Destruction of stars and the subsequent formation of black holes mentioned in the Qur

[Chuckt]

As I have told you before; you are trying to make your case using an english translation.

Which will never be able to convey the intent or meaning of the words which were originally written in classical Arabic.

True story.........

Really? Even if I let you use as many words as possible?
It is one of many reasons why I don't believe the Qu'ran.

 

[Sunni Man]

As I have told you before; you are trying to make your case using an english translation.

Which will never be able to convey the intent or meaning of the words which were originally written in classical Arabic.

True story.........

Why should I as an English speaker follow a book that can't be accurately translated into English? The minute I try to translate it for myself, it won't be accurate. It makes no sense.

That's why learning to read and speak arabic is stressed in the mosques.

And most mosques provide arabic language classes for all age groups.

In fact, tens of millions of muslims have memorized the entire Quran by heart. .

 

[Chuckt]

As I have told you before; you are trying to make your case using an english translation.

Which will never be able to convey the intent or meaning of the words which were originally written in classical Arabic.

True story.........

Why should I as an English speaker follow a book that can't be accurately translated into English? The minute I try to translate it for myself, it won't be accurate. It makes no sense.

That's why learning to read and speak arabic is stressed in the mosques.

And most mosques provide arabic language classes for all age groups.

In fact, tens of millions of muslims have memorized the entire Quran by heart. .

So illiterate people can grasp interpretation but English speaking people can't? Isn't that discrimination?

 

[Sunni Man]

As I have told you before; you are trying to make your case using an english translation.

Which will never be able to convey the intent or meaning of the words which were originally written in classical Arabic.

True story.........

Really? Even if I let you use as many words as possible?

Most Christian's can't read the Bible in the language it was originally written.

That is why there are soo many translations of the Bible with various shades of meanings.

Which causes great confusion in the Church and leads to the creation of different denominations. .

 

[Dajjal]

In the so called HOLY Quran, Muhammad spends many verses trying to justify himself, and in the following verses he tries to explain why he can get away with changing the words of God, he also goes on to admit that people of his time accused him of being taught by a foreigner, but he says the quran is Arabic, pure and clear.

16.101 When We substitute one revelation for another,- and God knows best what
He reveals (in stages),- they say, "Thou art but a forger": but most of them understand
not.
16.102 Say, the Holy Spirit has brought the revelation from thy Lord in Truth, in
order to strengthen those who believe, and as a Guide and Glad Tidings to Muslims.
16.103 We know indeed that they say, "It is a man that teaches him." The tongue of
him they wickedly point to is notably foreign, while this is Arabic, pure and clear.

 

[Sunni Man]

So illiterate people can grasp interpretation but English speaking people can't? Isn't that discrimination?

No you nitwit......

Muslims learn the Quran in the original arabic language.

So there is no interpretation involved. .

 

[Dajjal]

So illiterate people can grasp interpretation but English speaking people can't? Isn't that discrimination?

No you nitwit......

Muslims learn the Quran in the original arabic language.

So there is no interpretation involved. .

No they don't, among other things the original quran had no vowels.

 

[Sunni Man]

Dajjal, let me know when you can read and write Classical Arabic.

And I will have a debate about what the Quran says.

So until then........ Bye

 

[Dajjal]

Dajjal, let me know when you can read and write Classical Arabic.

And I will have a debate about what the Quran says.

So until then........ Bye

I suppose you are telling me I will have to discuss it in Arabic too.

You are just an exponent of the deceitful nonsense that the quran says something in Arabic that is more profound than it says in English.

English is a sophisticated language, and I remain certain there is nothing in the Quranic Arabic that is so different it cannot be understood in translation.

 

[Chuckt]

As I have told you before; you are trying to make your case using an english translation.

Which will never be able to convey the intent or meaning of the words which were originally written in classical Arabic.

True story.........

Really? Even if I let you use as many words as possible?

Most Christian's can't read the Bible in the language it was originally written.

That is why there are soo many translations of the Bible with various shades of meanings.

Which causes great confusion in the Church and leads to the creation of different denominations. .

There are 70 sects of Islam and it is all based on "interpretation".

 

[Sunni Man]

There are 70 sects of Islam and it is all based on "interpretation".

The differences of sects in Islam are over ethnic and political disputes........not interpretations of the Quran.

Whereas, there are hundreds, if not thousands of Christian denominations, based solely on differences in how the Bible is interpreted.


Anyway, I will extend the same invitation to you as I did with Dajjal.

When you learn the read and write Arabic as it was recorded in the Quran.

I will happy to debate the Quran with you.

But until then.......Bye ...

 

[Dajjal]

There are 70 sects of Islam and it is all based on "interpretation".

The differences of sects in Islam are over ethnic and political disputes........not interpretations of the Quran.

Whereas, there are hundreds, if not thousands of Christian denominations, based solely on differences in how the Bible is interpreted.


Anyway, I will extend the same invitation to you as I did with Dajjal.

When you learn the read and write Arabic as it was recorded in the Quran.

I will happy to debate the Quran with you.

But until then.......Bye ...

Which of the seven dialects the quran was written in do you recommend?

 

[Chuckt]

There are 70 sects of Islam and it is all based on "interpretation".

The differences of sects in Islam are over ethnic and political disputes........not interpretations of the Quran.

Whereas, there are hundreds, if not thousands of Christian denominations, based solely on differences in how the Bible is interpreted.

I saw a woman in Muslim dress walk out of a liquor store after having bought Hurricane with I think is a hard liquor by Budweiser and I saw another Muslim woman wearing hip huggers. To them they are Muslim because of interpretation but to Muslims, they aren't Muslim.

Anyway, I work with a Muslim away from the job and he says it is a matter of interpretation.

 

[Dajjal]

Regarding the nonsense that you cannot understand the Quran unless you can read it in Arabic, the Quran says it is a final message from God to all mankind.

Does this mean that all those who cannot read Arabic will not know what God has said?

Does this mean that all the so called Muslims who do not understand Arabic are not really Muslims at all because they don't even know what they believe?

Or does it mean that saying you cannot understand the quran unless you can read it in Arabic is just another twisted fabrication by Muslims ,to try and protect their beliefs from criticism?

I maintain that everything I have said about the OP is valid criticism. To hell with Arabic.

 

[Chuckt]

Regarding the nonsense that you cannot understand the Quran unless you can read it in Arabic, the Quran says it is a final message from God to all mankind.

Does this mean that all those who cannot read Arabic will not know what God has said?

Does this mean that all the so called Muslims who do not understand Arabic are not really Muslims at all because they don't even know what they believe?

Or does it mean that saying you cannot understand the quran unless you can read it in Arabic is just another twisted fabrication by Muslims ,to try and protect their beliefs from criticism?

I maintain that everything I have said about the OP is valid criticism. To hell with Arabic.

It is a controlled group. You have to say what others say in Islam. Anyone who doesn't say what they say are infidels so therefore independent thought is criticized and controlled like a cult even though it is a world religion. They exert control of those in the group so only the group can say what their leaders says it means and those outside can't criticize because they aren't Muslim and therefore can't know anything.

A Jehovah Witness brought her illiterate children to my door and because I dared help them read the Bible what it literally said that disagreed with what they taught, they never came back.

There is nothing new under the sun. They are exercising thought control and it is all a scam.

 

[Chuckt]

So illiterate people can grasp interpretation but English speaking people can't? Isn't that discrimination?

No you nitwit......

Muslims learn the Quran in the original arabic language.

So there is no interpretation involved. .

All translations are an interpretation including reading the Quran.

"The Qor'an contains sentences which are incomplete and not fully intelligible without the aid of commentaries; foreign words, unfamiliar Arabic words, and words used with other than the normal meaning, adjectives and verbs inflected without observance of the concords of gender and number; illogically and ungrammatically applied pronouns which sometimes have no referrent; and predicates which in rhymed passages are often remote from the subjects.2
To sum up, more than one hudred Qor'anic abberations from the normal rules and structure of Arabic have been noted.3"

-comments from Ali Dashti, p. 199, The Islamic Invasion, Confronting the World's Fastest Growing Religion by Dr. Robert Morey

 

[Bowman]

The Quran swears by destruction of stars and the subsequent formation of black holes to prove it is sent by God. (In 53:1 An oath by the destruction of stars is taken, In 56:75-76 An oath by the enormity of this event is taken, In 81:15-18 Formation of black holes which form after the destruction of giant stars and the fact that matter and light cannot escape is mentioned) - Below are the specific ayaat:

All of this material was wholesale copied from the Biblical Book of Revelation.

Too bad that this was just one of many hit-n-run posts by you.....if you ever do return, we can show you the error of your ignorant Islamic ways...

 

[Bowman]

The Quran swears by destruction of stars and the subsequent formation of black holes to prove it is sent by God. (In 53:1 An oath by the destruction of stars is taken,
53:1: By the star when it Hawa (destructs, blows up)

53:2: Has neither Dalla (gone astray), Your Companion (Muhammad Blessings and Peace of God be upon him) nor Ghawa (nor is being misled)

53 Nor does he speak from Hawa (emotion)

53:4: It is not but a Wahi (revelation, inspiration) Yuha (revealed, inspired)

The authors of the Koran swear by the Biblical material that they copied.



Sura 53


النجم

“Alnnajmi”

“The Asterism”

(Named in honor of the Biblical Jesus)





Sura 53 recalls John’s encounter with Jesus Christ, as recorded in the Book of Revelation.

John, the companion of Jesus Christ, just as told in Revelation, falls prostrate in worship at the feet of Jesus Christ. Jesus then proceeds to dictate to John what needs to be written down.

This sura attempts to cover a lot of ground by confirming the concept of the Biblical Trinity; the New Jerusalem descending; and an accurate description of the four living creatures surrounding the singular Throne of God and Jesus.






Summary:


53.1 And/by the asterism, when he fell down. (Swears by John prostrating before Jesus)

53.2 Your companion did not perish, and he did not err. (John, the companion of Jesus Christ)

53.3 And he speaks not on account of his own will. (The Revelation to John)

53.4 Indeed he is except Revelation that is inspired. (The Revelation of Jesus Christ)

53.5 He taught him, Lord of the mighty powers. (The Trinity)

53.6 Lord of one action, so to be equal. (The Trinity)

53.7 And He, on account of the heavens, the Most High. (Jesus comes on the clouds)

53.8 Then He drew near; so He drew near from above. (A vision of Christ)

53.9 So He was at a distance of two cubits, or nearer. (John prostrates before Jesus)

53.10 So He (God) spoke to His slave by Revelation that which he wrote. (Jesus speaks to John)

53.11 He was not told a lie by the Soul, nor by what he saw. (The Spirit of Truth)

53.12 So you do not dispute him on account of what he shall see? (The Truth from above)

53.13 And certainly he saw Him descend once again. (The New Jerusalem descends)

53.14 In the presence of lote-tree, the final destination. (The Tree of Life)

53.15 In the presence of her walled garden paradise, the abode. (The New Jerusalem)

53.16 Behold, it covers the lote-tree, that which (is) covered. (The Four Living Creatures)

53.17 The eyes turned aside not, and did not wander from its orbit. (The Four Living Creatures)

53.18 Certainly he saw, from apparent signs, the greatest ones of his Lord. (The Four Living Creatures)

53.19 So you saw the appellation of a man and the Eagle? (The Four Living Creatures)

53.20 And the decree of death, the third, the last (The Four Living Creatures)

 

[Bowman]

In 81:15-18 Formation of black holes which form after the destruction of giant stars and the fact that matter and light cannot escape is mentioned) - Below are the specific ayaat:




81:15: Fa (So) La (No), uqsimu (I swear, I take an oath) by Khunnas (drawn together objects) (When a massive star destructs, it subsequently draws together i.e. 10 times the mass of the sun is drawn to within a 30 km diameter in the stellar category of black holes)

81:16: Those that run (their courses) and Kunnas (sweep whatever is in their path, matter cannot escape)

81:17: And the night as it us'us (the darkness of a black hole is different than regular darkness)

81:18: And the light as it Tanaffus (As it gets pulled in, even light cannot escape)

81 Verily, this is the Word (this Qur'an brought by) a messenger Kareem (honourable, Jibrael (Gabriel), from God to the last human messenger)

81 (Who is) possessed of power and with the Owner of the Arsh (uppermost construction in heaven), Makeen (secure in position),

81 Obeyed there (in the heavens) and Ameen (trustworthy)

81:22: And your companion is not (at all) Majnoon (mad)

81:23: And he has already seen him (Gabriel) in the horizon Mubeen (clear)

81:24: And he (the last messenger) is not with the unseen Daneen (a with-holder, concealer of knowledge)

81:25: And it (the Qur'an) is not the word of Satan, Rajeem (expelled from the heavens).

81 So where are you Tazhaboon (going?)

81:27: It (the Quran) is not except a remembrance for the Alameen

81:28: For whoever wills among you that (he or she) Yastaqeem (stay straight, do what is right and avoid straying from what is right)

81:29: And you will not, except (it be) that Allah wills - Lord of the Alameen.


You may verify the words above using any arabic-english lexicon I used Lane's Lexicon.

Sura 81


التكوير

“alkuwwirat”

“The Folding of the Light”

(Named in honor of Jesus’ opening of the seals)





Sura 81 is a potpourri of paraphrased Book of Revelation material with much of the events described revolving around Jesus’ opening of the Sixth & Seventh seals; and the second, fifth, & sixth trumpet blasts.

Further, this sura emphasizes Jesus’ Second Coming to gather His Elect, and confirms His deity upon the Throne, as God Almighty.






Summary:


81.1 When the sun will be folded up and so darkened. (Announces Jesus’ opening of the Sixth Seal)

81.2 And when the stars fall upon the Earth. (Jesus’ opening of the Sixth Seal)

81.3 And when the mountains were made to move. (Jesus’ opening of the Sixth Seal)

81.4 And when the ten and ten abandoned the woman. (The First Beast)

81.5 And when the beasts were gathered. (The Second Death)

81.6 And when the sea and river shall be filled with fire and dried up. (The Second Trumpet Blast)

81.7 And when the souls shall be united with those whom it has followed. (The Marriage of the Lamb)

81.8 And when she is questioned about the sound. (The Fifth Trumpet Blast)

81.9 On account of which tail she was killed. (The Sixth Trumpet Blast)

81.10 And when the books will be spread out. (The Book of Judgment)

81.11 And when the heaven shall be unveiled. (Jesus’ opening of the Sixth Seal)

81.12 And when the fire of Hell is set ablaze. (The Second Death)

81.13 And when Paradise is brought near. (The New Jerusalem descends)

81.14 I know, that such a one was, or is, going forth, a man that which she has presented.(Announces The Lamb coming forth)

81.15 So I swear on account of the concealed stars. (Swears by Jesus’ opening of the Seventh Seal)

81.16 The ships, the stars. (Jesus’ opening of the Seventh Seal)

81.17 And/by the night when it departed. (Swears by Jesus’ opening of the Seventh Seal)

81.18 And/by the dawn when it became extended. (Swears by Jesus’ opening of the Seventh Seal)

81.19 Certainly His Word is a Holy messenger. (Jesus, the Word of God)

81.20 Lord of power in the presence and possession of the throne, the established one.
(Jesus as God upon the Throne)

81.21 Obeyed one there, Amen. (Jesus as God upon the Throne)

81.22 And your companion is not possessed with a devil. (John, the Companion of Jesus Christ)

81.23 And certainly he saw him on account of the heavens, the perspicuous. (John sees the Mighty Angel)

81.24 And he is not against the Mystery on account of its tenaciousness. (The Mystery of God)

81.25 And he is not on account of the expelled serpent’s saying. (The Accuser is thrown down)

81.26 Then where you may take away? (Jesus is caught up to the Throne)

81.27 Indeed he is except a warning to the Jinn and of mankind. (A warning from John)

81.28 For whosoever desires from you that be righteous. (The Water of Life)

81.29 And you will not, except that he wills allah, the Lord of the jinn, and of mankind. (The Lord of the Abyss)

 

[rdean]

People who didn't know to wash after wiping knew about "black holes"?????

Come on.