Rest in Peace Muhammad Ali

[Dr Grump]

[
FALSE! Both Iraq and Afghanistan pose the greatest threats to America that have ever existed. You don't know what you're talking about .

List them. Take your time...

1. Iraq (and Syria) - NUCLEAR threat from ISIS.

2. Afghanistan - NUCLEAR threat from Pakistan's 100+ nuclear warheads.

Fuck me. FFS WHO STARTED IT? The US created the fucking situation.

Christ almighty.

 

[protectionist]

Fuck me. FFS WHO STARTED IT? The US created the fucking situation.

Christ almighty.

The US wasn't around in 622 AD when Islam began. Since then marauding Muslims have killed 270 million people around the world. The USA is just the latest.

 

[Dr Grump]

Fuck me. FFS WHO STARTED IT? The US created the fucking situation.

Christ almighty.

The US wasn't around in 622 AD when Islam began. Since then marauding Muslims have killed 270 million people around the world. The USA is just the latest.

Oh god, you're one of those....should have known....

 

[protectionist]

Oh god, you're one of those....should have known....

"Those" people who report reality. One of them. Yup.

 

[jasonnfree]

Many might beg to differ, and it's just the way that we fought wars that changed. The circumstances for the troops remained the same "Win or Lose".

They may beg to differ, but there is only one criterion to use: What threat did Vietnam pose to the US? Answer: None. As was proven when the US lost.

Ditto Iraq and Afghanistan.

Red China and the Soviet Union was heavily in supplying arms in Vietnam back then. The political talk was the domino theory. Countries falling to communism.

 

[S.J.]

The "freaks and hippies" we're proven correct about Vietnam

It was the war Hawks who wrapped themselves in the American flag who sent 60,000 boys to their deaths

I had a former Green Beret who fought in the in the battle of Khe Sanh from January to July 1968, in what he thought was one of the bloodiest battles of the war, as my JROTC teacher in High School. We bonded and as such he opened up and told me some of his war stories. He also told me how disillusioned he was that our government was so passive that it wouldn't allow US forces to pursue Viet Cong into Laos and Cambodia. That from across the border the Viet Cong would launch Guerrilla style attacks on US forces then retreat back across the border. These attacks were devastating. He thought that this was one of the main reasons why we lost the war. The ROI was rigged against them.

60,000 of our boys needn't have died if our government had been interested in ending the war quickly.

If we were never there at all, we would not have needed rules of engagement

Not our fight

Maybe not, but even then, we could have minimized the casualties. However, this isn't the thread we should be discussing that in. This is Ali's thread, not a Vietnam War discussion thread.

Keep in mind that by 1967 Vietnam was immensely unpopular. When Nixon invaded Cambodia, there were riots at home
Extending the war into Laos and Cambodia was not a sellable strategy.....especially with 1968 being an election year




.

Nixon didn't start his presidency until 1969, dumbshit.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

Fuck you....send your family friends and loved ones to the front line when one of these politicians have brain fart like that asshole W Bush ..fuck all that

I fart in your direction.

 

[S.J.]

. Now your talking dumb. Bob hope was flat outright the best when it came to troop morale. Denounce the war & undermine the troops in action ? A typical weak knees liberal move, but not the move of true American patriots who were fighting for those in the world who wanted what America has "Freedom".

Bob Hope coming out against the war would have ended it two years earlier

Sometimes supporting the troops is not making them laugh but looking out for their well being

. Winning that war should have been the order of the day, and us not bowing down to freaks & hippies who didn't know their butt from a hole in the ground is where it all went wrong & where we went wrong. It's been a shame and a sham ever since. It opened up Pandora's box, and it all but erased our victories in Europe and in the Pacific theater.

The "freaks and hippies" we're proven correct about Vietnam

It was the war Hawks who wrapped themselves in the American flag who sent 60,000 boys to their deaths

War hawks like Kennedy and Johnson?

And Nixon and the whole Conservative party

Vietnam was well underway when Nixon was elected, stupid, and there was no "Conservative Party".

 

[beagle9]

Fuck you....send your family friends and loved ones to the front line when one of these politicians have brain fart like that asshole W Bush ..fuck all that

I fart in your direction.

. Monty Python and the Holy Grail... LOL

 

[beagle9]

Many might beg to differ, and it's just the way that we fought wars that changed. The circumstances for the troops remained the same "Win or Lose".

They may beg to differ, but there is only one criterion to use: What threat did Vietnam pose to the US? Answer: None. As was proven when the US lost.

Ditto Iraq and Afghanistan.

Germany posed no immediate threat to the US when entered the war, but as with other nations, if you sit back and do nothing, then we might well be speaking German today. The domino affect is always out there, so if you leave your allies behind, then you might as well get ready for the fall just like our allies have fallen over time. We are not immune to war, and especially if our vital interest are at stake.

 

[Pogo]

Putting the word "African" in front of the word "American" is absurd. Blacks is the correct term to describe black people, not African-American. Blacks in America have no connection to Africa whatsoever,. They don't speak African languages, they don't understand African cultures (of which there are many), and few of them have ever set foot in Africa.

And where were they taken from? "Blackland"?

You refer to Native Americans as "Red"? Asians as "Yellow" and "Brown"?

 

[Unkotare]

....... In fact you make a good point, so why do they put African in front of American ? Are they claiming their homeland is upon the whole continent of Africa, and therefore they are Africans from the continent of Africa who are misplaced in America ? That's huge. Now the ones that came here, what part of the continent did they come from.......

If you think about it for a minute, you should get the idea.

 

[Unkotare]

Many might beg to differ, and it's just the way that we fought wars that changed. The circumstances for the troops remained the same "Win or Lose".

They may beg to differ, but there is only one criterion to use: What threat did Vietnam pose to the US? Answer: None. As was proven when the US lost.

Ditto Iraq and Afghanistan.

Germany posed no immediate threat to the US when entered the war, but as with other nations, if you sit back and do nothing, then we might well be speaking German today. ......

Why would we be speaking German?

 

[S.J.]

Many might beg to differ, and it's just the way that we fought wars that changed. The circumstances for the troops remained the same "Win or Lose".

They may beg to differ, but there is only one criterion to use: What threat did Vietnam pose to the US? Answer: None. As was proven when the US lost.

Ditto Iraq and Afghanistan.

Germany posed no immediate threat to the US when entered the war, but as with other nations, if you sit back and do nothing, then we might well be speaking German today. ......

Why would we be speaking German?

The Nazis would insist on it?

 

[Unkotare]

Many might beg to differ, and it's just the way that we fought wars that changed. The circumstances for the troops remained the same "Win or Lose".

They may beg to differ, but there is only one criterion to use: What threat did Vietnam pose to the US? Answer: None. As was proven when the US lost.

Ditto Iraq and Afghanistan.

Germany posed no immediate threat to the US when entered the war, but as with other nations, if you sit back and do nothing, then we might well be speaking German today. ......

Why would we be speaking German?

The Nazis would insist on it?

And you imagine Germany conquering and taking over America completely? Don't be ridiculous.

 

[S.J.]

Many might beg to differ, and it's just the way that we fought wars that changed. The circumstances for the troops remained the same "Win or Lose".

They may beg to differ, but there is only one criterion to use: What threat did Vietnam pose to the US? Answer: None. As was proven when the US lost.

Ditto Iraq and Afghanistan.

Germany posed no immediate threat to the US when entered the war, but as with other nations, if you sit back and do nothing, then we might well be speaking German today. ......

Why would we be speaking German?

The Nazis would insist on it?

And you imagine Germany conquering and taking over America completely? Don't be ridiculous.

No, I was just answering your stupid question.

 

[JQPublic1]

This is a racist post, which supports Clay's racism which he demonstrated at the time that he refused the draft, by putting the Vietnam War into racial terms (as Blacks so often do with most everything in life).

What a pile of crap. The Vietnam War was a disgusting and idiotic screwup by the American leaders of the time, but it really wasn't a racial thing. Blacks have a way of making everything be about race, and Clay (note that I don't refer to a dopey Muslim name) was no exception.

As for your moronic claim of "RW conservatism/racism", there is no such thing. There is however very much so > LEFT wing liberal racism, in the form of AFFIRMATIVE ACTION, the # 1 racism in America, victimizing, by far, the largest number of people (whites), for 55 years now (except in 8 states where it is banned).

And for Clay, there was no "Jim Crow and a plethora of other racial atrocities as the backdrop of his refusal to be drafted" His refusal came in 1968, well after the end of Jim Crow, a few years well into the civil rights laws, and 7 years after the beginning of affirmative action.

And Clay could have served. I opposed the Vietnam War too, and I went out in the street and protested it. That didn't stop me from joining the military (Army National Guard) and putting in 6 years of service to the nation and state, and serving in national defense, 2 riots, 2 blackouts, and 3 floods. If I had been called to go to Vietnam THEN I would have refused it. Instead, I served, am now a veteran, I receive VA benefits in a pension, and a lot of free medical care from the VA. Clay could have done the same thing, but as a Muslim, he had no allegiance to the USA, as all Muslims owe no allegiance to any nation on earth, they owe allegiance only to the Ummah. In essence, Clay was a traitor to this country, as are all Muslims who claim they cannot serve in the US military, because of their religion (which isn't even a religion at all)

What I wonder about is why wasn't he jailed. I recall lots of guys left the country, and went to Canada, others went to jail, rather than accept the draft. How did Clay get around that ?

True.

No, Protectionist is a lying racist idiot. I thought you were of better character …thanks for showing your true colors..

 

[Unkotare]

They may beg to differ, but there is only one criterion to use: What threat did Vietnam pose to the US? Answer: None. As was proven when the US lost.

Ditto Iraq and Afghanistan.

Germany posed no immediate threat to the US when entered the war, but as with other nations, if you sit back and do nothing, then we might well be speaking German today. ......

Why would we be speaking German?

The Nazis would insist on it?

And you imagine Germany conquering and taking over America completely? Don't be ridiculous.

No, I was just answering your stupid question.

And ended up just demonstrating how stupid YOU really are.

 

[Dr Grump]

Red China and the Soviet Union was heavily in supplying arms in Vietnam back then. The political talk was the domino theory. Countries falling to communism.

I know. However, history shows they were wrong.

 

[Dr Grump]

Germany posed no immediate threat to the US when entered the war, but as with other nations, if you sit back and do nothing, then we might well be speaking German today. The domino affect is always out there, so if you leave your allies behind, then you might as well get ready for the fall just like our allies have fallen over time. We are not immune to war, and especially if our vital interest are at stake.

But they posed a threat to the world. Iraq - and Afghanistan especially - never have. I get it if you're out to protect a similar country with a similar democratic system of govt and ideals. South Vietnam had neither.

Well, depends what those interests are. And whether you're trying to take the moral high ground.