What happens when a leftist is President...

[sparky]

on the wind thing, i do believe we've just passed the 2MW milestone, or in otherwords come a long way in a short time

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

The benefit of wind power is that it does not create CO2 pollution, Gunny.

Stop playing the nitwit, okay?

Well that seems reasonable, since wind also doesn't produce much energy.

 

[Old Rocks]

Wind Energy Resource Atlas of the United States
Renewable Energy Atlas of the West

Well, Publius, you seem to be quite ignorant of the potential of wind in the US, so here are some sites on which you can come up to date.

 

[Old Rocks]

The wind potential for Montana alone is 1020 billion kwhs a year. And it is ranked fifth in potential power.

 

[DiamondDave]

I don't think we're going to set aside land masses the size of WVA to tap all potential wind power... hell, if we had solar collectors over all the oceans or all of California, we would have more energy too.. it still does not mean, just because of potential, that it is a practical sollution

 

[bigdaddygtr]

Why can’t we leave this one up to the people of Utah? They would be the ones closest to the positive and negative impacts of opening that BLM land to drilling. When they go through this process do they lease or sell the land to oil companies? If it’s a lease I would think it would be a great revenue raiser for the feds and for the state of Utah.

They don't have the time, their too busy being polygamists and hating gay people.

 

[Skeptik]

On drilling, the federal Bureau of Land Management is opening about 360,000 acres of public land in Utah to oil and gas drilling. Bush administration officials argue that the drilling will not harm sensitive areas; environmentalists oppose it.

"They want to have oil and gas drilling in some of the most sensitive, fragile lands in Utah," Podesta said. "I think that's a mistake."

Obama to use executive orders for immediate impact - Yahoo! News


Wonder what happened to the bipartisian deal reached in Congress?

At the risk of getting this thread back to the original track, let me say this:

Obama might be able to issue executive orders, and countermand executive orders passed by his predecessor. He can't, however, overturn the will of Congress via executive order.

And, it was some guy named Podesta who wanted the oil and gas exploration in Utah ended, not Obama.

 

[Turboswede]

They don't have the time, their too busy being polygamists and hating gay people.

It would be funny if it weren’t true.

 

[Old Rocks]

I don't think we're going to set aside land masses the size of WVA to tap all potential wind power... hell, if we had solar collectors over all the oceans or all of California, we would have more energy too.. it still does not mean, just because of potential, that it is a practical sollution

Again, bullshit. Much of the wind power in Oregon sets in wheat fields. The turbines take up less than an acre apiece. Some of the best wind potential is on the rocky ridges between the Idaho border and Klamath Falls. That also happens to be the best area for solar and geothermal. And it is almost completely empty, most of it BLM.

 

[Zoomie1980]

I find it so strange that some people seem to equating opposition to all alternative power, save nuclear, to be a conservative cause. We have more than adaquete power in the form of geothermal, solar, and wind. There is no need to burn coal or natural gas. We have already built successful electric cars, and a plug in diesel hybrid is well within the present technology. What is lacking is leadership and will.

Actually that is not even remotely close to true. We could cover the entire Great Plains with wind mills from Canada to Texas and still add less than 25% to the overall grid. We could blanket the entire rural SouthWest in solar panels and likewise be less than 20% of what we need. There simply are not enough active geothermal fields in the country to ever supply more than 5% or so of our needs.

And where do you think the power is going to come from to charge the batteries of the cars? And where are the batteries coming from? And where do they go when they are burnt out? Going pile auto batteries in your back yard where they can corrode and leach into the ground water? Also where are lubricants for those electric cars going to come from? The plastic they are built with???? Guess you haven't thought of all that?

 

[editec]

What happens when a leftist is President...

Well, it's a drop dead certainty we aren't going to find out in the next four years.

 

[Old Rocks]

Actually that is not even remotely close to true. We could cover the entire Great Plains with wind mills from Canada to Texas and still add less than 25% to the overall grid. We could blanket the entire rural SouthWest in solar panels and likewise be less than 20% of what we need. There simply are not enough active geothermal fields in the country to ever supply more than 5% or so of our needs.

You have thrown out a whole bunch of numbers here without a single citiation as to there source. Without that, they are just a bunch of numbers, unsubstantiated.

And where do you think the power is going to come from to charge the batteries of the cars? And where are the batteries coming from? And where do they go when they are burnt out? Going pile auto batteries in your back yard where they can corrode and leach into the ground water? Also where are lubricants for those electric cars going to come from? The plastic they are built with???? Guess you haven't thought of all that?

What happens to the present car bodies? The the present batteries in use? Lithium, nor nickel, are cheap. They will be recycled back into more batteries. And there are already people that are supplying electrical power both for their homes and electrical vehicles off of the solar on their roofs.

 

[auditor0007]

The benefit of wind power is that it does not create CO2 pollution, Gunny.

Stop playing the nitwit, okay?

The problem with wind is that the way everyone thinks of wind power as a solution is unworkable. Yes, we can increase wind power a bit, but we can't have wind as our biggest source of electicity.

Here is the problem; electicity must be made available when it is needed. The grid can only handle so much electicity. If wind power is the main source of electicity, there would be times it would over charge the grid. There would also be many times when it didn't provide enough electicity. The problem is that there is no way to store electricity on a large scale.

In order for solar and wind power to become our main source of energy, every home and building would need to have batteries to store excess electricity. That way, when less energy was being produced, power would still be available. Besides needing storage capabilities, you would need a mechanism that would automatically switch power from AC to DC, from the grid to the battery. We're not there yet in that type of technology, not to mention the cost.

Last of all, if the technology does become available, than it would make more sense to put a small wind turbine on every building along with solar panels. Electicity used from the grid would then be used as backup. Of course, this creates another problem. It costs a lot of money to maintain the grid. If everyone is using their own energy rather than that supplied on the grid, who pays to maintain the grid?

 

[revolutionary]

What happens when the president is leftist with a leftist congress, and a leftist judicial system? I think the answer is socialism.

 

[Chris]

The problem with wind is that the way everyone thinks of wind power as a solution is unworkable. Yes, we can increase wind power a bit, but we can't have wind as our biggest source of electicity.

Here is the problem; electicity must be made available when it is needed. The grid can only handle so much electicity. If wind power is the main source of electicity, there would be times it would over charge the grid. There would also be many times when it didn't provide enough electicity. The problem is that there is no way to store electricity on a large scale.

In order for solar and wind power to become our main source of energy, every home and building would need to have batteries to store excess electricity. That way, when less energy was being produced, power would still be available. Besides needing storage capabilities, you would need a mechanism that would automatically switch power from AC to DC, from the grid to the battery. We're not there yet in that type of technology, not to mention the cost.

Last of all, if the technology does become available, than it would make more sense to put a small wind turbine on every building along with solar panels. Electicity used from the grid would then be used as backup. Of course, this creates another problem. It costs a lot of money to maintain the grid. If everyone is using their own energy rather than that supplied on the grid, who pays to maintain the grid?

The Danes already get 20% of their power from wind. The Israelis are building one solar plant that will supply 5% of their energy. It can be done. The technology is there. All that is required is the political will.

 

[auditor0007]

The Danes already get 20% of their power from wind. The Israelis are building one solar plant that will supply 5% of their energy. It can be done. The technology is there. All that is required is the political will.

Yes, the Danes do get 20% of their power from wind. And that is where it stops. They are no longer pursuing wind as a further alternative due to the problems I discussed. Wind is a great supplement, but in it's present form of delivery and storage, or lack of, it cannot be used for a higher percentage of output, because it wreaks havoc on the grid.

In order to use wind for a greater percentage of output, there must be some form of storage available so that the energy can be used at a time when output is not as great. Neither wind nor solar give a steady stream of power, so you end up with too little or too much at any given time. That is not to say that at some time in the future, storage capabilities will become available and these forms of energy then will be can allow a greater percentage of production from these sources.

 

[Chris]

MADRID, Nov 24 (Reuters) - Spain's wind farms briefly provided a record 43 percent of demand for electricity early on Monday, producers' association AEE said.

The record was set at 5 a.m. (0400 GMT), when demand was well below peak levels, and beats a previous record of 40.8 percent set on March 22.

Wind power hit a maximum later in the day of 10,263 megawatts, which compares to a production record of 10,880, set on April 18.

Renewable energy has boomed in recent years in Spain, as the country tries to cut greenhouse gas emissions and reduce its heavy dependence on fuel imports.

Spain is the third-largest generator of wind power in the world, with about 16,000 MW of installed capacity and plants to have 20,000 MW by 2010.

Spanish wind power hits record 43 pct of demand | Industries | Industrials, Materials & Utilities | Reuters

 

[AllieBaba]

The benefit of wind power is that it does not create CO2 pollution, Gunny.

Stop playing the nitwit, okay?

There is no benefit to wind power. It eats up land, it's undependable, it's expensive and believe me, the armies of people it takes to man them, repair them, and construct them create oodles of CO2 pollution as they're driving the many, many miles between the worksites and their homes...each in his own individual car.

I live in the middle of windmills. I haven't seen it do anything except cause problems.

 

[Old Rocks]

The problem with wind is that the way everyone thinks of wind power as a solution is unworkable. Yes, we can increase wind power a bit, but we can't have wind as our biggest source of electicity.

Here is the problem; electicity must be made available when it is needed. The grid can only handle so much electicity. If wind power is the main source of electicity, there would be times it would over charge the grid. There would also be many times when it didn't provide enough electicity. The problem is that there is no way to store electricity on a large scale.

In order for solar and wind power to become our main source of energy, every home and building would need to have batteries to store excess electricity. That way, when less energy was being produced, power would still be available. Besides needing storage capabilities, you would need a mechanism that would automatically switch power from AC to DC, from the grid to the battery. We're not there yet in that type of technology, not to mention the cost.

Last of all, if the technology does become available, than it would make more sense to put a small wind turbine on every building along with solar panels. Electicity used from the grid would then be used as backup. Of course, this creates another problem. It costs a lot of money to maintain the grid. If everyone is using their own energy rather than that supplied on the grid, who pays to maintain the grid?

You really need to get current on the technology concerning home power. The device for converting AC to DC and vice-versa is called an inverter. Here is a list of just a few sources of them;
Eligible Inverter List - Go Solar California!

 

[Old Rocks]

patchandlersblog: North Powder Wind Mills

Westerners Look to Windmills As Possible Saviors of a Way of Life H Josef Hebert / AP 7sep01