COVID is just like the flu.

[LA RAM FAN]

Remember when that was one of the WH talking points in the early stages of the pandemic? No reason to panic. COVID will go away when the weather gets warm. It's all under control.

Turns out, they were wrong..........in too many ways to discuss. One of the more demonstrably provable things they were wrong about was the comparison to the flu.

We wiped out the flu this year. Could we do it again?

That's what happens to influenza type viruses when people wear masks and practice social distancing. Unfortunately, COVID is a highly transmissible virus. More so than the regular flu.

The point being the COVID protocols dismissed as ineffective, infringements on freedom, a waste of time by conservatives.........they work. And if we had not implemented them, if we had not locked down the economy for a while, the infection rate and death toll would be far worse than it is.

Figures an America hating troll would bring back this old dead thread.

 

[jc456]

Remember when that was one of the WH talking points in the early stages of the pandemic? No reason to panic. COVID will go away when the weather gets warm. It's all under control.

Turns out, they were wrong..........in too many ways to discuss. One of the more demonstrably provable things they were wrong about was the comparison to the flu.

We wiped out the flu this year. Could we do it again?

That's what happens to influenza type viruses when people wear masks and practice social distancing. Unfortunately, COVID is a highly transmissible virus. More so than the regular flu.

The point being the COVID protocols dismissed as ineffective, infringements on freedom, a waste of time by conservatives.........they work. And if we had not implemented them, if we had not locked down the economy for a while, the infection rate and death toll would be far worse than it is.

Hahaha coronavirus is the flu! Do you think masks prevent viruses?

 

[jc456]

. What these preventive measures will do is reduce your chance of being infected

How so?

 

[Weatherman2020]

Remember when that was one of the WH talking points in the early stages of the pandemic? No reason to panic. COVID will go away when the weather gets warm. It's all under control.

Turns out, they were wrong..........in too many ways to discuss. One of the more demonstrably provable things they were wrong about was the comparison to the flu.

We wiped out the flu this year. Could we do it again?

That's what happens to influenza type viruses when people wear masks and practice social distancing. Unfortunately, COVID is a highly transmissible virus. More so than the regular flu.

The point being the COVID protocols dismissed as ineffective, infringements on freedom, a waste of time by conservatives.........they work. And if we had not implemented them, if we had not locked down the economy for a while, the infection rate and death toll would be far worse than it is.

Except unlike the flu, Covid is manmade.

 

[jc456]

Remember when that was one of the WH talking points in the early stages of the pandemic? No reason to panic. COVID will go away when the weather gets warm. It's all under control.

Turns out, they were wrong..........in too many ways to discuss. One of the more demonstrably provable things they were wrong about was the comparison to the flu.

We wiped out the flu this year. Could we do it again?

That's what happens to influenza type viruses when people wear masks and practice social distancing. Unfortunately, COVID is a highly transmissible virus. More so than the regular flu.

The point being the COVID protocols dismissed as ineffective, infringements on freedom, a waste of time by conservatives.........they work. And if we had not implemented them, if we had not locked down the economy for a while, the infection rate and death toll would be far worse than it is.

Except unlike the flu, Covid is manmade.

Or, doesn’t exist

 

[Flopper]

. What these preventive measures will do is reduce your chance of being infected

How so?

Masks reduce your chance of infection or spreading Corvid for same reason it works for other respiratory disease such as the Flu or pneumonia. How effective masks are depends on the masks, viral load, the velocity of the expelled matter, and of course the physical characteristics of the virus.

https://files.fast.ai/papers/masks_lit_review.pdf

 

[jc456]

Masks reduce your chance of infection or spreading

Nope. I do woodworking, I use masks all the time for wood dust. You can see wood dust and it gets through the mask, you can’t see a virus and you think a mask will stop it! That’s hilarious

 

[Flopper]

Masks reduce your chance of infection or spreading

Nope. I do woodworking, I use masks all the time for wood dust. You can see wood dust and it gets through the mask, you can’t see a virus and you think a mask will stop it! That’s hilariou

If you wear a dust mask which most people wear for shop work it should eliminate over 99% of the dust particles and 30% of the virus. Thus 70% of the virus will pass through the mask and reach you if you are very close to an infected person say a foot or less and the person is talking to you. If the infected person is also wearing the mask then viral load drops in half to about 35%. Now if that person is 6 feet away and there is only moderate ventilation, then the viral load will be less than 1%.

Actually anything between you and the infected person that blocks or reduces the velocity of virus particles being expelled will improve your chances of avoiding the infection. If the other person is wearing a mask, your chances are nearly twice as good and if the person is 6 feet away, then your chance of infection is extremely low. One viral particle is not going to infect you. Typically it takes between 2000 an 3000 particles to cause any infection. and those particles need to reach deep into the nasal cavity A person with corvid symptoms and not seriously ill will produce from a few hundred to a few thousand particles when they speech which dissipates rapidly with distance so even the less effective mask can still be effective, particularly when everyone in the room is wearing a mask.

Coronavirus (COVID-19) Overview

COVID-19 is a new type of coronavirus that causes mild to severe cases. Here’s a quick guide on how to spot symptoms, risk factors, prevent spread of the disease, and find out what to do if you think you have it.

www.webmd.com

 

[Westender]

Remember when that was one of the WH talking points in the early stages of the pandemic? No reason to panic. COVID will go away when the weather gets warm. It's all under control.

Turns out, they were wrong..........in too many ways to discuss. One of the more demonstrably provable things they were wrong about was the comparison to the flu.

We wiped out the flu this year. Could we do it again?

That's what happens to influenza type viruses when people wear masks and practice social distancing. Unfortunately, COVID is a highly transmissible virus. More so than the regular flu.

The point being the COVID protocols dismissed as ineffective, infringements on freedom, a waste of time by conservatives.........they work. And if we had not implemented them, if we had not locked down the economy for a while, the infection rate and death toll would be far worse than it is.

I got sick from the flu, I got a headache from Covid

 

[jc456]

Actually anything between you and the infected person that blocks or reduces the velocity of virus particles being expelled will improve your chances of avoiding the infection. If the other person is wearing a mask, your chances are nearly twice as good and if the person is 6 feet away, then your chance of infection is extremely low

prove it. Put people with the virus in without a mask and with a mask and let's see if your percentage happens. It won't. You don't know how the infection actually occurs.

 

[jc456]

One viral particle is not going to infect you. Typically it takes between 2000 an 3000 particles to cause any infection. and those particles need to reach deep into the nasal cavity A person with corvid symptoms and not seriously ill will produce from a few hundred to a few thousand particles when they speech which dissipates rapidly with distance so even the less effective mask can still be effective, particularly when everyone in the room is wearing a mask.

so if someone isn't sick and still tests positive, how many particles do they carry? Seems you have done research, post some links.

Oh and, why do they swab your nose and then cover your mouth?

 

[jc456]

. What these preventive measures will do is reduce your chance of being infected

How so?

Masks reduce your chance of infection or spreading Corvid for same reason it works for other respiratory disease such as the Flu or pneumonia. How effective masks are depends on the masks, viral load, the velocity of the expelled matter, and of course the physical characteristics of the virus.

https://files.fast.ai/papers/masks_lit_review.pdf

nope, there's zero evidence. No study was ever done for you to make such a statement.

 

[Flopper]

Actually anything between you and the infected person that blocks or reduces the velocity of virus particles being expelled will improve your chances of avoiding the infection. If the other person is wearing a mask, your chances are nearly twice as good and if the person is 6 feet away, then your chance of infection is extremely low

prove it. Put people with the virus in without a mask and with a mask and let's see if your percentage happens. It won't. You don't know how the infection actually occurs.

The value of masks in the prevention of respiratory disease and Covid-19 in particular have been proven many times. Regardless of evidence you will remain unconvinced so I'm not waste my time on you but for the benefit of other reader, I will provide just a few links.

Face masks: what the data say

The science supports that face coverings are saving lives during the coronavirus pandemic, and yet the debate trundles on. How much evidence is enough?

www.nature.com

SARS-CoV-2 Transmission and Infection Among Attendees of an Overnight Camp - Georgia, June 2020 - PubMed

Limited data are available about transmission of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19), among youths. During June 17-20, an overnight camp in Georgia (camp A) held orientation for 138 trainees and 120 staff members; staff members remained for the first camp...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Masks Do More Than Protect Others During COVID-19: Reducing the Inoculum of SARS-CoV-2 to Protect the Wearer - Journal of General Internal Medicine

Although the benefit of population-level public facial masking to protect others during the COVID-19 pandemic has received a great deal of attention, we discuss for one of the first times the hypothesis that universal masking reduces the “inoculum” or dose of the virus for the mask-wearer...

link.springer.com

Effectiveness of Surgical and Cotton Masks in Blocking SARS-CoV-2: A Controlled Comparison in 4 Patients - PubMed

Effectiveness of Surgical and Cotton Masks in Blocking SARS-CoV-2: A Controlled Comparison in 4 Patients

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

AAAS

advances.sciencemag.org

 

[Flopper]

One viral particle is not going to infect you. Typically it takes between 2000 an 3000 particles to cause any infection. and those particles need to reach deep into the nasal cavity A person with corvid symptoms and not seriously ill will produce from a few hundred to a few thousand particles when they speech which dissipates rapidly with distance so even the less effective mask can still be effective, particularly when everyone in the room is wearing a mask.

so if someone isn't sick and still tests positive, how many particles do they carry? Seems you have done research, post some links.

Oh and, why do they swab your nose and then cover your mouth?

They cover your mouth because a nose swab often causes a person to sneeze and they don't want snot all over their gown.

Transmission of COVID-19 virus by droplets and aerosols: A critical review on the unresolved dichotomy

The practice of social distancing and wearing masks has been popular worldwide in combating the contraction of COVID-19. Undeniably, although such practices help control the COVID-19 pandemic to a greater extent, the complete control of virus-laden droplet ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[krichton]

"gullible blue lockdown states" had high mortality because they got hammered hard and early...

In fact those same states have since had far lower rates of infection and death than dumbass states like South Dakota

And as Berg notes...the mitigation practices used for Covid virtually eliminated the flu. They were less effective against the more virulent and deadly covid bug but they were effective enough to keep the death numbers NOT in the millions

And no ...they didn't just reclassify flu as covid. Neither the numbers nor the symptoms support that stupid claim

No, "flattening the curve" only reduces the rate of infection, but by preventing the spike, it conserves hosts to keeps the virus alive forever, which greatly increases the death total eventually.
Fauci only estimated millions of deaths if we went for herd immunity because he did not account for the fact over half the people, (like children), are already inherently immune, and that those under 40 years of age have 40 times less chance of dying from it than the elderly.
He over estimated by more than a factor of 200.
If we had gone for herd immunity last March, the death toll would have been only about 20,000 instead of half a million.
If not for the vaccine, then "flattening the curve" could have kept the virus alive for decades possibly.

You are very confused about how herd immunity works. The only way to get herd immunity is to attempt to get as many ppl infected with the virus as possible. Unchecked spread like that would naturally result in deaths on a massive scale, before any supposed herd immunity would start taking effect. Furthermore, while covid is very contagious, it's not so contagious that everyone would get it casually. Thus dragging out the time line you would want to achieve herd immunity before the dead toll starts mounting. You probably need to force covid on everyone. I'm sure that would work out just fine. Your fantasy of only having 20k dead is just that, a fantasy. I honestly don't know where you got such a silly number.

 

[Rigby5]

Yep - masking, social distancing and other mitigation has kept the flu at record lows this season. Also, more people than ever got a flu shot.

The number of people who die each year from flu-related causes in the U.S. is 8,200 to 20,000. SOURCE: Centers for Disease Control.

Nope, COVID ain't the flu

United States
Coronavirus Cases:
29,530,165
Deaths:
533,693
Recovered:
20,094,790

Wrong.

Past Seasons Estimated Influenza Disease Burden | CDC

These page includes information about the estimated burden of influenza from past seasons, including tables of the estimated influenza disease burden (and 95% credible interval [Cr I]) by age group.

www.cdc.gov

The lowest seasonal flu death toll in the US has been 12,000 to 23,000, (in 2011), and the largest was 46,000 to 95,000, (in 2017).
So then the covid-19 average of only 30,000 per month is much less than seasonal flu, considering both the seasonal flu and covid-19 normally only last less than 2 months.

And these are the real CDC statistic, not your made up ones.

 

[Rigby5]

Remember when that was one of the WH talking points in the early stages of the pandemic? No reason to panic. COVID will go away when the weather gets warm. It's all under control.

Turns out, they were wrong..........in too many ways to discuss. One of the more demonstrably provable things they were wrong about was the comparison to the flu.

We wiped out the flu this year. Could we do it again?

That's what happens to influenza type viruses when people wear masks and practice social distancing. Unfortunately, COVID is a highly transmissible virus. More so than the regular flu.

The point being the COVID protocols dismissed as ineffective, infringements on freedom, a waste of time by conservatives.........they work. And if we had not implemented them, if we had not locked down the economy for a while, the infection rate and death toll would be far worse than it is.

So do we mask up permanently to save lives or after Covid will flu deaths be acceptable?

Masking up stops easy hosts from getting used up early on.
Essentially that conserves easy host, and that prevents herd immunity, which then ensures that any epidemic can NEVER end.
That is why you NEVER want to wear masks or do social distancing.
And normally we do not.
We ONLY did social distancing once before, with Spanish flu, and that caused the Spanish flu to last 2 years instead of 2 months, and that caused the death total to be over 10 times what it normally would have been.
In fact, Spanish flu has returned a couple of times, and it was so insignificant that no one noticed it.

 

[DrLove]

Yep - masking, social distancing and other mitigation has kept the flu at record lows this season. Also, more people than ever got a flu shot.

The number of people who die each year from flu-related causes in the U.S. is 8,200 to 20,000. SOURCE: Centers for Disease Control.

Nope, COVID ain't the flu

United States
Coronavirus Cases:
29,530,165
Deaths:
533,693
Recovered:
20,094,790

Wrong.

Past Seasons Estimated Influenza Disease Burden | CDC

These page includes information about the estimated burden of influenza from past seasons, including tables of the estimated influenza disease burden (and 95% credible interval [Cr I]) by age group.

www.cdc.gov

The lowest seasonal flu death toll in the US has been 12,000 to 23,000, (in 2011), and the largest was 46,000 to 95,000, (in 2017).
So then the covid-19 average of only 30,000 per month is much less than seasonal flu, considering both the seasonal flu and covid-19 normally only last less than 2 months.

And these are the read CDC statistic, not your made up ones.

I was referring to mortality - not cases.

 

[Rigby5]

"gullible blue lockdown states" had high mortality because they got hammered hard and early...

In fact those same states have since had far lower rates of infection and death than dumbass states like South Dakota

And as Berg notes...the mitigation practices used for Covid virtually eliminated the flu. They were less effective against the more virulent and deadly covid bug but they were effective enough to keep the death numbers NOT in the millions

And no ...they didn't just reclassify flu as covid. Neither the numbers nor the symptoms support that stupid claim

No, "flattening the curve" only reduces the rate of infection, but by preventing the spike, it conserves hosts to keeps the virus alive forever, which greatly increases the death total eventually.
Fauci only estimated millions of deaths if we went for herd immunity because he did not account for the fact over half the people, (like children), are already inherently immune, and that those under 40 years of age have 40 times less chance of dying from it than the elderly.
He over estimated by more than a factor of 200.
If we had gone for herd immunity last March, the death toll would have been only about 20,000 instead of half a million.
If not for the vaccine, then "flattening the curve" could have kept the virus alive for decades possibly.

You are very confused about how herd immunity works. The only way to get herd immunity is to attempt to get as many ppl infected with the virus as possible. Unchecked spread like that would naturally result in deaths on a massive scale, before any supposed herd immunity would start taking effect. Furthermore, while covid is very contagious, it's not so contagious that everyone would get it casually. Thus dragging out the time line you would want to achieve herd immunity before the dead toll starts mounting. You probably need to force covid on everyone. I'm sure that would work out just fine. Your fantasy of only having 20k dead is just that, a fantasy. I honestly don't know where you got such a silly number.

I disagree.
First of all, you only need 70% to be immune in order to achieve herd immunity and kill off the virus entirely, because it has such a low R0=2.
Second is that we already know essentially all people under 18 are already inherently immune.
Then from total testing of all members of isolated groups, like military bases, prisons, cloisters, etc., we have now discovered that the number of people who have been infected is over 10 times what we thought, and that means the number infected, recovered, and acquired immunity is 10 times what we thought it was.
And finally, the difference in death rate of those over 70 is 400 times higher than the death rate of those under 38, so if you deliberately infect healthy volunteers under 38, you can reduce the death rate by a factor of 400.
Its called variolation, and is a tried and true historic method to end epidemics with the least number of deaths.
It was used in ancient India, Egypt, China, etc.
Variolation is how we discovered vaccination.

https://hekint.org/2020/09/29/the-global-journey-of-variolation/

{...
Some of the earliest written records of variolation come from China and India4 and the practice was well known in China by AD 1500,5 where the typical method was inserting dry scabs into the nostril of the recipient. In AD 1661, variolation influenced the Qing dynasty. Smallpox had killed emperor Fu-lin and was particularly prevalent among the Manchu people.6 Emperor Kangxi (K’ang Hsi), son of Fu-lin, had survived smallpox as a toddler. His immunity to the disease made him preferable as a ruler over his brothers, who had never had the pox. He was selected to be emperor when his father died, despite being the youngest. In Kangxi’s later years, he would institute a variolation program among his regular troops, protecting them, in his words “as I did my own children.”7

The overall evidence suggests that variolation began somewhere in Asia, traveled to China and then on to Persia and Turkey,8 where it would catch European attention. The most well-known form of variolation was practiced in Turkey. As recorded by Lady Mary Wortley Montague, who lived there with her ambassador husband: “a set of old women performed the operation by scratching open a vein in the patient and putting into it as much of the smallpox venom as could lie on the head of a needle.”9 The wound was then covered with a nutshell. Lady Mary had enough faith in this practice that she had her son variolated this way.

One story held that women from the Caucasus were considered especially beautiful in Turkey and married into the country because they had been variolated and were unscarred by smallpox.10 It is possible that these women went on to teach others the technique or to variolate others themselves, establishing the practice Lady Mary observed.

When Lady Mary’s family returned to England, a smallpox epidemic was raging. She had her daughter variolated and advocated for its widespread practice in England. Her efforts eventually resulted in the variolation of members of the royal family and an official experiment involving six Newgate prisoners.11,12

Variolation faced intense pushback from clergy in England, who said that the practice was counter to God’s will. However, after the Newgate experiment proved effective and the royal children survived their treatment, variolation became incredibly popular. As the practice spread, it evolved into an elaborate process of weeks-long preparation including special diets, cycles of purging and bleeding, and extensive recovery periods.13,14 From 1721, the year of the Newgate experiment,15 to 1728, physicians would variolate 897 people. Only seventeen of them would die, compared to the 18,000 total deaths from smallpox in those same seven years.16

Interestingly, variolation existed as a folk practice in Europe before Lady Mary’s introduction. Thomas Bartholin mentions it in a note published in 1675 and it could be found in rural France and Wales at that time.17 Parents would “buy the pox” by purchasing scabs or dried pustules from the parent of a child recovering from smallpox and tie them on to the arm of their own child, or deliberately put one child to bed with another who had mild smallpox.18

“Modern” variolation—reintroduced from Turkey—was first brought to the Royal Society by physicians Emanuel Timoni (or Timonius) and Jacob Pylarini (or Pylarinius), but the Society considered their reports a novelty, not worthy of investigation. However, after variolation’s rise to popularity in England many English physicians became popular elsewhere in Europe for offering variolation services.19

In Austria, Empress Marie Theresa promoted variolation after recovering from the pox, and this may have encouraged her daughter Marie Antoinette to do the same for the royal family in France.20 Another empress, Catherine the Great, would advocate for variolation in her country of Russia.21,22 Praise was not universal, however, and Voltaire recorded the opinion of some Europeans about the technique:

“The English, on the other side, call the rest of the Europeans cowardly and unnatural. Cowardly, because they are afraid of putting their children to a little pain; unnatural, because they expose them to die one time or other of the small-pox.”
...}

 

[Rigby5]

Yep - masking, social distancing and other mitigation has kept the flu at record lows this season. Also, more people than ever got a flu shot.

The number of people who die each year from flu-related causes in the U.S. is 8,200 to 20,000. SOURCE: Centers for Disease Control.

Nope, COVID ain't the flu

United States
Coronavirus Cases:
29,530,165
Deaths:
533,693
Recovered:
20,094,790

Wrong.

Past Seasons Estimated Influenza Disease Burden | CDC

These page includes information about the estimated burden of influenza from past seasons, including tables of the estimated influenza disease burden (and 95% credible interval [Cr I]) by age group.

www.cdc.gov

The lowest seasonal flu death toll in the US has been 12,000 to 23,000, (in 2011), and the largest was 46,000 to 95,000, (in 2017).
So then the covid-19 average of only 30,000 per month is much less than seasonal flu, considering both the seasonal flu and covid-19 normally only last less than 2 months.

And these are the read CDC statistic, not your made up ones.

I was referring to mortality - not cases.

So was I.
I was listing deaths from seasonal flu, and they are on average twice as high as covid-19 on a monthly basis.

Your problem is that although the monthly death rate of covid-19 is much lower, we won't let it end.
To end, an epidemic has to run out of easy host, since it needs a new host every 12 days.
And by "flattening the curve" we essentially are conserving easy hosts, so then the epidemic can NEVER end.