Tax the rich, lose the rich

[cad]

"Conservatives say if you don't give the rich more money, they will lose their incentive to invest. As for the poor, they tell us they've lost all incentive because we've given them too much money." George Carlin[/QUOTE]

have you ever actually looked at that carlin quote? conservatives have never said you need to give the rich more money. they say you need to let them KEEP MORE OF THE MONEY THEY EARNED. do you not see the difference?

 

[boedicca]

It was a fucking LIE to say he said that.

Lies are just fine though huh?

You seem quite copacetic with Lies, considering the near constant stream which emits from your keyboard.

 

[Bern80]

Exactlky where did I say they were all republicans?

What is with you and your "republican vs democrat" crap?

Soros is a great success. I admire him. He is a liberal, but I admire how he acheived great success.

I dont get it with you and your partisan crap. Dont you get it? This has nothing to do with politics. It has to do with a vision. I dont care what party you vote for. You can always have the same vision as I had. It has nothing to do with politics.

Jeez....you are so frustrating to debate with. You always go back to partisanship.

Give it a rest.

As I eluded to, it is class envy. It really is that people like righty and Truth just don't get it. Studies have actually been done about how people become wealthy. The FACT is most of them don't come from money. They are highly motivated and generally extremely frugal with their money.

Back atcha, Bern. You seem to think that a spectrum of relative wealth REQUIRES greedy bastards in the US. It doesn't. Feel free to lament about envy after taking your toys and leaving the US for the very third world that your kind must abuse in order to prop themselves up. I'm sure, uh, they won't get tired of it eventually either.

Oh Shogun buddy I was just starting to miss your deluded, nonsensical rants.

I don't think that at all. Being wealthy doesn't require greed. It doesn't require screwing employees or customers over. I have no intention of leving the U.S. And the jobs that we send overseas do not exploit their labor, in fact it generally raises their standard of living. People generally don't gravitate from better to worse working conditions. When American businesses setup shop overseas the workers there come for two reasons. Either the job is better in terms of compensation or they had no job at all. You just don't understand concepts like labor markets do you? Other countries have them too. And no one is forcing laborers in China to work in an American owned company located there. And Amazingly we seem to have very little trouble getting people to work for us overseas.

 

[drsmith1072]

Lib's just hate self-made men and women. They realize that it requires a work ethic, fortitude, and a never say die attitude.

I too am self-made. My family is taken care of for at least the next two generations. I didn't achieve success by sitting on my ass and waiting for someone else to provide it, I went after it. My wife went after it.

And yes, as someone who has provided well paying jobs and benefits to many people through the years, when success is taxed to the hilt, it does cause a closing of the purse strings. The liberal/progressives just don't get it.

The problem with your "logic" is that bush's tax cuts are STILL in effect and as far as I can tell taxes have not been raised by the fed so why is it that the businesses closed their purse strings even though taxcuts are and were in effect? What are you complaining about again? Who is taxing you to the hilt??
Oh and it's nice to know that you didn't lay off that waitress who was making $90,000. LOL

 

[The Rabbi]

More Rich Americans Renounce U.S. Citizenship over Taxes - DailyFinance

Keep in mind that wealthy people represent the dynamic force in our economy, starting businesses, expanding existing businesses or investing in new or starting companies. That they want to take their marbles and leave is a bad sign for us.
All you "don't let the screen door hit you where the good Lord split you" liberal class warriors can just STFU now.

Yeah and despite the fact that bush's tax cuts which were supposed to spur growth are still active while the wealthy that you are referring to chose and are choosing to pocket the tax breaks and have not used them to act as the dynamic force in our economy and are now asking for MORE.

Sometimes you have to say enough is enough. If they have the tax cuts but haven't used them for what they claimed they would use them for then why should they get more or even keep what they got??

You mean the tax cuts that are expiring in January? The ones Geithner said he would oppose renewing?
Do you think wealthy people wait around until taxes hit them before they do something?
The economy expanded for 7 years after the tax cuts. To pretend otherwise is the mark of a partisan retard.
Of course look who I'm responding to.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

We were in a recession. It was expected. Some jobs are lost in a recesssion. But then, as is expected, one of the candidates decided to play in it and call it the beginnig of a depression...that was to get votes. But it did more. IT SCARED THE HELL OUT OF PEOPLE. So they started to lay off out of fear. Then it spiraled.

The recession didn't start in earnest until 2008 - the housing collapse started in 2006. Outsourcing has been ramping up since NAFTA (the worst legislation EVER, by the way) was passed - for at least a decade. Don't you think it is interesting that there is not ONE statistic that shows how many jobs have been erased, never to return. I'm betting that's not an accident. THEY is the rich who said they needed the tax cuts to create jobs and boost the economy, neither of which happened.

 

[daveman]

But that wouldn't make any sense because it isn't true. You need to learn what a Marxist is before you go flinging that around.

Of course it's true. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it's false.

I love how people "know" what other people are really thinking.

Define "Marxism", if you're so sure that you "know".

Placing less value on individual freedoms than collective interests. Centrally planned economy. Government run or owned industry. Rigid speech and thought control.

You know...all the things leftists love.

 

[The Rabbi]

From your own article

As many as 743 people with American citizenship or legal resident status renounced their U.S. citizenship in 2009 -- three times as many as in 2008 -- which resulted in a waiting list for people to say farewell to the red, white and blue at the U.S. Embassy in London, according to the Financial Times. That represents a tiny fraction of the 7 million or so Americans living abroad, but does underscore the growing unease about the Obama administration's taxation policies among the wealthy, according to experts.

Many of those leaving the U.S. behind have dual nationality and may not have lived in the country for years. Others have lived overseas for so long that America no longer feels like home.

So the claim that they are RICH and are leaving the country for tax purposes is a little less than honest don't you think?? Especially since the article itself counters that claim.

Thanks for the "worthless opinon presented as fact post".

So you mischaracterize what I wrote and then proceed to try to say that is false? Nice work if you can get it.
In fact the article makes two things clear: the number of people renouncing citizenship has doubled and will continue to increase. The number of people leaving to preserve their wealth is increasing.
Doubtless you will again misconstrue what I wrote, try to show it was wrong, and call me names.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

People generally don't gravitate from better to worse working conditions.

American workers have... and for less money too.

 

[Bern80]

We were in a recession. It was expected. Some jobs are lost in a recesssion. But then, as is expected, one of the candidates decided to play in it and call it the beginnig of a depression...that was to get votes. But it did more. IT SCARED THE HELL OUT OF PEOPLE. So they started to lay off out of fear. Then it spiraled.

The recession didn't start in earnest until 2008 - the housing collapse started in 2006. Outsourcing has been ramping up since NAFTA (the worst legislation EVER, by the way) was passed - for at least a decade. Don't you think it is interesting that there is not ONE statistic that shows how many jobs have been erased, never to return. I'm betting that's not an accident. THEY is the rich who said they needed the tax cuts to create jobs and boost the economy, neither of which happened.

I love the whiners about overseas jobs. You can't have it both ways people. Either you can keep jobs here and pay more for goods services, lowering everyone's standard of living. Or you can hire cheap labor overseas that allows goods and services to cost less, which allows consumers to keep more money. Pick one.

 

[drsmith1072]

GDP growth for Q2 has been revised downward to 2.6%.

At this point after the 1981 recession, we had growth rates of double to more than triple that level.

The proof is in the GDP Growth Pudding. Obamanomics is an Epic Fail.

As anyone with an ounce of common sense, economic literacy, and historical perspective knows: the more you tax something, the less of it you get; the more you subsidize something, the more of it you get.

Obamanomics subsidizes Big Government and taxes productivity. That's why unemployment is at unprecedentedly high levels for this stage of what is supposed to be an economic recover.

Fasten your seat belts, it's going to be a bumpy Double Dip.

Oh and (sarcasm coming) I am certain that it couldn't have anything to do with the republicans blocking and obstructing anything and everything including tax cuts for small businesses and extending unemployment benefits now could it?? It couldn't be because they would rather maintain the status quo in the hopes that the flatlining economy which has bene directly impacted by their obstruction will benefit them in the upcoming election now could it??

As usual with the republican hacks and their lemming lap dogs who are willfully ill-informed it is party first and the end justifies the means.

I just love how morons parrot the bs about taxes and yet when asked for substance about how obama did anything to impact their taxes negatively they become mute on the subject or just parrot the same lame claims over and over again.

 

[cad]

and to the doctorisin.

please explain how jesus was a community organzier.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Of course it's true. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it's false.

I love how people "know" what other people are really thinking.

Define "Marxism", if you're so sure that you "know".

Placing less value on individual freedoms than collective interests. Centrally planned economy. Government run or owned industry. Rigid speech and thought control.

You know...all the things leftists love.

Yeah, none of these things are true.

"Marxism" is a anarco-collectivist philosophy. As in, there is no "government" to own anything.

Learn the definitions of words before you use them.

Plus, I don't think you've ever actually met a "leftist". Name one person on this board who is in favor of what you call "rigid speech and thought control".

 

[Bern80]

People generally don't gravitate from better to worse working conditions.

American workers have... and for less money too.

Enter problem number two of the liberal mindset: Everything is predestined. You have no control over your future, your opportunities for making money float in the wind and luck cloud may land on you or it may not....according to liberals.

 

[Jarhead]

People generally don't gravitate from better to worse working conditions.

American workers have... and for less money too.

I am not going to say you are lying.

You are misinformed.

People may take less money during a recession. But they do not naturally gravitate from better to worse.

People leave jobs by choice for one of four things:

Better working conditions
Better money/benefits
Better position/increase in responsibilty/career development
Relocation for better quality of life/family sitautions

 

[Mr. Peepers]

Placing less value on individual freedoms than collective interests. Centrally planned economy. Government run or owned industry. Rigid speech and thought control.

That is not Marxism, fool. I knew it. Here.

Marx for dummies. | Ask MetaFilter

 

[theDoctorisIn]

and to the doctorisin.

please explain how jesus was a community organzier.

I think that's pretty self-explanatory.

He "organized" a new religion. He led people into a new way of thinking, helped people break the cycle of ideology and power that had been in control before.

 

[Jarhead]

People generally don't gravitate from better to worse working conditions.

American workers have... and for less money too.

Enter problem number two of the liberal mindset: Everything is predestined. You have no control over your future, your opportunities for making money float in the wind and luck cloud may land on you or it may not....according to liberals.

As I continue to read some responses on here....I think yoiu may be correct.

I am starting to believe that the liberal mindset is on of being reactive....not proactive.

Yes, a generalization on my part. But the liberal argument seems to be based on "there is nothing we can do so government needs to do it for us"

It is starting to really fall into place.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

I love the whiners about overseas jobs. You can't have it both ways people. Either you can keep jobs here and pay more for goods services, lowering everyone's standard of living. Or you can hire cheap labor overseas that allows goods and services to cost less, which allows consumers to keep more money. Pick one.

Um, how do IT and customer service people lower the cost of cheap crap at Wal Mart??? Those are the decent-paying jobs that have been decimated - for higher profits.

 

[drsmith1072]

Haven't we been through this a dozen times already?

Abe Lincoln never said that

He should have----do you have a problem with any of those principles ?

Funny. I was thinking the same thing.

Just becuase someone never said it means that the principles themselves are not valid and worthy of following?

It is like...

"Because Glen Beck is the one who found it out, it is not worth worrying about"

SO If I am in a building and a guy I dont like screams "fire"....I will say..."who cares since you are the one warning me"

What is with people these days? Has logic become outlawed and I missed it?

Whether he should have said it or not really isn't the point. The fact is that falsely attributing a quote to someone in a desperate attempt to give that quote validity is dishonest.

So you definitely did miss something.