Nazis were Fascist not socialists

[Blaster]

Are you a Democrat now?

I think he has too much self respect to be a Democrat.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

They only used socialists in their party name because it was very popular at the time

They hated the working class , peasants and unions

Their pact with giant corporations and industries was only to benefit the elites of the party

Hitler hated communist and many Jews were also far leftist in Europe and communism members

Not this shit again

 

[Blaster]

Mussolini broke with Italian socialists in 1919. Fascism was embraced by hard right Italian conservatives.

Socialism and fascism are very similar.

 

[Litwin]

Socialism and fascism are very similar.

whats about communism and nazism ?
ps

 

[Pellinore]

Fascism is a form of socialism.

Socialism and fascism are very similar.

You are both mistaken.

They don't even measure the same thing (economy vs. government), but even with that in mind, they are diametrically opposed.

The core idea behind socialism is that every person owns the means of production equally.

The last thing the fascists ever want is to be seen equal with the lower classes. Nazis, for example, would never, ever want to be considered equal with Jews.

The name was basically branding. That happens a lot in politics.

 

[westwall]

You are both mistaken.

They don't even measure the same thing (economy vs. government), but even with that in mind, they are diametrically opposed.

The core idea behind socialism is that every person owns the means of production equally.

The last thing the fascists ever want is to be seen equal with the lower classes. Nazis, for example, would never, ever want to be considered equal with Jews.

The name was basically branding. That happens a lot in politics.

Yes, they do. Under fascism the corporations were still controlled by the State. The State just did not own them. But every aspect of what the corporations produced was absolutely controlled by the State. They told you what to make, where to obtain resources, and how much you were allowed to charge for your product.

In other words, SOCIALIST.

 

[Deadstick]

The farther left they go, the more people they kill.

Yes he gassed 6million Jews, behave yourself.

 

[Deadstick]

You are both mistaken.

They don't even measure the same thing (economy vs. government), but even with that in mind, they are diametrically opposed.

The core idea behind socialism is that every person owns the means of production equally.

The last thing the fascists ever want is to be seen equal with the lower classes. Nazis, for example, would never, ever want to be considered equal with Jews.

The name was basically branding. That happens a lot in politics.

They know that but want it both ways.

 

[Pellinore]

Yes, they do. Under fascism the corporations were still controlled by the State. The State just did not own them. But every aspect of what the corporations produced was absolutely controlled by the State. They told you what to make, where to obtain resources, and how much you were allowed to charge for your product.

In other words, SOCIALIST.

But did you see what you just wrote? They CHARGED. Socialism doesn't charge money.

I will go back once again to the example I often use: the fire department. They are an industry, whose product is a service (putting out fires). They are publicly owned and administered through the government. They are supported by each of us, according to our ability (through taxes). They have no cost or price point for their services, and give it out free of charge based on need (to the person whose house is on fire). That is the epitome of an industry based on socialist ideals.

The Marxist ideal was an entire society where every industry would be run by that. If you had a gift for making burgers, the government would assign you to the burger joint, they would make the kind of burgers they thought people needed and if you were hungry, they would give you a burger. The idea was if everything reached this Utopia, we wouldn't need social hierarchy or money or, eventually, government.

Communism was a bunch of autocrats who promised this Marxist ideal of ultimate socialism, then kept the power for themselves.

Fascists are also a bunch of autocrats but they don't promise equality like that. They are extreme hard-line nationalists, who say that their nation of people are better, and therefore deserve more from society than those others. They love the social hierarchy, with them on top. They love money, for themselves. They embrace private ownership of companies but they demand their loyalty and will favor the ones who give it; for the same reason, they can't stand labor unions.

This is Politics 101. It's been exactly the same for a hundred years, through WWII and the whole Cold War, and you should have been taught this in middle or high school. Go dig out your textbooks, it's still in there. There's big business in trying to convince people that socialism is bad, but don't fall for it; it's just a tool.

 

[Pellinore]

They know that but want it both ways.

I disagree. My experience tells me that most of the people who believe this aren't motivated by greed, but have instead been misled. Various bad actors with a lot of money and power at stake have been trying to rile people up against socialism for longer than any of us have been alive, and what better way then to equate it with the hated Nazis?

Nobody like to have to rethink what they're that invested in, though, much less admit that they were wrong or have been fooled, so it's a perpetual uphill battle.

 

[Deadstick]

I disagree. My experience tells me that most of the people who believe this aren't motivated by greed, but have instead been misled. Various bad actors with a lot of money and power at stake have been trying to rile people up against socialism for longer than any of us have been alive, and what better way then to equate it with the hated Nazis?

Nobody like to have to rethink what they're that invested in, though, much less admit that they were wrong or have been fooled, so it's a perpetual uphill battle.

The brainwashing of the herd has been going on for a very long time. it is worse in America where the word Socialist has become a a term of abuse, many don't know the difference between Socialism and Communism, even Communist states had differences.

 

[westwall]

But did you see what you just wrote? They CHARGED. Socialism doesn't charge money.

I will go back once again to the example I often use: the fire department. They are an industry, whose product is a service (putting out fires). They are publicly owned and administered through the government. They are supported by each of us, according to our ability (through taxes). They have no cost or price point for their services, and give it out free of charge based on need (to the person whose house is on fire). That is the epitome of an industry based on socialist ideals.

The Marxist ideal was an entire society where every industry would be run by that. If you had a gift for making burgers, the government would assign you to the burger joint, they would make the kind of burgers they thought people needed and if you were hungry, they would give you a burger. The idea was if everything reached this Utopia, we wouldn't need social hierarchy or money or, eventually, government.

Communism was a bunch of autocrats who promised this Marxist ideal of ultimate socialism, then kept the power for themselves.

Fascists are also a bunch of autocrats but they don't promise equality like that. They are extreme hard-line nationalists, who say that their nation of people are better, and therefore deserve more from society than those others. They love the social hierarchy, with them on top. They love money, for themselves. They embrace private ownership of companies but they demand their loyalty and will favor the ones who give it; for the same reason, they can't stand labor unions.

This is Politics 101. It's been exactly the same for a hundred years, through WWII and the whole Cold War, and you should have been taught this in middle or high school. Go dig out your textbooks, it's still in there. There's big business in trying to convince people that socialism is bad, but don't fall for it; it's just a tool.

What are taxes?

 

[Pellinore]

What are taxes?

I take it that that is your way of saying that services such as the fire brigade do charge us, in the form of taxes. They do not; you pay the same amount of taxes whether they come to your house or not. That amount is based on your ability (income, most notably), not an amount they charge you for their services. It's a different system.

If you have another question beyond that, go ahead and spit it out.

 

[westwall]

I take it that that is your way of saying that services such as the fire brigade do charge us, in the form of taxes. They do not; you pay the same amount of taxes whether they come to your house or not. That amount is based on your ability (income, most notably), not an amount they charge you for their services. It's a different system.

If you have another question beyond that, go ahead and spit it out.

You claimed socialism doesn't "charge" money.

So, yet again. What are taxes?

 

[Pellinore]

You claimed socialism doesn't "charge" money.

So, yet again. What are taxes?

I've already answered that. Goods and services from industries run on a socialist dynamic do not charge for those goods or services at the time; they are dispatched free of charge according to need.

People pay taxes based on their ability to do so. People who make nearly nothing pay no income tax, but people who make a fortune pay a lot more.

If you can't see the difference between everyone paying taxes based on ability, and being charged for services as you use them, then I can't help you.

And since you focus on just that one word, I assume you understand the rest. Good.

 

[BackAgain]

Nazis were fascist socialists among other crap.

 

[westwall]

I've already answered that. Goods and services from industries run on a socialist dynamic do not charge for those goods or services at the time; they are dispatched free of charge according to need.

People pay taxes based on their ability to do so. People who make nearly nothing pay no income tax, but people who make a fortune pay a lot more.

If you can't see the difference between everyone paying taxes based on ability, and being charged for services as you use them, then I can't help you.

And since you focus on just that one word, I assume you understand the rest. Good.

How do those goods and services get paid for?

Magic?

 

[Pellinore]

How do those goods and services get paid for?

Magic?

I've already explained that several times, and I'm done here. Have a good week.

 

[westwall]

I've already explained that several times, and I'm done here. Have a good week.

No, you haven't explained anything. Merely saying "they are provided for based on need" doesn't explain how they are PAID FOR!