Merry Christmas climate naysayers

[catatomic]

Dear board,

China will cut its coal emissions/pollutions by 60 % by 2020. It will also invest heavily in Nuclear, Wind, and Solar. Since MIT doesn't appear to cover this yet, for all the details from a pro-environmentalism source you can go to Grist.

The Paris climate talks: Yes oui can!

has tons of information about the Paris talks. I will return to this forum when there are decisions to make.

Well Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays,

catatomic

 

[Iceweasel]

LOL, you believe it because....why?

 

[Crick]

Because it's Christmas

 

[catatomic]

Well now it's not Christmas and the truth is still there:

Wikipedia Coal in China.

The National Development and Reform Commission, which determines the energy policy of China, aims to keep China's coal consumption below 3.8 billion metric tonnes per annum.


Coal in China - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

so take your toys that you grinches have stolen and give them to the poor countries who have such a burden now because they only want to help!

 

[waltky]

Climate change gonna wipe out alla forests in the US...

Study: Climate Change Threatens ‘Nearly All' US Forests
February 23, 2016 - Nearly all forests in the United States are under threat from climate change, new research indicates.

Writing in the journal Global Change Biology, researchers from 14 institutions say higher temperatures and changing precipitation patterns are happening so fast the forests do not have time to respond.

The researchers say that we are already seeing the effects in the West, where bark beetles and wildfires are impacting forests. They added that climate models show a likelihood that droughts will become “more severe, frequent and prolonged” over much of the country. "Over the last two decades, warming temperatures and variable precipitation have increased the severity of forest droughts across much of the continental United States," said James S. Clark, lead author of the study and Nicholas Professor of Environmental Science at Duke University. "While the effects have been most pronounced in the West, our analysis shows virtually all U.S. forests are now experiencing change and are vulnerable to future declines," he said. "Given the high degree of uncertainty in our understanding of how forest species and stands adapt to rapid change, it's going to be difficult to anticipate the type of forests that will be here in 20 to 40 years."

The effect of drought-induced dieback of ponderosa pines in California's Tehachapi Mountains​

Clark added that forests in the Eastern U.S. are particularly vulnerable. "Prolonged drought affects wildfire risks, species distribution, forest biodiversity and productivity, and virtually all goods and services provided by forests, so there is a pressing need to know what is happening now, what might happen in the future and how we can manage for these changes," Clark said.

He added that while there is a good understanding of how climate change effects individual trees, there is “still uncertainty about what might happen at the species-wide or stand-wide levels, particularly in Eastern forests.” “These are the scales where we really need reliable predictions so forest managers can take steps now to help reduce large-scale problems," he said.

Study: Climate Change Threatens ‘Nearly All' US Forests

 

[skookerasbil]

OK.....I'll nominate this thread as STOOPIDEST OF THE YEAR for 2016. Of course, its still early but this one will be up there by years end...........

By 2050, China will have increased coal production by......ready for this......50%. Even the Obama EIA concurs!!!

World Coal Consumption To Surpass Oil By 2020 Due To Rising Demand In China And India

China’s Growing Coal Use Is World’s Growing Problem

10 predictions for the world's energy future



Happy New Year!!!

 

[skookerasbil]

Who's not winning?

 

[catatomic]

You obviously. You wait 'til I'm gone and then you post three articles that don't negate what I said.

I'll raise you that China wants to get rid of Coal in the '30s.

 

[flacaltenn]

You obviously. You wait 'til I'm gone and then you post three articles that don't negate what I said.

I'll raise you that China wants to get rid of Coal in the '30s.

You sure are gullible. But that's expected. You need to get grounded in reality. Until about 2012 China was opening 2 to 3 coal plants a WEEK !!. And that is slowing now --- down about 50% in actual BUILD rate.. Not likely those plants are going away in 2030 or even maybe 2040.. Here's where wind/solar stand now with regard to coal/gas.

over 80% of their "renewable" source is HUGE environmentally UGLY Hydro plants. ACTUALLY those are a LARGE source of CO2 for at least 20 years because they are new. Not many people appreciate that. But BURYING all that land and flooding it causes HUGE net carbon SEEPS into the atmos.

Wind/Solar and OTHER are barely visible on that mountain. And will never exceed about 20% of the capacity because of the realities of how demand changes during the day and night. And the overall FLAKY performance of wind/solar..

The coal segment is not going away unless China economy takes a big dump.. NUCLEAR is the only option to keep up with growth..

But yet your original OP did not exactly lie..

China will cut its coal emissions/pollutions by 60 % by 2020. It will also invest heavily in Nuclear, Wind, and Solar.

This IS quite possible because they did not build in the complex scrubbers/emission controls that they SHOULD have in the first place. Which is GOOD NEWS for people's health when they take a breather ( ) and do some retrofitting.. But it's BAD NEWS for "the planet climate" because the more completely you burn ANYTHING -- the more CO2 is produced. CO2 is an indication of complete efficient combustion.

I don't blame you for knowing that CO2 is not a pollutant because your "movement knowledge" has been purposely concocted to confuse the 2 issues of Global Warming and :"carbon pollution"..

Try building out massive new HYDRO plants in this country and calling them "renewable and green". The Sierra Club would beat you senseless. BUT -- that's China's other "clean" alternative besides nuclear..

And P.S. ------ Merry Christmas to you too !!!!

 

[catatomic]

Thank you for not calling my claim a lie. It isn't. It is accelerating and they are cutting into that acceleration by 60%, enough to keep it level by 2020. It will hurt their economy no doubt in the short term.

Wikipedia Coal in China.

"The National Development and Reform Commission, which determines the energy policy of China, aims to keep China's coal consumption below 3.8 billion metric tonnes per annum." Then look at the chart (Coal production in China 1950-2012).

As for Hydroelectricity - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia , says "
Reduced CO2 emissions
Since hydroelectric dams do not burn fossil fuels, they do not directly produce carbon dioxide. While some carbon dioxide is produced during manufacture and construction of the project, this is a tiny fraction of the operating emissions of equivalent fossil-fuel electricity generation."

I think they will do a lot of hydro if I were to guess; but I know from the third paragraph above that they will do it one way or another.

I recommend reading this as well: it might just change your mind about the feeling you have for what you just posted

China’s greenhouse emissions might already have peaked

Adding scrubbers/emission controls/sequestering carbon underground I had already factored - America wants to sequester CO2 as well - but the equations know this already. That helps them do it!

I don't look at any one thing like your CO2 argument; I have insisted since I got here that the whole picture should be looked at, including the whole picture about CO2.

And happy St. Patrick's Day.

 

[waltky]

Granny says, "Dat's right - fire, flames an' vapors o' smoke like inna Bible - we all gonna die...

White House ‘Fact Sheet’ Says Climate Change Could Kill 27,000 Americans In Summer of 2100
April 11, 2016 | – In a “fact sheet” issued by the White House in conjunction with a climate change report made public last week, one of the impacts of increasing temperatures is the deaths of thousands of American people over the course of one summer.

“Extreme heat can be expected to cause an increase in the number of premature deaths, from thousands to tens of thousands, each summer, which will outpace projected decreases in deaths from extreme cold,” the fact sheet stated.

Fire near Ventura, California.​

“One model projected an increase, from a 1990 baseline for more than 200 American cities, of more than an additional 11,000 deaths during the summer in 2030 and more than an additional 27,000 deaths during the summer in 2100,” the fact sheet said.

The summary of the climate change report, titled “The Impacts of Climate Change on Human Health in the United States: A Scientific Assessment,” states that climate change is “a significant threat to the American people” and that the findings in the report “represent an improvement in scientific confidence in the link between climate change and a broad range of threats to public health.”

White House ‘Fact Sheet’ Says Climate Change Could Kill 27,000 Americans In Summer of 2100