And this is Why You Don't Privatize Education

[Winco]

We would have had private accounts with investment funds like variable annuities. The government would have kept the dividends and we would get capital gains and the growth of the funds as well. At the end, combined with non-privatized social security, we would have had a lot more money at retirement.

Oh, I get it.
You are not educating me.
In Utopia, this sounds GREAT.

I'm saying that 95% of the people would NOT have invested the money they saved.
They would have spent it.

 

[Winco]

We would have had private accounts with investment funds like variable annuities.

My Employer offered plans of .......... self contributions of......No Option of Opting OUT.
1) 5%
2) 10%
3) 15 %
4) Some Mix depending on age.

Do you consider this ^^^^ Forced like SS was?
We had to choose ONE, we couldn't opt out.
So what is your OPINION on this ^^^^^?

 

[Cougarbear]

Oh, I get it.
You are not educating me.
In Utopia, this sounds GREAT.

I'm saying that 95% of the people would NOT have invested the money they saved.
They would have spent it.

You don’t get it. This money would be part of the social security and would not be eligible for any withdrawals prior to retirement. Privatize to the educated in this instance simply means 5% of the money money for social security would go into an investment fund and there would be no option to take the money. Can you simply think with some logic?

 

[Cougarbear]

My Employer offered plans of .......... self contributions of......No Option of Opting OUT.
1) 5%
2) 10%
3) 15 %
4) Some Mix depending on age.

Do you consider this ^^^^ Forced like SS was?
We had to choose ONE, we couldn't opt out.
So what is your OPINION on this ^^^^^?

Social Security is a forced savings vehicle for workers. 5% would have gone into the investment fund making 7-9% return instead of the putrid amount social security gives. Retires today would have had much more of an income with just 5%. 15% would be much better.

 

[Winco]

You don’t get it. This money would be part of the social security and would not be eligible for any withdrawals prior to retirement. Privatize to the educated in this instance simply means 5% of the money money for social security would go into an investment fund and there would be no option to take the money. Can you simply think with some logic?

Dear Lord Dude. I totally GET IT.
I'm not arguing that SS isn't Flawed, It is.
There is NO Statistic that suggests that people would have reasonably invested that money otherwise.......There is ample evidence that they would have SPENT IT instead of investing it. Utopia is your world. That's NICE.

Likewise, there are a MILLION++++ Elders Living off of SS, that would have ZILCH w/out SS.
Oh....unless they invested as you claim. Utopia Bear, only in Utopia.

Social Security is a forced savings vehicle for workers. 5% would have gone into the investment fund making 7-9% return instead of the putrid amount social security gives. Retires today would have had much more of an income with just 5%. 15% would be much better.

Social Security is a forced savings vehicle for workers.
And many Elders say Thank Goodness for that FORCED SAVINGS.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

You misunderstand what Bush was proposing. We still would not have had access to that money until we retired. And, we would not have been allowed to just take it out. It would have been more like a variable annuity in which a set amount based on age would be paid each month like SS is today. Only, instead of the approximately average of $1,600/mo. being paid out, it would be well over $4,000 now. Just 5% of SS money would have really made that difference.

Let me tell you about my experience with my 403B which would be similar to privatizing SS. I decided to retire in 2022 because of my illness made it impossible to work. I decided to pull my money out of the 403B which was about $40,000 at the time in two accounts both heavily invested in the stock market. Thanks to Brandon's economy, I watch while my request was processed and the stock market continued a slow crash, losing thousands of points during that period. My $40,000 quickly turned into about $32,000 and I lost another 20% for taxes. MY $40,000 turned into $25,000 really fast.

Imagine something happening about the time you turn 67 and can retire.

 

[Unkotare]

It's a shame that the left has worked so hard to undermine the traditional family that for centuries took care of their elders.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Social Security is a forced savings vehicle for workers. 5% would have gone into the investment fund making 7-9% return instead of the putrid amount social security gives. Retires today would have had much more of an income with just 5%. 15% would be much better.

Your numbers are best case scenario which we know never happens.

 

[Cougarbear]

Dear Lord Dude. I totally GET IT.
I'm not arguing that SS isn't Flawed, It is.
There is NO Statistic that suggests that people would have reasonably invested that money otherwise.......There is ample evidence that they would have SPENT IT instead of investing it. Utopia is your world. That's NICE.

Likewise, there are a MILLION++++ Elders Living off of SS, that would have ZILCH w/out SS.
Oh....unless they invested as you claim. Utopia Bear, only in Utopia.

Social Security is a forced savings vehicle for workers.
And many Elders say Thank Goodness for that FORCED SAVINGS.

Then why do you keep saying people would have spent the money instead of investing it when they would not have been allowed to spend it?

 

[Cougarbear]

Let me tell you about my experience with my 403B which would be similar to privatizing SS. I decided to retire in 2022 because of my illness made it impossible to work. I decided to pull my money out of the 403B which was about $40,000 at the time in two accounts both heavily invested in the stock market. Thanks to Brandon's economy, I watch while my request was processed and the stock market continued a slow crash, losing thousands of points during that period. My $40,000 quickly turned into about $32,000 and I lost another 20% for taxes. MY $40,000 turned into $25,000 really fast.

Imagine something happening about the time you turn 67 and can retire.

There’s no similarity. In the SS system you would only be able to take out the monthly allotment. At that time, the money would be rolled back out of the stock market into the annuity fund of SS. Then you would take out that monthly from a larger amount because over 40 years of working, that 5% would be worth a lot of money.

 

[Cougarbear]

Your numbers are best case scenario which we know never happens.

It always happens. Take any 40 year block of time with mutual funds and it works out every time as long as the funds aren’t mostly bond funds. And, after 20 years, there is no volatility in the market. I do this for a living and have all the stats to prove it.
What does happen on occasions is when people get near retirement, the market goes down and they have to work longer. One can move the money into safer assets close to retirement. Even guaranteed income vehicles. What you should have done before asking for the money is moved it into a money market inside the 403b and then taken it out. Brandon hasn’t a clue how the economy works.
I have a client who retired last year. Rolled it over to an IRA. Right afterwards, it dropped from $425,000 to $390,000 because of Brandon. But, because of capitalism, it soon rose to $470,000. Then it dropped again recently to $440,000. But is back to $461,000. During that time, has taken out $25,000 for retirement. A little each month. It’s all in asset allocations of stock funds. None in bonds. And the dividends and capital gains have been huge.
In the SS system, people would be required to shift from stock to bond funds.

 

[hadit]

Some services should not be for profit. There are some things the govenrment should provide for its citizens. Education is one of them. Leaving education to the decisions based on profit margins is insane. It creates this:

TEXAS TAX DOLLARS ALLEGEDLY DIVERTED TO OUT-OF-STATE CHARTER SCHOOLS FOUNDED BY HOUSTON SUPERINTENDENT MIKE MILES​

In a recent report by FOX 26, it's been unveiled that funds amounting in the millions, earmarked for Texas' public schools, have wound up bolstering the accounts of out-of-state charter schools established by Mike Miles, a notable figure in Texan education. Miles, the current superintendent of the Houston Independent School District following his appointment by the Texas Education Commissioner Mike Morath, reportedly diverted Texas education tax dollars to a network of charter schools he conceived before assuming the role.

Texas Tax Dollars Allegedly Diverted to Out-of-State Charter Schools Founded by Houston Superintendent Mike Miles

Texas tax dollars were diverted to out-of-state charter schools founded by Mike Miles, as revealed by FOX 26 and Spectrum News.

hoodline.com

Wow, one must admire the massive leaps in illogic going on here. Because ONE guy is corrupt, the whole thing is corrupt? Using that standard, if we can find an example of a bad teacher that was not fired but was shuffled from one school to another, we should be able to state we can't have teachers' unions.

 

[Winco]

Then why do you keep saying people would have spent the money instead of investing it when they would not have been allowed to spend it?

Person A makes $4,000 per month and SS takes out 6.2% of your check.
That amount that goes to SS is $248 per month deducted from Person A's Check.

If there was no SS deduction, then you are suggesting that Person A would save that $248 and Invest that $248 in a Retirement account of their choosing.

I'm saying they would NOT invest it on their own and they would SPEND it, since they are NOT forced to put that $248 into a retirement fund.
It's just my opinion.
You saying they would invest that $248 is your opinion.

Is your claim that Person A would be required to invest that $248, but just not in the SS system?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

It always happens. Take any 40 year block of time with mutual funds and it works out every time as long as the funds aren’t mostly bond funds. And, after 20 years, there is no volatility in the market. I do this for a living and have all the stats to prove it.
What does happen on occasions is when people get near retirement, the market goes down and they have to work longer. One can move the money into safer assets close to retirement. Even guaranteed income vehicles. What you should have done before asking for the money is moved it into a money market inside the 403b and then taken it out. Brandon hasn’t a clue how the economy works.
I have a client who retired last year. Rolled it over to an IRA. Right afterwards, it dropped from $425,000 to $390,000 because of Brandon. But, because of capitalism, it soon rose to $470,000. Then it dropped again recently to $440,000. But is back to $461,000. During that time, has taken out $25,000 for retirement. A little each month. It’s all in asset allocations of stock funds. None in bonds. And the dividends and capital gains have been huge.
In the SS system, people would be required to shift from stock to bond funds.

So he lost $35,000. That's the point. Regaining it is irrelevant if you have to retire like I did. I could not leave the money in and wait for it to rebound. I had almost zero income other than my state retirement which was very little consequence. the fact that he lost money is the critical point. If the stock market drops, SS does not.

 

[Cougarbear]

So he lost $35,000. That's the point. Regaining it is irrelevant if you have to retire like I did. I could not leave the money in and wait for it to rebound. I had almost zero income other than my state retirement which was very little consequence. the fact that he lost money is the critical point. If the stock market drops, SS does not.

That person is retired. People have this idea that a bank will outperform inflation and taxes. That is a guaranteed way to lose purchasing power and money. Is account today is back to where it was before the last pull back. It’s all about how the money is invested.

 

[Deplorable Yankee]

Some services should not be for profit. There are some things the govenrment should provide for its citizens. Education is one of them. Leaving education to the decisions based on profit margins is insane. It creates this:

TEXAS TAX DOLLARS ALLEGEDLY DIVERTED TO OUT-OF-STATE CHARTER SCHOOLS FOUNDED BY HOUSTON SUPERINTENDENT MIKE MILES​

In a recent report by FOX 26, it's been unveiled that funds amounting in the millions, earmarked for Texas' public schools, have wound up bolstering the accounts of out-of-state charter schools established by Mike Miles, a notable figure in Texan education. Miles, the current superintendent of the Houston Independent School District following his appointment by the Texas Education Commissioner Mike Morath, reportedly diverted Texas education tax dollars to a network of charter schools he conceived before assuming the role.

Texas Tax Dollars Allegedly Diverted to Out-of-State Charter Schools Founded by Houston Superintendent Mike Miles

Texas tax dollars were diverted to out-of-state charter schools founded by Mike Miles, as revealed by FOX 26 and Spectrum News.

hoodline.com

Leaving education to the state and you have 10 year olds on puberty blockers .....and not to mention blockhead after blockhead who can't read analog clocks or point out where Canada or Mexico is on a map ....

 

[IM2]

Leaving education to the state and you have 10 year olds on puberty blockers .....and not to mention blockhead after blockhead who can't read analog clocks or point out where Canada or Mexico is on a map ....

How about we cut the military and law enforcemet budgets and provide students with everything they need to learn effectively? Leaving that to the whims of a profit margin is idiocy.

 

[Deplorable Yankee]

How about we cut the military and law enforcemet budgets and provide students with everything they need to learn effectively? Leaving that to the whims of a profit margin is idiocy.

We already spend a fortune on education .even in the dumpiest communities in the nation ...but hell yes slash military spending ...and then bulldoze the department of education in DC

Maybe hang a few purple haired activist teachers for good measure....
White females ...like yourself

 

[westwall]

We call that "Embezzlement" and it's a crime.

Oh? You were silent about Bernie and diblasio doing it.

 

[Polishprince]

What was the performance of these charter schools as opposed to the Government School system? That's the real question, IM, no?

I attended a small , private Catholic high school and our record far exceeded the failed government school system.

It really, to me, doesn't matter that the schools were controlled by out of state people. My school was ultimately controlled out of the country in Vatican City and did a tremendous job.