Did Liberalism Cause Virginia Tech Shootings?

[Diuretic]

You may wish to have your ' wish you were me' complex looked at.

I don't think so

 

[myth]

uhm...i was "picked on" in elementary and high school...never once did it occur to me to buy a gun (or steal one from my Dad) and go blow away either the "guilty" parties or the innocent classmates. when your last name is doggett in the 60's...and everyone else's is smith, jones, davis, etc...(you get the picture), there is a lot of ridiculing...of course i was picked on...here doggie doggie....dogshit, dog buscuit...etc, ad nauseum...it hurt very deeply, yet i knew that someday i would be grown, and that hopefully the adults wouldn't make such assholes out of themselves. the fact remains, this maniac took out 32 innocent students/faculty members and i don't really care how much gun control is out there, if a person is so incredibly mentally ill and obviously a sociopath...he was only thinking of himself, and his hurt...oh boo hoo...it doesn't have anything to do with gun control or the lack thereof...it has to do with one more sick motherfucker!!! if anyone wants to buy a gun...then a gun is available...i am sickened by the liberals, and the rosie o'donnells, and the sean penn's of this world...get a life, you certainly have the money to do do...i own a gun for self defense in my apartment...what?!?!?!...should i just let someone come into my home and kill/rape/burglarize my family??? oh, please...

 

[myth]

I am as certain Liberal idiots have murdered people with guns as I am conservative idiots have murdered people with guns, you idiots cause me to despair.

Here in England, politics very rarely have fuck all to do with murder, I wish you lot would grow the fuck up and shut the fuck up.

why don't you just grow the fuck up and shut up...that's why the uk doesn't celebrage july 4th...because you're all a bunch of fucking asshole randy's...oh yeah, and because we beat the fuck out of you when we were forming our own nation...if you don't like the way we run things around here then stay the fuck out of our messageboards!!!!!!!!!!!!

also, why not play the fucking violin for yourself...give me liberty, or give me death...go to hell you stupid ass brit!!! (and no, i don't have anger management problems...just sick of the rest of the world criticizing us and telling us how to run our country, when their own is in such disarray!!!!!)

 

[Annie]

why don't you just grow the fuck up and shut up...that's why the uk doesn't celebrage july 4th...because you're all a bunch of fucking asshole randy's...oh yeah, and because we beat the fuck out of you when we were forming our own nation...if you don't like the way we run things around here then stay the fuck out of our messageboards!!!!!!!!!!!!

also, why not play the fucking violin for yourself...give me liberty, or give me death...go to hell you stupid ass brit!!! (and no, i don't have anger management problems...just sick of the rest of the world criticizing us and telling us how to run our country, when their own is in such disarray!!!!!)

Wow, what do you have against Brits in general and Roomy in particular? He grows on one sort of, over time. He's been here a long time, (off and on, ). You've been here how long?

 

[roomy]

why don't you just grow the fuck up and shut up...that's why the uk doesn't celebrage july 4th...because you're all a bunch of fucking asshole randy's...oh yeah, and because we beat the fuck out of you when we were forming our own nation...if you don't like the way we run things around here then stay the fuck out of our messageboards!!!!!!!!!!!!

also, why not play the fucking violin for yourself...give me liberty, or give me death...go to hell you stupid ass brit!!! (and no, i don't have anger management problems...just sick of the rest of the world criticizing us and telling us how to run our country, when their own is in such disarray!!!!!)

Hahahahahah...you call yourself myth and you believe yourself already?

What a thick bastard you are I may never recognise you ever again.


Proper fucking idiot, fuck off.

 

[myth]

Wow, what do you have against Brits in general and Roomy in particular? He grows on one sort of, over time. He's been here a long time, (off and on, ). You've been here how long?

sorry...don't have anything against the brits in general...way back in the early 1600's, my family came here from England/Germany...so, guess the brit blood is in my veins. does it really matter how long i've been here...so sorry, thought i would just express my, uhm, first amendment rights...(hangs head in shame)...also, assume much there kathianne?...i was spikesgirll500...as in spikesmygod's best friend on the earth...so, why don't you just check the facts out before going all willy nilly into accusing people of being all cheeky?????

 

[myth]

Hahahahahah...you call yourself myth and you believe yourself already?

What a thick bastard you are I may never recognise you ever again.


Proper fucking idiot, fuck off.

and, uhm, i'm supposed to care exactly how??? why don't you fuck off? have you ever had an original thought in your head....EVER????...or is it just liberal bumper sticker mentality???? why does my presence threaten you??? just curious?...or are you man/woman enough to answer that question???

 

[Annie]

sorry...don't have anything against the brits in general...way back in the early 1600's, my family came here from England/Germany...so, guess the brit blood is in my veins. does it really matter how long i've been here...so sorry, thought i would just express my, uhm, first amendment rights...(hangs head in shame)...also, assume much there kathianne?...i was spikesgirll500...as in spikesmygod's best friend on the earth...so, why don't you just check the facts out before going all willy nilly into accusing people of being all cheeky?????

Okay, you give no facts. I believe you posted earlier about Spikesmygod and I responded on how highly regarded he was and expressed condolences? Yet, you come on with plenty of attitude about one post, with no context of why? Yet you castigate me?

Starting over, Welcome. Hope you enjoy.

 

[myth]

oh kathianne...
don't really think that i castigated YOU in particular...yeah, we can start over if you like...but i'm not like apologizing for anything that i said...it was nothing personal against you...i just logged on to the site and entered into the fray of the conversation...posted my thoughts on the matter, etc...i thought that's what we were supposed to do here...anyway...i can post my own thingy if necessary)...yeah, i miss the hell out of spikes...his real name was matt (or mati)...now i'm here in new jersey, he's there (well, okay his remains are there) in nc...i have very definite views about the whole vt thing...i almost went there in the 70's as a student, but went instead to randolph macon (which wasn't that far from there), and had a friend who was a student there...visited there a lot...beautiful campus...okay, let's start over and be friends??? thanks....rene'

 

[roomy]

and, uhm, i'm supposed to care exactly how??? why don't you fuck off? have you ever had an original thought in your head....EVER????...or is it just liberal bumper sticker mentality???? why does my presence threaten you??? just curious?...or are you man/woman enough to answer that question???

It's fair to say that bigger better girls than you have tried to chase me away, so., I don't think so mithy.Your presence here, like anyone elses, doesn't bother me in the slightest. I can see the back of you any time I choose really, I just don't choose to, your own fucking stupidity will be the death of you here mithy.

A word to the wise, count your losses and shut the fuck up, you stupid twat

 

[myth]

It's fair to say that bigger better girls than you have tried to chase me away, so., I don't think so mithy.Your presence here, like anyone elses, doesn't bother me in the slightest. I can see the back of you any time I choose really, I just don't choose to, your own fucking stupidity will be the death of you here mithy.

A word to the wise, count your losses and shut the fuck up, you stupid twat

first of all...if you can't take a "reply" that you don't agree with, then don't post...duh...i'm so glad that my presence doesn't bother you, that certainly wasn't my intention...what, can only posters who agree with you reply here...get over yourself, you obviously have issues...but, that's okay...don't hate me because i'm both beautiful and smart!!!

 

[Annie]

oh kathianne...
don't really think that i castigated YOU in particular...yeah, we can start over if you like...but i'm not like apologizing for anything that i said...it was nothing personal against you...i just logged on to the site and entered into the fray of the conversation...posted my thoughts on the matter, etc...i thought that's what we were supposed to do here...anyway...i can post my own thingy if necessary)...yeah, i miss the hell out of spikes...his real name was matt (or mati)...now i'm here in new jersey, he's there (well, okay his remains are there) in nc...i have very definite views about the whole vt thing...i almost went there in the 70's as a student, but went instead to randolph macon (which wasn't that far from there), and had a friend who was a student there...visited there a lot...beautiful campus...okay, let's start over and be friends??? thanks....rene'

Good for us. Welcome Rene. Truth is, we missed Spikes from his last post, Darin and I found the reference to his death at the same time. I always thought him a massive talent, encouraged him to look for a publisher.

As for boards, I think there is a lot to be said for tact and feeling out the sense of a board, but that's me. Do what you gotta do.

 

[myth]

Good for us. Welcome Rene. Truth is, we missed Spikes from his last post, Darin and I found the reference to his death at the same time. I always thought him a massive talent, encouraged him to look for a publisher.

As for boards, I think there is a lot to be said for tact and feeling out the sense of a board, but that's me. Do what you gotta do.

sorry...don't like it when people from other countries attack our country...yet that seems to be okay with you guys...i'm not the only one in the last hour who has responded negatively to "roomy"...and he hasn't exactly been the soul of virtue in his responses to his responses, or whatever...hey, i can tone it down, but only if everyone else promises to play nicely as well...

 

[Vintij]

Er - since when was schizophrenia "not crazy" ? It sure ain't normal. The bloke was a nutter.

Paranoid schizophrenia is a disorder. If he was crazy, he would have just went around campus shooting whoever he sees with no intelligent design. Crazy is something people like to say because they dont like him and dont know what a disorder is. Disturbed is a better word. Crazy is a lady who throws cats at you, disturbed is a lady who plans an attack. Read the dictionary.

My point was, he should have been diagnosed long before the shootings.

 

[Ninja]

That's the dumbest post I've read here so far - which says a lot.

I take it that you majored in psychology at "UC Berkely"?

 

[myth]

Paranoid schizophrenia is a disorder. If he was crazy, he would have just went around campus shooting whoever he sees with no intelligent design. Crazy is something people like to say because they dont like him and dont know what a disorder is. Disturbed is a better word. Crazy is a lady who throws cats at you, disturbed is a lady who plans an attack. Read the dictionary. They dont let crazy people into VT.

unfornately..."crazy" people are admitted into every university...first of all, it's difficult to diagnose certain abnormalities because either the signs are benign or the person chooses to "cover" them...matt and i were in chapel hill the day the dude (sorry, can't remember his name, but he was all pissed at his shrink and decided to take this out on the shrink as well as other students...wendell, i believe, was his first name)...anyway, he went on a little shooting rampage of his own, resulting in quite a few casualties...matt and i were in a deli when it all started happening in the next block...we ran out to see what was going on and if we could help, when we see this madman with a gun killing people...

i went to college and grad school, and sometimes, i did encounter some weird people...had they gone off and killed fellow students and/or faculty members, i guess that it would have, at that point, been apparent that there was something seriously wrong with them, but at the moment of occurrence..i would have probably just chalked it up to "well, that person is really strange"...still, i don't think gun control is the answer to the problem at hand...not sure that there is an answer to an act of violence that was so irrational (at least, to those of us who are rational), or cruel...my heart breaks for the families of these students and faculty members.

 

[Diuretic]

Paranoid schizophrenia is a disorder. If he was crazy, he would have just went around campus shooting whoever he sees with no intelligent design. Crazy is something people like to say because they dont like him and dont know what a disorder is. Disturbed is a better word. Crazy is a lady who throws cats at you, disturbed is a lady who plans an attack. Read the dictionary.

My point was, he should have been diagnosed long before the shootings.

Don't be a smartarse, it will get you in the end Vintij, it's just a discussion forum, not a final year psychology exam. As for the dictionary - no, you leaf through it by all means, I'll stick with DSMIV.

 

[Creek_George]

I find it deplorable - and have written so in a prior column - that liberals immediately exploited the tragic massacre at Virginia Tech University to promote their crusade for abolition of gun ownership. They chose to politicize this calamity even before the murderer was identified.

Yet, unfortunately, they did just that. They did so in the most loathsome manner possible by blaming Republicans, the NRA, gun owners, and conservatives. People like Democrat Congressman Jim Moran, New York Times columnist Michael Daly, and other, similarly vile people, immediately assigned blame to gun laws and gun ownership as if they somehow knew, unqualifiedly, that this was the reason.

Just as unfortunate as the misinformation campaign by the aforementioned, is the fact that it now creates the obligation, among those who know better, to respond with the truth. Indeed, a response is absolutely necessary lest it seem that what the gun control zealots are saying is true.

It is ironic that liberals want to blame conservatives and Republicans for the Virginia Tech disaster. Indeed, far from being a validation of liberal policies towards gun ownership, the fact is, the Virginia Tech catastrophe, is quite the opposite. What happened in Blacksburg, Va., on Monday proves that liberal policies have, once again, failed to protect the innocent.

The first evidence that liberal ideas either contributed to, or were the cause, of the VA Tech tragedy is that of the very words of the murderer, Cho Seung-Hui. A videotape and some writings he made before, and during the killing spree, which he sent to NBC, revealed his motivation. Among his reasons were his resentment of "rich kids," and their "Mercedes," their "golden necklaces," their "trust funds," their "debaucheries" and their "hedonistic" lifestyle.

This hatred of the "rich" is right out of the leftist and liberal Democratic Party philosophy of class warfare. It is they who are always demonizing the wealthy - claiming they want to starve the poor, or send the poor to war for oil so they can profit from it. Democrat leaders like Charlie Rangel, Ted Kennedy, Harry Reid, and Howard Dean, among others, routinely portray the wealthy as greedy and evil.

The second substantiation that liberal concepts caused the massacre was that the murderer, despite having a history of criminally insane behavior, was not incarcerated. Almost 18 months ago, a Virginia court order, dated December 13, 2005, stated the murderer "is mentally ill and in need of hospitalization, and presents an imminent threat to self and others as a result of mental illness..." He was taken by police to a psychiatric facility, Carilion St. Albans Behavioral Health Center, where the next day Dr. Roy Crouse, a psychiatrist found that he was "mentally ill," yet did "not present an imminent danger to himself/others" and did, "not require involuntary hospitalization." (This is contradicted by another form signed by a Judge Paul Barnett which states the murderer is a danger to himself, yet recommends outpatient treatment).

The killer was represented by an attorney at that time. This was a requirement established "civil libertarian" attorneys. Indeed the "danger to himself or others" sole criterion for involuntary hospitalization is the direct result of the "civil libertarian" philosophy of not placing mentally ill people in institutions. Indeed, "civil libertarians" are quite proud of the fact that they changed these laws. They rejoice that they caused millions of mentally ill people to roam the streets and make it difficult for them to be arrested. This was essentially codified by a 1975 Supreme Court ruling.

The third proof that liberalism was responsible for the Virginia Tech carnage was the leftwing policy that Va. Tech's campus was a "gun free zone." Guns were not permitted to be carried on campus. Consequently, the students were unable to defend themselves and kill the murderer.

Compare this to Pearl (Mississippi) High School, Vice Principal, Joel Myrick, who in October 1997, realized that a 16-year-old student was killing students. Myrick went to his vehicle got his gun and returned in time to stop the killer. Myrick, by doing this, was in violation of the Gun Free School Zones Act of 1990.

Ironically, eight months before the Virginia Tech student killer was able to walk out of psychiatric facility, in April 2005, another VT student was disciplined for carrying a gun on campus. A VT spokesman said, "We think we have the right to adhere to and enforce that policy because, in the end, we think it's a common-sense policy for the protection of students, staff and faculty as well as guests and visitors..."

An armed VT student or VT students might have prevented the slaughter just as Joel Myrick did at his Mississippi high school

Liberals need to be very careful if they want to use the Virginia Tech incident to validate their ideas because, if anything, it disproves them.

They also discredit themselves by claiming that nearly all studies disprove that guns are used in self-defense. This is patently false.

The May 1997 National Institute of Justice report titled, "Guns in America; National Survey on Private Ownership and Use of Firearms cited two studies that furnished significant - if divergent - numbers for defensive gun use.

The National Crime Victimization Survey data concluded that guns are used about 108,000 per year for self-defense. The National Survey of the Private Ownership of Firearms determined that people defended themselves with guns 2,500,000 times per year. Philip Cook, the director of Duke University's Public Policy Institute and a member of the apolitical National Consortium on Violence Research, states that the actual figure is somewhere in between these two.

Whatever the actual figure, the fact is that while there are about 10,000 gun homicides each year, there are more people who use guns to protect themselves. It is also worth noting that federal government data states that about 15 percent of murderers have a prior homicide conviction and that about 65 percent have a prior felony arrest.

Michael P. Tremoglie is the author of A Sense Of Duty, available on Amazon.com. He can be reached at [email protected]
http://www.thebulletin.us/site/news.cfm?newsid=18238693&BRD=2737&PAG=461&dept_id=576361&rfi=6

I read this....

Everybody was shocked about this...and especially from a parents view..Lib & Con alike...

Did you write this article from gathering information from newspaper clippings..internet research?..Your own resources?...Or did you take this to the streets?

You were just as fast as the libs...and just as guilty to make a political statement about this....This is what your bitching about?

It's pretty easy to see..It was a killer(cold blooded)..and the lives taken..will not be given back...Gun laws..votes..who says what?..I guess both parties take advantage of that...and shit like this...What's worse...the clean up?

Personaly..from what I've seen..is your "Liberial" reaction..is no more better that than your colorful article...

Do you write your feelings for a vote...because all you have to say is this.

I saw posts going after libs..before they could even react....Is damage control what you're doing?

I would of been in silence..or sorrow...out of 99% of everybody...But all you s.o.b.'s the first thing outa ya..was a political statement.

Guns are not the issue..There are more guns than we could ever get rid of here & if we did put an end to them..It would be a 9 month notice...and more guns would be purchased in a 9 month period..than any time in the history of this country.

But like you said..if this is not political.....and you believe what you write...

Go tell what you say...to the family members of the victims...and the shooters family.

One week..two,three,even 100 weeks weeks after this nightmare for them...They will not want to read this shit.

It's not liberals who have to be careful talking about this..We all do my friend...(handshake).

You said this...posted it...

<QUOTE>

Liberals need to be very careful if they want to use the Virginia Tech incident to validate their ideas because, if anything, it disproves them.

</QUOTE>

This horrible thing that happened...is not a political thing....

If it's a fear on your gun right laws..."we" are gona have to live with that...and take that step/obsticle when it comes...

This is not a liberal/con thing that happened....This stage is so early in the game...

Shame on you both(parties)...and bless those that mean well...

To write an article on this..is a politcal statement..Both parties were probably writing before...well I need not be so graphic.

 

[red states rule]

and how does the liberal media "report" when the criminal gets shot?


SFChron: Robber Killed By Victim, Reported as 'Tragic', Robber a 'Good Person'
Posted by Warner Todd Huston on April 21, 2007 - 19:55.
One would think the writers of The Onion satirical newspaper snuck into the offices of The San Francisco Chronicle after reading a report about a pizza shop owner who saved the lives of his family by killing a gun wielding robber that was attempting to rob his store, a store with the owner's whole family inside. The Chronicle calls the meeting of the thief and would be killer and the innocent pizza shop owner "tragic" and the report is filed as if the whole story was all just some unfortunate accident instead of a crime stopped cold.

The lives of the two men intersected tragically at about 9:30 p.m. Thursday when Hicks, armed with a pistol and joined by two other men, tried to rob Piedra inside the popular pizzeria at 89th Avenue and International Boulevard. Fearful that the assailants might hurt him, his wife and three children -- all of whom were inside the restaurant -- Piedra pulled out his 9mm semiautomatic pistol and opened fire, killing Hicks, police said.

The Chronicle made the story as an excuse at a morality play revealing how friends are remembering the robber as one who "...always had a smile on his face", that the shop owner "took no satisfaction in taking Hicks' life", and the police "...by no stretch of the imagination" were they "agreeing with or justifying what the owner did." We are even treated to a telling of our "tragic" robber's happy little "rap artist" name; "Boonie".

Obviously the San Francisco Chronicle has decided that this story is going to be their platform to show how guns "traumatize" everyone when the real focus of the story should be on how a shop owner protected himself and his family inside the shop from an armed criminal.

This is no "tragic" incident, but a crime stopped by a man protecting his family!

But, the SFChron goes to great pains to show the remorse of the shop owner, Mr. Piedra, as well as reporting how everyone just loved the drug using, girlfriend beating, pseudo "rapper", Hicks, turning a righteous case of self-protection into a giant pity party for the criminal.

The shop owner is reported as having remorse:

"I wish this never happened," Piedra said. "I don't want anybody, any business to be in this kind of situation, with anybody putting a gun in your face."

Why, exactly, would anyone imagine otherwise?

The police are seen as scolding the shop owner who was just protecting his family and property:

Piedra said his 17-year-old son, 19-month-old son and 13-year-old daughter were inside the restaurant at the time. Piedra said he was afraid that the assailants would shoot him or hurt his family, a contention supported by Oakland police who nevertheless cautioned against citizens taking direct action against criminals.

"There is definitely a balance," said Officer Roland Holmgren, department spokesman. "This thing had potential -- who knows where the suspects were going to take the situation? But by no stretch of the imagination are we agreeing with or justifying what the owner did."

Holmgren said, "We're not saying that we want citizens to go out there and arm themselves and take the law into their own hands. We want citizens to be good witnesses, to be good report-takers and to identify suspects."

And a neighbor of the shop owner is quixotically quoted in the story as being anti-gun:

Mohammed Ali, the manager of a market on the busy thoroughfare that has seen its share of robberies, had mixed feelings about business owners arming themselves. "Of course they have a right to protect themselves, but from what? If we have law enforcement, should (businesses) have guns? I don't think so. They're inviting trouble."

Again, WHY is this man's quote in the story? Ah, because the SFChron is anti-gun, that's why.

Then the SFChron goes into a long account about how everyone just loved the criminal, Hicks... sorry, "Boonie"... and how they are all going to miss him.

They even take time out to quote one of "Boonie's" friends found at a "makeshift memorial" to Hicks who is presented as a philosopher, rapper.

"He always had a smile on his face," said a 22-year-old man who identified himself as a rapper named Little Al. "He was a solid dude, loyal."

He didn't express any anger at the pizzeria owner for shooting his friend. "Life happens," he said. "I'm not upset, you feel me? You wouldn't want it to happen, but it happened. Ain't no telling why that shooting occurred."

Well, isn't that nice?

Even the girlfriend Hicks beat up is quoted as saying "despite the alleged abuse, Hicks was a 'good person.'"

This story was such an absurd warping of the proper message, that a crime was stopped and a family had their lives and property saved in accordance with the Constitution and all that is right. But, the SFChron used the story, instead, to moralize on how bad guns are and mourn the death of a criminal.

http://newsbusters.org/node/12211

 

[myth]

Gee Roomy...bitter much? Here in America, everyone has the right to voice their own opinion...so sorry that's not true in your own country...though, you do have the whole "oh, woe is me" thing down pat. I don't know if gun control is the answer, but I don't think so...honest, legal gun owners only purchase guns for their own self protection in their homes, and the protection of their family. Don't hate me because I don't suscribe to the whole liberal "let's totally outlaw guns" thingy...then, who would own all of the guns?...oh yeah, the criminals would...get a grip...don't hate me because my opinon happens to be different from yours...Cho purchased the guns (actually over the web, and then picked them up in a pawn shop near campus)...he was a sick dude...i think we can all agree on that...and hindsight is always 20/20...my heart totally goes out to the surviving students who were there, and to the families of the victims (these were innocent students just going to class...like any other normal Monday)...please stop the name calling (i haven't done that to you)...and just accept that some's opinions are going to be different to your own....yet, no less valid. can we call a truce and just agree to disagree on this subject???