RON PAUL VS Rockefeller

[Paulie]

but, back on topic, I just don't think that RP will pull enough dems or pubs to join with libertarian votes. It IS nice to see some from each side break off and consider a different platform with a different set of common ideas though.

Well, consider this.

Only 10% of the voting population votes in Primaries. That's what, like 10 mil?

Break it down into individual states, and you got about 200,000 votes per state, in primaries/caucuses. Split that in half, to represent each party, and it's roughly 100,000 votes per party. This is all rough estimates, of course. Some states would have a bigger turnout of a particular party, but it's ballpark figures. Add in the Libertarian voters, the Constitution Party voters, the Democrats switching to republican for him, and all the other disenchanted people in the country who've never even voted before, as well.

Of the 30-50% poll numbers that are reflected in national polls, how many of those voters do you think are going to actually show up at primaries and vote? Not all of them, I promise you that. Most voters are very apathetic. You can bet your ass though, that every single Ron Paul supporter will show up at his/her precinct on Primary day in their state. We ALL know what's at stake.

This means that Ron would have to probably average 100,000 votes in primaries, give or take. There's still a while to go, and he's even climbing quicker now in the national polls. He's around 5-6%, depending on the company conducting the poll. When you take into consideration how many Ron Paul supporters probably don't sit around their house all day answering land-line calls, or even having land-line phones to begin with, i would expect his numbers to actually be higher than they're represented. Also, the latest polls were done before his huge fund-raising day, which got him a LOT of media attention. And there's another one on Dec. 16th, which is already shaping up to be just as big, if not bigger.

What I'm getting at, is that he has a damn good chance at winning some primaries. Especially NH, considering how many people there are still undecided, and registered Independent. He could very well win over a lot of that support and get much needed votes. His campaign has been hitting NH hard, and a win there would mean a HUGE amount of exposure and CREDIBILITY/Electability going into the remaining primaries. Never forget how Buchanan won NH. NO ONE saw that coming.

You may not necessarily SEE him being able to get enough votes, but coming from someone who has been on that campaign trail in numerous areas in the northeast, I can tell you that he certainly CAN. I've seen the overall support, and it's much bigger than you might imagine.

 

[Shogun]

yeeea. but even Pat Buchanan carried NH in the 96 primary.... HE still lost to bob dole.


I hear what you are saying and I appriciate hwo much you want him to win.. But I don't think i'd put so much weight on polls right now. There is still a LOT of time left. the closer we come to primary season the greater you will see the right consolidate around their mainstream candidate.

the ONLY strategy that I think would give him even the slightest chance would be if he flaunted his pro-life platform and views on public christianity in order to collect the protistants and catholics who are the ONLY group that I see swallowing major election apathy this year. They don't like the social agenda of Rudy and they sure as hell won't vote for a Mormon (which, I admit, makes me laugh even if it is silly as hell) any quicker than they would vote for a jahovas witness. It's a huge voting bloc. If RP could get their votes, with the libertarians and fringe pubs and dems he MIGHT upset a hand full of states during primaries.

However, the GOP still doesn't have to nominate him and I don't think they will.

he should have run as a third party with lieberman as a running mate. I don't like ole joe but I think the PR move would go along way.

 

[Annie]

yeeea. but even Pat Buchanan carried NH in the 96 primary.... HE still lost to bob dole.


I hear what you are saying and I appriciate hwo much you want him to win.. But I don't think i'd put so much weight on polls right now. There is still a LOT of time left. the closer we come to primary season the greater you will see the right consolidate around their mainstream candidate.

the ONLY strategy that I think would give him even the slightest chance would be if he flaunted his pro-life platform and views on public christianity in order to collect the protistants and catholics who are the ONLY group that I see swallowing major election apathy this year. They don't like the social agenda of Rudy and they sure as hell won't vote for a Mormon (which, I admit, makes me laugh even if it is silly as hell) any quicker than they would vote for a jahovas witness. It's a huge voting bloc. If RP could get their votes, with the libertarians and fringe pubs and dems he MIGHT upset a hand full of states during primaries.

However, the GOP still doesn't have to nominate him and I don't think they will.

he should have run as a third party with lieberman as a running mate. I don't like ole joe but I think the PR move would go along way.

and Joe L. running with RP would make as much sense as Al Gore and Winston Churchill.

 

[Shogun]

and Joe L. running with RP would make as much sense as Al Gore and Winston Churchill.

in an election where breaking the mold would be the biggest selling point it may just make more sense than you think. neither Ron or Joe is Al. The closest would be Joe, and we all saw him take a step to the right in 06. In fact, his status as an independent would strike a helluva chord with those looking at RP. They would have to come to reconcile their views on Iraq and the ME in general... but they would mop up the religious right who will go to the polls holding their noses while voting for a mormon, a "pro-abortion cross dresser" or just staying home. Besides, RP would leave iraq, but NOT restrict israel. I doubt if RP would step in the way of Israel nuking the shit out of Iran... and THAT would make joe willing to consider the ticket.

I could be wrong..

I'm just projecting a bit...

 

[Paulie]

yeeea. but even Pat Buchanan carried NH in the 96 primary.... HE still lost to bob dole.


I hear what you are saying and I appriciate hwo much you want him to win.. But I don't think i'd put so much weight on polls right now. There is still a LOT of time left. the closer we come to primary season the greater you will see the right consolidate around their mainstream candidate.

the ONLY strategy that I think would give him even the slightest chance would be if he flaunted his pro-life platform and views on public christianity in order to collect the protistants and catholics who are the ONLY group that I see swallowing major election apathy this year. They don't like the social agenda of Rudy and they sure as hell won't vote for a Mormon (which, I admit, makes me laugh even if it is silly as hell) any quicker than they would vote for a jahovas witness. It's a huge voting bloc. If RP could get their votes, with the libertarians and fringe pubs and dems he MIGHT upset a hand full of states during primaries.

However, the GOP still doesn't have to nominate him and I don't think they will.

he should have run as a third party with lieberman as a running mate. I don't like ole joe but I think the PR move would go along way.

If he ran 3rd party, he would never have gotten the momentum he has gained since his first televised debate with the republicans. So many people got on board with RP after they saw him on that first debate, and have been captivated ever since. He's still be a footnote in obscurity if he hadn't run republican.

Lieberman probably wouldn't team up with Ron. Or, I should actually reverse that statement. Lieberman is too pro-war. He also employed a tactic that many people are accusing Ron of without any merit, and that's switching party affiliation to get votes, and take away others. Ron has always been registered republican, so that argument goes out the window for him. But Lieberman's tactic was definitely dirty, whether legal or not. Ron would never associate himself with that kind of behavior, it's too unethical for him. It's probably why he promises not to run 3rd party if he doesn't get the R nomination. He knows the potential consequences if he does that.

However, the GOP still doesn't have to nominate him and I don't think they will.

If he has enough delegates, they may have no choice. His campaign knows the importance of that issue, and they and all the independent volunteers around the country have been doing everything they can to address the issue.

 

[Annie]

in an election where breaking the mold would be the biggest selling point it may just make more sense than you think. neither Ron or Joe is Al. The closest would be Joe, and we all saw him take a step to the right in 06. In fact, his status as an independent would strike a helluva chord with those looking at RP. They would have to come to reconcile their views on Iraq and the ME in general... but they would mop up the religious right who will go to the polls holding their noses while voting for a mormon, a "pro-abortion cross dresser" or just staying home. Besides, RP would leave iraq, but NOT restrict israel. I doubt if RP would step in the way of Israel nuking the shit out of Iran... and THAT would make joe willing to consider the ticket.

I could be wrong..

I'm just projecting a bit...

Joe is NOT going to go for a pull out in Iraq, much less Afghanistan and ignoring Iran, hoping that free trade will change their tunes. Dreaming.

 

[Shogun]

Like I said, RP would let Israel dominate the hell out of the ME with their arsenal of nukes. RP won't get involved and we all know how effective dropping a few nukes on people who don't have them are, eh? It's a win for Joe.

Iraq and Afghan have been losers, anyway. We;ll significantly be out of both by '12 anyway. If RP doesn't do it then a dem will in 08. If not, then by '12. Betcha.


If such a combo doesn't tempt you it's cool. Would I be presuming too much to assume you already have no intention of entertaining a vote for RP?

 

[Annie]

Like I said, RP would let Israel dominate the hell out of the ME with their arsenal of nukes. RP won't get involved and we all know how effective dropping a few nukes on people who don't have them are, eh? It's a win for Joe.

Iraq and Afghan have been losers, anyway. We;ll significantly be out of both by '12 anyway. If RP doesn't do it then a dem will in 08. If not, then by '12. Betcha.


If such a combo doesn't tempt you it's cool. Would I be presuming too much to assume you already have no intention of entertaining a vote for RP?

I'm trying, very hard, not to bring up his ties to anti-semite groups. There is NOTHING to back what you are saying and lots to contradict you.

 

[eots]

Like I said, RP would let Israel dominate the hell out of the ME with their arsenal of nukes. RP won't get involved and we all know how effective dropping a few nukes on people who don't have them are, eh? It's a win for Joe.

that's the stupidest thing I have heard so far

 

[eots]

I'm trying, very hard, not to bring up his ties to anti-semite groups. There is NOTHING to back what you are saying and lots to contradict you.

WHOS ties to anti semetic groups ?

 

[Shogun]

by all means.. contradict. If you've got some bullets in that smokestack then whip it out.


indeed, let's see you prove the charge of anti-semitism.

 

[Shogun]

Like I said, RP would let Israel dominate the hell out of the ME with their arsenal of nukes. RP won't get involved and we all know how effective dropping a few nukes on people who don't have them are, eh? It's a win for Joe.

that's the stupidest thing I have heard so far

Is it? Would RP get in the way of Israel if they decided to launch nukes at Iran?

no. That IS his rhetoric, yes?

Would Joe get a hardon if Israel were able to "defend" itself with the full might of its arsenal?

Yes. CLEARLY Joe's got his finger on the pulse of Israel.

Would RP and Joe make a helluva package for an apathetic voter bloc who isn't happy with either parties' nominations? One based on "bucking the system" so to speak? Joe broke from his party in 06. RP is chaffing against his own. Joe doesn't care about iraq, afghanistan or iran until they threaten Israel.


Besides, who else could RP possibly get to run with him?

 

[Annie]

WHOS ties to anti semetic groups ?

Ron Paul's. I'm not going to link but it's been clear for a very long time. To the amazement and consternation of those that lean libertarian, it's been overtaken by the neo-nazis. The same that want to equate the arguement for being 'homebound' are the same that argue our biggest challenge is the minorities. Why do you all think WJ is so simpatico?

 

[Shogun]

Ron Paul's. I'm not going to link but it's been clear for a very long time. To the amazement and consternation of those that lean libertarian, it's been overtaken by the neo-nazis. The same that want to equate the arguement for being 'homebound' are the same that argue our biggest challenge is the minorities. Why do you all think WJ is so simpatico?

oh come ON, K.. if you are going to tease us with accusations then at least toss us a bone...

hehehehehe...

 

[eots]

Ron Paul's. I'm not going to link but it's been clear for a very long time. To the amazement and consternation of those that lean libertarian, it's been overtaken by the neo-nazis. The same that want to equate the arguement for being 'homebound' are the same that argue our biggest challenge is the minorities. Why do you all think WJ is so simpatico?

wow your a real piece of work ..how desperate can you get.. this is even worse than your lie that raising 4.2 million in a day was not reported on all major news outletsand only Ron Paul sites. even fox mentioned it ......briefly

I have information kat is a baby killing Jew hater i wont post it but its very credible and is apparent to all....what a joke

 

[Annie]

oh come ON, K.. if you are going to tease us with accusations then at least toss us a bone...

hehehehehe...

hey, if you really care you'll look. I'm not getting into the problems with paulpolitics that I did with the last idiot. Problem for me, I'm more a libertarian than most. Why do they continue to pick such dicks?

 

[eots]

hey, if you really care you'll look. I'm not getting into the problems with paulpolitics that I did with the last idiot. Problem for me, I'm more a libertarian than most. Why do they continue to pick such dicks?

all of a sudden your shy to post a links ? and he is running for the republican nomination

 

[Paulie]

You're really making yourself look bad here, Kath.

Accusations out of hand? With no source? WE'RE supposed to go find the claims that YOU'RE making?

And your claim of being a Libertarian is ridiculous. Name the last Libertarian that advocated pre-emptive wars, tightening of civil liberties, and invasion of privacy.

And as for Paul's running mate, if it comes to that...

Dare I say it...

















Chuck Hagel

 

[Annie]

There is some here from the dreaded blogs and some from newspapers. Some from groups that are concerned:

http://www.americanthinker.com/2007/11/the_ron_paul_campaign_and_its.html

 

[eots]

When some in a crowd of anti-war activists meeting at Democrat National Committee HQ in June, 2005 suggested Israel was behind the 9-11 attacks, DNC Chair Howard Dean was quick to get behind the microphones and denounce them saying: "such statements are nothing but vile, anti-Semitic rhetoric."


When KKK leader David Duke switched parties to run for Louisiana governor as a Republican in 1991, then-President George H W Bush responded sharply, saying, "When someone asserts the Holocaust never took place, then I don't believe that person ever deserves one iota of public trust. When someone has so recently endorsed Nazism, it is inconceivable that someone can reasonably aspire to a leadership role in a free society."


Ron Paul is different.


Rep Ron Paul (R-TX) is the only Republican candidate to demand immediate withdrawal from Iraq and blame US policy for creating Islamic terrorism. He has risen from obscurity and is beginning to raise millions of dollars in campaign contributions. Paul has no traction in the polls -- 7% of the vote in New Hampshire -- but he at one point had more cash on hand than John McCain. And now he is planning a $1.1 million New Hampshire media blitz just in time for the primary.

this is the most irresponsible and slimy piece of journalism i have seen in a long time no wonder you where ashamed to Post it and by the way the 911 report and the CIA agree with Ron Paul on this on
Online Video: Ron Paul on CNN: Guliani - You owe me an apology ...Ron Paul to Rudy Giuliani "You owe me an apology" Read the 9/11 Commission Report concerning foreign policy and the CIA. Interview with Wolf Blitzer. ...
www.veoh.com/videos/v509605ekRep678 - 104k