The Official Discussion Thread for who is considered indiginous to Palestine?

[P F Tinmore]

Labelling Arab Muslim "Palestinians" an indigenous peoples stretches the definition of the term far past breaking point:

“Indigenous communities, peoples and nations are those which, having a historical continuity with pre-invasion and pre-colonial societies that developed on their territories, consider themselves distinct from other sectors of the societies now prevailing on those territories, or parts of them. They form at present non-dominant sectors of society and are determined to preserve, develop and transmit to future generations their ancestral territories, and their ethnic identity, as the basis of their continued existence as peoples, in accordance with their own cultural patterns, social institutions and legal system.

“This historical continuity may consist of the continuation, for an extended period reaching into the present of one or more of the following factors:

a) Occupation of ancestral lands, or at least of part of them;

b) Common ancestry with the original occupants of these lands;

c) Culture in general, or in specific manifestations (such as religion, living under a tribal system, membership of an indigenous community, dress, means of livelihood, lifestyle, etc.);

d) Language (whether used as the only language, as mother-tongue, as the habitual means of communication at home or in the family, or as the main, preferred, habitual, general or normal language);

e) Residence on certain parts of the country, or in certain regions of the world;

f) Other relevant factors.

“On an individual basis, an indigenous person is one who belongs to these indigenous populations through self-identification as indigenous (group consciousness) and is recognized and accepted by these populations as one of its members (acceptance by the group).

“This preserves for these communities the sovereign right and power to decide who belongs to them, without external interference”

Source

his Land
A culture of the invading and colonizing peoples, by definition, can not be indigenous.

Well then,the Jews claim to this Land is Null and Void...Completely..Because the Jews invaded this Land and overthrough the Indigenous Canaanites that originally owned this Land

Know any Canaanites? Yup, that's what I thought.

Ah yeah the ethnic cleansing of Canaanites by Jews saw to that!

The FACT that Canaanites were there and THEN Jews... Is not a debatable fact!

The FACT that Canaanite tribes became part of the Jewish Nation with the creation of Israel by King David is not a debatable fact.

That the Arabs, even those who call themselves Palestinians now, were all living in Arabia until the 7th century CE, is also not a debatable fact.

In other words, if you still do not understand it, the Jewish Nation/People is made up of all, if not most, of the Canaanite tribes of Ancient Canaan, including a tribe called Canaan.

IN OTHER WORDS, Jews are the indigenous people of the ancient land of Canaan.

The FACT that Canaanite tribes became part of the Jewish Nation with the creation of Israel by King David is not a debatable fact.

Indeed, all of the various peoples folded into each other eventually to become the Palestinians after WWI.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Labelling Arab Muslim "Palestinians" an indigenous peoples stretches the definition of the term far past breaking point:

“Indigenous communities, peoples and nations are those which, having a historical continuity with pre-invasion and pre-colonial societies that developed on their territories, consider themselves distinct from other sectors of the societies now prevailing on those territories, or parts of them. They form at present non-dominant sectors of society and are determined to preserve, develop and transmit to future generations their ancestral territories, and their ethnic identity, as the basis of their continued existence as peoples, in accordance with their own cultural patterns, social institutions and legal system.

“This historical continuity may consist of the continuation, for an extended period reaching into the present of one or more of the following factors:

a) Occupation of ancestral lands, or at least of part of them;

b) Common ancestry with the original occupants of these lands;

c) Culture in general, or in specific manifestations (such as religion, living under a tribal system, membership of an indigenous community, dress, means of livelihood, lifestyle, etc.);

d) Language (whether used as the only language, as mother-tongue, as the habitual means of communication at home or in the family, or as the main, preferred, habitual, general or normal language);

e) Residence on certain parts of the country, or in certain regions of the world;

f) Other relevant factors.

“On an individual basis, an indigenous person is one who belongs to these indigenous populations through self-identification as indigenous (group consciousness) and is recognized and accepted by these populations as one of its members (acceptance by the group).

“This preserves for these communities the sovereign right and power to decide who belongs to them, without external interference”

Source

his Land
A culture of the invading and colonizing peoples, by definition, can not be indigenous.

Well then,the Jews claim to this Land is Null and Void...Completely..Because the Jews invaded this Land and overthrough the Indigenous Canaanites that originally owned this Land

Know any Canaanites? Yup, that's what I thought.

Ah yeah the ethnic cleansing of Canaanites by Jews saw to that!

The FACT that Canaanites were there and THEN Jews... Is not a debatable fact!

The FACT that Canaanite tribes became part of the Jewish Nation with the creation of Israel by King David is not a debatable fact.

That the Arabs, even those who call themselves Palestinians now, were all living in Arabia until the 7th century CE, is also not a debatable fact.

In other words, if you still do not understand it, the Jewish Nation/People is made up of all, if not most, of the Canaanite tribes of Ancient Canaan, including a tribe called Canaan.

IN OTHER WORDS, Jews are the indigenous people of the ancient land of Canaan.

The FACT that Canaanite tribes became part of the Jewish Nation with the creation of Israel by King David is not a debatable fact.

Indeed, all of the various peoples folded into each other eventually to become the Palestinians after WWI.

Your therapist called me. He is really in need of talking to you.

The Canaanites becoming part of the Nation of Israel as Jews happened after WWI.

Yeap, fast, call your therapist.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Well then,the Jews claim to this Land is Null and Void...Completely..Because the Jews invaded this Land and overthrough the Indigenous Canaanites that originally owned this Land

Know any Canaanites? Yup, that's what I thought.

Ah yeah the ethnic cleansing of Canaanites by Jews saw to that!

The FACT that Canaanites were there and THEN Jews... Is not a debatable fact!

The FACT that Canaanite tribes became part of the Jewish Nation with the creation of Israel by King David is not a debatable fact.

That the Arabs, even those who call themselves Palestinians now, were all living in Arabia until the 7th century CE, is also not a debatable fact.

In other words, if you still do not understand it, the Jewish Nation/People is made up of all, if not most, of the Canaanite tribes of Ancient Canaan, including a tribe called Canaan.

IN OTHER WORDS, Jews are the indigenous people of the ancient land of Canaan.

The FACT that Canaanite tribes became part of the Jewish Nation with the creation of Israel by King David is not a debatable fact.

Indeed, all of the various peoples folded into each other eventually to become the Palestinians after WWI.

Your therapist called me. He is really in need of talking to you.

The Canaanites becoming part of the Nation of Israel as Jews happened after WWI.

Yeap, fast, call your therapist.

Nation of Israel

Aren't those the people who got the boot because they would not keep God's commandments?

 

[Sixties Fan]

Know any Canaanites? Yup, that's what I thought.

Ah yeah the ethnic cleansing of Canaanites by Jews saw to that!

The FACT that Canaanites were there and THEN Jews... Is not a debatable fact!

The FACT that Canaanite tribes became part of the Jewish Nation with the creation of Israel by King David is not a debatable fact.

That the Arabs, even those who call themselves Palestinians now, were all living in Arabia until the 7th century CE, is also not a debatable fact.

In other words, if you still do not understand it, the Jewish Nation/People is made up of all, if not most, of the Canaanite tribes of Ancient Canaan, including a tribe called Canaan.

IN OTHER WORDS, Jews are the indigenous people of the ancient land of Canaan.

The FACT that Canaanite tribes became part of the Jewish Nation with the creation of Israel by King David is not a debatable fact.

Indeed, all of the various peoples folded into each other eventually to become the Palestinians after WWI.

Your therapist called me. He is really in need of talking to you.

The Canaanites becoming part of the Nation of Israel as Jews happened after WWI.

Yeap, fast, call your therapist.

Nation of Israel

Aren't those the people who got the boot because they would not keep God's commandments?

Here is a useful number

555-helpme

 

[thetor]

Ah yeah the ethnic cleansing of Canaanites by Jews saw to that!

The FACT that Canaanites were there and THEN Jews... Is not a debatable fact!

Um. People here (not just you) really don't understand what being indigenous means. Being indigenous does not mean that your tribe was there "first". Or that your tribe was there before another tribe. And its not a zero sum game -- more than one people can claim indigenous status in the same territory. The fact that Canaanites were there first is true. Its also true that the Jewish culture arose and developed from the Canaanite culture. You could argue that the two cultures are distinct enough that they both qualify for indigenous status, or you could argue that they are similar enough that they are the same culture and the Jewish culture is simply the development of the Caananite culture. Doesn't really matter which.


Being indigenous refers to a culture which came into being and developed in a particular location or territory. It is a pre-invasion, pre-colonialization culture which existed in the territory prior to invasion, conquest or colonization by an outside culture (a culture which developed elsewhere). Without doubt the Jewish culture developed pre-invasion on the territory we are discussing.

If you want to make the argument that the Jewish people are invaders and not indigenous -- you would have to find evidence that the Jewish culture originated elsewhere.

Gormless post,you forgot about the Moabites who resided in this area

 

[Boston1]

Tinhat has to be some kinda bot designed to simply spew certain things in response to certain other things. There certainly doesn't appear to be any intelligent logic to the arguments and the same arguments are presented over and over and over and over.

 

[thetor]

Tinhat has to be some kinda bot designed to simply spew certain things in response to certain other things. There certainly doesn't appear to be any intelligent logic to the arguments and the same arguments are presented over and over and over and over.

could you repeat this above post in clear grammatical English in future...it makes no logic

 

[Boston1]

Tinhat has to be some kinda bot designed to simply spew certain things in response to certain other things. There certainly doesn't appear to be any intelligent logic to the arguments and the same arguments are presented over and over and over and over.

could you repeat this above post in clear grammatical English in future...it makes no logic

Tinhat = bot
Bot design parameters = spew nonsensical gibberish in response to any pro Israeli statement.
Critical thinking = not required to fulfill design parameters
Tactics = Redundancy and repetition,
factual requirements = none

 

[montelatici]

Tinhat has to be some kinda bot designed to simply spew certain things in response to certain other things. There certainly doesn't appear to be any intelligent logic to the arguments and the same arguments are presented over and over and over and over.

could you repeat this above post in clear grammatical English in future...it makes no logic

Tinhat = bot
Bot design parameters = spew nonsensical gibberish in response to any pro Israeli statement.
Critical thinking = not required to fulfill design parameters
Tactics = Redundancy and repetition,
factual requirements = none

Boston=HASBOT
HASBOT operational program=Accuse anyone that has a balanced view of antisemitism
Tactics=Deny facts
Propaganda requirements=Use propaganda exclusively

 

[Sixties Fan]

Tinhat has to be some kinda bot designed to simply spew certain things in response to certain other things. There certainly doesn't appear to be any intelligent logic to the arguments and the same arguments are presented over and over and over and over.

could you repeat this above post in clear grammatical English in future...it makes no logic

Tinhat = bot
Bot design parameters = spew nonsensical gibberish in response to any pro Israeli statement.
Critical thinking = not required to fulfill design parameters
Tactics = Redundancy and repetition,
factual requirements = none

Boston=HASBOT
HASBOT operational program=Accuse anyone that has a balanced view of antisemitism
Tactics=Deny facts
Propaganda requirements=Use propaganda exclusively

LOL, I just love this part

"Accuse anyone that has a balanced view of antisemitism"

Balanced, as in non biased.

That would not be you, nor tinmore, nor anyone who bashes Jews for sport.

Show one thing which can be considered unbiased about all the accusations launched at Jews, any Jews, all Jews for the past 1950 years.

If not, show just one thing which could be considered "balanced" in the allegations that Jews are not the indigenous people of the Land of Israel, since this is the theme of this thread.

 

[fanger]

HASBOT operational program=Accuse anyone that has a balanced view, of antisemitism
just put the comma in

In Zionist history, the different waves of aliyah, beginning with the arrival of the Biluim from Russia in 1882,
The khazar immigrants took over and now call themselves indigenous, more like ingenious

 

[JoelT1]

Palestine: Roman name for ancient Israel. Palestine is historically bogus

Palestine has been attacked, conquered, and occupied many times. It was also a center for trade. Caravans went through to Asia, Africa, and Europe. Many people came and went.

In the middle of all this there was a core group of people who stayed and put down roots. Palestine was a multi racial, multi ethnic, multi cultural, multi religious place where there was little animosity between peoples.

These are the People who became Palestinians when Palestine was released from Turkish rule after WWI.

 

[JoelT1]

HASBOT operational program=Accuse anyone that has a balanced view, of antisemitism
just put the comma in

In Zionist history, the different waves of aliyah, beginning with the arrival of the Biluim from Russia in 1882,
The khazar immigrants took over and now call themselves indigenous, more like ingenious

Um, most Israeli Jews are indigenous to Israel. Khazar nonsense was discredited last century

 

[JoelT1]

This thread is being set up to prevent our second most common thread derailment (after the Mandate) - please discuss the ancient history of the peoples in the Palestine area here.

Palestine is from a Roman name imposed on Jews and ancient Israel, “palaestina”

 

[JoelT1]

Palestine has been attacked, conquered, and occupied many times. It was also a center for trade. Caravans went through to Asia, Africa, and Europe. Many people came and went.

In the middle of all this there was a core group of people who stayed and put down roots. Palestine was a multi racial, multi ethnic, multi cultural, multi religious place where there was little animosity between peoples.

These are the People who became Palestinians when Palestine was released from Turkish rule after WWI.

Um, Jews were first called “palestinians,” by the British in the British Mandate. And, palestine originated as a Roman name imposed on Jews and ancient Israel, about 2000 years ago

 

[JoelT1]

Palestine has been attacked, conquered, and occupied many times. It was also a center for trade. Caravans went through to Asia, Africa, and Europe. Many people came and went.

In the middle of all this there was a core group of people who stayed and put down roots. Palestine was a multi racial, multi ethnic, multi cultural, multi religious place where there was little animosity between peoples.

These are the People who became Palestinians when Palestine was released from Turkish rule after WWI.

Jews were originally called “palestinians,” by the British, who called the British Mandate “palestine” after WW1. Palestine is the anglicized form of palaestina, the name imposed on Jews and ancient Israel by the Roman Empire.

 

[Coyote]

So?

 

[JoelT1]

So?

“Palestinians”

So?

Jews, historically, are the “palestinians” as “palestine” originally was imposed on them and their land by the Roman Empire. Otherwise, “palestinians” has no legitimacy.

 

[fanger]

Timeline of the name "Palestine" - Wikipedia

 

[JoelT1]

Bernard Lewis, Dean of Middle East historians: Romans rename Jews’ land “palestine”

View attachment 152197

Timeline of the name "Palestine" - Wikipedia