Considerations: The selfishness of #NeverTrump

[TemplarKormac]

How is this country "falling apart"?

Not trying to blow you off, I would explain why, but it would lead us off the beaten path. You probably think it isn't, but I think it is. Can we leave it at that?

Are you saying that conservatives should support Trump because he's echoing the populist rhetoric that they've been shouting about for years?

No.

I'm hoping that they look past the rhetoric, and focus purely on intent. The rhetoric isn't important, the future of our country is. They think that by not voting for Trump or voting for a third party candidate that they are somehow preserving their values, but (I believe) they fail to realize that such a quest could bring about an end to the same values they were hoping to preserve. I don't know if that makes any sense, but there it is.

 

[Pogo]

First off I'm going to start with this disclaimer: let it be clear that I'm not telling anyone who to vote for, or demanding that anyone vote at all. This thread is intended to compel the reader to consider the ramifications of their decision to stay home or vote third party, whichever it may be. Once again, do whatever the hell you want, I'm just stating my personal opinion on the subject. Sure, it will sound condescending to some of you, but don't take it personally. I'm not angry with you. If you think it's funny, feel free to press the funny button.

But I want you NeverTrumpers to think about something. Before Hillary ever came along, most of you were preaching of the horrors of what would come to pass if she became president. Then, out of nowhere, Donald Trump began his rapid rise to the top of the GOP presidential field. And then, in a sudden reversal, you began preaching the horrors of what would come to pass if he became the nominee. You wrote him off repeatedly, as a flash in the pan or the like. You kept reassuring yourselves that he would never, ever succeed in his campaign. Suddenly, it became a campaign against Trump, not a unified campaign against Hillary as it should have been.

As the inevitability of Trump's victory began to strike home, more and more of you vowed never to vote for Donald Trump, be it a conflict of values or matters of conscience, out of a fit of anger, or perhaps no matter what. For that, I think you're being selfish, and I'll tell you why. Consider what the future of America would be like if Hillary Clinton were elected president, also consider the possibility that your abstinence could put her there. Is selfishness moral? Is it a virtue, a value you hold dear to your heart? No? Then why? Why would you be so righteously indignant that you're willing to risk the future of America to preserve your own values or conscience? This isn't a noble act, this isn't sending a message, it's downright selfish.

You are all no doubt aware of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia's untimely demise earlier this year, as a result, that leaves his seat vacant, ripe for the picking for the next president to fill. You also have four other aging Justices on the bench right now. Over the next decade, there is a likelihood that those four other seats could become vacant. In addition to appointing a successor for Scalia, a president Hillary Clinton could appoint five liberal justices to the bench. Think about that. There could be seven liberal justices on the bench, redefining the conscience of America, and changing her identity.

From then on, on issues of gun rights, religious freedom, freedom of speech, or abortion, the rulings could be 7-2 against the conservative arguments. Seven to two. Consider this: In an effort to preserve your values and conscience, by voting third party, or staying home out of a sense of righteous indignance, you're willing to risk a future where a majority liberal Supreme Court would be allowed to redefine your values for you. The would be given free reign to twist the Constitution to liberal ideals, essentially erasing the conservative brand from the face of America. You must realize that under a Supreme Court with seven liberal justices,there would never be another conservative victory at the Supreme Court level for at least a generation to come. You would be ensuring in your selfishness, an end to your values amid an ill advised attempt to preserve them.

Now, you all also value individual rights. In one case, Hillary made herself clear that she will use the Supreme Court as a weapon to radically alter Americans rights to bear arms. In essence, using our highest court as a weapon against religious freedom or freedom of speech and every other conservative value we all hold dear. You want to help America, yet you are willing to go about precipitating her destruction. You may hate Trump's guts, and I do understand where you're coming from. But Hillary wouldn't give a damn about you or your beliefs, your faith, or your vaunted values and conscience. Because in her presidency, you may not have the right to any of those things again. Do you want that on your conscience? So if Hillary ultimately wins, don't complain. You put her there.

In sum, and in my own personal opinion, you #NeverTrumpers are being selfish, and you need to grow up and consider the wider ramifications of a Hillary Clinton presidency. If you truly love America, you would do whatever it took to preserve as much of the country you love as you possibly could, to ensure that you maintain an atmosphere that is tolerant of your beliefs, values or conscience, even if that meant holding back a gag reflex in order to vote for Donald Trump in the general election. The ball's in your court. Don't screw this up for the rest of us.

From what I have seen of the Trump campaign, his supporters are voting against the status quo, the party, and the establishment. They are not voting for anything, just against most everything. Trump is a symbol of their discontent.

You might say, he's the Winner of Their Discontent

And I suspect by the time the GE comes around, if he's still in play as a candidate that contingent will have figured that they made their point and go vote for a real candidate, who in effect runs unopposed.

Which is a damn shame.

 

[TemplarKormac]

TK let me give you some perspective. The #nevertrumpers are a very small piece of the pie in the grand scheme of things. They consist of between 20-40 politicians and pundits. And lets just say 20,000 Republican voters (likely WAY less)

There are no where near enough of them to impact an election. Trump has expanded the tent by bringing in millions of new voters and the tent will grow even larger in the GE. You get the picture yet? The #nevertrump movement is irrelevant. They do not matter. They are nothing more than a headline who flail around on the cable/major news networks. Once the Convention rolls around they'll be nothing but an after thought. The news cycle will eventually move on to more important things as everyone gets bored with them. They'll be like the crew on Gilligans Island

Well, we'll just have to agree to disagree about this one, boss.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

How is this country "falling apart"?

Not trying to blow you off, I would explain why, but it would lead us off beaten path. You probably think it isn't, but I think it is. Can we leave it at that?

If you want, but I think it's a pretty integral part of (or fault in) your argument.

Are you saying that conservatives should support Trump because he's echoing the populist rhetoric that they've been shouting about for years?

No.

I'm hoping that they look past the rhetoric, and focus purely on intent. The rhetoric isn't important, the future of our country is. They think that by not voting for Trump or voting for a third party candidate that they are somehow preserving their values, but (I believe) they fail to realize that such a quest could bring about an end to the same values they were hoping to preserve. I don't know if that makes any sense, but there it is.

How do you know "intent", aside from rhetoric?

More importantly, is it so hard to understand that perhaps the "NeverTrump" people fear a Trump Presidency more than they fear a Clinton one, when it comes to protecting their "values"?

 

[TemplarKormac]

TK let me give you some perspective. The #nevertrumpers are a very small piece of the pie in the grand scheme of things. They consist of between 20-40 politicians and pundits. And lets just say 20,000 Republican voters (likely WAY less)

I hope you're right, but I fear we're underestimating them, numerically, as well as figuratively.

 

[Flopper]

First off I'm going to start with this disclaimer: let it be clear that I'm not telling anyone who to vote for, or demanding that anyone vote at all. This thread is intended to compel the reader to consider the ramifications of their decision to stay home or vote third party, whichever it may be. Once again, do whatever the hell you want, I'm just stating my personal opinion on the subject. Sure, it will sound condescending to some of you, but don't take it personally. I'm not angry with you. If you think it's funny, feel free to press the funny button.

But I want you NeverTrumpers to think about something. Before Hillary ever came along, most of you were preaching of the horrors of what would come to pass if she became president. Then, out of nowhere, Donald Trump began his rapid rise to the top of the GOP presidential field. And then, in a sudden reversal, you began preaching the horrors of what would come to pass if he became the nominee. You wrote him off repeatedly, as a flash in the pan or the like. You kept reassuring yourselves that he would never, ever succeed in his campaign. Suddenly, it became a campaign against Trump, not a unified campaign against Hillary as it should have been.

As the inevitability of Trump's victory began to strike home, more and more of you vowed never to vote for Donald Trump, be it a conflict of values or matters of conscience, out of a fit of anger, or perhaps no matter what. For that, I think you're being selfish, and I'll tell you why. Consider what the future of America would be like if Hillary Clinton were elected president, also consider the possibility that your abstinence could put her there. Is selfishness moral? Is it a virtue, a value you hold dear to your heart? No? Then why? Why would you be so righteously indignant that you're willing to risk the future of America to preserve your own values or conscience? This isn't a noble act, this isn't sending a message, it's downright selfish.

You are all no doubt aware of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia's untimely demise earlier this year, as a result, that leaves his seat vacant, ripe for the picking for the next president to fill. You also have four other aging Justices on the bench right now. Over the next decade, there is a likelihood that those four other seats could become vacant. In addition to appointing a successor for Scalia, a president Hillary Clinton could appoint five liberal justices to the bench. Think about that. There could be seven liberal justices on the bench, redefining the conscience of America, and changing her identity.

From then on, on issues of gun rights, religious freedom, freedom of speech, or abortion, the rulings could be 7-2 against the conservative arguments. Seven to two. Consider this: In an effort to preserve your values and conscience, by voting third party, or staying home out of a sense of righteous indignance, you're willing to risk a future where a majority liberal Supreme Court would be allowed to redefine your values for you. The would be given free reign to twist the Constitution to liberal ideals, essentially erasing the conservative brand from the face of America. You must realize that under a Supreme Court with seven liberal justices,there would never be another conservative victory at the Supreme Court level for at least a generation to come. You would be ensuring in your selfishness, an end to your values amid an ill advised attempt to preserve them.

Now, you all also value individual rights. In one case, Hillary made herself clear that she will use the Supreme Court as a weapon to radically alter Americans rights to bear arms. In essence, using our highest court as a weapon against religious freedom or freedom of speech and every other conservative value we all hold dear. You want to help America, yet you are willing to go about precipitating her destruction. You may hate Trump's guts, and I do understand where you're coming from. But Hillary wouldn't give a damn about you or your beliefs, your faith, or your vaunted values and conscience. Because in her presidency, you may not have the right to any of those things again. Do you want that on your conscience? So if Hillary ultimately wins, don't complain. You put her there.

In sum, you #NeverTrumpers are being selfish, and you need to grow up and consider the wider ramifications of a Hillary Clinton presidency. If you truly love America, you would do whatever it took to preserve as much of the country you love as you possibly could, to ensure that you maintain an atmosphere that is tolerant of your beliefs, values or conscience, even if that meant holding back a gag reflex in order to vote for Donald Trump in the general election. The ball's in your court. Don't screw this up for the rest of us.

George Bush was supposed to protect the supreme court. He gave us Juan Roberts. There is just as good a chance Trump will pick the same type person Hillery would. he runs with the same crowed. he is shallow to. no depth. no explanation other then "we are going to make america great again." and then he says "trust me". Know what trust me means in California? can't say I'm never trump, more like zero faith in trump. no proof he will be better then Hillery.

Supreme Court justices have a way of surprising their supporters; that is they take their judicial oath seriously, setting aside politics and personal prejudices.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

First off I'm going to start with this disclaimer: let it be clear that I'm not telling anyone who to vote for, or demanding that anyone vote at all. This thread is intended to compel the reader to consider the ramifications of their decision to stay home or vote third party, whichever it may be. Once again, do whatever the hell you want, I'm just stating my personal opinion on the subject. Sure, it will sound condescending to some of you, but don't take it personally. I'm not angry with you. If you think it's funny, feel free to press the funny button.

But I want you NeverTrumpers to think about something. Before Hillary ever came along, most of you were preaching of the horrors of what would come to pass if she became president. Then, out of nowhere, Donald Trump began his rapid rise to the top of the GOP presidential field. And then, in a sudden reversal, you began preaching the horrors of what would come to pass if he became the nominee. You wrote him off repeatedly, as a flash in the pan or the like. You kept reassuring yourselves that he would never, ever succeed in his campaign. Suddenly, it became a campaign against Trump, not a unified campaign against Hillary as it should have been.

As the inevitability of Trump's victory began to strike home, more and more of you vowed never to vote for Donald Trump, be it a conflict of values or matters of conscience, out of a fit of anger, or perhaps no matter what. For that, I think you're being selfish, and I'll tell you why. Consider what the future of America would be like if Hillary Clinton were elected president, also consider the possibility that your abstinence could put her there. Is selfishness moral? Is it a virtue, a value you hold dear to your heart? No? Then why? Why would you be so righteously indignant that you're willing to risk the future of America to preserve your own values or conscience? This isn't a noble act, this isn't sending a message, it's downright selfish.

You are all no doubt aware of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia's untimely demise earlier this year, as a result, that leaves his seat vacant, ripe for the picking for the next president to fill. You also have four other aging Justices on the bench right now. Over the next decade, there is a likelihood that those four other seats could become vacant. In addition to appointing a successor for Scalia, a president Hillary Clinton could appoint five liberal justices to the bench. Think about that. There could be seven liberal justices on the bench, redefining the conscience of America, and changing her identity.

From then on, on issues of gun rights, religious freedom, freedom of speech, or abortion, the rulings could be 7-2 against the conservative arguments. Seven to two. Consider this: In an effort to preserve your values and conscience, by voting third party, or staying home out of a sense of righteous indignance, you're willing to risk a future where a majority liberal Supreme Court would be allowed to redefine your values for you. The would be given free reign to twist the Constitution to liberal ideals, essentially erasing the conservative brand from the face of America. You must realize that under a Supreme Court with seven liberal justices,there would never be another conservative victory at the Supreme Court level for at least a generation to come. You would be ensuring in your selfishness, an end to your values amid an ill advised attempt to preserve them.

Now, you all also value individual rights. In one case, Hillary made herself clear that she will use the Supreme Court as a weapon to radically alter Americans rights to bear arms. In essence, using our highest court as a weapon against religious freedom or freedom of speech and every other conservative value we all hold dear. You want to help America, yet you are willing to go about precipitating her destruction. You may hate Trump's guts, and I do understand where you're coming from. But Hillary wouldn't give a damn about you or your beliefs, your faith, or your vaunted values and conscience. Because in her presidency, you may not have the right to any of those things again. Do you want that on your conscience? So if Hillary ultimately wins, don't complain. You put her there.

In sum, and in my own personal opinion, you #NeverTrumpers are being selfish, and you need to grow up and consider the wider ramifications of a Hillary Clinton presidency. If you truly love America, you would do whatever it took to preserve as much of the country you love as you possibly could, to ensure that you maintain an atmosphere that is tolerant of your beliefs, values or conscience, even if that meant holding back a gag reflex in order to vote for Donald Trump in the general election. The ball's in your court. Don't screw this up for the rest of us.

Nonsense.

There’s nothing ‘selfish’ about wanting to keep Trump – someone completely unqualified and not fit to be president – from indeed becoming president.

 

[TemplarKormac]

More importantly, is it so hard to understand that perhaps the "NeverTrump" people fear a Trump Presidency more than they fear a Clinton one, when it comes to protecting their "values"?

That would be an open contradiction. If they both present an affront to their values, then why would they think a Clinton presidency presents a lesser affront than the other? I find such reasoning to be... odd.

So yes, I find it difficult to understand.

 

[TemplarKormac]

If you want, but I think it's a pretty integral part of (or fault in) your argument.

Alright. Explain.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

More importantly, is it so hard to understand that perhaps the "NeverTrump" people fear a Trump Presidency more than they fear a Clinton one, when it comes to protecting their "values"?

That would be an open contradiction. If they both present an affront to their values, then why would they think a Clinton presidency presents a lesser affront than the other? I find such reasoning to be... odd.

How is it an "open contradiction" to think that Trump would be worse than Clinton?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

First off I'm going to start with this disclaimer: let it be clear that I'm not telling anyone who to vote for, or demanding that anyone vote at all. This thread is intended to compel the reader to consider the ramifications of their decision to stay home or vote third party, whichever it may be. Once again, do whatever the hell you want, I'm just stating my personal opinion on the subject. Sure, it will sound condescending to some of you, but don't take it personally. I'm not angry with you. If you think it's funny, feel free to press the funny button.

But I want you NeverTrumpers to think about something. Before Hillary ever came along, most of you were preaching of the horrors of what would come to pass if she became president. Then, out of nowhere, Donald Trump began his rapid rise to the top of the GOP presidential field. And then, in a sudden reversal, you began preaching the horrors of what would come to pass if he became the nominee. You wrote him off repeatedly, as a flash in the pan or the like. You kept reassuring yourselves that he would never, ever succeed in his campaign. Suddenly, it became a campaign against Trump, not a unified campaign against Hillary as it should have been.

As the inevitability of Trump's victory began to strike home, more and more of you vowed never to vote for Donald Trump, be it a conflict of values or matters of conscience, out of a fit of anger, or perhaps no matter what. For that, I think you're being selfish, and I'll tell you why. Consider what the future of America would be like if Hillary Clinton were elected president, also consider the possibility that your abstinence could put her there. Is selfishness moral? Is it a virtue, a value you hold dear to your heart? No? Then why? Why would you be so righteously indignant that you're willing to risk the future of America to preserve your own values or conscience? This isn't a noble act, this isn't sending a message, it's downright selfish.

You are all no doubt aware of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia's untimely demise earlier this year, as a result, that leaves his seat vacant, ripe for the picking for the next president to fill. You also have four other aging Justices on the bench right now. Over the next decade, there is a likelihood that those four other seats could become vacant. In addition to appointing a successor for Scalia, a president Hillary Clinton could appoint five liberal justices to the bench. Think about that. There could be seven liberal justices on the bench, redefining the conscience of America, and changing her identity.

From then on, on issues of gun rights, religious freedom, freedom of speech, or abortion, the rulings could be 7-2 against the conservative arguments. Seven to two. Consider this: In an effort to preserve your values and conscience, by voting third party, or staying home out of a sense of righteous indignance, you're willing to risk a future where a majority liberal Supreme Court would be allowed to redefine your values for you. The would be given free reign to twist the Constitution to liberal ideals, essentially erasing the conservative brand from the face of America. You must realize that under a Supreme Court with seven liberal justices,there would never be another conservative victory at the Supreme Court level for at least a generation to come. You would be ensuring in your selfishness, an end to your values amid an ill advised attempt to preserve them.

Now, you all also value individual rights. In one case, Hillary made herself clear that she will use the Supreme Court as a weapon to radically alter Americans rights to bear arms. In essence, using our highest court as a weapon against religious freedom or freedom of speech and every other conservative value we all hold dear. You want to help America, yet you are willing to go about precipitating her destruction. You may hate Trump's guts, and I do understand where you're coming from. But Hillary wouldn't give a damn about you or your beliefs, your faith, or your vaunted values and conscience. Because in her presidency, you may not have the right to any of those things again. Do you want that on your conscience? So if Hillary ultimately wins, don't complain. You put her there.

In sum, you #NeverTrumpers are being selfish, and you need to grow up and consider the wider ramifications of a Hillary Clinton presidency. If you truly love America, you would do whatever it took to preserve as much of the country you love as you possibly could, to ensure that you maintain an atmosphere that is tolerant of your beliefs, values or conscience, even if that meant holding back a gag reflex in order to vote for Donald Trump in the general election. The ball's in your court. Don't screw this up for the rest of us.

George Bush was supposed to protect the supreme court. He gave us Juan Roberts. There is just as good a chance Trump will pick the same type person Hillery would. he runs with the same crowed. he is shallow to. no depth. no explanation other then "we are going to make america great again." and then he says "trust me". Know what trust me means in California? can't say I'm never trump, more like zero faith in trump. no proof he will be better then Hillery.

Supreme Court justices have a way of surprising their supporters; that is they take their judicial oath seriously, setting aside politics and personal prejudices.

That ‘problem’ was ‘fixed’ by GWB – a republican president will never again appoint another Warren, Stevens, or Kennedy to the bench.

 

[Zoom-boing]

You might say, he's the Winner of Their Discontent

And I suspect by the time the GE comes around, if he's still in play as a candidate that contingent will have figured that they made their point and go vote for a real candidate, who in effect runs unopposed.

Which is a damn shame.

Damn you crack me up sometimes, P.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

If you want, but I think it's a pretty integral part of (or fault in) your argument.

Alright. Explain.

Well, we can start with the fact that this country is clearly not falling apart. There are problems, sure - but nothing close to the level of problems that this country has faced before, and overcome. That's the whole problem with the Trump thing.


As PJ O'Rourke said, Clinton is wrong about everything - but she's wrong with normal parameters. Hilary Clinton is no more the "end of the US" to you guys as GWB was to us.

Clinton is entirely predictable. She'll do things that you guys don't like, sure. But the status quo will remain. Trump, on the other hand, is a wildcard. There's a lot of people that just don't feel comfortable with his finger on The Button, because they don't know what he could do. Clinton, she's pretty much a known quantity.

 

[TemplarKormac]

More importantly, is it so hard to understand that perhaps the "NeverTrump" people fear a Trump Presidency more than they fear a Clinton one, when it comes to protecting their "values"?

That would be an open contradiction. If they both present an affront to their values, then why would they think a Clinton presidency presents a lesser affront than the other? I find such reasoning to be... odd.

How is it an "open contradiction" to think that Trump would be worse than Clinton?

Because if one views them both as an equal threat, how can they perceive one or the other to be the greater threat to their values? One would think the term "equal" leaves no difference between the two.

 

[Pogo]

You might say, he's the Winner of Their Discontent

And I suspect by the time the GE comes around, if he's still in play as a candidate that contingent will have figured that they made their point and go vote for a real candidate, who in effect runs unopposed.

Which is a damn shame.

Damn you crack me up sometimes, P.

TY, o poster who ...... until recently said "Ni".

 

[theDoctorisIn]

More importantly, is it so hard to understand that perhaps the "NeverTrump" people fear a Trump Presidency more than they fear a Clinton one, when it comes to protecting their "values"?

That would be an open contradiction. If they both present an affront to their values, then why would they think a Clinton presidency presents a lesser affront than the other? I find such reasoning to be... odd.

How is it an "open contradiction" to think that Trump would be worse than Clinton?

Because if one views them both as an equal threat, how can they perceive one or the other to be the greater threat to their values? One would think the term "equal" leaves no difference between the two.

Where are you getting "equal threat" from?

This is what I said:

More importantly, is it so hard to understand that perhaps the "NeverTrump" people fear a Trump Presidency more than they fear a Clinton one, when it comes to protecting their "values"?

 

[Zoom-boing]

TY, o poster who ...... until recently said Ni.

 

[TemplarKormac]

There's a lot of people that just don't feel comfortable with his finger on The Button, because they don't know what he could do.

Hmmm. Call me cynical, but I believe nobody can reap any substantial gains by not taking a risk. And before we go any further, I need to clarify that my OP was referring specifically to members of the Republican party, other conservatives, not to the entire electorate.

Clinton is entirely predictable. She'll do things that you guys don't like, sure. But the status quo will remain... she's pretty much a known quantity.

I would view that as a negative. That's another thing, I hear lots of conservatives expressing how disillusioned they are with the "status quo" and voting for Trump would guarantee a disruption to this "status quo." Yet they think he's the devil.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Where are you getting "equal threat" from?

See my previous post. First response.

 

[Flopper]

First off I'm going to start with this disclaimer: let it be clear that I'm not telling anyone who to vote for, or demanding that anyone vote at all. This thread is intended to compel the reader to consider the ramifications of their decision to stay home or vote third party, whichever it may be. Once again, do whatever the hell you want, I'm just stating my personal opinion on the subject. Sure, it will sound condescending to some of you, but don't take it personally. I'm not angry with you. If you think it's funny, feel free to press the funny button.

But I want you NeverTrumpers to think about something. Before Hillary ever came along, most of you were preaching of the horrors of what would come to pass if she became president. Then, out of nowhere, Donald Trump began his rapid rise to the top of the GOP presidential field. And then, in a sudden reversal, you began preaching the horrors of what would come to pass if he became the nominee. You wrote him off repeatedly, as a flash in the pan or the like. You kept reassuring yourselves that he would never, ever succeed in his campaign. Suddenly, it became a campaign against Trump, not a unified campaign against Hillary as it should have been.

As the inevitability of Trump's victory began to strike home, more and more of you vowed never to vote for Donald Trump, be it a conflict of values or matters of conscience, out of a fit of anger, or perhaps no matter what. For that, I think you're being selfish, and I'll tell you why. Consider what the future of America would be like if Hillary Clinton were elected president, also consider the possibility that your abstinence could put her there. Is selfishness moral? Is it a virtue, a value you hold dear to your heart? No? Then why? Why would you be so righteously indignant that you're willing to risk the future of America to preserve your own values or conscience? This isn't a noble act, this isn't sending a message, it's downright selfish.

You are all no doubt aware of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia's untimely demise earlier this year, as a result, that leaves his seat vacant, ripe for the picking for the next president to fill. You also have four other aging Justices on the bench right now. Over the next decade, there is a likelihood that those four other seats could become vacant. In addition to appointing a successor for Scalia, a president Hillary Clinton could appoint five liberal justices to the bench. Think about that. There could be seven liberal justices on the bench, redefining the conscience of America, and changing her identity.

From then on, on issues of gun rights, religious freedom, freedom of speech, or abortion, the rulings could be 7-2 against the conservative arguments. Seven to two. Consider this: In an effort to preserve your values and conscience, by voting third party, or staying home out of a sense of righteous indignance, you're willing to risk a future where a majority liberal Supreme Court would be allowed to redefine your values for you. The would be given free reign to twist the Constitution to liberal ideals, essentially erasing the conservative brand from the face of America. You must realize that under a Supreme Court with seven liberal justices,there would never be another conservative victory at the Supreme Court level for at least a generation to come. You would be ensuring in your selfishness, an end to your values amid an ill advised attempt to preserve them.

Now, you all also value individual rights. In one case, Hillary made herself clear that she will use the Supreme Court as a weapon to radically alter Americans rights to bear arms. In essence, using our highest court as a weapon against religious freedom or freedom of speech and every other conservative value we all hold dear. You want to help America, yet you are willing to go about precipitating her destruction. You may hate Trump's guts, and I do understand where you're coming from. But Hillary wouldn't give a damn about you or your beliefs, your faith, or your vaunted values and conscience. Because in her presidency, you may not have the right to any of those things again. Do you want that on your conscience? So if Hillary ultimately wins, don't complain. You put her there.

In sum, and in my own personal opinion, you #NeverTrumpers are being selfish, and you need to grow up and consider the wider ramifications of a Hillary Clinton presidency. If you truly love America, you would do whatever it took to preserve as much of the country you love as you possibly could, to ensure that you maintain an atmosphere that is tolerant of your beliefs, values or conscience, even if that meant holding back a gag reflex in order to vote for Donald Trump in the general election. The ball's in your court. Don't screw this up for the rest of us.

From what I have seen of the Trump campaign, his supporters are voting against the status quo, the party, and the establishment. They are not voting for anything, just against most everything. Trump is a symbol of their discontent.

You might say, he's the Winner of Their Discontent

And I suspect by the time the GE comes around, if he's still in play as a candidate that contingent will have figured that they made their point and go vote for a real candidate, who in effect runs unopposed.

Which is a damn shame.

By the time the election rolls around, Trump will have split the party so badly, That Hillary will need only one slogan, "I'm not Trump".