Drunk driver kills jewish couple, flees scene, baby delivered

[AmyNation]

Noomie, you seem rather desperate to blame the victim.


Many pregnant women choose not to wear a seat belt because of the position over the stomach and the worry that even minor accidents could result in trama to the fetus.

 

[Noomi]

Noomie, you seem rather desperate to blame the victim.


Many pregnant women choose not to wear a seat belt because of the position over the stomach and the worry that even minor accidents could result in trama to the fetus.

I am not blaming the victim, I noted that no seatbelt was worn, which contributed to her death.
Yes, I understand the risks that may be involved given the position of the belt over the stomach, but the point is, seat belts save lives, and she could have lived had she buckled up.

 

[CMike]

I went to a small synagogue that closed. I've been searching for a new synagogue.

I found a chabad one, which is pretty orthodox.

I really enjoy it. Why? Other than the service itself, the congregants have been extremely friendly. I like the atmosphere.

And I love chulunt.

 

[Pogo]

According to the reports in this mornings paper, the women was thrown from the car. Thrown. In other words, she wasn't wearing a seatbelt. She was on the way to hospital, and not once did she consider buckling in to protect her life, and the life of her unborn baby.

If she had been wearing a seatbelt, there is a high chance she would be alive today. I have no sympathy for those who get into a car and refuse to do the right thing and put a damn seat belt on.

Noomi, this has gone far enough.

(a) You cannot have the slightest idea what she "not once considered" if you weren't there...

(b) I've never been pregnant so I don't know for sure, but is it even possible for an extremely pregnant woman to fit a seat belt? And if it is, does that belt not constrain the very area where the baby is gestating? Is that wise?

(c) seat belts do not necessarily save lives; there are numerous cases where a passenger or driver survived because they were NOT wearing one. You're not qualified to judge what would have happened if. To suggest that a seat belt in this kind of impact would have made the difference is absurd.

Your comments are your right. But they're also offensive. And not at all well thought out.

 

[gallantwarrior]

According to the reports in this mornings paper, the women was thrown from the car. Thrown. In other words, she wasn't wearing a seatbelt. She was on the way to hospital, and not once did she consider buckling in to protect her life, and the life of her unborn baby.

If she had been wearing a seatbelt, there is a high chance she would be alive today. I have no sympathy for those who get into a car and refuse to do the right thing and put a damn seat belt on.

Pay attention...the couple was in a CAB, as in TAXICAB. Lots of people don't buckle in when in a CAB. Second, as someone else observed, she was SEVEN MONTHS PREGNANT and a belt, if available, may not have fit. Why don't you blame the asshole who hit the cab, then ran off with his passenger? Are you one of those people who will defend a rapist to the bitter end because we should all know, the woman was "asking" for it?

 

[CMike]

Noomie, you seem rather desperate to blame the victim.


Many pregnant women choose not to wear a seat belt because of the position over the stomach and the worry that even minor accidents could result in trama to the fetus.

I am not blaming the victim, I noted that no seatbelt was worn, which contributed to her death.
Yes, I understand the risks that may be involved given the position of the belt over the stomach, but the point is, seat belts save lives, and she could have lived had she buckled up.

Noomi

 

[Noomi]

^what? Seat belts save lives. That is a fact.

 

[gallantwarrior]

Noomie, you seem rather desperate to blame the victim.


Many pregnant women choose not to wear a seat belt because of the position over the stomach and the worry that even minor accidents could result in trama to the fetus.

I am not blaming the victim, I noted that no seatbelt was worn, which contributed to her death.
Yes, I understand the risks that may be involved given the position of the belt over the stomach, but the point is, seat belts save lives, and she could have lived had she buckled up.

You know this how? Or do you just liking making up your own little narrative to defend you shitty attitude and blame of the victims?

 

[novasteve]

People also have died from seatbelt a being in a flipped car on fire and they are trapped

 

[Noomi]

People also have died from seatbelt a being in a flipped car on fire and they are trapped

More often than not they live.

 

[Noomi]

Noomie, you seem rather desperate to blame the victim.


Many pregnant women choose not to wear a seat belt because of the position over the stomach and the worry that even minor accidents could result in trama to the fetus.

I am not blaming the victim, I noted that no seatbelt was worn, which contributed to her death.
Yes, I understand the risks that may be involved given the position of the belt over the stomach, but the point is, seat belts save lives, and she could have lived had she buckled up.

You know this how? Or do you just liking making up your own little narrative to defend you shitty attitude and blame of the victims?

What are you asking? That I know seat belts save lives? Or that she wasn't wearing one? She was thrown from the car. What does that tell you?

 

[gallantwarrior]

I find that I often am able to play devil's advocate on many issues. I can see why liberals might think relativistically about some issues. What bothers me is the apparent hypocrisy they bring with those opinions.
Case in point: because the couple who died in this horrible accident had chosen a different lifestyle, a path that some (in this case, Noomi) might not choose, their child is assumed to be raised in an unhappy environment. Hasidim are a close-knit cultural/religious group, and they adhere pretty strictly to a very (biblically) moral code. Some people who have eschewed religiously-driven moral codes reject, out-of-hand, anything or anyone that do not. Yet, the very same people who would condemn one group of people for their beliefs are the loudest, most obnoxious when they feel their beliefs have been trammeled.

Dear GW I am glad you make the effort to try to see both sides. We all have our biases and preferences, so we do the best we can knowing we are going to project a little.

What I find causes this imbalance of forgiving things in one instance but hammering in another (what I call "selective forgiveness" and most obvious when used for political convenience to defend one's arguments or viewpoints) is in general NOT forgiving or resolving some past issue in one's own life such as with family or personal relations.

Then anything with politics or religion that "reminds" each person of some past injustice or BS conflict that never got fixed, gets "projected" onto THAT group of people or anyone who appears to represent THAT issue, group or stereotype. I've seen things that boiled down to basic "mommy and daddy issues," or past control issues with other people, repeating over and over. And that biases our perception of who is causing the problem or most to blame, and gets projected from there onto groups.

[from your viewpoint, you may be able to see the liberal bias more clearly than the people you are looking at as hypocritical; but the same can be said for them, too. some areas where I have caught conservatives being hypocritical include: (a1) pushing for religious freedom for Christianity, but when it comes to Constitutional protections of Islam suddenly it's okay to push for banning mosques and pre-emptive laws against shariah which has broader meaning and is problematic to enforce without infringing on charitable practice. (a2) another variation: blaming Muslims even innocent ones for somehow enabling or tolerating extremists Jihadist who abuse religion to commit violent attacks; but when it comes to "ALL corporations" being blamed for abusing power, suddenly there is a DISTINCTION made between good companies having the freedom to protect themselves from liability and the bad companies that "may be abusive" for which the good companies claim no responsibility (just like Muslims who claim no affiliation with Jihadists)
(b1) pushing for pro-life legislation against free choice of individuals, because saving lives is more important than freedom, but when it comes to mandates on health care to save lives, then suddenly prolife people want free choice also independent of govt regulation; and (b2) a variation of this is opposing any regulation on gun control since banning guns won't stop the problem causing the abuse, while pushing regulations on abortion, despite the same argument that banning it won't stop the cause of the problems.]

When I look at these forums I see a bunch of people thrown into group therapy together, not always aware what is going on, and in different stages of grief or anger, denial or bargaining/resolution, trying to sort things out by comparing notes and perceptions.

And the lessons learned are that you get back what you give.
if you project blame onto others while denying your part of the responsibility,
guess what, other people see you the same way.
if you blame someone as representing a group, you get that same treatment in return.

so if we don't like people making generalizations about us, guess what,
we eventually learn not to make generatizations about others that put people
on the defensive where this game STARTS of "excusing one and accusing the other"

someday when we tire of these finger-pointing festivals
we will think up some new games that may be more challenging but fun

such as how can we work together in teams, to get the best ideas from all parties
and correct the worst faults, so we can actually make the most of our resources
and freedoms we have as Americans that we take for granted and waste by fighting?

how can we convert our ailing prisons and mental health systems
to reinvest those wasted resources into funding medical education with public health programs run by interns and residencies under supervised training to cut the costs of both?

how can we pay back debts from misspending by assessing the cost of developing sustainable jobs and education, and investing capital loans there lent against past debts while holding wrongdoers responsible for paying back illicit profits at taxpayers' expense?

heck, if we are going to throw proverbial mud back and forth, why not set up food fights or jello throwing competitions to raise money to pay for the solutions to problems we disagree on so much. At least set things up to be fun and raise money toward the actual CAUSES, instead of wasting billions on campaign funds fighting and not getting anywhere but in debt!

I see bias' on both sides. I see generalization on both sides. I see where people project their anger, fear, and loathing on the "other side". People are most passionate about politics and religion. And, generally, the left seems to have eschewed religion and replaced it with politics. The right, generally, tends to cling to their religion and feel very much under attack. That makes them defensive. Both sides are guilty of seeing only black and white. But the world is not black and white, it is all shades of gray.
The world is a harsh place. Life is not fair. We are not all equal. Until that fact is accepted and dealt with, we will continue to have this polarized conflict in which some people believe in some unattainable utopia and others do not.

 

[gallantwarrior]

I am not blaming the victim, I noted that no seatbelt was worn, which contributed to her death.
Yes, I understand the risks that may be involved given the position of the belt over the stomach, but the point is, seat belts save lives, and she could have lived had she buckled up.

You know this how? Or do you just liking making up your own little narrative to defend you shitty attitude and blame of the victims?

What are you asking? That I know seat belts save lives? Or that she wasn't wearing one? She was thrown from the car. What does that tell you?

How can you know whether she would have lived? Are you psychic, then? How about that rapist? Damned slut was begging for it, wearing provocative clothing. Deserved what she got, did she?

 

[Papageorgio]

The couple who were killed were a bunch of weirdo freaks who belonged on Little House On The Prairie. No one dresses like they are stuck in the 19th century, at least not normal people.

At least the kid will have a normal life - hopefully.

And there is no evidence as yet that the driver was drunk, it could have been someone speeding.

So dislike people that look different than you, interesting. I guess you can call it liberal bigotry.

 

[Pogo]

I am not blaming the victim, I noted that no seatbelt was worn, which contributed to her death.
Yes, I understand the risks that may be involved given the position of the belt over the stomach, but the point is, seat belts save lives, and she could have lived had she buckled up.

You know this how? Or do you just liking making up your own little narrative to defend you shitty attitude and blame of the victims?

What are you asking? That I know seat belts save lives? Or that she wasn't wearing one? She was thrown from the car. What does that tell you?

SMH.... Noomi your logic is as bad as the OP when it made assumptions about drunks.

I don't see any indication that the husband was thrown from the car, and he's dead too. Shall we conclude then that he was wearing a seat belt? And if so, what good did it do him? Did you see the photos of the taxi after impact? Judging from that, since we're going on assumptions, I'd rather be thrown from that car than be crushed inside it.

Again -- seat belts do not necessarily equate to saving lives, especially when it's not a head-on collision. This taxi was T-boned.

 

[Pogo]

The couple who were killed were a bunch of weirdo freaks who belonged on Little House On The Prairie. No one dresses like they are stuck in the 19th century, at least not normal people.

At least the kid will have a normal life - hopefully.

And there is no evidence as yet that the driver was drunk, it could have been someone speeding.

So dislike people that look different than you, interesting. I guess you can call it liberal bigotry.

I guess we can call this post ^^ mental retardation.

 

[Noomi]

You know this how? Or do you just liking making up your own little narrative to defend you shitty attitude and blame of the victims?

What are you asking? That I know seat belts save lives? Or that she wasn't wearing one? She was thrown from the car. What does that tell you?

SMH.... Noomi your logic is as bad as the OP when it made assumptions about drunks.

I don't see any indication that the husband was thrown from the car, and he's dead too. Shall we conclude then that he was wearing a seat belt? And if so, what good did it do him? Did you see the photos of the taxi after impact? Judging from that, since we're going on assumptions, I'd rather be thrown from that car than be crushed inside it.

Again -- seat belts do not necessarily equate to saving lives, especially when it's not a head-on collision. This taxi was T-boned.

I guess no one will know either way whether she would have lived or not. I just find it sad that in her final hours, she didn't think to buckle up.

I'm sorry if I sound nasty and hateful toward the victim. That is not my intention. I have my reasons for harping on about the seatbelt, I feel strongly about their use.

 

[Pogo]

What are you asking? That I know seat belts save lives? Or that she wasn't wearing one? She was thrown from the car. What does that tell you?

SMH.... Noomi your logic is as bad as the OP when it made assumptions about drunks.

I don't see any indication that the husband was thrown from the car, and he's dead too. Shall we conclude then that he was wearing a seat belt? And if so, what good did it do him? Did you see the photos of the taxi after impact? Judging from that, since we're going on assumptions, I'd rather be thrown from that car than be crushed inside it.

Again -- seat belts do not necessarily equate to saving lives, especially when it's not a head-on collision. This taxi was T-boned.

I guess no one will know either way whether she would have lived or not. I just find it sad that in her final hours, she didn't think to buckle up.

I'm sorry if I sound nasty and hateful toward the victim. That is not my intention. I have my reasons for harping on about the seatbelt, I feel strongly about their use.

Very well but none of us know what she thought about the seat belt, whether it would fit, whether it's a wise idea for a very pregnant woman to wear it, or whether the cab even had a working seat belt where she was sitting. Just as I said to the OP, we can't just plug in our own facts based on assumption.

 

[gallantwarrior]

What are you asking? That I know seat belts save lives? Or that she wasn't wearing one? She was thrown from the car. What does that tell you?

SMH.... Noomi your logic is as bad as the OP when it made assumptions about drunks.

I don't see any indication that the husband was thrown from the car, and he's dead too. Shall we conclude then that he was wearing a seat belt? And if so, what good did it do him? Did you see the photos of the taxi after impact? Judging from that, since we're going on assumptions, I'd rather be thrown from that car than be crushed inside it.

Again -- seat belts do not necessarily equate to saving lives, especially when it's not a head-on collision. This taxi was T-boned.

I guess no one will know either way whether she would have lived or not. I just find it sad that in her final hours, she didn't think to buckle up.

I'm sorry if I sound nasty and hateful toward the victim. That is not my intention. I have my reasons for harping on about the seatbelt, I feel strongly about their use.

My sister-in-law died when she was ejected from a car during an accident. We had a closed casket funeral, that's how bad it was. No one in my family rides without a belt. There are just so many circumstances we do not know here.

 

[gallantwarrior]

What are you asking? That I know seat belts save lives? Or that she wasn't wearing one? She was thrown from the car. What does that tell you?

SMH.... Noomi your logic is as bad as the OP when it made assumptions about drunks.

I don't see any indication that the husband was thrown from the car, and he's dead too. Shall we conclude then that he was wearing a seat belt? And if so, what good did it do him? Did you see the photos of the taxi after impact? Judging from that, since we're going on assumptions, I'd rather be thrown from that car than be crushed inside it.

Again -- seat belts do not necessarily equate to saving lives, especially when it's not a head-on collision. This taxi was T-boned.

I guess no one will know either way whether she would have lived or not. I just find it sad that in her final hours, she didn't think to buckle up.

I'm sorry if I sound nasty and hateful toward the victim. That is not my intention. I have my reasons for harping on about the seatbelt, I feel strongly about their use.

OH, yeah, I'm pretty damned sure that she had no clue that those were to be her final hours.