5 Reasons Why Modern Wing-Nuts Would've Hated The Founding Fathers

[Divine Wind]

I found this article while looking around the Internet researching the Founding Fathers. Fair warning; it leans Left. However, it has several very interesting viewpoints of which I agree. In general, while it does lean left (just like the Founders!) it's mostly anti-authoritarian. There's no doubt in my mind modern US liberals are very authoritarian. "Nanny Staters" is a correct label for them. Modern conservatives are a mix; they are authoritarian on some issues, but individualist and anti-federalist on others. Of the two sides, I lean right, but am not partisan right because they can be as authoritarian as LWers on different issues.

That said, the article is factually correct and an interesting read:
5 Reasons Why Modern Wing-Nuts Would've Hated The Founding Fathers
If you’re a Democrat (or, for that matter, a progressive of any stripe) the chances are you’ve heard conservatives evoke the founding fathers when dismissing your beliefs on economic issues. The term “socialist” has become such a toxic epithet in our political culture that the two chief candidates for the Democratic presidential nomination have spent considerable time confronting the term – with Hillary Clinton correctly pointing out that it doesn’t apply to her center-left views, even as Bernie Sanders valiantly strives to remove its stigma by self-identifying as a “democratic socialist.”

In light of all this, one might be forgiven for assuming that America’s founders were unilaterally right-wing in their economic ideology. After all, if this wasn’t the case, liberals could easily debunk attempts to delegitimize them by simply citing the incontrovertible facts of American history......

 

[occupied]

Every conservative ideal was at one time a radical new concept that faced resistance from conservatives.

 

[Seawytch]

Progressive ideas are mainstream...just before their time.

 

[paulitician]

Booting the Brits was as 'Anti-Authoritarian' as it gets. Our Founding Fathers certainly weren't perfect, but they did create the greatest nation in history. They truly believed in, and risked their lives fighting for individual freedom & liberty. They would be very sad and disappointed seeing how much today's American political leaders are assaulting our Constitution.

 

[MarathonMike]

I would only add The Founding Fathers would be appalled at the high percentage of career politicians in both parties running this country and the complete lack of a free and unbiased press.

 

[Divine Wind]

Booting the Brits was as 'Anti-Authoritarian' as it gets. Our Founding Fathers certainly weren't perfect, but they did create the greatest nation in history. They truly believed in, and risked their lives fighting for individual freedom & liberty. They would be very sad and disappointed seeing how much today's American political leaders are assaulting our Constitution.

Agreed. The assault on the Constitution is from both sides, but mostly from the Left since they are the ones that actually want to rewrite it and cut out parts. The Right just wants to interpret it to their own ideals. Still wrong, just not as wrong.

 

[Divine Wind]

I would only add The Founding Fathers would be appalled at the high percentage of career politicians in both parties running this country and the complete lack of a free and unbiased press.

Agreed. We're seeing an age of "legacy" or professional politicians. Is there any doubt Chelsea will run one day? Any of the Bush kids? Oh, wait. They are. They are free to do so, but the reason why I think this is happening is because politics has become a rich man's game. Only the rich have the pull and the assets to run for office. It doesn't matter if they are left or right, the 1% are taking over control.

George P. wins Texas election, accomplishes Bush family first
George P. Bush was elected Texas land commissioner in a landslide Tuesday, winning a little-known but powerful post that could eventually lead to higher offices and becoming the first in his family's political dynasty to win his first race.

Bush, a 38-year-old Fort Worth attorney and energy consultant, raised more than $3 million against his little-known Democratic opponent, former El Paso Mayor John Cook. Nonetheless, he spent months crisscrossing the state in a campaign bus adorned with his towering, grinning face.

Bush is the grandson of former President George H.W. Bush and nephew of President George W. Bush, who was Texas governor before taking the White House. His father, Jeb, is a former Florida governor who is considering a presidential run in 2016. But none of them--nor the family patriarch and source of George P.'s middle name, long-serving Connecticut Sen. Prescott Bush--won their first races.

 

[norwegen]

Left wing-nuts hate the founders for lots of reasons. Not just five.

 

[norwegen]

Booting the Brits was as 'Anti-Authoritarian' as it gets. Our Founding Fathers certainly weren't perfect, but they did create the greatest nation in history. They truly believed in, and risked their lives fighting for individual freedom & liberty. They would be very sad and disappointed seeing how much today's American political leaders are assaulting our Constitution.

Agreed. The assault on the Constitution is from both sides, but mostly from the Left since they are the ones that actually want to rewrite it and cut out parts. The Right just wants to interpret it to their own ideals. Still wrong, just not as wrong.

The assault on the Constitution is Democratic and somewhat Republican, and entirely leftist.

 

[Divine Wind]

Agreed. The assault on the Constitution is from both sides, but mostly from the Left since they are the ones that actually want to rewrite it and cut out parts. The Right just wants to interpret it to their own ideals. Still wrong, just not as wrong.

The assault on the Constitution is Democratic and somewhat Republican, and entirely leftist.[/QUOTE]
Not entirely leftist. Just mostly leftist.

 

[Iceweasel]

Progressive ideas are mainstream...just before their time.

Shortest contradiction I've ever seen.

 

[PredFan]

5 reasons why the author is himself a wing it: (in response to his 5 points)

1. Yeah we know they disagreed, but in the end they hammered out something they could agree on and it worked very well.

2. The author uses the term "weak" which is a strawman. Conservatives don't demand a weak government, we demand a small government. HUGE difference. We don't want one too weak to function, but we want it to be as small as possible.

3. Totally irrelevant and doesn't make his case.

4. Giving free land to settlers is the same thing as "economic assistance"??? Are you fucking kidding me? They gave them land to settle but gave them no assistance other than a plot of it. The settlers had to build houses, till the soil and eke out a living ON THEIR OWN.
Also, the government did not create innovation, or transportation or any of that other shit he claims. The Free Market did that. Barons and Magnates made a killing on railroads, shipping, and new technologies. The government didn't have shit to do with it.
And his point about Jefferson taxing the rich? Well the income tax didn't exist until after he was dead. There were no income taxes at all until 1862. Maybe he opined on it but he didn't even propose it.

5. Again irrelevant and doesn't help his goofy point.

Then in the end the wingnut goes on the make conclusions based on his erroneous interpretation of history and his opinions.

 

[occupied]

Agreed. The assault on the Constitution is from both sides, but mostly from the Left since they are the ones that actually want to rewrite it and cut out parts. The Right just wants to interpret it to their own ideals. Still wrong, just not as wrong.

The assault on the Constitution is Democratic and somewhat Republican, and entirely leftist.

Not entirely leftist. Just mostly leftist.[/QUOTE]
Most assaults on the constitution are federal lawsuits brought by conservatives to set back the clock in civil rights. They have never forgiven any forward progress in this area.

 

[Al Azar]

Progressive ideas are mainstream...just before their time.

Shortest contradiction I've ever seen.

Let it sink in.

 

[Divine Wind]

Most assaults on the constitution are federal lawsuits brought by conservatives to set back the clock in civil rights. They have never forgiven any forward progress in this area.

Define "forward progress". Do you think banning soda pop and high capacity magazines is in keeping with the Constitution?

 

[norwegen]

Agreed. The assault on the Constitution is from both sides, but mostly from the Left since they are the ones that actually want to rewrite it and cut out parts. The Right just wants to interpret it to their own ideals. Still wrong, just not as wrong.

The assault on the Constitution is Democratic and somewhat Republican, and entirely leftist.

Not entirely leftist. Just mostly leftist.[/QUOTE]Entirely leftist.

The Constitution is to the left of the founding and the Articles of Confederation. Honest Antifederalists - Thomas Jefferson, Patrick Henry, George Mason, etc. - and anyone else who wishes that we preserve our revolutionary principles, would not venture to the left of the Constitution. If a Republican does so, he is not a conservative.

 

[PredFan]

Most assaults on the constitution are federal lawsuits brought by conservatives to set back the clock in civil rights. They have never forgiven any forward progress in this area.

Define "forward progress". Do you think banning soda pop and high capacity magazines is in keeping with the Constitution?

Those wingnuts view the constitution in the same erroneous way that the wingnut that wrote the article does. They cherry pick what they want out of it and ignore the general idea of freedom and liberty.

 

[Iceweasel]

Progressive ideas are mainstream...just before their time.

Shortest contradiction I've ever seen.

Let it sink in.

It sunk in the shit pile it came from, Einstein.

 

[Al Azar]

Progressive ideas are mainstream...just before their time.

Shortest contradiction I've ever seen.

Let it sink in.

It sunk in the shit pile it came from, Einstein.

Sounds like you spend your life playing catch-up.

 

[occupied]

Most assaults on the constitution are federal lawsuits brought by conservatives to set back the clock in civil rights. They have never forgiven any forward progress in this area.

Define "forward progress". Do you think banning soda pop and high capacity magazines is in keeping with the Constitution?

The founders created a mechanism for us to amend the constitution and test the constitutionality of new laws. Whether anything is constitutional is up to us and not to the opinions of people 230 years ago. Trying to imagine how the founders would have felt about current situations is a meaningless exercise. They had the wisdom to create a flexible document that could change with the times, it is supposed to make us free, not lock us in a cage constructed long ago by people who could not even imagine our world.