREE times without having to use it, or the one that has never had to draw that firearm but is willing to use it for what it was designed for when needed? I'm not the one running around in public waving a handgun.

As far as "disgracing the gun community", you need to do your homework and get some training, the serious members of the gun community are on MY SIDE on this question, I've trained with some of the best in business including Gunsite Academy and been told the same thing by all of them, "don't draw it if you don't intend to pull the bang switch".

 

[progressive hunter]

You're taking greater risks than I am, since you've already drawn your weapon THREE times, I never have, thus you're far more likely to end up in jail than I am.

Who's the "Rambo"? The person that has to draw their firearm THREE times without having to use it, or the one that has never had to draw that firearm but is willing to use it for what it was designed for when needed? I'm not the one running around in public waving a handgun.

As far as "disgracing the gun community", you need to do your homework and get some training, the serious members of the gun community are on MY SIDE on this question, I've trained with some of the best in business including Gunsite Academy and been told the same thing by all of them, "don't draw it if you don't intend to pull the bang switch".

whos to say I didnt walk into the situation with my gun already in my hand??

we can sit here all day and talk about scenarios and opinions and it wwont change a thing,,

not every threat requires killing someone,,


and no the serious members of the gun community are not OK with everytime pull your gun you just start shooting,,

thats whats caused the problem we have right now with cops shooting people because they thought or didnt know if a person had a weapon or that they were a threat,,

you can pull your gun out and not shoot,, its OK,,

 

[NetJedi]

whos to say I didnt walk into the situation with my gun already in my hand??

we can sit here all day and talk about scenarios and opinions and it wwont change a thing,,

not every threat requires killing someone,,

You don't seem to understand the basics, you're pulling your firearm out because you're facing imminent threat of death or great bodily harm, if that's not the case then you shouldn't drawing (or carrying around) your firearm. Learn how to avoid situations that lead to confrontations, get some quality self-defense training and carry a non-lethal, and you won't have to draw your firearm so damn often. Heaven forbid your luck runs out and you end up in jail behind an aggravated assault charge or worse IN THE MORGUE.

and no the serious members of the gun community are not OK with everytime pull your gun you just start shooting,,

thats whats caused the problem we have right now with cops shooting people because they thought or didnt know if a person had a weapon or that they were a threat,,

you can pull your gun out and not shoot,, its OK,,

No, it's ok for you to pull your gun and not shoot, until it's not. I'll continue with my strategy of using my skillset to avoid having to draw my firearm unless it's to stop an imminent threat of death or great bodily harm, in which case I'll actually use it for what it's intended for.