What are the Palestinians playing at?

[Lipush]

The continued terror attack threats from Judea and Samaria, the refusal of Abu Mazen to sit and talk, got Israel to refuse to what is called the "Fourth Beat", AKA further terrorists-release. Netanyahu said that any upcoming release of prisoners should only come to pass once the Palestinians show tributes of good will, as well.

Palestinians threatened to adress the UN and closed the 'Negotiation', and just for sit down and continue talking (are they doing us any favors? who is without a state, here?) they came up with new, amusing, rediculous new demands.

....The list was presented to the PLO Thursday by Chief Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erekat and Mohammed Al-Aalul, a Fatah central committee member, and indicated a hardening of positions by the Palestinians as talks falter.

The demands are:

> A written commitment by Prime Minister Benjamin Netnayahu that the borders of the Palestinian state will be along the 1967 'green-line' and that its capital will be East Jerusalem.

> The release of 1,200 Palestinian prisoners, including political heavyweights Marwan Barghouti, Ahmed Saadat and Fuad Shubkhi.

>An end to the Egyptian-Israeli blockade on Gaza, and the formulation of dealing allowing the flow of goods into Gaza.

> A halt in construction in East Jerusalem.

> The IDF will not be allowed to enter Area A – the area of the West Bank under autonomous PA control since the Oslo Accords – to conduct arrests or assassinations
Israel will permit the PA control over Area C – currently under Israel's control.

> The Palestinians known as the Church of Nativity deportees – a group of terrorist who barricaded themselves in the Church of the Nativity on April 2, 2002 and were later deported to European nations and the Gaza Strip – will be allowed to return to the West Bank.

> The reopening of a number of Palestinian development agencies Israel shut down.

> (unwritten condition)- Israel will allow 15,000 Palestinians to gain Israeli citizenship.

Palestinians publish new list of demands: PM must agree to East Jerusalem as... - Israel News, Ynetnews

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Those are only conditions for sitting down and talk. I ask myself, if those are pre-negotiation, what will be the rude demand once the negotiation "re-starts"?

I want some of whatever it is they're smoking!

 

[toastman]

Abbas knows that Israel will not succumb to his demands. He's just playing around as usual.

 

[Lipush]

The old guy is delusional. Maybe he finally cracked?

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

At least the world knows about the situation, which is why more and more are coming over to Israel's side in the debate. They know the Palestinian Authority, with them openly admitting they are just carrying on with the talks to get the last batch of terrorists released, are just playing games and it is the PA that are at fault for the failure of the talks. Still, we all knew they would be the ones who scuppered the talks, and not the Israelis.

 

[Manchester]

At least the world knows about the situation, which is why more and more are coming over to Israel's side in the debate. They know the Palestinian Authority, with them openly admitting they are just carrying on with the talks to get the last batch of terrorists released, are just playing games and it is the PA that are at fault for the failure of the talks. Still, we all knew they would be the ones who scuppered the talks, and not the Israelis.

I genuinely believe that you believe that.

 

[Hossfly]

At least the world knows about the situation, which is why more and more are coming over to Israel's side in the debate. They know the Palestinian Authority, with them openly admitting they are just carrying on with the talks to get the last batch of terrorists released, are just playing games and it is the PA that are at fault for the failure of the talks. Still, we all knew they would be the ones who scuppered the talks, and not the Israelis.

I genuinely believe that you believe that.

It was just announced on cable news channels that Israel has decided not to release any prisoners. Guess that settles the matter and the Palis will threaten to walk out.

 

[aris2chat]

At least the world knows about the situation, which is why more and more are coming over to Israel's side in the debate. They know the Palestinian Authority, with them openly admitting they are just carrying on with the talks to get the last batch of terrorists released, are just playing games and it is the PA that are at fault for the failure of the talks. Still, we all knew they would be the ones who scuppered the talks, and not the Israelis.

I genuinely believe that you believe that.

>>But in contrast to the Israelis, there is no Palestinian peace camp or faction within either Abbas’ Fatah or his Hamas rivals that will push for peace even if it doesn’t grant their maximal demands. The only possible source of pressure on Abbas to do make peace must come from the U.S., Europe and the Arab States. But if President Obama is not willing to hold Abbas accountable for his behavior, then no one will. In the absence of an American determination to hold Abbas’ feet to the fire in spite of the enormous Palestinian constituency that will always oppose even the most generous Israeli offer, the already slim prospects for peace are altogether extinguished.<<

Peace talks for the palestinians have always been a stall and repositioning. Peace with Israel was never the goal. More land, more concession, more exposure, more publicity, but not a final peace, unless that peace meant the eventual end of the Israeli state. The longer talks go on, the more the world is willing to help support the palestinians financially.
It is the palestinians that will be the perpetual victims in the game. Abbas knew very well there could be no agreement without Hamas on board. Hamas was never going to agree to a unity or peace that would leave them weaker in the gaza. Their power and finance comes from the perpetuation of hostilities with Israel, the "struggle".
We all hope that someday peace will be a reality, a real peace with two state side by side complimenting each other economically, spiritually and in security. A dream that will not come about till the palestinians are educated in the benefits of peace. Even the UN has conceded that hostility and hate are perpetuated within the education system. Hamas refuses to use UN supplied books that are "too peaceful".
Peace does not begin with a silence of guns or a signature on a piece of paper. It will begin with the minds and hearts of the palestinians. It begins with the language of peace and love from not just the schools but the mosques, the media, the streets, the family meal, teaching children their first words. It means handing out flowers instead of guns. It mean sharing a mean instead of bombs. It means talking someone's hand and helping walk a path together instead of holding a knife to the other's throat.

Israel has been making overtures of peace for more than a century. One day we all hope the palestinians will be ready to make peace. We all knew, through we hoped we were wrong, that Abbas could not make peace and this was all an exercise in futility. Just another step in the dance.

 

[aris2chat]

Another Tack: The postulate of illegitimacy | Bucking the Trend ?

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

At least the world knows about the situation, which is why more and more are coming over to Israel's side in the debate. They know the Palestinian Authority, with them openly admitting they are just carrying on with the talks to get the last batch of terrorists released, are just playing games and it is the PA that are at fault for the failure of the talks. Still, we all knew they would be the ones who scuppered the talks, and not the Israelis.

I genuinely believe that you believe that.

In my years on forums certainly now there are more in the pro-Israel camp than anti-Israel. More and more of the people that were unsure about what was going on are now pro-Israel. It is really heartening to see people realize the truth of history of the region and what is going on now. Pallywood, lies and hate on the part of the Palestinians are obvious to all. It's brilliant.

 

[GHook93]

The continued terror attack threats from Judea and Samaria, the refusal of Abu Mazen to sit and talk, got Israel to refuse to what is called the "Fourth Beat", AKA further terrorists-release. Netanyahu said that any upcoming release of prisoners should only come to pass once the Palestinians show tributes of good will, as well.

Palestinians threatened to adress the UN and closed the 'Negotiation', and just for sit down and continue talking (are they doing us any favors? who is without a state, here?) they came up with new, amusing, rediculous new demands.

....The list was presented to the PLO Thursday by Chief Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erekat and Mohammed Al-Aalul, a Fatah central committee member, and indicated a hardening of positions by the Palestinians as talks falter.

The demands are:

> A written commitment by Prime Minister Benjamin Netnayahu that the borders of the Palestinian state will be along the 1967 'green-line' and that its capital will be East Jerusalem.

> The release of 1,200 Palestinian prisoners, including political heavyweights Marwan Barghouti, Ahmed Saadat and Fuad Shubkhi.

>An end to the Egyptian-Israeli blockade on Gaza, and the formulation of dealing allowing the flow of goods into Gaza.

> A halt in construction in East Jerusalem.

> The IDF will not be allowed to enter Area A – the area of the West Bank under autonomous PA control since the Oslo Accords – to conduct arrests or assassinations
Israel will permit the PA control over Area C – currently under Israel's control.

> The Palestinians known as the Church of Nativity deportees – a group of terrorist who barricaded themselves in the Church of the Nativity on April 2, 2002 and were later deported to European nations and the Gaza Strip – will be allowed to return to the West Bank.

> The reopening of a number of Palestinian development agencies Israel shut down.

> (unwritten condition)- Israel will allow 15,000 Palestinians to gain Israeli citizenship.

Palestinians publish new list of demands: PM must agree to East Jerusalem as... - Israel News, Ynetnews

----------

Those are only conditions for sitting down and talk. I ask myself, if those are pre-negotiation, what will be the rude demand once the negotiation "re-starts"?

I want some of whatever it is they're smoking!

They forgot: "And Bibi must walk into the middle of Gaza City put his head between his legs and kiss his own ass!" A little shout out to Braveheart!

 

[GHook93]

The old guy is delusional. Maybe he finally cracked?

No he is like Arafat. He doesn't want peace or a state. He, like Arafat, are getting fat and rich off the occupation. Arafat had savings of 10s of millions of dollars? Where did he get it from? He never ran a business or anything of the sort.

Second, it is much easier to run a terrorist movement and make demands, then it is to run a functioning society who lives within it's means. See Africa. The Palestinians live a ton better than anyone in Africa and most of the countries in the middle east. That is simply because of Israel's assistance. They know if they get their own country they will have to run it and they will run it into the ground!

Running a country isn't easy. Making money off of a terrorist campaign is!

 

[GHook93]

At least the world knows about the situation, which is why more and more are coming over to Israel's side in the debate. They know the Palestinian Authority, with them openly admitting they are just carrying on with the talks to get the last batch of terrorists released, are just playing games and it is the PA that are at fault for the failure of the talks. Still, we all knew they would be the ones who scuppered the talks, and not the Israelis.

I genuinely believe that you believe that.

It was just announced on cable news channels that Israel has decided not to release any prisoners. Guess that settles the matter and the Palis will threaten to walk out.

Good for them! Why release these scumbags. They should only be free to leave in body bags!

 

[aris2chat]

Israel Thrives: The Elder and the "Assumed Symmetry Fallacy"

 

[aris2chat]

Abbas to Kerry: Please Beg Me More!

 

[RoccoR]

et al,

I believe toastman is correct.

Abbas knows that Israel will not succumb to his demands. He's just playing around as usual.

(COMMENT)

This is a desperation move; a WIN-WIN for the Palestinians and a huge risk for the Israelis.

The Palestinian Authority doesn't want to negotiate the terms.

So, they have to make it look like the Palestinians are attempting to engage the Israelis.

This was the risk the Israelis took when they agree to the talks. And it is the SECSTATE's fault for pushing it forward.

Most Respectfully,
R