The "Art of the Deal".... Ukraine... when they give Putin everything he wants before they've even started

[TimFitz]

Yeah, Joe was just so tough on China, denying them... denying them... NOTHING.

That must be why China was giving the Biden family rubies, millions of dollars, etc.

Memos show Biden associates, not kin, got most foreign cash

Announcing an impeachment inquiry into President Joe Biden on Sept. 12, House Speaker Kevin McCarthy said a Republican-l

www.politifact.com

Nine Biden family members who allegedly got foreign money identified by House GOP

House Oversight Committee Chairman James Comer identified nine members of President Biden’s family who allegedly received foreign income after teasing the bombshell for weeks.

nypost.com

MSN

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The guy who sold Comer and Co all these lies pleaded guilty, and is in jail.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Discordant Trump team statements on Ukraine leave allies anxious

A cacophony from senior members of the US administration has sown confusion and alarm in Europe.

www.bbc.com

"

Discordant Ukraine statements from Trump team leave allies anxious"​

"
But despite the mid-air scare the news was already firmly elsewhere. In Europe, US Defence Secretary Pete Hegseth had stunned America's allies with a speech setting out what many saw as a series of concessions Ukraine would have to make to sign any peace deal with Russia brokered by President Trump.

Hegseth said it was "unrealistic" to think Ukraine could win back its sovereign territory occupied by Russia, as was its demand for Nato membership, adding it was up to European and not US troops to keep the peace."

Yep, they've come out and said "you know, the Ukraine is fucked" and this before they've started negotiating. It's like the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact where Poland was represented by nobody, and the big two countries had already decided what they wanted to do with Poland in the first place.

How can you make a deal, when you've already told one side of the deal "we'll give you all you want"????

This isn't the "Art of the Deal", this is the "Art of the Steal".

It's called lowering expectations, and it is much needed when we have people with no skin in the game making pronouncements like "The only way out is for Russia to leave Ukraine completely."

Russia is currently occupying 20% of Ukraine. Therefore acknowledging that the border must be redrawn to achieve peace isn't "giving" Russia anything.

But, heck! Maybe Ukraine really can win back all of its territory and also secure its border so strongly that there will never be another Ruskie invation.

If you have a plan for them to do that, I'm all ears. If Zelensky has such a plan, this might be a good time to activate it.

Just out of curiosity, do you think Ukraine should join NATO before or after Russia leaves its territory?

 

[Dekster]

Giving away another country’s territory without even bothering to talk to them…..”schtick”?

More like weakness, cowardice and betrayal.

The Russians are delighted. you proud of that?

Either way, Zelenskyy can negotiate with Russia in good faith or he can suffer the consequences. It is not the US decision, it is his. The US decision is how long are we going to keep pouring money by the billions into the inevitable Russian win.

 

[dudmuck]

Trump is playing 4D chess. He's got Putin right where he wants him.

 

[Seymour Flops]

You all realize that Trump does not own Ukraine, anymore than Biden did?

Ukraine has no obligation to accept any peace deal. If it doesn't like what Trump negotiates, it can fight on as long as it likes.

Of course when I say "Ukraine," I mean the unelected dictator Zelensky, not the country as a whole. Still . . .

 

[TimFitz]

You know that Hegseth is not the President, right?

He’s a stooge. When his lips move, Trump is speaking (until Trump decides he doesn’t want him around anymore).

 

[TimFitz]

You all realize that Trump does not own Ukraine, anymore than Biden did?

Ukraine has no obligation to accept any peace deal. If it doesn't like what Trump negotiates, it can fight on as long as it likes.

Of course when I say "Ukraine," I mean the unelected dictator Zelensky, not the country as a whole. Still . . .

“You all realize that Trump does not own Ukraine, anymore than Biden did?”

try telling that to your beloved fuhrer.

 

[TimFitz]

You all realize that Trump does not own Ukraine, anymore than Biden did?

Ukraine has no obligation to accept any peace deal. If it doesn't like what Trump negotiates, it can fight on as long as it likes.

Of course when I say "Ukraine," I mean the unelected dictator Zelensky, not the country as a whole. Still . . .

Zelinsky was elected.

 

[Contumacious]

Giving away another country’s territory without even bothering to talk to them…..”schtick”?

The teritory East of the Dipro River has NEVER been Ukranian Territory

Kruschev gave ADMINISTRATIVE CONTROL to Ukraine in 1956 .

Furthermore , during the Soviet Era Donbas was composed of the Independent Republics : Crimea , Donetsk and Luhansk.

 

[Seymour Flops]

“You all realize that Trump does not own Ukraine, anymore than Biden did?”

try telling that to your beloved fuhrer.

Ooooooh!

Good one!

 

[Seymour Flops]

Zelinsky was elected.

His term expired, but he stayed in office anyway, refusing to allow elections. Always a good idea to read more than you write. I recommend at least a three to one ratio.

Just sayin . . .

 

[frigidweirdo]

The teritory East of the Dipro River has NEVER been Ukranian Territory

Kruschev gave ADMINISTRATIVE CONTROL to Ukraine in 1956 .

Furthermore , during the Soviet Era Donbas was composed of the Independent Republics : Crimea , Donetsk and Luhansk.

Doesn't matter. There are ways of dealing with this, and it's not b y invading.

 

[Mac1958]

This isn't the "Art of the Deal", this is the "Art of the Steal".

Incredible to watch. I've never seen this degree of capitulation before negotiations even begin. America is joining the dark side.

I'd love to see Zelensky bring two or three European countries with him to negotiations. The lines have really been drawn now.

 

[Zavulon]

Incredible to watch. I've never seen this degree of capitulation before negotiations even begin. America is joining the dark side.

I'd love to see Zelensky bring two or three European countries with him to negotiations. The lines have really been drawn now.

And what if those European countries decided to challenge American leadership in the West, spoil American peace plan and start an actual (nuclear) war with Russia?

Should the USA occupy the UK?

Let's play the game. Just a pure intellectual exercise, nothing real about it. Let's imagine, that Russia and the USA has achieved mutually acceptable solution over situation in Europe. But this solution isn't really acceptable for Kievan regime and ruling regime of the UK. American president...

www.usmessageboard.com

 

[Mac1958]

And what if those European countries decided to challenge American leadership in the West, spoil American peace plan and start an actual (nuclear) war with Russia?

Then we'll wish Trump hadn't killed our relationships with them.

Too late now. He's convinced them to detach from us.

 

[frigidweirdo]

And what if those European countries decided to challenge American leadership in the West, spoil American peace plan and start an actual (nuclear) war with Russia?

Should the USA occupy the UK?

Let's play the game. Just a pure intellectual exercise, nothing real about it. Let's imagine, that Russia and the USA has achieved mutually acceptable solution over situation in Europe. But this solution isn't really acceptable for Kievan regime and ruling regime of the UK. American president...

www.usmessageboard.com

How many times has Putin threatened a nuclear war? I think it's more than 50 times since 2022.

He's not going to do it. China would shun him, Russia would suffer way more than other countries. It's not worth it for Putin, it's just his play book.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Discordant Trump team statements on Ukraine leave allies anxious

A cacophony from senior members of the US administration has sown confusion and alarm in Europe.

www.bbc.com

"

Discordant Ukraine statements from Trump team leave allies anxious"​

"
But despite the mid-air scare the news was already firmly elsewhere. In Europe, US Defence Secretary Pete Hegseth had stunned America's allies with a speech setting out what many saw as a series of concessions Ukraine would have to make to sign any peace deal with Russia brokered by President Trump.

Hegseth said it was "unrealistic" to think Ukraine could win back its sovereign territory occupied by Russia, as was its demand for Nato membership, adding it was up to European and not US troops to keep the peace."

Yep, they've come out and said "you know, the Ukraine is fucked" and this before they've started negotiating. It's like the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact where Poland was represented by nobody, and the big two countries had already decided what they wanted to do with Poland in the first place.

How can you make a deal, when you've already told one side of the deal "we'll give you all you want"????

This isn't the "Art of the Deal", this is the "Art of the Steal".

This is the Art of Letting Bankers run the war for you.

1. It should NEVER have started in the first place
2. The Bankers bought Ukraine's $12T in resources for pennies on the dollar and were going after Russia $80+T
3. Should have made peace in April 2022!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[LordBrownTrout]

So you couldn't give a fuck about the Ukrainians, just think only of the money?

No, that money should have NEVER gone to ukraine but thats what happens when you have dumbness like corn pop and kamala dumb.

 

[Zavulon]

Then we'll wish Trump hadn't killed our relationships with them.

I thought healthy relationships should be mutually profitable. Like "We defend you - you pay us". Your current relationships seems really toxic. Some even call them "strategic parasitism".

Too late now. He's convinced them to detach from us.

As if he is wrong. They should be more interested in alliance with the USA, and, for this, they should do what the USA said them to do.

 

[frigidweirdo]

No, that money should have NEVER gone to ukraine but thats what happens when you have dumbness like corn pop and kamala dumb.

And why not? Should US allies not be protected?