Zone1 sacraments are unbiblical

[ding]

The Coptic church was started in 42 AD.

And?

 

[hobelim]

Not sure what this is all about. First of all, what are "Sacraments?"

Mithraism, the secret "MYSTERY RELIGION"of the Roman government and military originated in Babylon, had seven sacraments that the Roman church follows exactly, a trinity, and a special meal where "believers" could partake in the divine nature of Mithras by eating bread and drinking blood existed from the 1st to the 4th century then "mysteriously", lol, disappeared when Rome unleashed on the world the antichrist, a false counterfeit Jesus created in the likeness of Mithras.

Mithraism was an ascetic, anti-female religion. Its priesthood consisted of celibate men only

 

[Cougarbear]

Mithraism, the secret "MYSTERY RELIGION"of the Roman government and military originated in Babylon, had seven sacraments that the Roman church follows exactly, a trinity, and a special meal where "believers" could partake in the divine nature of Mithras by eating bread and drinking blood existed from the 1st to the 4th century then "mysteriously", lol, disappeared when Rome unleashed on the world the antichrist, a false counterfeit Jesus created in the likeness of Mithras.

Mithraism was an ascetic, anti-female religion. Its priesthood consisted of celibate men only

Israel for thousands of years was a patriarchal priesthood after Aaron, brother of Moses. Nothing new. Nothing anti-women either. Look how Churches praise and revere Mary, the mother of Jesus. It’s you who are the counterfeit and liar. As far as drinking real blood was not done among the followers of Jesus Christ even after his resurrection. Romans may have been doing this but not believers in Christ. I reject the idea that the bread changes into actual flesh and blood as the scriptures are clear he established this ordinance of the Sacrament only for remembrance of his atonement washing away our sins. His work washed away our sins. Not some bread and wine we may eat or drink. Note that Catholic Masses don’t allow the members to drink the wine. Actually, because of a new commandment in these latter days, our church uses water or any fluid if the water isn’t good to drink. Even grape juice.

 

[hobelim]

I reject the idea that the bread changes into actual flesh and blood as the scriptures are clear he established this ordinance of the Sacrament only for remembrance of his atonement washing away our sins.

I hate to break the news to you sweetness but even symbolically eating the flesh of Jesus and drinking his blood or grape juice in memory of his so called "sacrificial atonement" that washed away your sins, even though as you said you sin every single day, is reprehensible. If your sins were washed away how is it that you still sin daily? Sin is disobedience to the Law the consequence for sin is death. You would let an innocent man Jesus pay the penalty for your sins?

What a gal! I am sure that Jesus is very impressed by your love for him and devotion to sin. I am.

If you were blind you would not be guilty of sin, but because you say "We see" your guilt remains.

His work washed away our sins.

Jesus said that his task was to bear witness to the truth, the truth that revealed the wisdom of God in the hidden meaning of the figurative words and deeper subjects of the Law which fulfills the promise of eternal life here and now on earth (not when you die after living like a schnook for your entire life) for anyone and everyone who listens to his teaching and acts on this revelation from God freeing them all forever from the death consequent for failing to comply with Divine law.

If you continue to sin you will remain dead, no matter how much you blubber about loving Jesus as you celebrate his crucifixion and death by eating bread and drinking water or grape juice. derp

 

[Cougarbear]

I hate to break the news to you sweetness but even symbolically eating the flesh of Jesus and drinking his blood or grape juice in memory of his so called "sacrificial atonement" that washed away your sins, even though as you said you sin every single day, is reprehensible. If your sins were washed away how is it that you still sin daily? Sin is disobedience to the Law the consequence for sin is death. You would let an innocent man Jesus pay the penalty for your sins?

What a gal! I am sure that Jesus is very impressed by your love for him and devotion to sin. I am.

If you were blind you would not be guilty of sin, but because you say "We see" your guilt remains.



Jesus said that his task was to bear witness to the truth, the truth that revealed the wisdom of God in the hidden meaning of the figurative words and deeper subjects of the Law which fulfills the promise of eternal life here and now on earth (not when you die after living like a schnook for your entire life) for anyone and everyone who listens to his teaching and acts on this revelation from God freeing them all forever from the death consequent for failing to comply with Divine law.

If you continue to sin you will remain dead, no matter how much you blubber about loving Jesus as you celebrate his crucifixion and death by eating bread and drinking water or grape juice. derp

You have no ability to understand a thing. Your mind is like talking to a nat. At the moment of baptism for one who is older than age 8, like I was 24, the sins up to that point are washed away and you are reborn without sin. No more worrying about the sins you committed in the past. But, from that point on, we are still human and we still sin. Some are very small sins while others close to denying the Holy Ghost. The Sacraments are not baptism all over again. This is a covenant between the Lord and myself to partake of these Sacraments to remember my baptism and not forget to repent everyday from Sabbath to Sabbath. It's a tool for us to renew our covenants of baptism (those of us who have also made Temple Covenants to remember them too) so we don't forget him and fall back into the ways of the world. Like you do every day not keeping the spirit of the Law. As an example, Jesus said not to commit adultery for that is the letter of the law. But, he gave us a higher law to not entertain adultery in your mind and heart because you have already committed adultery by doing so. Jews and Jews for Jesus don't like this. But, this is part of our higher law the Jesus instituted.

Some of what you say reminds me of Southern Baptists teaching that once you repent and believe you are forgiven, you never have to worry about not obtaining the kingdom of God. You have been saved once and that is all that is necessary. You can go out and commit the act of sin like banging your sister or your neighbor's husband. But, that's okay because you already accepted Jesus Christ as your personal Savior. If that were the case, then Judas is in heaven. But, he is not, is he?

There are two deaths. The first is physical death in which your spirit leaves your body and the body returns to dust of the earth. The second is spiritual death. Jesus was interested in teaching how to not receive a second spiritual death by sinning and not repenting. Our separation from the visible God is the first spiritual death. After our death and judgment, if we deny the Holy Ghost, we will receive a second spiritual death never to be with our Father in Heaven again. I have been repenting since 1977 and am still alive. I will eventually die and hopefully go to Paradise to await my final judgement. You throw out what appears to be scriptures but you did not give us the reference in the Bible for your words. Deceptive practices.

 

[hobelim]

You have no ability to understand a thing. Your mind is like talking to a nat. At the moment of baptism for one who is older than age 8, like I was 24, the sins up to that point are washed away and you are reborn without sin.

Nice fantasy!

If you were reborn without sin and then continue to sin all you can have is a terrifying expectation of judgment, the death, a curse, that you so perfectly display by failing to grasp your predicament in the fact that what you believe is true, a religious duty and holy obligation, is in itself sinful.

You brazenly perjure yourself in the name of God and desecrate the teachings of Jesus daily.

If scripture is true and God is God and what Jesus taught is true then, my dear, you are fucked.

 

[Cougarbear]

Nice fantasy!

If you were reborn without sin and then continue to sin all you can have is a terrifying expectation of judgment, the death, a curse, that you so perfectly display by failing to grasp your predicament in the fact that what you believe is true, a religious duty and holy obligation, is in itself sinful.

You brazenly perjure yourself in the name of God and desecrate the teachings of Jesus daily.

If scripture is true and God is God and what Jesus taught is true then, my dear, you are fucked.

You deny Jesus Christ. Why? He taught that all sin and come short the glory of God. He taught to repent and be baptized as it’s the only way back to the highest degree in Heaven. You are spreading false doctrine and will be judged on it.

 

[hobelim]

You deny Jesus Christ. Why?

I don't deny Jesus. Everything I have made known to you I have drawn from what Jesus taught.

I deny your version of Jesus because it's false, a substitute counterfeit Jesus that never existed, the Antichrist, conjured from the depths of a Roman hell and unleashed on the world in 325 CE, with all the wondrous signs and miracles of the bald faced lie that scripture is to be taken literally.

You have eaten lies. The blood of vile and loathsome creatures is dripping from your unclean lips

THIS IS NOT KOSHER!

He taught to repent and be baptized as it’s the only way back to the highest degree in Heaven.

So when are you going to get around to doing just that? Not to worry! I'm here to help. You are being baptized by the Holy Spirit with fire. Water doesn't seem to have done a damn thing for you

You are spreading false doctrine and will be judged on it.

You have fallen for the bullshit of a religious deceiver and so have died and descended into hell.

YOU HAVE YOUR REWARD ALREADY!

Unless you repent you will never enter the kingdom of Heaven. And never is a very very long time.

 

[Cougarbear]

I don't deny Jesus. Everything I have made known to you I have drawn from what Jesus taught.

I deny your version of Jesus because it's false, a substitute counterfeit Jesus that never existed, the Antichrist, conjured from the depths of a Roman hell and unleashed on the world in 325 CE, with all the wondrous signs and miracles of the bald faced lie that scripture is to be taken literally.

You have eaten lies. The blood of vile and loathsome creatures is dripping from your unclean lips

If you reject the Bible you deny Jesus Christ. What other records are you reading from about Jesus Christ that suggests he did not atone for our sins? Please share these with us... If you can.

 

[hobelim]

If you reject the Bible you deny Jesus Christ. What other records are you reading from about Jesus Christ that suggests he did not atone for our sins? Please share these with us... If you can.

Like I said; Everything I have made known to you I have drawn from what Jesus taught as recorded in the Gospels. Everyone is held accountable for their own sins, everyone must bear their own cross. Its all on you. Jesus won't do it for you. No one can do it for you. Not even God.

When you screw up you must repent to atone for your own mistakes. Jesus showed the way.

Your belief that Jesus, an innocent man, suffered and died for your sins is REPREHENSIBLE.

 

[kjw47]

By David J. Stewart​

All the grace we will ever need is received the moment we trust Jesus, by faith, as Savior (Ephesians 2:8-9). The saving grace that is granted at the moment of genuine faith is the only saving grace God’s Word calls on us to receive. This grace is received by faith, not by observing rituals. So, while the seven sacraments are “good things to do,” when they are understood in a biblical context, the concept of the seven sacraments as “conferring sanctifying grace” is completely unbiblical.

Sacraments are Unbiblical​

None serving a non existent god will get Grace. The religionsssssssssssssssss serving a non existent god teach a false Jesus.

 

[Cougarbear]

Like I said; Everything I have made known to you I have drawn from what Jesus taught as recorded in the Gospels. Everyone is held accountable for their own sins, everyone must bear their own cross. Its all on you. Jesus won't do it for you. No one can do it for you. Not even God.

When you screw up you must repent to atone for your own stupid mistakes.

Your belief that Jesus, an innocent man, suffered and died for your sins is REPREHENSIBLE.

Uggg... you are just spinning what I've stated. Of course we are responsible for our own sins and not the sins of Adam. Jesus commanded us to repent and be baptized in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost, the Godhead. We are then baptized for the remission of sins as stated clearly in the Gospels. It's an act of acceptance, commitment and covenant with God. However, we cannot always fully repent and make restitution. What we cannot do properly is supplemented with the atoning sacrifice of the only begotten of the Father in the flesh, Jesus Christ. What the heck to you think he was doing at the Garden of Gethsemane? He was taking upon him the sins of the repented washing them away. Without this, your repentance cannot be whole.

 

[hobelim]

We are then baptized for the remission of sins as stated clearly in the Gospels.

Baptism was done AS A TOKEN OF REPENTANCE for the forgiveness of sins. Unless a person actually bears fruit worthy of repentance there is no forgiveness. The guilt of their sin remains.

No matter how holy or righteous Jesus was. No matter how much you blubber about loving Jesus, no matter how many songs you sing, candles you light, or money you toss at your preacher.

 

[Cougarbear]

Baptism was done AS A TOKEN OF REPENTANCE for the forgiveness of sins. Unless a person actually bears fruit worthy of repentance there is no forgiveness. The guilt of their sin remains.

No matter how holy or righteous Jesus was. No matter how much you blubber about loving Jesus

So? Again, you may think you have done all you can do to repent. But the person you offended doesn’t think so. Where’s the mediator in your bottomless mind? You need to study more and maybe you will read that Jesus atoned for my sins as long as I’ve done everything I can. He will carry us the rest of the way because of your atonement.

 

[Cougarbear]

Baptism was done AS A TOKEN OF REPENTANCE for the forgiveness of sins. Unless a person actually bears fruit worthy of repentance there is no forgiveness. The guilt of their sin remains.

No matter how holy or righteous Jesus was. No matter how much you blubber about loving Jesus, no matter how many songs you sing, candles you light, or money you toss at your preacher.

So, the question you pose is that the Atonement isn't necessary. Maybe you need some information what the Atonement is:
As used in the scriptures, to atone is to suffer the penalty for sins, thereby removing the effects of sin from the repentant sinner and allowing him or her to be reconciled to God. Jesus Christ was the only one capable of carrying out the Atonement for all mankind. Because of His Atonement, all people will be resurrected, and those who obey His gospel will receive the gift of eternal life with God.

Simply put, if you commit adultery, how do you fully repent and make restitution for the pain and hurt of those who you injured like your wife? There's a penalty for adultery but how do you fully repent and make restitution? You can't. The act in the Garden of Gethsemane will take the pain away from your wife and allow your repentance to be fully fulfilled. A young man ran a stop sign in which I slammed into him going 45 miles an hour. He was not hurt. I was a bit sore and my car was totaled. His father was willing to buy me a new car. I turned him down when I found out he had done this 3 other times, was driving without a driver's license and left the scene as well. It was time for him to pay the price and live in jail for a while. I've long forgiven him as he paid as much of the price as he could by losing his freedom for awhile. But, every time I go through the same intersection, I still slow down and remember. The atonement will eventually take this away. Eventually, the pain you cause your wife for adultery will be taken from her and paid by Jesus Christ while he was in the Garden of Gethsemane.

Also, the Atonement also included his crucifixion and his resurrection as well. We are to repent as much as we possibly can and Jesus will forgive us and pay whatever price needs to be paid. But, there is nothing we can do on our own for the sins of Adam that caused us to be mortal and die. We are unable to resurrect ourselves. Jesus Christ's atonement paved the way for us to also be resurrected regardless of how well we repented or not. By the Lord's grace, all of our bodies will not be left in the grave. We all, righteous or wicked, will be resurrected. That's the grace or gift God talks about. That's what Paul talked about. The status and place we end up with after judgment and resurrection will depend upon our belief in Christ and acceptance of him as our personal Savior.

 

[ninja007]

None serving a non existent god will get Grace. The religionsssssssssssssssss serving a non existent god teach a false Jesus.

the one teaching a false Jesus is your cult- repent while you can.

 

[kjw47]

the one teaching a false Jesus is your cult- repent while you can.

This cult- A house divided( hundreds of trinity religions) will not stand--I don't belong to that cult. They are a mass of confusion.

 

[hobelim]

So, the question you pose is that the Atonement isn't necessary.

Jesus died trying to teach his people that the law, specifically kosher law, was not about food. His death doesn't do anyone any good unless they listen to what he said, eat his flesh, and act on it, drink his blood, comply with the deeper meaning of the laws demands according to his revelation

Life is in the blood. In the doing. You live on earth. You have been deceived. Does this shock you?

There is no such thing as a Jesus who atoned for the sins of everyone who has or ever will live.

"They pay no heed to the real hidden meaning of things but divert themselves instead with all kinds of iniquitous arcane lore. They do not know the hidden meaning of what is actually taking place, nor have they ever understood the lessons of the past. Consequently, they have no knowledge of what is coming upon them and have done nothing to save their souls from the deeper implications of present events."

 

[hobelim]

maybe you will read that Jesus atoned for my sins as long as I’ve done everything I can. He will carry us the rest of the way because of your atonement.

My atonement? What in hell are you blabbing about now? lol. Nevermind. I really don't care.

You don't seem to mind or think anything is wrong with an innocent man paying for your sins. And so you, a dingbat "without blemish" have been carefully chosen and prepared as an offering for the expiation of sin. Don't worry! Your slaughter has been dedicated to the Lord, my God.

No temples, no priests, no fancy robes, no knives, no theatrics, no blood, no bullshit necessary.

Many will feast on the flesh trimmed from the fat after your blood is soaked up into the ground, and the smell of the fat thrown on the fire is a soothing and fragrant offering to the Lord, my God.

You are as guilty as sin. Your sacrifice will prove right the Jesus you pretend to love so very much.

So be happy!

 

[ding]

My atonement? What in hell are you blabbing about now? lol. Nevermind. I really don't care.

You don't seem to mind or think anything is wrong with an innocent man paying for your sins. And so you, a dingbat "without blemish" have been carefully chosen and prepared as an offering for the expiation of sin. Don't worry! Your slaughter has been dedicated to the Lord, my God.

No temples, no priests, no fancy robes, no knives, no theatrics, no blood, no bullshit necessary.

Many will feast on the flesh trimmed from the fat after your blood is soaked up into the ground, and the smell of the fat thrown on the fire is a soothing and fragrant offering to the Lord, my God.

You are as guilty as sin. Your sacrifice will prove right the Jesus you pretend to love so very much.

So be happy!

I'd love to see you try it. Then you'd find out real fast what happens to smack talking assholes in the real world.