Replacing diesel locomotives on short haul runs

[Old Rocks]

Interesting idea. Double battery energy density and double range.

Former SpaceX engineers to turn freight trains into autonomous EVs

Three former SpaceX engineers have launched a startup to replace traditional freight trains with autonomous, battery-powered railcars.

www.freethink.com

 

[toobfreak]

Interesting idea. Double battery energy density and double range.

Former SpaceX engineers to turn freight trains into autonomous EVs

Three former SpaceX engineers have launched a startup to replace traditional freight trains with autonomous, battery-powered railcars.

www.freethink.com

What a dumb idea. For one thing, diesel engines only produce electricity to power the electric motors and diesel hydrocarbons are simpler and break down more easily than gasoline anyway. Where does the electricity come from to power these EV trains? Unless they can generate it more cheaply and environmentally friendly than generating it directly right at the train as they do now, just another plan that looks good on paper, satisfies folks like you, but accomplishes nothing but another pie in the sky as if electricity came free from the stars.

 

[ding]

What a dumb idea. For one thing, diesel engines only produce electricity to power the electric motors and diesel hydrocarbons are simpler and break down more easily than gasoline anyway. Where does the electricity come from to power these EV trains? Unless they can generate it more cheaply and environmentally friendly than generating it directly right at the train as they do now, just another plan that looks good on paper, satisfies folks like you, but accomplishes nothing but another pie in the sky as if electricity came free from the stars.

All excellent points. It seems the OP is so enamored with EV's that he wants to forcve square pegs into round holes. Battery powered technology has a role to play. Trains isn't one of them.

 

[toobfreak]

All excellent points. It seems the OP is so enamored with EV's that he wants to forcve square pegs into round holes. Battery powered technology has a role to play. Trains isn't one of them.

Well, maybe is can or can't, all I'm saying is that all these battery-powered EV things the OP gets a stiffy over all need CHARGED. They don't GENERATE their own power, something else does, then it must be stored and/or transmitted to the EV, then charged up itself. That is a WHOLE LOT of extra steps already putting EV technology at a decided COST disadvantage!

Then the entire idea of battery EV technology is predicated on how GREEN it is, but that ENTIRELY depends on how the power was itself originally created! If the generation process pollutes and if the manufacturing process of making all these batteries, et al. pollutes, then the EV vehicle is no greener than the SUM all all of the pollution it took to get it to that point.

That doesn't even consider whether with all this added complexity to the chain whether the final total operating cost of the EV vehicle is even remotely as cheap to operate as a regular train or car. If it is even 10% more costly to operate in toto, then that is a 10% rise in cost to all the services it provides.

A 10% increase in getting stuff to the stores would alone be an economic disaster as that would have to be recovered in dramatic product and food cost increases! But it could well be much more than 10% more expensive.

Much like the side effects of Covid vaxes and shutdowns, if going "green" with immature EV technology wrecks the economy and people's lives with unaffordable increases in basic goods and services, it becomes a brobdingnagian solution essentially throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

 

[Captain Caveman]

Well, maybe is can or can't, all I'm saying is that all these battery-powered EV things the OP gets a stiffy over all need CHARGED. They don't GENERATE their own power, something else does, then it must be stored and/or transmitted to the EV, then charged up itself. That is a WHOLE LOT of extra steps already putting EV technology at a decided COST disadvantage!

Then the entire idea of battery EV technology is predicated on how GREEN it is, but that ENTIRELY depends on how the power was itself originally created! If the generation process pollutes and if the manufacturing process of making all these batteries, et al. pollutes, then the EV vehicle is no greener than the SUM all all of the pollution it took to get it to that point.

That doesn't even consider whether with all this added complexity to the chain whether the final total operating cost of the EV vehicle is even remotely as cheap to operate as a regular train or car. If it is even 10% more costly to operate in toto, then that is a 10% rise in cost to all the services it provides.

A 10% increase in getting stuff to the stores would alone be an economic disaster as that would have to be recovered in dramatic product and food cost increases! But it could well be much more than 10% more expensive.

Much like the side effects of Covid vaxes and shutdowns, if going "green" with immature EV technology wrecks the economy and people's lives with unaffordable increases in basic goods and services, it becomes a brobdingnagian solution essentially throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

In the UK, electric trains have overhead wires, all the rest are diesel. Batteries in trains is a dumb idea.

An EV car, according to the official EU study, will reduce your co2 emissions by 17% to 30% compared to a comparative ICE car. It has to be a fuel source, batteries are hopeless.

 

[toobfreak]

In the UK, electric trains have overhead wires, all the rest are diesel. Batteries in trains is a dumb idea.

As I have said, I am all for electric motors, but IMO, the real way of making EV technology practical and effective would be to power the vehicles with a DIRECT ELECTRICAL CONNECTION as they travel, much like an electric trolley car, an overhead tether, a ground connection like a subway, etc., that eliminates carrying a massive battery half the weight of the car.

Then the EV could have just a SMALL battery to temporarily power it places where the tether doesn't reach like into your garage or a parking station.

But I know that isn't what EV lovers want to hear.

 

[Wyatt earp]

They are already electric you dumb ass

 

[Wyatt earp]

 

[toobfreak]

In the UK, electric trains have overhead wires, all the rest are diesel. Batteries in trains is a dumb idea.

As an addendum, since a ground tether seems more practical than an overhead one as vehicle heights vary greatly on most streets, being tethered to a ground connection solves a number of other problems-- -- --

In theory, that would also allow cars and such, tethered to a voltage point or some magnetic coupling, to also be registered and counted in computerized traffic management systems regulating the flow of traffic.

Done right, the central traffic computer would know where every car is coming from and going, thereby not only able to direct traffic all but eliminating the need for stop signs and red lights or traffic jams, but also in steering the cars! So now you have true intelligent self-driving cars all electrically driven with better traffic management, but this is a very complex issue needing a great deal of thought, consideration and study, and not some pell mell political solution.

 

[skookerasbil]

CP Rail just purchased a handful of electric diesel locomotives...nine I think. Very expensive and in Canada, it's funded with taxpayer $$.....ghey.

In the US, we won't be seeing this because the RR's use a huge amount of discretion in terms of costs. GE and EMD make almost all of the diesel locomotives for US railroads.
We might see a couple of dozen surface here and there but RR's are not within state businesses....they are interstate. So the economics won't work for the railroads.

 

[skookerasbil]

Btw....the typical cost of a conventional 4,500hp diesel electric locomotive is between 1.5 - 2 million US dollars. The full electric locomotives are 3 million dollars.

Costs never matter to progressives. They do matter to the railroads who buy the engines

CN to buy 200 locomotives from GE as freight volumes surge