Why do the U.S. support Ukraine which has Nazi laws?

[g5000]

Wrong.
This is common knowledge that Gorbachev gave the Ukraine independence in 1991, but under certain conditions.

Betrayal Of Gorbachev Regarding NATO Explained In Detail

Clinton's betrayal of Gorbachov is the root cause of the current impasse. He promised not to expand NATO up to Russia's border.

progressivehub.net

{...

Top leaders of the “Free World” all agreed that the United States would never enlarge NATO to reassure Gorbachev that the new Russia had nothing to fear from NATO.​

By Sharon Tennison, Center for Citizen Initiatives
At last … 30 years plus, the truth comes out. There are numerous accounts by the top leaders of the Free World that they all agreed that the United States would never enlarge NATO to reassure Mikhail Gorbachev that the new Russia had no worry from NATO, definitely there would be no enlargement beyond the borders of the reunited Germany.
Below note how many of the VIP’s assured Gorbachev that he need have no fear … they were adamant that NATO would never move closer to the struggling-to-survive new Russia in the 1990s.
These facts below have been ignored, blurred and buried as Bill Clinton mercilessly began admitting one piece of the former USSR into NATO. Today NATO surrounds Russia with the latest NATO missiles and troops aimed at Russia.
This is what Putin’s defiant resistance and threat to NATO in Ukraine is all about. He demands to have assurances that NATO will back off … or else. Russia is now strong enough militarily to make such demands. All of us could be caught in the crossfires if this situation isn’t resolved.
...}

Did NATO Promise Not to Enlarge? Gorbachev Says "No" | Brookings

Russian President Vladimir Putin has made it well known his antipathy towards NATO, claiming the Alliance took advantage of Russian weakness after the collapse of the Soviet Union in violation of promises allegedly made to Moscow by Western leaders. Steven Pifer argues that no such promises were...

www.brookings.edu

What the Germans, Americans, British and French did agree to in 1990 was that there would be no deployment of non-German NATO forces on the territory of the former GDR. I was a deputy director on the State Department’s Soviet desk at the time, and that was certainly the point of Secretary James Baker’s discussions with Gorbachev and his foreign minister, Eduard Shevardnadze. In 1990, few gave the possibility of a broader NATO enlargement to the east any serious thought.

The agreement on not deploying foreign troops on the territory of the former GDR was incorporated in Article 5 of the Treaty on the Final Settlement with Respect to Germany, which was signed on September 12, 1990 by the foreign ministers of the two Germanys, the United States, Soviet Union, Britain and France. Article 5 had three provisions:

1. Until Soviet forces had completed their withdrawal from the former GDR, only German territorial defense units not integrated into NATO would be deployed in that territory.
2. There would be no increase in the numbers of troops or equipment of U.S., British and French forces stationed in Berlin.
3. Once Soviet forces had withdrawn, German forces assigned to NATO could be deployed in the former GDR, but foreign forces and nuclear weapons systems would not be deployed there.

When one reads the full text of the Woerner speech cited by Putin, it is clear that the secretary general’s comments referred to NATO forces in eastern Germany, not a broader commitment not to enlarge the Alliance.



Here is the Woerner speech: NATO Speech: The Atlantic Alliance and European Security

 

[Rigby5]

Stalin was a communists who also rob banks and no a bank robber is a thief he is not about making money.

His political beliefs were communsim to the core and described by Marx who did in fact create the ideology.

Communism is never about cooperation or communal sharing it is enbout enslavement and tyranny.

Those communal organizations were not communist.

Robbing banks is willing to murder others for profit.
That is absolute capitalist.

Marx was over 70 year earlier, but was an absolute egalitarian and believe in democracy.
Everything written by Marx or Engles is against enslavement and tyranny, which are entirely capitalist.

 

[koshergrl]

Robbing banks is willing to murder others for profit.
That is absolute capitalist.

Marx was over 70 year earlier, but was an absolute egalitarian and believe in democracy.
Everything written by Marx or Engles is against enslavement and tyranny, which are entirely capitalist.

Uh, no, robbing banks and murdering for profit is not "capitalist". You sound just like the fanatic commies who called anybody who isn't a commie willing to butcher the kids next door a "counter-revoluntionary". The Nazis had code words they used to marginalize anybody who objected to their human rights violations as well.

 

[g5000]

Everything Zelensky did was in direct violation of the 1992 treaties between Russia and the Ukraine.

There was no 1992 treaty between Russia and Ukraine.

The PLEDGE you just referred to was in 1990, and it only pledged not to put non-German NATO forces in East Germany, which no longer exists.

All caught up now on history, comrade?

 

[Rigby5]

Well, now Putin is going to have NATO all up his ass. Ukraine, Sweden, and Finland.

KGB Putin thought the West was all cucks like you and Trump.

Putin had absolutely no choice, and if it comes to nukes, he will have to use them if we do not back down.
What we are doing not only is illegal and criminal, but completely intolerable.
In fact, NATO itself is not at all based on the rule of law, blind justice, or any decent principle, and is always totally corrupt.
Like NATO countries participating in the illegal invasion of Iraq, the illegal murder of Qaddafi, etc.

 

[Rigby5]

Did NATO Promise Not to Enlarge? Gorbachev Says "No" | Brookings

Russian President Vladimir Putin has made it well known his antipathy towards NATO, claiming the Alliance took advantage of Russian weakness after the collapse of the Soviet Union in violation of promises allegedly made to Moscow by Western leaders. Steven Pifer argues that no such promises were...

www.brookings.edu

What the Germans, Americans, British and French did agree to in 1990 was that there would be no deployment of non-German NATO forces on the territory of the former GDR. I was a deputy director on the State Department’s Soviet desk at the time, and that was certainly the point of Secretary James Baker’s discussions with Gorbachev and his foreign minister, Eduard Shevardnadze. In 1990, few gave the possibility of a broader NATO enlargement to the east any serious thought.

The agreement on not deploying foreign troops on the territory of the former GDR was incorporated in Article 5 of the Treaty on the Final Settlement with Respect to Germany, which was signed on September 12, 1990 by the foreign ministers of the two Germanys, the United States, Soviet Union, Britain and France. Article 5 had three provisions:

1. Until Soviet forces had completed their withdrawal from the former GDR, only German territorial defense units not integrated into NATO would be deployed in that territory.
2. There would be no increase in the numbers of troops or equipment of U.S., British and French forces stationed in Berlin.
3. Once Soviet forces had withdrawn, German forces assigned to NATO could be deployed in the former GDR, but foreign forces and nuclear weapons systems would not be deployed there.

When one reads the full text of the Woerner speech cited by Putin, it is clear that the secretary general’s comments referred to NATO forces in eastern Germany, not a broader commitment not to enlarge the Alliance.



Here is the Woerner speech: NATO Speech: The Atlantic Alliance and European Security

Who cares what the Germans, Americans, British and French agreed to in 1990. The Ukrainians agreed in 1991 to NEVER try to join any alliance hostile to Russia.

 

[Rigby5]

Uh, no, robbing banks and murdering for profit is not "capitalist". You sound just like the fanatic commies who called anybody who isn't a commie willing to butcher the kids next door a "counter-revoluntionary". The Nazis had code words they used to marginalize anybody who objected to their human rights violations as well.

Communism by definition has to be democratic, egalitarian, and employ the rule of law for justice.
Only capitalism throws that all out in favor of profits by any means.
So robbing banks is exactly capitalist.
The Nazis were also totally capitalist.
The closest to a point would have been if you have also pointed out Stalin was capitalist.

 

[g5000]

Putin had absolutely no choice, and if it comes to nukes, he will have to use them if we do not back down.

You sound just like the lefty crybabies in the 80s who said Reagan was going to get us all nuked, especially if he put MX missiles in Europe.

KGB Putin is a paper tiger and you are a spineless appeaser.

 

[g5000]

Who cares what the Germans, Americans, British and French agreed to in 1990. The Ukrainians agreed in 1991 to NEVER try to join any alliance hostile to Russia.

Link?

 

[Rigby5]

There was no 1992 treaty between Russia and Ukraine.

The PLEDGE you just referred to was in 1990, and it only pledged not to put non-German NATO forces in East Germany, which no longer exists.

All caught up now on history, comrade?

Totally wrong.
Gorbachev gave the Ukraine independence through negotiations.
Before that, the Ukraine was not independent.
If the Ukraine declared independence on their own, then why did they give Russia back its nuclear weapons?

 

[Rigby5]

You sound just like the lefty crybabies in the 80s who said Reagan was going to get us all nuked, especially if he put MX missiles in Europe.

KGB Putin is a paper tiger and you are a spineless appeaser.

Kyiv is criminal, stealing oil, murdering ethnic Russians, and trying to put NATO nukes on Russia's border.

 

[Oddball]

Total misunderstanding of what actually happened.
The original National Socialists by Roehm was socialist.
But they could never get any traction due to the communists and real socialists being much larger numbers.
The original National Socialists were really more of a veteran's group.
But when Hitler got his big break in 1933, it was by totally giving up on the group started by Roehm.
So Hitler sold out to Hindenburg and the wealthy elite.
He disavowed socialism completely, and adopted pure Laisses faire capitalism.
Hitler was a capitalist and not a socialist.

Similarly, Stalin was a capitalist and not at all a communist.
Communism can never be centralized, and always has to be egalitarian.
Stalin created a wealthy elite, and was totally profit motivated.
That is pure capitalism.
All dictators in history are profit motivated, so then capitalist.

 

[Rigby5]

The invasion was legal and Baghdad Bobn was an idiot.

Your history is revisionist crap

How was the invasion of the sovereign and innocent country of Iraq, legal?
It is only legal to invade when another nation is violating laws and rights of the US.
Iraq in no way violated any laws or rights related to the US.

 

[g5000]

Totally wrong.
Gorbachev gave the Ukraine independence through negotiations.
Before that, the Ukraine was not independent.
If the Ukraine declared independence on their own, then why did they give Russia back its nuclear weapons?

Still waiting on that link to the 1991 treaty between Ukraine and Russia.

 

[Rigby5]

BWA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA!

Clearly a post made by someone who has never read Mein Kampf.

The book "Mein Kampf" was written back when Hitler was still an idealist, unsure of himself, in 1925.
It was in 1933 Hitler was appointed Chancellor by the wealthy elite, after he had Roehm executed.

 

[Rigby5]

Still waiting on that link to the 1991 treaty between Ukraine and Russia.

Do you think all negotiation are public or something?
Russia could have prevented the Ukraine from becoming independent.

 

[g5000]

The book "Mein Kampf" was written back when Hitler was still an idealist, unsure of himself, in 1925.
It was in 1933 Hitler was appointed Chancellor by the wealthy elite, after he had Roehm executed.

Still waiting on that link to the 1991 treaty between Ukraine and Russia.

 

[Ralph Norton]

Communism by definition has to be democratic, egalitarian, and employ the rule of law for justice.
Only capitalism throws that all out in favor of profits by any means.
So robbing banks is exactly capitalist.
The Nazis were also totally capitalist.
The closest to a point would have been if you have also pointed out Stalin was capitalist.

"Communism by definition has to be democratic, egalitarian, and employ the rule of law for justice."
You can't be that delusional?
You just can't be.
Comrade?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Well, now Putin is going to have NATO all up his ass. Ukraine, Sweden, and Finland.

KGB Putin thought the West was all cucks like you and Trump.

Trump?

Guno, you're a TDS addled fool - even when you're on the right side of the issue, you can't help vomiting out your Nazi hate and looking like a retard.

Remember Retards, every single time Putin has invaded Ukraine, Quid Pro Biden was in the White House.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Robbing banks is willing to murder others for profit.
That is absolute capitalist.

Marx was over 70 year earlier, but was an absolute egalitarian and believe in democracy.
Everything written by Marx or Engles is against enslavement and tyranny, which are entirely capitalist.

Serious question, are you on drugs?