America Before the Entitlement State

[Dragon]

If leftists had facts and logic, they'd use those.

But all they have is emotion.

LOL.

Quoted without comment for the sheer beautiful irony.

 

[Foxfyre]

Those who DO use facts and logic know that there are negatives in EVERY generation and in EVERY cultural scenario in America and that has been the case since the first settlers arrived on the Mayflower. To pull out and emphasize the negatives while ignoring all the positives is a favorite tactic of the statists or political class who have given us all these entitlements that now threaten to sink us all.

In modern vernacular they throw the baby out with the bathwater to try to paint as grim a scenario as they can to justify handing over more and more of our resources to the government to dole out. They are so conditioned as little socialists or even Marxists that they do not want to hear any problems or negatives inherent in returning to an authoritarian government that they alone trust to be benevolent and trustworthy to manage our resources better than we would do ourselves.

 

[bripat9643]

Ágrarian economy. Rural population. Night and day.

Nice try, though.

Add in no middle class, Jim Crow laws, lynchings, massive ghettoes, child labor, work camps, Hoovervilles..heck..a virtual conservative paradise!

Fear-monger much?

We might as well accuse Democrats of rape, mass murder, child molesting, slavery and necrophilia. It would be more credible than the crap they accuse Republicans of.

 

[Bfgrn]

Those who DO use facts and logic know that there are negatives in EVERY generation and in EVERY cultural scenario in America and that has been the case since the first settlers arrived on the Mayflower. To pull out and emphasize the negatives while ignoring all the positives is a favorite tactic of the statists or political class who have given us all these entitlements that now threaten to sink us all.

In modern vernacular they throw the baby out with the bathwater to try to paint as grim a scenario as they can to justify handing over more and more of our resources to the government to dole out. They are so conditioned as little socialists or even Marxists that they do not want to hear any problems or negatives inherent in returning to an authoritarian government that they alone trust to be benevolent and trustworthy to manage our resources better than we would do ourselves.

You continue to LIE. We tried a charity only approach to social services...IT FAILED miserably. Medicare alone lifted millions of Americans out of poverty. I provided a chart of poverty by age, did you even LOOK at it? This is the second thread I have provided concrete facts and you continue to lie and emote.

YOU are the one willing to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Hey I have a solution...

Hey grandma...get a fucking job, go back to college, start a new career...get your lazy ass out of that chair!!!

Do you hear me grandma?

Do you hear me grandma?

Do you hear me grandma?

Do you hear me grandma?

You shall rise up before the gray-headed and honor the aged, and you shall revere your God; I am the Lord.
Leviticus 19:32

 

[Foxfyre]

I submit the looniness of the immediately preceding post as evidence that the statist political class is totally out of touch with many realities. But damn if they aren't really good with straw men, red herrings, and non sequiturs.

 

[The T]

Those who DO use facts and logic know that there are negatives in EVERY generation and in EVERY cultural scenario in America and that has been the case since the first settlers arrived on the Mayflower. To pull out and emphasize the negatives while ignoring all the positives is a favorite tactic of the statists or political class who have given us all these entitlements that now threaten to sink us all.

In modern vernacular they throw the baby out with the bathwater to try to paint as grim a scenario as they can to justify handing over more and more of our resources to the government to dole out. They are so conditioned as little socialists or even Marxists that they do not want to hear any problems or negatives inherent in returning to an authoritarian government that they alone trust to be benevolent and trustworthy to manage our resources better than we would do ourselves.

And they project themselves very well to that they are guilty of. Face it? They're lying, stupid, or both.

 

[Bfgrn]

I submit the looniness of the immediately preceding post as evidence that the statist political class is totally out of touch with many realities. But damn if they aren't really good with straw men, red herrings, and non sequiturs.

You can call me whatever you want. And you are more that welcome to defend conservatism, but I have yet to meet anyone that can do it without diminishing others or requiring some group of human beings to evaporate. It is a negative form of thought that is incompatible with a free and open society. It is anti-democratic in nature and builds nothing, it can only tear things down. The last 30 years are a shining example of conservatism.

Conservatism throughout human history has always created a aristocracy, plutocracy, or some form of oppressive society where there is a ruling class or hierarchy. Today's aristocrats and hierarchy are the CEO's, corporations, free marketeers, and the business elite. Conservatives will defend to the death McDonalds right to slowly poison our children, but they never defend our children's health and well being.

I've lived to see the total failure of two revolutions of extreme ideology. The Bolshevik revolution and the Reagan revolution. Unfettered communism and unfettered capitalism creates the same end...failure.

Conservatism has no investment in human capital. It believes everyone is basically evil, so it treats people accordingly and it always creates a fear of 'others', some group of people that must be excluded or ostracized. Liberalism is faith in human beings and a trust that the human spirit can solve all man-made problems.

So you are more than welcome to defend conservatism, but you don't get to decide the debate outcome.

Liberalism is trust of the people, tempered by prudence; conservatism, distrust of people, tempered by fear.
William E. Gladstone

 

[The T]

I submit the looniness of the immediately preceding post as evidence that the statist political class is totally out of touch with many realities. But damn if they aren't really good with straw men, red herrings, and non sequiturs.

You can call me whatever you want. And you are more that welcome to defend conservatism, but I have yet to meet anyone that can do it without diminishing others or requiring some group of human beings to evaporate. It is a negative form of thought that is incompatible with a free and open society. It is anti-democratic in nature and builds nothing, it can only tear things down. The last 30 years are a shining example of conservatism.

Conservatism throughout human history has always created a aristocracy, plutocracy, or some form of oppressive society where there is a ruling class or hierarchy. Today's aristocrats and hierarchy are the CEO's, corporations, free marketeers, and the business elite. Conservatives will defend to the death McDonalds right to slowly poison our children, but they never defend our children's health and well being.

I've lived to see the total failure of two revolutions of extreme ideology. The Bolshevik revolution and the Reagan revolution. Unfettered communism and unfettered capitalism creates the same end...failure.

Conservatism has no investment in human capital. It believes everyone is basically evil, so it treats people accordingly and it always creates a fear of 'others', some group of people that must be excluded or ostracized. Liberalism is faith in human beings and a trust that the human spirit can solve all man-made problems.

So you are more than welcome to defend conservatism, but you don't get to decide the debate outcome.

Liberalism is trust of the people, tempered by prudence; conservatism, distrust of people, tempered by fear.
William E. Gladstone

 

[Bfgrn]

I submit the looniness of the immediately preceding post as evidence that the statist political class is totally out of touch with many realities. But damn if they aren't really good with straw men, red herrings, and non sequiturs.

You can call me whatever you want. And you are more that welcome to defend conservatism, but I have yet to meet anyone that can do it without diminishing others or requiring some group of human beings to evaporate. It is a negative form of thought that is incompatible with a free and open society. It is anti-democratic in nature and builds nothing, it can only tear things down. The last 30 years are a shining example of conservatism.

Conservatism throughout human history has always created a aristocracy, plutocracy, or some form of oppressive society where there is a ruling class or hierarchy. Today's aristocrats and hierarchy are the CEO's, corporations, free marketeers, and the business elite. Conservatives will defend to the death McDonalds right to slowly poison our children, but they never defend our children's health and well being.

I've lived to see the total failure of two revolutions of extreme ideology. The Bolshevik revolution and the Reagan revolution. Unfettered communism and unfettered capitalism creates the same end...failure.

Conservatism has no investment in human capital. It believes everyone is basically evil, so it treats people accordingly and it always creates a fear of 'others', some group of people that must be excluded or ostracized. Liberalism is faith in human beings and a trust that the human spirit can solve all man-made problems.

So you are more than welcome to defend conservatism, but you don't get to decide the debate outcome.

Liberalism is trust of the people, tempered by prudence; conservatism, distrust of people, tempered by fear.
William E. Gladstone

No I am not a liar...

Republicans and the right in America today believe the only way to solve our problems is through punishment. And if that doesn't work, the punishment is just not severe enough. I suggest you research the 1994 Crimes Bill and how Republicans and the right demonized the most constructive part of that bill.

In the early to mid 90's Congress crafted a crimes bill. The original funding framework called for equal thirds of the money to go to 1) police enforcement 2) prisons 3) crime prevention

The crime prevention part of the bill would go toward education, job training, community engagement by law enforcement, child-centered activities (money for arts and crafts, dance programs, recreational activities, nutrition training, and so forth), assorted inner city youth activity programs, urban parks and recreation, schools (money is to be used "to improve the academic and social development of youths by instituting a collaborative structure that trains and coordinates efforts of social workers, teachers, and principles."), youth development for such activities as "providing youth with life skills" , drug treatment programs in prisons. and facilities like community centers.

Statistics showed that the majority of youth crimes are committed after school lets out and before dinner time. It is not difficult to see what is missing during that time period, adult supervision. So the idea was to provide a safe and supervised facility where these kids could go.

It was during this period that Newt Gingrich and the 'Contract with America' Republicans took over Congress.

The 'Contract with America' Republicans attacked and demonized this part of the bill. They even labeled it and added a racial slur, They called the prevention part of the bill paying for 'midnight basketball'

The real irony of that debate; Police Chiefs from around the country ascended on Washington to lobby Congress FOR the prevention provisions, because they knew that the best way to help law enforcement was not more police or more punishment, it was through education, training and community activism.

 

[Foxfyre]

And the beat goes on. They accuse others of demonizing by demonizing those they accuse. And they can't see that they're doing it.

 

[The T]

And the beat goes on. They accuse others of demonizing by demonizing those they accuse. And they can't see that they're doing it.

No they can't. They are that much at a loss for logic. But that comes from have zero scruples or morals. Thier parents didn't teach them right.

 

[The T]

You can call me whatever you want. And you are more that welcome to defend conservatism, but I have yet to meet anyone that can do it without diminishing others or requiring some group of human beings to evaporate. It is a negative form of thought that is incompatible with a free and open society. It is anti-democratic in nature and builds nothing, it can only tear things down. The last 30 years are a shining example of conservatism.

Conservatism throughout human history has always created a aristocracy, plutocracy, or some form of oppressive society where there is a ruling class or hierarchy. Today's aristocrats and hierarchy are the CEO's, corporations, free marketeers, and the business elite. Conservatives will defend to the death McDonalds right to slowly poison our children, but they never defend our children's health and well being.

I've lived to see the total failure of two revolutions of extreme ideology. The Bolshevik revolution and the Reagan revolution. Unfettered communism and unfettered capitalism creates the same end...failure.

Conservatism has no investment in human capital. It believes everyone is basically evil, so it treats people accordingly and it always creates a fear of 'others', some group of people that must be excluded or ostracized. Liberalism is faith in human beings and a trust that the human spirit can solve all man-made problems.

So you are more than welcome to defend conservatism, but you don't get to decide the debate outcome.

Liberalism is trust of the people, tempered by prudence; conservatism, distrust of people, tempered by fear.
William E. Gladstone

No I am not a liar...

Republicans and the right in America today believe the only way to solve our problems is through punishment. And if that doesn't work, the punishment is just not severe enough. I suggest you research the 1994 Crimes Bill and how Republicans and the right demonized the most constructive part of that bill.

In the early to mid 90's Congress crafted a crimes bill. The original funding framework called for equal thirds of the money to go to 1) police enforcement 2) prisons 3) crime prevention

The crime prevention part of the bill would go toward education, job training, community engagement by law enforcement, child-centered activities (money for arts and crafts, dance programs, recreational activities, nutrition training, and so forth), assorted inner city youth activity programs, urban parks and recreation, schools (money is to be used "to improve the academic and social development of youths by instituting a collaborative structure that trains and coordinates efforts of social workers, teachers, and principles."), youth development for such activities as "providing youth with life skills" , drug treatment programs in prisons. and facilities like community centers.

Statistics showed that the majority of youth crimes are committed after school lets out and before dinner time. It is not difficult to see what is missing during that time period, adult supervision. So the idea was to provide a safe and supervised facility where these kids could go.

It was during this period that Newt Gingrich and the 'Contract with America' Republicans took over Congress.

The 'Contract with America' Republicans attacked and demonized this part of the bill. They even labeled it and added a racial slur, They called the prevention part of the bill paying for 'midnight basketball'

The real irony of that debate; Police Chiefs from around the country ascended on Washington to lobby Congress FOR the prevention provisions, because they knew that the best way to help law enforcement was not more police or more punishment, it was through education, training and community activism.

 

[The T]

You can call me whatever you want. And you are more that welcome to defend conservatism, but I have yet to meet anyone that can do it without diminishing others or requiring some group of human beings to evaporate. It is a negative form of thought that is incompatible with a free and open society. It is anti-democratic in nature and builds nothing, it can only tear things down. The last 30 years are a shining example of conservatism.

Conservatism throughout human history has always created a aristocracy, plutocracy, or some form of oppressive society where there is a ruling class or hierarchy. Today's aristocrats and hierarchy are the CEO's, corporations, free marketeers, and the business elite. Conservatives will defend to the death McDonalds right to slowly poison our children, but they never defend our children's health and well being.

I've lived to see the total failure of two revolutions of extreme ideology. The Bolshevik revolution and the Reagan revolution. Unfettered communism and unfettered capitalism creates the same end...failure.

Conservatism has no investment in human capital. It believes everyone is basically evil, so it treats people accordingly and it always creates a fear of 'others', some group of people that must be excluded or ostracized. Liberalism is faith in human beings and a trust that the human spirit can solve all man-made problems.

So you are more than welcome to defend conservatism, but you don't get to decide the debate outcome.

Liberalism is trust of the people, tempered by prudence; conservatism, distrust of people, tempered by fear.
William E. Gladstone

No I am not a liar...

Republicans and the right in America today believe the only way to solve our problems is through punishment. And if that doesn't work, the punishment is just not severe enough. I suggest you research the 1994 Crimes Bill and how Republicans and the right demonized the most constructive part of that bill.

In the early to mid 90's Congress crafted a crimes bill. The original funding framework called for equal thirds of the money to go to 1) police enforcement 2) prisons 3) crime prevention

The crime prevention part of the bill would go toward education, job training, community engagement by law enforcement, child-centered activities (money for arts and crafts, dance programs, recreational activities, nutrition training, and so forth), assorted inner city youth activity programs, urban parks and recreation, schools (money is to be used "to improve the academic and social development of youths by instituting a collaborative structure that trains and coordinates efforts of social workers, teachers, and principles."), youth development for such activities as "providing youth with life skills" , drug treatment programs in prisons. and facilities like community centers.

Statistics showed that the majority of youth crimes are committed after school lets out and before dinner time. It is not difficult to see what is missing during that time period, adult supervision. So the idea was to provide a safe and supervised facility where these kids could go.

It was during this period that Newt Gingrich and the 'Contract with America' Republicans took over Congress.

The 'Contract with America' Republicans attacked and demonized this part of the bill. They even labeled it and added a racial slur, They called the prevention part of the bill paying for 'midnight basketball'

The real irony of that debate; Police Chiefs from around the country ascended on Washington to lobby Congress FOR the prevention provisions, because they knew that the best way to help law enforcement was not more police or more punishment, it was through education, training and community activism.

Your problem is that YOU are a moocher. YOU are threatened that your little gravy train on the backs of the Taxpayers is coming to an end. Admit it.

 

[Bfgrn]

No I am not a liar...

Republicans and the right in America today believe the only way to solve our problems is through punishment. And if that doesn't work, the punishment is just not severe enough. I suggest you research the 1994 Crimes Bill and how Republicans and the right demonized the most constructive part of that bill.

In the early to mid 90's Congress crafted a crimes bill. The original funding framework called for equal thirds of the money to go to 1) police enforcement 2) prisons 3) crime prevention

The crime prevention part of the bill would go toward education, job training, community engagement by law enforcement, child-centered activities (money for arts and crafts, dance programs, recreational activities, nutrition training, and so forth), assorted inner city youth activity programs, urban parks and recreation, schools (money is to be used "to improve the academic and social development of youths by instituting a collaborative structure that trains and coordinates efforts of social workers, teachers, and principles."), youth development for such activities as "providing youth with life skills" , drug treatment programs in prisons. and facilities like community centers.

Statistics showed that the majority of youth crimes are committed after school lets out and before dinner time. It is not difficult to see what is missing during that time period, adult supervision. So the idea was to provide a safe and supervised facility where these kids could go.

It was during this period that Newt Gingrich and the 'Contract with America' Republicans took over Congress.

The 'Contract with America' Republicans attacked and demonized this part of the bill. They even labeled it and added a racial slur, They called the prevention part of the bill paying for 'midnight basketball'

The real irony of that debate; Police Chiefs from around the country ascended on Washington to lobby Congress FOR the prevention provisions, because they knew that the best way to help law enforcement was not more police or more punishment, it was through education, training and community activism.

Your problem is that YOU are a moocher. YOU are threatened that your little gravy train on the backs of the Taxpayers is coming to an end. Admit it.

You are a sick excuse for a human being. People don't need to be punished for something they didn't do. Medicare is the very best of what this nation has done for We, the People.

I find it ironic that you right wing turds LOVE government when it bombs, invades, tortures, arrests, incarcerates and executes human beings. Cost is NEVER considered. But when government actually helps people it is evil.

I suggest you consider the way you were raised...by wolves.

 

[The T]

No I am not a liar...

Republicans and the right in America today believe the only way to solve our problems is through punishment. And if that doesn't work, the punishment is just not severe enough. I suggest you research the 1994 Crimes Bill and how Republicans and the right demonized the most constructive part of that bill.

In the early to mid 90's Congress crafted a crimes bill. The original funding framework called for equal thirds of the money to go to 1) police enforcement 2) prisons 3) crime prevention

The crime prevention part of the bill would go toward education, job training, community engagement by law enforcement, child-centered activities (money for arts and crafts, dance programs, recreational activities, nutrition training, and so forth), assorted inner city youth activity programs, urban parks and recreation, schools (money is to be used "to improve the academic and social development of youths by instituting a collaborative structure that trains and coordinates efforts of social workers, teachers, and principles."), youth development for such activities as "providing youth with life skills" , drug treatment programs in prisons. and facilities like community centers.

Statistics showed that the majority of youth crimes are committed after school lets out and before dinner time. It is not difficult to see what is missing during that time period, adult supervision. So the idea was to provide a safe and supervised facility where these kids could go.

It was during this period that Newt Gingrich and the 'Contract with America' Republicans took over Congress.

The 'Contract with America' Republicans attacked and demonized this part of the bill. They even labeled it and added a racial slur, They called the prevention part of the bill paying for 'midnight basketball'

The real irony of that debate; Police Chiefs from around the country ascended on Washington to lobby Congress FOR the prevention provisions, because they knew that the best way to help law enforcement was not more police or more punishment, it was through education, training and community activism.

Your problem is that YOU are a moocher. YOU are threatened that your little gravy train on the backs of the Taxpayers is coming to an end. Admit it.

You are a sick excuse for a human being. People don't need to be punished for something they didn't do. Medicare is the very best of what this nation has done for We, the People.

I find it ironic that you right wing turds LOVE government when it bombs, invades, tortures, arrests, incarcerates and executes human beings. Cost is NEVER considered. But when government actually helps people it is evil.

I suggest you consider the way you were raised...by wolves.

Shut up and get a fucking JOB. Your FREE RIDE is coming to an end after 2012.

 

[Bfgrn]

Your problem is that YOU are a moocher. YOU are threatened that your little gravy train on the backs of the Taxpayers is coming to an end. Admit it.

You are a sick excuse for a human being. People don't need to be punished for something they didn't do. Medicare is the very best of what this nation has done for We, the People.

I find it ironic that you right wing turds LOVE government when it bombs, invades, tortures, arrests, incarcerates and executes human beings. Cost is NEVER considered. But when government actually helps people it is evil.

I suggest you consider the way you were raised...by wolves.

Shut up and get a fucking JOB. Your FREE RIDE is coming to an end after 2012.

The only time I ever had a 'free ride' was when I was very young. I did chores at home when I was old enough. I had a couple paper routes through my early teens, and had my first job lined up before my 16th birthday when I was old enough for working papers. I worked my whole life, was the sole provider so my wife could stay home to raise our children.

Stick it up your ass sonny boy...

 

[OODA_Loop]

The only time I ever had a 'free ride' was when I was very young. I did chores at home when I was old enough. I had a couple paper routes through my early teens, and had my first job lined up before my 16th birthday when I was old enough for working papers. I worked my whole life, was the sole provider so my wife could stay home to raise our children.

how and what enabled the motivation to pull this off ?

 

[Bfgrn]

The only time I ever had a 'free ride' was when I was very young. I did chores at home when I was old enough. I had a couple paper routes through my early teens, and had my first job lined up before my 16th birthday when I was old enough for working papers. I worked my whole life, was the sole provider so my wife could stay home to raise our children.

how and what enabled the motivation to pull this off ?

The same motivation most people have. But to you right wing turds, all people must be loathed.

 

[The T]

You are a sick excuse for a human being. People don't need to be punished for something they didn't do. Medicare is the very best of what this nation has done for We, the People.

I find it ironic that you right wing turds LOVE government when it bombs, invades, tortures, arrests, incarcerates and executes human beings. Cost is NEVER considered. But when government actually helps people it is evil.

I suggest you consider the way you were raised...by wolves.

Shut up and get a fucking JOB. Your FREE RIDE is coming to an end after 2012.

The only time I ever had a 'free ride' was when I was very young. I did chores at home when I was old enough. I had a couple paper routes through my early teens, and had my first job lined up before my 16th birthday when I was old enough for working papers. I worked my whole life, was the sole provider so my wife could stay home to raise our children.

Stick it up your ass sonny boy...

So...this means YOU are an enabler. Got it.

 

[Bfgrn]

Shut up and get a fucking JOB. Your FREE RIDE is coming to an end after 2012.

The only time I ever had a 'free ride' was when I was very young. I did chores at home when I was old enough. I had a couple paper routes through my early teens, and had my first job lined up before my 16th birthday when I was old enough for working papers. I worked my whole life, was the sole provider so my wife could stay home to raise our children.

Stick it up your ass sonny boy...

So...this means YOU are an enabler. Got it.

Working your whole life makes you an enabler? An enabler of what?