Capitalism vs. Freedom

[sealybobo]

Out of Prozac too, judging by a few of your other posts.

Del never says anything that matters. No matter what information I put up, he always replies something like this.

 

[Oddball]

Is that right? Is the private ownership of the means of production a prevailing condition in the "black markets"? You do realize that mere market exchange is not a sufficient condition for capitalism, correct?

If the means of production and distribution aren't in private hands in black markets, whose hands are they in??

 

[editec]

Is that right? Is the private ownership of the means of production a prevailing condition in the "black markets"? You do realize that mere market exchange is not a sufficient condition for capitalism, correct?

If the means of production and distribution aren't in private hands in black markets, whose hands are they in??

Good point.

Ecept that even black markets strive for order.

They merely use a gun to enforce their order, rather than less overtly opproessive means.

Heard recently about an author who studied the gangs which control the drug business in urban environments.

Did you know that when looked at the hours that most low level dealers work compared to how much they make, they are actually usually working for less than minimum wage?

That is why most street level drug dealers in the cities (those would be the ones you see standing on the street corners) LIVE AT HOME WITH THEIR MOMS.

Even the BLACK market is far from that libertopian idea that some of us think is possible.

Kinda sad isn't it?

Even criminals aren't truly free.

 

[Amanda]

Is that right? Is the private ownership of the means of production a prevailing condition in the "black markets"? You do realize that mere market exchange is not a sufficient condition for capitalism, correct?

If the means of production and distribution aren't in private hands in black markets, whose hands are they in??

Good point.

Ecept that even black markets strive for order.

They merely use a gun to enforce their order, rather than less overtly opproessive means.

Heard recently about an author who studied the gangs which control the drug business in urban environments.

Did you know that when looked at the hours that most low level dealers work compared to how much they make, they are actually usually working for less than minimum wage?

That is why most street level drug dealers in the cities (those would be the ones you see standing on the street corners) LIVE AT HOME WITH THEIR MOMS.

Even the BLACK market is far from that libertopian idea that some of us think is possible.

Kinda sad isn't it?

Even criminals aren't truly free.

Sudhir Venkatesh did the study, he was mentioned in Freakanomics Freakonomics by Steven D. Levitt and Stephen J. Dubner and has had magazine articles done on him. I think I saw 1 in Forbes earlier this year.

 

[LaLinda75]

Long live capitalism!!!

 

[Oddball]

Good point.

Ecept that even black markets strive for order.

They merely use a gun to enforce their order, rather than less overtly opproessive means.

Heard recently about an author who studied the gangs which control the drug business in urban environments.

Did you know that when looked at the hours that most low level dealers work compared to how much they make, they are actually usually working for less than minimum wage?

That is why most street level drug dealers in the cities (those would be the ones you see standing on the street corners) LIVE AT HOME WITH THEIR MOMS.

Even the BLACK market is far from that libertopian idea that some of us think is possible.

Kinda sad isn't it?

Even criminals aren't truly free.

Wasn't really trying to tout any supposed libertopian ideal...In fact, it's libertarians and anarchists who are the first to recognize and point out that Utopia cannot be an option.

That said, great post!

 

[Toro]

Capitalism is freedom.

Next.

 

[code1211]

[/quote]

The superior efficiency of worker-owned enterprises and labor cooperatives is a well-established economic reality. .[/QUOTE]


Can you provide a list of the top 100 worker owned enterprises and labor cooperatives?

Not doubting that I'll recognize each and every one of them. Just trying to gauge your grip on reality.

 

[Gunny]

I collected a few statements I'd made here and there to form a brief synthesis about the manner in which capitalism undermines freedom and related libertarian principles by establishing authoritarian social relationships effectively as dictatorial in nature as those of an authoritarian state. I've posted it elsewhere, and decided that our local Peter Schiff caucus should have a bone to gnaw on other than Petey's organ.

So reply if you'd like, and I'll be back by and by.

As I've previously noted, the economic framework of capitalism necessitates a scheme in which the private ownership of the means of production (acquired through a coercive process of "primitive accumulation") and consequent hierarchical subordination of labor under capital enables the extraction of surplus value from the working class in the production process through the use of wage labor and subsequent utilization in the circulation process in order to perpetuate a vicious cycle of capital accumulation. In visually pleasing terms:

Moreover, capitalism is necessarily antithetical to freedom. The hierarchical organization of the capitalist firm (a necessary demand of the financial and coordinator classes), necessitates the subordination of workers under bosses and higher-level employers, depriving them of the right to democratically manage a major aspect of their own lives. Nor is answering "you can simply change jobs" a sufficient response to this criticism, because just as the right to migrate between an island chain of kingdoms but not outside of them would not free one from monarchy, neither can the right to select specific masters in a capitalist economy free one from that tyranny.

Nor are external economic conditions based on freedom, so long as privileged and elite segments of the population (namely the financial class, as they have more dominance than the coordinator class outside of the internal structure of the firm), to make decisions that affect the rest of the population without their democratic input. After the unjust consolidation of the means of production and the resulting power that comes as a result of it during a stage of primitive accumulation (the state had a major role in class creation), the financial class, characterized by a small and elite segment of the population is thereby able to use their control over the means of production to drastically affect the vast majority of the population in whatever way they please, which is obviously a significant rationale for collectivizing the means of production, decentralizing them, and subjecting them to direct democratic management.

In our present state of affairs, this private ownership of the means of production permits the aforementioned utilization of wage labor, which is a critical element in the coercive nature of capitalism. Since the means of production are privately owned, large components of the public have no alternative but to subordinate themselves under an employer. The best way to illustrate this form of authoritarianism is to use the "robbery analogy." If a person were to be violently tackled by an assailant and have his/her valuables torn out of his/her pockets, we would accurately call this a robbery. Now, if the assailant were to instead point a gun at the victim and demand that the valuables be surrendered, we would still call this a robbery, as coercion was used to gain the valuables, if not outright physical violence. The fact that the victim technically "consented" to surrender his/her valuables is not pertinent, since it was consent yielded while under duress.

The former example represents the direct tyranny of statism, often blunt, direct, and brutal, whereas the latter represents the more subtle tyranny of capitalism, specifically wage labor, in which a person technically "consents" to work for an employer, but does this only because he/she has no other alternative for sustenance.

Capitalism? What world are YOU living in? The current state of affairs is fascism in the guise of democracy vs freedom.

 

[Zoomie1980]

All systems have their downside. I'd be in favor of communism if it actually worked. I'm a capitalist because I'm a hard worker and I want a chance to achieve more through my effort. I guess it doesn't work for everyone but I think that a lot of the people it doesn't work for are lazy or don't apply themselves. And life isn't fair. I started a thread about (economic) fairness, maybe you could pop in and share your thoughts Ag. I'd be interested in your take.

Wow...a thoughtful post.... Refreshing for this forum. I predict you will do well over the long haul...

 

[editec]

The superior efficiency of worker-owned enterprises and labor cooperatives is a well-established economic reality. .[/quote]


Can you provide a list of the top 100 worker owned enterprises and labor cooperatives?

Not doubting that I'll recognize each and every one of them. Just trying to gauge your grip on reality.[/quote]

Here's some...sorry about the mess. I fixed some of it, but it's easier to look it up. You can find a easier to read list here.

ESOP: Employee Stock Ownership Plan
PS: Profit Sharing Trust
SP: Stock Purchase Plan


Publix Supermarkets LakelandFL ESOP, SP supermarkets142,000Hy-VeeW. Des MoinesIA PS supermarkets 51,000
Science Applications Intl. Corp.San DiegoCA Multiple plans R&D & computer systems 44,000
Price Chopper dba Golub Corp. Schenectady NY ESOP supermarkets 24,000 CH2M Hill Inc.Denver CO S
Pengineering/construction 19,089
The Tribune Co. Chicago IL ESOP media 19,000
Lifetouch Minneapolis MN ESOP photography studios 18,000 Nypro ClintonMA ESOP plastics manufacturer15,000
Parsons Corp. PasadenaCA ESOP engineering/construction11,500
Houchens IndustriesBowling Green KY ESOP supermarkets & other services11,487
Black & Veatch Kansas City MO ESOP engineering 9,600
Amsted IndustriesChicagoILESOPmanufacturing9,200Graybar St LouisMOSPelectrical wholesale8,400WinCo FoodsBoiseIDESOPsupermarkets8,000W.L. Gore & AssociatesNewarkDEESOPmanufacturing8,000Davey Tree Expert Co.KentOHESOPtree service7,000MWH AmericasBroomfieldCOESOPengineering/consulting6,100Austin IndustriesDallasTXESOPconstruction6,000Journal Communications MilwaukeeWISPnewspapers & media5,700HDR, Inc.OmahaNEESOPengineering/architecture5,668Piggly Wiggly CarolinaCharlestonSCESOPsupermarkets5,000Schreiber FoodsGreen BayWIESOPcheese producer5,000Brookshire BrothersLufkinTXESOPsupermarkets4,600Columbia Forest ProductsPortlandORESOPwood products4,000Herff Jones IndianapolisINESOPawards & gifts4,000HNTBKansas CityMOESOParchitecture/engineering3,800Vance InternationalOaktonVAESOPsecurity3,700Tharaldson Lodging Co.FargoNDESOPmotel management3,600Stanley Inc.ArlingtonVAESOPsystems integration3,500Guckenheimer EnterprisesRedwood CityCAESOPfood distribution3,300Alion Science and TechnologyMcLeanVAESOPtechnology services3,300Lewis Tree ServiceRochesterNYESOPtree service3,100AppletonAppletonWIESOPpaper manufacturer3,100Miller's Health SystemsWarsawINESOPnursing homes3,000Bi-MartEugeneORESOPdiscount stores3,000Kinney DrugsGouverneurNYESOPdrug stores3,000Scheels All SportFargoNDESOPsporting goods3,000Terracon ConsultantsOlatheKSESOPengineering/consulting3,000GenslerSan FranciscoCAESOParchitecture3,000KIGreen BayWIPSfurniture manufacturer3,000Norcal Waste SystemsSan FranciscoCAESOPwaste disposal2,800Hensel Phelps Construction GreeleyCOESOPconstruction2,500Stiefel LaboratoriesCoral GablesFLESOPpharmaceuticals2,500Burns & McDonnell EngineeringKansas CityMOESOParchitecture/engineering2,400American Cast Iron PipeBirminghamALstock trustfoundry2,400Acadian AmbulanceLafayetteLAESOPambulance service2,385MedicalodgesCoffeyvilleKSESOPnursing homes2,363Omaha World-Herald CmahaNESPnewspaper2,323CentiMark Corp.CanonsburgPAESOProof repair2,220SwinertonSan FranciscoCAESOPconstruction2,123Cianbro Corp. PittsfieldMEESOPconstruction2,100Kelly-Moore PaintsSan CarlosCAESOPpaint manufacturer/retail2,000Kleinfelder Inc.San DiegoCAESOPengineering2,000McCarthy Building Cos.St. LouisMOESOPconstruction2,000National Spinning Co.New YorkNYESOPtextiles2,000Rieth-RileyGoshenINESOPconstruction 1,800Weston SolutionsWest ChesterPAESOPenvironmental engineering1,800Bureau of Natl. Affairs Inc.ArlingtonVASPpublisher1,728The Sundt Cos.TempeAZESOPconstruction1,719Round Table PizzaConcordCAESOPfranchisor1,700Dunn-EdwardsLos AngelesCAESOPpaint manufacturer1,660Fred WeberMaryland Hts.MOESOPcontractor1,650Greenheck FanSchofieldWIESOPindustrial fans1,612Cooperative Home Care Assocs.BronxNYCo-ophealth care1,600Ebby Halliday RealtorsDallasTXESOPreal estate1,600Harps Food Stores Inc.SpringdaleARESOPsupermarkets1,600Woodman's Food MarketsJanesvilleWIESOPsupermarkets1,600American Systems Corp.ChantillyVAESOPengineering1,500Brown and CaldwellWalnut CreekCAESOPengineering1,500Camber Corp.HuntsvilleALESOPtechnology services1,500Martin & BayleyCarmiILESOPconvenience stores1,500MMC Corp.Overland ParkKSESOPconstruction1,500Pinnacle BuildersW. SacramentoCAESOPframing1,500Rosendin ElectricSan JoseCAESOPelectrical work1,500STV GroupDouglassvillePAESOParchitecture/engineering1,500Okonite Co.RamseyNJESOPwire & cable 1,494Schuck & Sons ConstructionGlendaleAZESOPconstruction1,467Bradford WhiteAmblerPAESOPwater heaters1,361FBG Service Corp.OmahaNEESOPfacilities management1,325Charles Machine WorksPerryOKESOPbackhoes1,256Border States ElectricFargoNDESOP electrical wholesale1,200Hot Dog on a StickCarlsbadCAESOPfast food1,200Osmose HoldingsBuffaloNYESOPwood preservatives/utility services1,200Pizzagalli ConstructionS. BurlingtonVTESOPconstruction1,200Riesbeck's Food MarketsSt. ClairsvilleOHESOPsupermarkets1,200SecTekRestonVAESOPsecurity services1,200SPARTA Inc.Lake ForestCAESOPsystems engineering1,200Scitor Corp.HerndonVAESOPaerospace/systems engineering1,200Zandex Health CareZanesvilleOHESOPnursing homes1,200Holiday Quality FoodsCottonwoodCAESOPsupermarkets1,100RPCS, Inc.SpringfieldMOESOPsupermarkets1,100Abt AssociatesCambridgeMAESOPconsulting & research1,050Angus IndustriesWatertownSDESOPelectrical components1,050Wilbur Smith AssociatesColumbiaSCESOPprofessional services 1,050DyneticsHuntsvilleALESOPdefense contractor1,040Branch GroupRoanokeVAESOPconstruction1,000Crucible MaterialsSyracuseNY ESOPsteel manufacturer 1,000 KC I Technologies
Hunt Valley MD ESO Pengineering consultants 1,000
Besser Company Al pena MI ESOP concrete 1,000
Direct SupplyMilwaukeeWI ESOP nursing home care supply1,000

FWIW, Sears Roebuck was one of the first Employee Owned Stock Option companies.

Many of it's long time employees retired owning a small fortune in Sears stocks.

I knew a janitor, for example, who retired in the 1960s after wroking with Sears for about 40 years. His stocks were worth (at that time) about 20 years of his last year's salary.

He was a janitor, folks...he retired a wealthy man.

He was NOT an unusual case for a retiring Sears employees, incidently.

Then Sears Roebuck's Managment forgot what Sears Rosebuck was good at (retail) and decided that the smart money was in insurance, investment, and real estate.

Now the company no longer is a ESOP and it's in the crapper.

 

[Toro]

Stock corporations are the most efficient form of capital organization and output. A noble prize was given out about 10 years to someone whom I cannot remember who demonstrated that economic activity which is more efficient within a corporation is internalized by a corporation while activities that are more efficient produced outside a corporation are produced outside a corporation. This allows the efficiency of capital to be optimized.

 

[code1211]

The superior efficiency of worker-owned enterprises and labor cooperatives is a well-established economic reality. .

Can you provide a list of the top 100 worker owned enterprises and labor cooperatives?

Not doubting that I'll recognize each and every one of them. Just trying to gauge your grip on reality.[/quote]

Here's some...sorry about the mess. I fixed some of it, but it's easier to look it up. You can find a easier to read list here.

ESOP: Employee Stock Ownership Plan
PS: Profit Sharing Trust
SP: Stock Purchase Plan


Publix Supermarkets LakelandFL ESOP, SP supermarkets142,000Hy-VeeW. Des MoinesIA PS supermarkets 51,000
Science Applications Intl. Corp.San DiegoCA Multiple plans R&D & computer systems 44,000
Price Chopper dba Golub Corp. Schenectady NY ESOP supermarkets 24,000 CH2M Hill Inc.Denver CO S
Pengineering/construction 19,089
The Tribune Co. Chicago IL ESOP media 19,000
Lifetouch Minneapolis MN ESOP photography studios 18,000 Nypro ClintonMA ESOP plastics manufacturer15,000
Parsons Corp. PasadenaCA ESOP engineering/construction11,500
Houchens IndustriesBowling Green KY ESOP supermarkets & other services11,487
Black & Veatch Kansas City MO ESOP engineering 9,600
Amsted IndustriesChicagoILESOPmanufacturing9,200Graybar St LouisMOSPelectrical wholesale8,400WinCo FoodsBoiseIDESOPsupermarkets8,000W.L. Gore & AssociatesNewarkDEESOPmanufacturing8,000Davey Tree Expert Co.KentOHESOPtree service7,000MWH AmericasBroomfieldCOESOPengineering/consulting6,100Austin IndustriesDallasTXESOPconstruction6,000Journal Communications MilwaukeeWISPnewspapers & media5,700HDR, Inc.OmahaNEESOPengineering/architecture5,668Piggly Wiggly CarolinaCharlestonSCESOPsupermarkets5,000Schreiber FoodsGreen BayWIESOPcheese producer5,000Brookshire BrothersLufkinTXESOPsupermarkets4,600Columbia Forest ProductsPortlandORESOPwood products4,000Herff Jones IndianapolisINESOPawards & gifts4,000HNTBKansas CityMOESOParchitecture/engineering3,800Vance InternationalOaktonVAESOPsecurity3,700Tharaldson Lodging Co.FargoNDESOPmotel management3,600Stanley Inc.ArlingtonVAESOPsystems integration3,500Guckenheimer EnterprisesRedwood CityCAESOPfood distribution3,300Alion Science and TechnologyMcLeanVAESOPtechnology services3,300Lewis Tree ServiceRochesterNYESOPtree service3,100AppletonAppletonWIESOPpaper manufacturer3,100Miller's Health SystemsWarsawINESOPnursing homes3,000Bi-MartEugeneORESOPdiscount stores3,000Kinney DrugsGouverneurNYESOPdrug stores3,000Scheels All SportFargoNDESOPsporting goods3,000Terracon ConsultantsOlatheKSESOPengineering/consulting3,000GenslerSan FranciscoCAESOParchitecture3,000KIGreen BayWIPSfurniture manufacturer3,000Norcal Waste SystemsSan FranciscoCAESOPwaste disposal2,800Hensel Phelps Construction GreeleyCOESOPconstruction2,500Stiefel LaboratoriesCoral GablesFLESOPpharmaceuticals2,500Burns & McDonnell EngineeringKansas CityMOESOParchitecture/engineering2,400American Cast Iron PipeBirminghamALstock trustfoundry2,400Acadian AmbulanceLafayetteLAESOPambulance service2,385MedicalodgesCoffeyvilleKSESOPnursing homes2,363Omaha World-Herald CmahaNESPnewspaper2,323CentiMark Corp.CanonsburgPAESOProof repair2,220SwinertonSan FranciscoCAESOPconstruction2,123Cianbro Corp. PittsfieldMEESOPconstruction2,100Kelly-Moore PaintsSan CarlosCAESOPpaint manufacturer/retail2,000Kleinfelder Inc.San DiegoCAESOPengineering2,000McCarthy Building Cos.St. LouisMOESOPconstruction2,000National Spinning Co.New YorkNYESOPtextiles2,000Rieth-RileyGoshenINESOPconstruction 1,800Weston SolutionsWest ChesterPAESOPenvironmental engineering1,800Bureau of Natl. Affairs Inc.ArlingtonVASPpublisher1,728The Sundt Cos.TempeAZESOPconstruction1,719Round Table PizzaConcordCAESOPfranchisor1,700Dunn-EdwardsLos AngelesCAESOPpaint manufacturer1,660Fred WeberMaryland Hts.MOESOPcontractor1,650Greenheck FanSchofieldWIESOPindustrial fans1,612Cooperative Home Care Assocs.BronxNYCo-ophealth care1,600Ebby Halliday RealtorsDallasTXESOPreal estate1,600Harps Food Stores Inc.SpringdaleARESOPsupermarkets1,600Woodman's Food MarketsJanesvilleWIESOPsupermarkets1,600American Systems Corp.ChantillyVAESOPengineering1,500Brown and CaldwellWalnut CreekCAESOPengineering1,500Camber Corp.HuntsvilleALESOPtechnology services1,500Martin & BayleyCarmiILESOPconvenience stores1,500MMC Corp.Overland ParkKSESOPconstruction1,500Pinnacle BuildersW. SacramentoCAESOPframing1,500Rosendin ElectricSan JoseCAESOPelectrical work1,500STV GroupDouglassvillePAESOParchitecture/engineering1,500Okonite Co.RamseyNJESOPwire & cable 1,494Schuck & Sons ConstructionGlendaleAZESOPconstruction1,467Bradford WhiteAmblerPAESOPwater heaters1,361FBG Service Corp.OmahaNEESOPfacilities management1,325Charles Machine WorksPerryOKESOPbackhoes1,256Border States ElectricFargoNDESOP electrical wholesale1,200Hot Dog on a StickCarlsbadCAESOPfast food1,200Osmose HoldingsBuffaloNYESOPwood preservatives/utility services1,200Pizzagalli ConstructionS. BurlingtonVTESOPconstruction1,200Riesbeck's Food MarketsSt. ClairsvilleOHESOPsupermarkets1,200SecTekRestonVAESOPsecurity services1,200SPARTA Inc.Lake ForestCAESOPsystems engineering1,200Scitor Corp.HerndonVAESOPaerospace/systems engineering1,200Zandex Health CareZanesvilleOHESOPnursing homes1,200Holiday Quality FoodsCottonwoodCAESOPsupermarkets1,100RPCS, Inc.SpringfieldMOESOPsupermarkets1,100Abt AssociatesCambridgeMAESOPconsulting & research1,050Angus IndustriesWatertownSDESOPelectrical components1,050Wilbur Smith AssociatesColumbiaSCESOPprofessional services 1,050DyneticsHuntsvilleALESOPdefense contractor1,040Branch GroupRoanokeVAESOPconstruction1,000Crucible MaterialsSyracuseNY ESOPsteel manufacturer 1,000 KC I Technologies
Hunt Valley MD ESO Pengineering consultants 1,000
Besser Company Al pena MI ESOP concrete 1,000
Direct SupplyMilwaukeeWI ESOP nursing home care supply1,000

FWIW, Sears Roebuck was one of the first Employee Owned Stock Option companies.

Many of it's long time employees retired owning a small fortune in Sears stocks.

I knew a janitor, for example, who retired in the 1960s after wroking with Sears for about 40 years. His stocks were worth (at that time) about 20 years of his last year's salary.

He was a janitor, folks...he retired a wealthy man.

He was NOT an unusual case for a retiring Sears employees, incidently.

Then Sears Roebuck's Managment forgot what Sears Rosebuck was good at (retail) and decided that the smart money was in insurance, investment, and real estate.

Now the company no longer is a ESOP and it's in the crapper.[/QUOTE]


I forgot about the ESOP's. Good examples. Set up as corporations, the ESOP's act as the ready cash line for the corporations that use them. You referanced the janitor who retired a rich man due to his ESOP. A matter of timing, really. The functioning ESOP, though, does not have a workforce that is paid equally as the kibutz style workplace implied by our thread starter would be constructed.

The Chairman of the Board of Sears who retired at the same time as the janitor in the story probably enjoyed a higher take home during his career and perhaps larger cache of stock. Not that this is a bad thing. If I was the janitor, I would like to have a pretty smart guy running the joint and making sure that my retirement was in a good place when I needed it.

The janitor probably was appreciated by the Chairman, or at least his work was just as the chairman, or at least his work, was appreciated by the janitor. All the voices in the chorus are needed to make the concert.

 

[Quatermass]

Nice post. Unfortunately Agnapostate, the baulk of people who have contributed here are not only intellectually, but emotionally brainwashed. So even if they see a truth within their grasp, the mere prospect of an alternate perception, outside the comforting constraints of a bourgeois dominance they've become institutionalised in, is 'too traumatic' a proposition to tolerate.

Thus, the proletariat are infantile in their countenance under the Capitalist system. The responses of the worker who lacks class consciousness is predictable and shallow, like the peasant mentality; as is abundantly evident in even the best of message-boards.

Del's bird-brain avatar is a poignant spectacle representing so many in this epoch; raising its head with an expression of bewilderment along with the inevitable, worthless contribution, in the endless pursuit of levity. Each and every following response is only a variation of Del's, albeit more convoluted or arrogant.

It's an ironic reality that many workers will defend the capitalist boss character in your excellent cartoon and castigate the fellow who dares to represent the interests of the exploited labourer. The latter two will manifest as 'the problem with this country', while the greedy, parasitic capitalist held up as a paragon of virtue for children to admire and adults attempt emulate.

(I wrote the above before reading neurosport's post #13, which underlines my point about predictability of the backward element)




Karl Marx, here on: Individuals, Class, and Community. From
The German Ideology.


"Only in community [with others has each] individual the means of cultivating his gifts in all directions; only in the community, therefore, is personal freedom possible. In the previous substitutes for the community, in the State, etc. personal freedom has existed only for the individuals who developed within the relationships of the ruling class, and only insofar as they were individuals of this class. The illusory community, in which individuals have up till now combined, always took on an independent existence in relation to them, and was at the same time, since it was the combination of one class over against another, not only a completely illusory community, but a new fetter as well. In a real community the individuals obtain their freedom in and through their association."
Full article: The German Ideology

p.s. Would appreciate source for cartoon.

 

[Oddball]

Nice post. Unfortunately Agnapostate, the baulk of people who have contributed here are not only intellectually, but emotionally brainwashed. So even if they see a truth within their grasp, the mere prospect of an alternate perception, outside the comforting constraints of a bourgeois dominance they've become institutionalised in, is 'too traumatic' a proposition to tolerate.

Thus, the proletariat are infantile in their countenance under the Capitalist system. The responses of the worker who lacks class consciousness is predictable and shallow, like the peasant mentality; as is abundantly evident in even the best of message-boards.

Del's bird-brain avatar is a poignant spectacle representing so many in this epoch; raising its head with an expression of bewilderment along with the inevitable, worthless contribution, in the endless pursuit of levity. Each and every following response is only a variation of Del's, albeit more convoluted or arrogant.

It's an ironic reality that many workers will defend the capitalist boss character in your excellent cartoon and castigate the fellow who dares to represent the interests of the exploited labourer. The latter two will manifest as 'the problem with this country', while the greedy, parasitic capitalist held up as a paragon of virtue for children to admire and adults attempt emulate.

Good thing we have smug elitist punks, like Agnaplebe and you, you set the hoi polly stright!!