The NYPD Are Making Themselves Look Really Small With Their Anti-DeBlasio Antics

[zeke]

It is clear to any decent human being that excessive and unnecessary force was used...IMMEDIATELY. No discussion, no attempt to diffuse or deescalate...a gang of thugs pounced on this man, choked him, applied brute force to his neck, head and chest causing his death...

What people don't get is that it wouldn't matter to me, or I believe to you, that either of us would have been happy with the way the cops went about their business IF the guy they were trying to arrest was white.

In a later post, Mac alludes to the fact folks like me are upset with the NYC police because Garner was black. I don't give a shit what color the guy was, being "arrested" in the manner he was for the "crime" of selling cigs is bullshit and the police should be condemned for their actions. And someone punished.

I know you will refuse to put even the tiniest shred of blame on Garner because he's black and you're a member of the PC Police.

You are the one slickly selling the racial angle there Mac. PC police my ass is you dude. Trying to tell others what they are thinking and believing based on what YOU think they should be thinking. That's PC Police to the macs.

 

[Ravi]

You said you get what you pay for while extolling the way cops treat people in wealthy neighborhoods. You know what you said. Own it and stop trying to lie. Shit.

"you get what you pay for" = "poor people deserve no respect from cops."

You're a dick.

Come on man.....why get all offended now? You fucking said it. What could you possibly have meant? Your problem seems to be that you THINK you are talking to an idiot.

Your words were very clear. Own them.

You're just being a dick. I'm not offended, it's just what you are doing. I just said cops know what community pays most of their salary, I'm sure they're feeling a lot more support from us too. The link to an implication that poor people somehow deserve anything was completely and utterly fabricated by you in your effort to be a dick. And you succeeded, you are being a dick.

I support justice, I'm not pro-cop or anti-cop. I do see though why I missed you supporting the cops though, LOL. It wasn't there...

You're basically saying cops mainly protect the wealthy. This true but it isn't what they are hired for.

Strawman

Coward that can't even admit to his own words

 

[kaz]

"you get what you pay for" = "poor people deserve no respect from cops."

You're a dick.

Come on man.....why get all offended now? You fucking said it. What could you possibly have meant? Your problem seems to be that you THINK you are talking to an idiot.

Your words were very clear. Own them.

You're just being a dick. I'm not offended, it's just what you are doing. I just said cops know what community pays most of their salary, I'm sure they're feeling a lot more support from us too. The link to an implication that poor people somehow deserve anything was completely and utterly fabricated by you in your effort to be a dick. And you succeeded, you are being a dick.

I support justice, I'm not pro-cop or anti-cop. I do see though why I missed you supporting the cops though, LOL. It wasn't there...

You're basically saying cops mainly protect the wealthy. This true but it isn't what they are hired for.

Strawman

Coward that can't even admit to his own words

Neither of you can show a quote I said anything about the poor and cops much less that. That's why liberals are so good at being offended, you really want to be offended.

But obviously you two geniuses know what I meant more than I do, right Ravi? What a couple of arrogant, condescending self deluded asses you are.

 

[Theowl32]

I hope this is not in any way insinuating the fat ghetto thug was not doing anything wrong.

Oh wait, the left actually still thinks the thug criminal was shot in the back for no reason, other than he was black.

 

[Mac1958]

WOW, you are a real piece of work. When did the crime of selling a cigarette become a death sentence?

Huh?

They both resisted arrest, precisely as I said. Selling a cigarette has nothing to do with it.

You're not really denying they resisted arrest, are you? What does that have to do with cigarettes?

Your thought processes are completely distorted by your ideology, speaking of being "a piece of work".

.

Garner's "crime" deserved a summons, not an arrest. And anyone who watches the video can see police used excessive and unnecessary force.

As a matter of FACT, his death was ruled a homicide. But morally bankrupt people like you just turn a blind eye to crimes of the police state.

So you're saying he was not resisting arrest?

Yes or no?

Surely you know by now you can't deflect with me.

Yes or no?

.

The king of deflection pounding his chest? What I do know about you is that as soon as you are confronted with the fact that you always attack the left, you cut and run. You watch the video, do you hear any officer state that he is under arrest? Were Miranda rights issued? Did police clearly state "you are under arrest"?

It is clear to any decent human being that excessive and unnecessary force was used...IMMEDIATELY. No discussion, no attempt to diffuse or deescalate...a gang of thugs pounced on this man, choked him, applied brute force to his neck, head and chest causing his death...

It was ruled a HOMICIDE...

"It is the job of thinking people not to be on the side of the executioners"
Albert Camus


"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government."
Thomas Jefferson to the Republican Citizens of Washington County, Maryland" (March 31, 1809).


But don't deviate from your attack on those of us who are appalled by this police state thuggery.

As I've said multiple times on multiple threads, I think the officer was wrong and that the Grand Jury was wrong.

Did you think you had me there?

Wanna try again?

I know you will refuse to put even the tiniest shred of blame on Garner because he's black and you're a member of the PC Police. You are ideologically committed to spinning and lying to push your partisan agenda. Fine. I know how that is. What I don't understand is why you don't just confine your silly hardcore left wing partisan arguments for hardcore right wing partisans who want to play your games.

.

My liberal beliefs have nothing to do with what your obsessive PC vitriol. It has to do with just plain CORRECT. I place human life above all else. Eric Garner was a human being, a father, a husband and a US citizen. His skin color is irrelevant. If being appalled by seeing excessive police state abuse one would expect in some Islamic police state, Nazi Germany, or Iron curtain country play out on an American street makes me hardcore, then I am guilty.

You accuse me of refusing to put the "tiniest" blame on Eric Garner, but the fact that there is not a PEEP from you in response to the right who place all the blame on Eric Garner is telling. You are just too big of a coward to acknowledge that you are one of them.

It sure must help to ignore what I actually say to make your simplistic accusations.

I would much prefer you played your games with a right wing counterpart.

.

 

[Mac1958]

.

The cops' actions in both the Brown and Garner deaths were questionable enough for the Grand Juries to at least move forward.

At the same time, both guys resisted arrest and would most likely be alive today had they not.

As with any issue, there are two perfectly reasonable sides to a story. And both are usually ignored by the other "side".

.

I would argue the grand jury investigations in both cases denied both sides an opportunity to accurately gauge the truth. IMHO, two trials in open court would have answered many questions.

It certainly seemed to that there was enough of a question in both cases to move forward to get the facts in depth.

Wouldn't it make sense to look at revising the GJ process when a public servant is accused?

There are clear potential conflicts of interest in that situation.

.

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

How are they helping the situation by vehemently, publicly and visibly defying their boss, the mayor of New York City?

They must think that the mayor should pander to their every whim, wish and demand. He doesn't work for the police department, he works the city at large.

Not to mention not setting a good example. They are only making things worse.

Policemen's unions around the country have formed a coalition against de Blasio. Ever since wimpy Darrell Wilson lost control and killed an unarmed kid in Ferguson, the police unions from coast to coast have circled their wagons.

They don't care if they start a race war, they have more guns, bigger guns, body armor and tanks.

 

[Bfgrn]

Garner's "crime" deserved a summons, not an arrest. And anyone who watches the video can see police used excessive and unnecessary force.

As a matter of FACT, his death was ruled a homicide. But morally bankrupt people like you just turn a blind eye to crimes of the police state.

So you're saying he was not resisting arrest?

Yes or no?

Surely you know by now you can't deflect with me.

Yes or no?

.

The king of deflection pounding his chest? What I do know about you is that as soon as you are confronted with the fact that you always attack the left, you cut and run. You watch the video, do you hear any officer state that he is under arrest? Were Miranda rights issued? Did police clearly state "you are under arrest"?

It is clear to any decent human being that excessive and unnecessary force was used...IMMEDIATELY. No discussion, no attempt to diffuse or deescalate...a gang of thugs pounced on this man, choked him, applied brute force to his neck, head and chest causing his death...

It was ruled a HOMICIDE...

"It is the job of thinking people not to be on the side of the executioners"
Albert Camus


"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government."
Thomas Jefferson to the Republican Citizens of Washington County, Maryland" (March 31, 1809).


But don't deviate from your attack on those of us who are appalled by this police state thuggery.

As I've said multiple times on multiple threads, I think the officer was wrong and that the Grand Jury was wrong.

Did you think you had me there?

Wanna try again?

I know you will refuse to put even the tiniest shred of blame on Garner because he's black and you're a member of the PC Police. You are ideologically committed to spinning and lying to push your partisan agenda. Fine. I know how that is. What I don't understand is why you don't just confine your silly hardcore left wing partisan arguments for hardcore right wing partisans who want to play your games.

.

My liberal beliefs have nothing to do with what your obsessive PC vitriol. It has to do with just plain CORRECT. I place human life above all else. Eric Garner was a human being, a father, a husband and a US citizen. His skin color is irrelevant. If being appalled by seeing excessive police state abuse one would expect in some Islamic police state, Nazi Germany, or Iron curtain country play out on an American street makes me hardcore, then I am guilty.

You accuse me of refusing to put the "tiniest" blame on Eric Garner, but the fact that there is not a PEEP from you in response to the right who place all the blame on Eric Garner is telling. You are just too big of a coward to acknowledge that you are one of them.

It sure must help to ignore what I actually say to make your simplistic accusations.

I would much prefer you played your games with a right wing counterpart.

.

Cut & run, right on cue...

 

[Mac1958]

So you're saying he was not resisting arrest?

Yes or no?

Surely you know by now you can't deflect with me.

Yes or no?

.

The king of deflection pounding his chest? What I do know about you is that as soon as you are confronted with the fact that you always attack the left, you cut and run. You watch the video, do you hear any officer state that he is under arrest? Were Miranda rights issued? Did police clearly state "you are under arrest"?

It is clear to any decent human being that excessive and unnecessary force was used...IMMEDIATELY. No discussion, no attempt to diffuse or deescalate...a gang of thugs pounced on this man, choked him, applied brute force to his neck, head and chest causing his death...

It was ruled a HOMICIDE...

"It is the job of thinking people not to be on the side of the executioners"
Albert Camus


"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government."
Thomas Jefferson to the Republican Citizens of Washington County, Maryland" (March 31, 1809).


But don't deviate from your attack on those of us who are appalled by this police state thuggery.

As I've said multiple times on multiple threads, I think the officer was wrong and that the Grand Jury was wrong.

Did you think you had me there?

Wanna try again?

I know you will refuse to put even the tiniest shred of blame on Garner because he's black and you're a member of the PC Police. You are ideologically committed to spinning and lying to push your partisan agenda. Fine. I know how that is. What I don't understand is why you don't just confine your silly hardcore left wing partisan arguments for hardcore right wing partisans who want to play your games.

.

My liberal beliefs have nothing to do with what your obsessive PC vitriol. It has to do with just plain CORRECT. I place human life above all else. Eric Garner was a human being, a father, a husband and a US citizen. His skin color is irrelevant. If being appalled by seeing excessive police state abuse one would expect in some Islamic police state, Nazi Germany, or Iron curtain country play out on an American street makes me hardcore, then I am guilty.

You accuse me of refusing to put the "tiniest" blame on Eric Garner, but the fact that there is not a PEEP from you in response to the right who place all the blame on Eric Garner is telling. You are just too big of a coward to acknowledge that you are one of them.

It sure must help to ignore what I actually say to make your simplistic accusations.

I would much prefer you played your games with a right wing counterpart.

.

Cut & run, right on cue...

I don't know how to effectively communicate with liars & zealots.

So I no longer try.

.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Yo, Bfgrn,

Rock on.

 

[Bfgrn]

The king of deflection pounding his chest? What I do know about you is that as soon as you are confronted with the fact that you always attack the left, you cut and run. You watch the video, do you hear any officer state that he is under arrest? Were Miranda rights issued? Did police clearly state "you are under arrest"?

It is clear to any decent human being that excessive and unnecessary force was used...IMMEDIATELY. No discussion, no attempt to diffuse or deescalate...a gang of thugs pounced on this man, choked him, applied brute force to his neck, head and chest causing his death...

It was ruled a HOMICIDE...

"It is the job of thinking people not to be on the side of the executioners"
Albert Camus


"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government."
Thomas Jefferson to the Republican Citizens of Washington County, Maryland" (March 31, 1809).


But don't deviate from your attack on those of us who are appalled by this police state thuggery.

As I've said multiple times on multiple threads, I think the officer was wrong and that the Grand Jury was wrong.

Did you think you had me there?

Wanna try again?

I know you will refuse to put even the tiniest shred of blame on Garner because he's black and you're a member of the PC Police. You are ideologically committed to spinning and lying to push your partisan agenda. Fine. I know how that is. What I don't understand is why you don't just confine your silly hardcore left wing partisan arguments for hardcore right wing partisans who want to play your games.

.

My liberal beliefs have nothing to do with what your obsessive PC vitriol. It has to do with just plain CORRECT. I place human life above all else. Eric Garner was a human being, a father, a husband and a US citizen. His skin color is irrelevant. If being appalled by seeing excessive police state abuse one would expect in some Islamic police state, Nazi Germany, or Iron curtain country play out on an American street makes me hardcore, then I am guilty.

You accuse me of refusing to put the "tiniest" blame on Eric Garner, but the fact that there is not a PEEP from you in response to the right who place all the blame on Eric Garner is telling. You are just too big of a coward to acknowledge that you are one of them.

It sure must help to ignore what I actually say to make your simplistic accusations.

I would much prefer you played your games with a right wing counterpart.

.

Cut & run, right on cue...

I don't know how to effectively communicate with liars & zealots.

So I no longer try.

.

And you don't know how to communicate with pragmatism and honesty...

 

[georgephillip]

Wouldn't it make sense to look at revising the GJ process when a public servant is accused?

There are clear potential conflicts of interest in that situation.

It seems to me local DAs can't be trusted to present evidence to a grand jury when local police officers are suspected of wrong doing. If the state government took over that responsibility, it's possible there would be more public trials in cases like that of Eric Garner.

 

[FA_Q2]

Whatever happened to Personal Responsibility? You know, like the people who pulled the triggers? I guess they don't matter, you can't play partisan with them.

Personal responsibility doesn't really count any more.

If it did, we'd hear more from the Left about how Garner and Brown resisted arrest.

.

WOW, you are a real piece of work. When did the crime of selling a cigarette become a death sentence?

Personal responsibility doesn't really count any more.

If it did, we'd hear more from the Left about how Garner and Brown resisted arrest.

.

WOW, you are a real piece of work. When did the crime of selling a cigarette become a death sentence?

Huh?

They both resisted arrest, precisely as I said. Selling a cigarette has nothing to do with it.

You're not really denying they resisted arrest, are you? What does that have to do with cigarettes?

Your thought processes are completely distorted by your ideology, speaking of being "a piece of work".

.

Garner's "crime" deserved a summons, not an arrest. And anyone who watches the video can see police used excessive and unnecessary force.

As a matter of FACT, his death was ruled a homicide. But morally bankrupt people like you just turn a blind eye to crimes of the police state.

So you're saying he was not resisting arrest?

Yes or no?

Surely you know by now you can't deflect with me.

Yes or no?

.

The king of deflection pounding his chest? What I do know about you is that as soon as you are confronted with the fact that you always attack the left, you cut and run. You watch the video, do you hear any officer state that he is under arrest? Were Miranda rights issued? Did police clearly state "you are under arrest"?

It is clear to any decent human being that excessive and unnecessary force was used...IMMEDIATELY. No discussion, no attempt to diffuse or deescalate...a gang of thugs pounced on this man, choked him, applied brute force to his neck, head and chest causing his death...

It was ruled a HOMICIDE...

"It is the job of thinking people not to be on the side of the executioners"
Albert Camus


"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government."
Thomas Jefferson to the Republican Citizens of Washington County, Maryland" (March 31, 1809).


But don't deviate from your attack on those of us who are appalled by this police state thuggery.

Did he?

You seem to have a video that was not edited - care to share a link to it. The only video I have seen was edited and cut out the most important parts - the ones that you are referring to.

 

[ninja007]

You two have never heard of people being hassled by cops for no reason? That is exactly why you are not equipped to take part in a serious discussion about being hassled by cops.

I can see the goalposts moving now. Suddenly, "hassled" will be changed to "assaulted".

and you know this "for no reason" because? Have you ever thought maybe they have more insight then you? Maybe there was a robbery near where you were or you looked liked a possible suspect, etc.. YOU don't know....

 

[TemplarKormac]

Have they defied any direct orders?

No.

They have every right to protest and a silent turning of the back is certainly more acceptable than shutting down bridges and highways.

That has nothing to do with my OP.

1.They are making themselves look really small, I guess that's who they are right now
2. How are they helping?

I think they are protesting in a perfectly acceptable manner.

So what, I never addressed that. Can you read or are you just too dense to comprehend what this thread is about?

You make your threads that way on purpose. Not even YOU know what it's about.

 

[Mac1958]

Wouldn't it make sense to look at revising the GJ process when a public servant is accused?

There are clear potential conflicts of interest in that situation.

It seems to me local DAs can't be trusted to present evidence to a grand jury when local police officers are suspected of wrong doing. If the state government took over that responsibility, it's possible there would be more public trials in cases like that of Eric Garner.

I look at it as human nature, that anyone in any position who has significant temptation not to properly follow protocol may not.

Since everything is now polluted and distorted by partisan politics, I'm not sure what the fix would be. I do think it's a good idea to examine this.

.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Have they defied any direct orders?

No.

They have every right to protest and a silent turning of the back is certainly more acceptable than shutting down bridges and highways.

That has nothing to do with my OP.

1.They are making themselves look really small, I guess that's who they are right now
2. How are they helping?

I think they are protesting in a perfectly acceptable manner.

Acceptable manner? Then you would support the protests of Westboro Baptist Church too.

The only one the police were disrespectful of was Officer Ramos. They turned his funeral into a political tantrum, just like Westboro.

The Mayor asked for a deescalation of protests and politicizing after the two officers were slain. But the childish police decided to politicize during Ram's eulogy...

You really think the silent gesture of turning a back compares to shouting insults at a funeral?

 

[Andylusion]

Wouldn't it make sense to look at revising the GJ process when a public servant is accused?

There are clear potential conflicts of interest in that situation.

It seems to me local DAs can't be trusted to present evidence to a grand jury when local police officers are suspected of wrong doing. If the state government took over that responsibility, it's possible there would be more public trials in cases like that of Eric Garner.

And it's possible there would be far fewer public trials, since doing so could cause mass quitting by police, which would result in a political football for opposition politicians to use against incumbents.

I still don't see any evidence that suggest a need for a trial. The evidence is pretty clear. He resisted, requiring the officers to take him down with force, resulting in him having a secondary medical problem, resulting in his death.

Solution: Don't resist. When the officer says "do X".......... do it. Then they don't have to use force.

 

[FA_Q2]

And it's possible there would be far fewer public trials, since doing so could cause mass quitting by police, which would result in a political football for opposition politicians to use against incumbents.

I still don't see any evidence that suggest a need for a trial. The evidence is pretty clear. He resisted, requiring the officers to take him down with force, resulting in him having a secondary medical problem, resulting in his death.

Solution: Don't resist. When the officer says "do X".......... do it. Then they don't have to use force.

While true (and I still have not seen complete data on how that encounter actually happened) a trial does one thing that is central - it makes the public feel as though the system is at least trying to achieve justice. There is a huge problem when the public sees police applying fatal force and no one ever seems to go through a trial for it.

It looks like the government simply will not prosecute its own - the truth of it being immaterial to the way it looks.

 

[georgephillip]

I look at it as human nature, that anyone in any position who has significant temptation not to properly follow protocol may not.

Local prosecutors work closely with local police officers everyday and depend on good working relations to advance their careers. Hence, the DAs are trying cases involving police misconduct before grand juries and that isn't how the justice process is supposed to work. In New York, the world watched a man killed on camera, and a grand jury decided no criminal trial should follow. No wonder the NY state Attorney General is calling for changes requiring outside investigators be brought in when police kill unarmed civilians.