Said1
Gold Member
Educated? Some are some are not. One of the little girls I babysit had her boots physically removed from her feet because "they were not good enough" on Friday. She was given an old used pair, left by another student to wear instead. This was done to a 5yr old by her teacher, an educated woman, who should know how to be sensetive and understanding to the children she is EDUCATING. Besides, it wasn't cold out, and I old the old bat what happened, and why she was wearing rubber boots - she had no excuse. Anyway, ignore me, I'm still ranting about it
:
rtwngAvngr
Senior Member
- Jan 5, 2004
- 15,755
- 513
- 48
- Banned
- #43
Get a sense of humor. Oh wait, then you couldn't be a lib anymore.
jon_forward
Active Member
I dont think he/she has any sense....at all...none...
- Moderator
- #45
"I hate when people say this, as if they're currupting our youth. It reminds me a lot of Socrates and what happened to him.
"Well the easy answer to this is that teachers are EDUCATED!!"
I guess that depends which level teachers are we talking about. Elementry? high school? College?
We spend more money on education than any other item. We should have a society of brilliant men and women. Yet our children are doing so poorly that they arent being prepared to enter the work force and our jobs are being outsourced to countries in Asia like India who teach their children to learn and ask question.
I know. I finished my Bachlors not to long ago. I somehow managed to survive the public school system through high school. Since i have gotten out i am simply amazed at what I was not taught in school. If my teachers had spent more time teaching me reading and writing skills and how to discuss concepts, if they taught me how to research in public school i dont think i would have been so unprepared for college and the real world. And the messed up part of it, is I was one of the smarter kids. I cant imagine what someone who wasnt as blessed with academics as easily is going through.
The fact is our schools are failing. Part of that is the ideology of some of the teachers teaching. And throwing more money in a failing system isnt going to make it better.
"Well the easy answer to this is that teachers are EDUCATED!!"
I guess that depends which level teachers are we talking about. Elementry? high school? College?
We spend more money on education than any other item. We should have a society of brilliant men and women. Yet our children are doing so poorly that they arent being prepared to enter the work force and our jobs are being outsourced to countries in Asia like India who teach their children to learn and ask question.
I know. I finished my Bachlors not to long ago. I somehow managed to survive the public school system through high school. Since i have gotten out i am simply amazed at what I was not taught in school. If my teachers had spent more time teaching me reading and writing skills and how to discuss concepts, if they taught me how to research in public school i dont think i would have been so unprepared for college and the real world. And the messed up part of it, is I was one of the smarter kids. I cant imagine what someone who wasnt as blessed with academics as easily is going through.
The fact is our schools are failing. Part of that is the ideology of some of the teachers teaching. And throwing more money in a failing system isnt going to make it better.
i like this no child left behind thingy. so far, as far as my town is concerned, all the school here are on the watch/ warning list. all of them. isnt that sad? but its not really a suprise. they have been turning out substandard education since i went there.
Said1
Gold Member
@Avatar4321
You make some excellent points. I went back to University 2 yrs ago, and was amazed at the marks I was receiving. I was trying my hardest, but I had been out of school for a long time, and had forgotten how to put a sentance together. I was handing in papers I was very unhappy with, and getting A's and B's. If I had turned in work like that in high school, I'd be lucky to get a C after all the grammar mistakes were calculated. I fear for my daughter, but, unlike my own mother, i'm prepared to help her in any way I can.
You make some excellent points. I went back to University 2 yrs ago, and was amazed at the marks I was receiving. I was trying my hardest, but I had been out of school for a long time, and had forgotten how to put a sentance together. I was handing in papers I was very unhappy with, and getting A's and B's. If I had turned in work like that in high school, I'd be lucky to get a C after all the grammar mistakes were calculated. I fear for my daughter, but, unlike my own mother, i'm prepared to help her in any way I can.
You do make one good pt above Avatar. Todays universities are simply not preparing people for life after college. Sure we can take you step by step through how photosynthesis works or how the Vagina Monologues was this great work that we should apply to our lives, but did anyone learn how to take out their first mortgage or set up an IRA or finance your first car or even pay your taxes? I didn't. It seems like liberalism has taking over our universities instead of teaching some of the stuff we actually need to know we are constantly be drilled with the notion that we need to promote diversity, be aware of social issues and other things that aren't going to help me one iota in getting through daily life.
jon_forward
Active Member
thats what parents are for....the schools are not by any means perfect but somethings are best taught by family/parents....
jon_forward
Active Member
some parents are chicken shits
montyfowler
Member
I don't want to get into the whole mess about too many liberal teachers, etc. But I do want to share some of my observations of the educational system in America, as I have four children and have personally touched many levels of the system.
Ten Steps to Improving Education
1. School curricula do not focus enough resources on reading and writing.
2. Teachers should be required to have "real world" experience in the subjects they teach, especially at the college level.
3. All schools should be held to a basic level of performance...period. If the product they turn out is shoddy, they should not be allowed to operate.
4. Every student should be required to learn a foriegn language. Our country is part of a global economy and we handicap our children by not giving them this vital skill.
5. Vouchers...and now!
6. Every child should speak English fluently upon graduation, no matter what his/her country of origin.
7. Schools should focus the same resources on gifted or advanced students as they do on at-risk or challenged students. Bottom line...the smart kids are the keys to the future.
8. End social promotion. If they can't do the work, they need to stay behind.
9. Teach history as it happened, without any contextualization or equivocation.
10. Demand that students be disciplined. Teach respect for self and respect for others. Encourage creativity and personal achievement. Do not stifle an inquisitive mind...challenge it to discover its limits.
Ten Steps to Improving Education
1. School curricula do not focus enough resources on reading and writing.
2. Teachers should be required to have "real world" experience in the subjects they teach, especially at the college level.
3. All schools should be held to a basic level of performance...period. If the product they turn out is shoddy, they should not be allowed to operate.
4. Every student should be required to learn a foriegn language. Our country is part of a global economy and we handicap our children by not giving them this vital skill.
5. Vouchers...and now!
6. Every child should speak English fluently upon graduation, no matter what his/her country of origin.
7. Schools should focus the same resources on gifted or advanced students as they do on at-risk or challenged students. Bottom line...the smart kids are the keys to the future.
8. End social promotion. If they can't do the work, they need to stay behind.
9. Teach history as it happened, without any contextualization or equivocation.
10. Demand that students be disciplined. Teach respect for self and respect for others. Encourage creativity and personal achievement. Do not stifle an inquisitive mind...challenge it to discover its limits.
i dont think they should be forced to learn a new language. that should be an elective IMO.
a good bumper sticker: welcome to America, now speak english.
if they have visions of going to other countries to do whatever, then they can work that into their schedules.
a good bumper sticker: welcome to America, now speak english.
if they have visions of going to other countries to do whatever, then they can work that into their schedules.
montyfowler
Member
Beyond the potential for future use in a career, learning a foreign language at a young age has many beneficial effects on overall learning. There have been many studies conducted in this realm. It certainly more important than some of the other crap they make our kids learn.
jon_forward
Active Member
for the most part I feel that the teachers do as best they can with what they have to do. 30 plus kids in a class...BUZZZ... 8 different classes a day?...BUZZZ..How is a student in middle school,junior high or high school suppose to retain anything? I would like to see 3 to maybe 5 class blocks per day. the lesser the better. Also why do some teachers get so far from what is needed? Do they think they can change the world into what THEY want by leading our children down the wrong path? They have changed math so much since I graduated that it 2plus2 aint 4 anymore. good thing they have not got to the spoken word yet.
I had a problem with my sons 5 grade teacher, he called me at work to tell me he had to stay after school for no fault of his own...but mine. When school let out, I went into my sons classroom and told him to go out and wait in the truck..which he gladly did. As my son left the room the teacher came in and informed me that he did not have HER permission to leave. after a short a very heated debate she was made to realize that she was a teacher not the parent. and if not for my son and the others she would not have a job.shortly thereafter she was released from the school after 13 years of questionable service.
sorry for rambling on...still pisses me off. Any way, the teachers should be left to teach..period. have an agenda and follow it as close as one can.
I had a problem with my sons 5 grade teacher, he called me at work to tell me he had to stay after school for no fault of his own...but mine. When school let out, I went into my sons classroom and told him to go out and wait in the truck..which he gladly did. As my son left the room the teacher came in and informed me that he did not have HER permission to leave. after a short a very heated debate she was made to realize that she was a teacher not the parent. and if not for my son and the others she would not have a job.shortly thereafter she was released from the school after 13 years of questionable service.
sorry for rambling on...still pisses me off. Any way, the teachers should be left to teach..period. have an agenda and follow it as close as one can.
jon_forward
Active Member
have to agree monty...also music should in some way be required
Jon i remember hearing something a little while back about some teacher spanking a student (little guys that is). for something retarded. that went bug fuck for a while. the teacher saying something like he was in line in doing it. yeah he didnt last too long.
anyones going to spank my child its going to be me, not some half assed teacher.
anyones going to spank my child its going to be me, not some half assed teacher.
Just out of curiosity, has anyone here ever been a teacher?
Anyone had to deal with a class of thirty mid-level high school kids all of which would rather pass notes about who is dating whom than learn Geometry? That's without any serious recourse to discipline, mind you. Can't kick 'em out, can't beat 'em. Why does it seem like America expects teachers to raise their children for them? I remember when I was in elementary school, I didn't learn to read or do math in the classroom. I got the information and the material, but learning took hours of at home practice daily. If parents aren't there to force their kids to do that, then it doesn't happen. If both parents have to work to make ends meet, as is the case with most households, how can they stay on top of their children? Education is NOT an island, it is affected by all aspects of the economy and society. At a certain point, some of you are right. You can't just throw more money at the problem. But if we're talking about improving quantity and quality of facilities and reducing class size, then yeah, the teachers need every edge they can get.
Monty, you demand that schools meet established standards or be shut down, as if schools were businesses. You expect them to produce well educated and disciplined children from completely raw material, and you seem to expect them to do this without help from parents and community. My guess is you're going to be shutting down alot of schools.
With this voucher thing, am I to understand that you think it is a good idea that the education you receive should be in proportion to the money your parents earn? Nice vicious circle that would create.
Don't stifle an inquisitive mind? I'm not sure what that's supposed to mean in the context of thirty unruly kids in a small room (if it's not a trailer parked in back of the main building) for an hour, but If I'm the teacher, I'll probably spend more time trying to get attention and solve disputes than answering to your child's inquisitiveness.
What job do you know of that has these kinds of demands, plus your added resume requirements, that rewards all of $20,000 a year? My guess is there are an awful lot of teachers with a tendency toward charity work.
Anyone had to deal with a class of thirty mid-level high school kids all of which would rather pass notes about who is dating whom than learn Geometry? That's without any serious recourse to discipline, mind you. Can't kick 'em out, can't beat 'em. Why does it seem like America expects teachers to raise their children for them? I remember when I was in elementary school, I didn't learn to read or do math in the classroom. I got the information and the material, but learning took hours of at home practice daily. If parents aren't there to force their kids to do that, then it doesn't happen. If both parents have to work to make ends meet, as is the case with most households, how can they stay on top of their children? Education is NOT an island, it is affected by all aspects of the economy and society. At a certain point, some of you are right. You can't just throw more money at the problem. But if we're talking about improving quantity and quality of facilities and reducing class size, then yeah, the teachers need every edge they can get.
Monty, you demand that schools meet established standards or be shut down, as if schools were businesses. You expect them to produce well educated and disciplined children from completely raw material, and you seem to expect them to do this without help from parents and community. My guess is you're going to be shutting down alot of schools.
With this voucher thing, am I to understand that you think it is a good idea that the education you receive should be in proportion to the money your parents earn? Nice vicious circle that would create.
Don't stifle an inquisitive mind? I'm not sure what that's supposed to mean in the context of thirty unruly kids in a small room (if it's not a trailer parked in back of the main building) for an hour, but If I'm the teacher, I'll probably spend more time trying to get attention and solve disputes than answering to your child's inquisitiveness.
What job do you know of that has these kinds of demands, plus your added resume requirements, that rewards all of $20,000 a year? My guess is there are an awful lot of teachers with a tendency toward charity work.
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