Adding to the debate about whether we are in a constitutional crisis.

[Darkwind]

Although you try to portray this as a "natural conclusion", your logic is deeply flawed.

First off, NO ONE can be deported without "due process". If the government has proof of their claims, then bring them to court and get a deportation order.

Trump is simply picking people up off the streets and loading them into planes and shipping them off to a prison in El Salvador without even filing charges.

Who's next to be "disappeared". Your American born neighbour who hates Trump????

Nothing flawed about My logic at all.

He is not picking up people; he is picking up criminal terrorists from other nations. They do NOT get due process because they are not citizens.

 

[ThisIsMe]

White House touts deportation of alleged gang members that court ordered returned to US​

President Donald Trump’s White House is celebrating his use of a rarely invoked wartime authority to carry out the mass deportation of hundreds of alleged gang members to El Salvador in an episode that fueled doubts about the ability of the U.S. court system to constrain the Trump administration’s actions.

After a federal judge issued an unusual order Saturday evening that required all planes carrying those covered by Trump’s Alien Enemies Act declaration to return to the U.S, at least one planeload of Venezuelan deportees continued on to San Salvador and discharged its passengers to a waiting brigade of Salvadoran soldiers, police and videographers.

Grim video posted on X by El Salvador’s president, Nayib Bukele, contained movie-like scenes set over a music soundtrack and depicted soldiers leading tattooed men off an airplane, forcing them to bend toward the ground as they were frog-marched to waiting buses and had their heads shaved by hooded prison guards.

Statements from Bukele and from Trump allies mocking the court order issued by the chief U.S. District Judge in Washington, James Boasberg, contributed to an air of fecklessness around the U.S. legal system in Trump’s second term.

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/03/16/deport-support-venezuela-el-salvador-00232379

It's not the first time trump refused to comply with a court order. It likely won't be the last as he tries to normalize ignoring the courts.

Yes, we are in a constitutional crisis...but it didn't start with trump.

 

[Seymour Flops]

It's not the first time trump refused to comply with a court order. It likely won't be the last as he tries to normalize ignoring the courts.

Okay, and?

How is that a crises?

For example, we had a crises at the border, though the Biden admin refused to admit it. It was a crises, because border towns were overwhelms with illegals in several times their population arriving in their city limits, straining all government provided services, crime was spiking in further cities as the "migrants" migrated further, to the point that even blue cities, extremely loyal to Joe Biden started screaming when their cities were overrun. That's a crises.

The president continuing his presidential duties in the face of hectoring by an obscure judge appointed to his position by the opposition party is not even close to a crises.

 

[berg80]

Okay, and?

How is that a crises?

I see your point. If a Dem prez openly defies a court order it's a constitutional crises. If trump does it's no big deal. After all, trump is infallible.

President Trump has wasted no time in his second term in declaring war on the nation’s federal judiciary, the country’s legal profession and the rule of law. He has provoked a constitutional crisis with his stunning frontal assault on the third branch of government and the American system of justice. The casualty could well be the constitutional democracy Americans fought for in the Revolutionary War against the British monarchy 250 years ago.

Mr. Trump has yearned for this war against the federal judiciary and the rule of law since his first term in office. He promised to exact retribution against America’s justice system for what he has long mistakenly believed is the federal government’s partisan “weaponization” against him.

It’s no secret that he reserves special fury for the justice system because it oversaw his entirely legitimate prosecution for what the government charged were the crimes of attempting to overturn the 2020 presidential election and purloining classified documents from the White House, secreting them at Mar-a-Lago and obstructing the government’s efforts to reclaim them. He escaped the prosecutions by winning a second term, stopping them in their tracks.

Opinion | Trump Won’t Win a War Against the Courts

The judiciary will never surrender to the president its constitutional role to interpret the Constitution.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Nostra]

I see your point. If a Dem prez openly defies a court order it's a constitutional crises. If trump does it's no big deal. After all, trump is infallible.

President Trump has wasted no time in his second term in declaring war on the nation’s federal judiciary, the country’s legal profession and the rule of law. He has provoked a constitutional crisis with his stunning frontal assault on the third branch of government and the American system of justice. The casualty could well be the constitutional democracy Americans fought for in the Revolutionary War against the British monarchy 250 years ago.

Mr. Trump has yearned for this war against the federal judiciary and the rule of law since his first term in office. He promised to exact retribution against America’s justice system for what he has long mistakenly believed is the federal government’s partisan “weaponization” against him.

It’s no secret that he reserves special fury for the justice system because it oversaw his entirely legitimate prosecution for what the government charged were the crimes of attempting to overturn the 2020 presidential election and purloining classified documents from the White House, secreting them at Mar-a-Lago and obstructing the government’s efforts to reclaim them. He escaped the prosecutions by winning a second term, stopping them in their tracks.

Opinion | Trump Won’t Win a War Against the Courts

The judiciary will never surrender to the president its constitutional role to interpret the Constitution.

www.nytimes.com

Trump complied with the court orders, Dumbass.

Stop letting that Madcow dude on MSDNC tell you what to think.

 

[Seymour Flops]

I see your point. If a Dem prez openly defies a court order it's a constitutional crises. If trump does it's no deal deal. After all, trump is infallible.

I remember Republicans and conservative news outlets mocking Biden for openly defying the courts on student loan, but i don't remember them saying it was a "constitutional crises." If they had, I would have said that that was overwrought, emotional language, with no basis in fact. Same as I say now about Dems.

President Trump has wasted no time in his second term in declaring war on the nation’s federal judiciary, the country’s legal profession and the rule of law. He has provoked a constitutional crisis with his stunning frontal assault on the third branch of government and the American system of justice. The casualty could well be the constitutional democracy Americans fought for in the Revolutionary War against the British monarchy 250 years ago.

Mr. Trump has yearned for this war against the federal judiciary and the rule of law since his first term in office. He promised to exact retribution against America’s justice system for what he has long mistakenly believed is the federal government’s partisan “weaponization” against him.

It’s no secret that he reserves special fury for the justice system because it oversaw his entirely legitimate prosecution for what the government charged were the crimes of attempting to overturn the 2020 presidential election and purloining classified documents from the White House, secreting them at Mar-a-Lago and obstructing the government’s efforts to reclaim them. He escaped the prosecutions by winning a second term, stopping them in their tracks.

Opinion | Trump Won’t Win a War Against the Courts

The judiciary will never surrender to the president its constitutional role to interpret the Constitution.

www.nytimes.com

Thanks for making my point. TDS is not a "constitutional crises." It's just a mental illness that seems to be very persistent.

 

[berg80]

‘This Is Worse’: Trump’s Judicial Defiance Veers Beyond the Autocrat Playbook​

President Trump’s intensifying conflict with the federal courts is unusually aggressive compared with similar disputes in other countries, according to scholars. Unlike leaders who subverted or restructured the courts, Mr. Trump is acting as if judges were already too weak to constrain his power.

“Honest to god, I’ve never seen anything like it,” said Steven Levitsky, a Harvard political scientist and coauthor of “How Democracies Die” and “Competitive Authoritarianism.”

“We look at these comparative cases in the 21st century, like Hungary and Poland and Turkey. And in a lot of respects, this is worse,” he said. “These first two months have been much more aggressively authoritarian than almost any other comparable case I know of democratic backsliding.”

There are many examples of autocratic leaders constraining the power of the judiciary by packing courts with compliant judges, or by changing the laws that give them authority, he said. But it is extremely rare for leaders to simply claim the power to disregard or override court orders directly, especially so immediately after taking office.
‘This Is Worse’: Trump’s Judicial Defiance Veers Beyond the Autocrat Playbook

It's apparent trump actually believes his re-election was a coronation. That receiving a plurality of votes means the people have given him more than a legislative mandate (he doesn't have one), he has absolute power that can't be challenged. Explaining why he wants to push every case up to the warm embrace of the radical Right SC he created. Though I believe his ultimate goal of amassing autocratic control over the country will be thwarted, he's already been given more power (immunity) than the Constitution allows.

 

[Nostra]

‘This Is Worse’: Trump’s Judicial Defiance Veers Beyond the Autocrat Playbook​

President Trump’s intensifying conflict with the federal courts is unusually aggressive compared with similar disputes in other countries, according to scholars. Unlike leaders who subverted or restructured the courts, Mr. Trump is acting as if judges were already too weak to constrain his power.

“Honest to god, I’ve never seen anything like it,” said Steven Levitsky, a Harvard political scientist and coauthor of “How Democracies Die” and “Competitive Authoritarianism.”

“We look at these comparative cases in the 21st century, like Hungary and Poland and Turkey. And in a lot of respects, this is worse,” he said. “These first two months have been much more aggressively authoritarian than almost any other comparable case I know of democratic backsliding.”

There are many examples of autocratic leaders constraining the power of the judiciary by packing courts with compliant judges, or by changing the laws that give them authority, he said. But it is extremely rare for leaders to simply claim the power to disregard or override court orders directly, especially so immediately after taking office.
‘This Is Worse’: Trump’s Judicial Defiance Veers Beyond the Autocrat Playbook

It's apparent trump actually believes his re-election was a coronation. That receiving a plurality of votes means the people have given him more than a legislative mandate (he doesn't have one), he has absolute power that can't be challenged. Explaining why he wants to push every case up to the warm embrace of the radical Right SC he created. Though I believe his ultimate goal of amassing autocratic control over the country will be thwarted, he's already been given more power (immunity) than the Constitution allows.

Trump created the Supreme Court?

Link?

 

[Seymour Flops]

‘This Is Worse’: Trump’s Judicial Defiance Veers Beyond the Autocrat Playbook​

President Trump’s intensifying conflict with the federal courts is unusually aggressive compared with similar disputes in other countries, according to scholars. Unlike leaders who subverted or restructured the courts, Mr. Trump is acting as if judges were already too weak to constrain his power.

“Honest to god, I’ve never seen anything like it,” said Steven Levitsky, a Harvard political scientist and coauthor of “How Democracies Die” and “Competitive Authoritarianism.”

“We look at these comparative cases in the 21st century, like Hungary and Poland and Turkey. And in a lot of respects, this is worse,” he said. “These first two months have been much more aggressively authoritarian than almost any other comparable case I know of democratic backsliding.”

There are many examples of autocratic leaders constraining the power of the judiciary by packing courts with compliant judges, or by changing the laws that give them authority, he said. But it is extremely rare for leaders to simply claim the power to disregard or override court orders directly, especially so immediately after taking office.
‘This Is Worse’: Trump’s Judicial Defiance Veers Beyond the Autocrat Playbook

It's apparent trump actually believes his re-election was a coronation. That receiving a plurality of votes means the people have given him more than a legislative mandate (he doesn't have one), he has absolute power that can't be challenged. Explaining why he wants to push every case up to the warm embrace of the radical Right SC he created. Though I believe his ultimate goal of amassing autocratic control over the country will be thwarted, he's already been given more power (immunity) than the Constitution allows.

Mr. Trump is acting as if judges were already too weak to constrain his power.

It seems that they are.

If Trump really is “defying the court” and there are no consequences and the court is unable to force compliance, then the “crisis“ is settled.

This shouldn’t have been a nailbiter of a “crisis.” The final resolution is predicted in the constitution of the United States:

Article 2
The executive power shall be vested in a president of the United States.

It doesn’t say “unless constrained by a low/level judge.”

 

[LAUGHatLEFTISTS]

There is only a deluded liberal crisis. These drama queen activist judges are a disgrace, Roberts needs to get the judicial clownshow under control.

Robert’s is part of the judicial clown show.

 

[berg80]

Trump administration argues judge can’t order return of man mistakenly deported to El Salvador​

WASHINGTON (AP) — A federal judge didn't have the authority to order the Trump administration to broker the return of a Maryland man who was mistakenly deported from the U.S. to a notorious El Salvador prison, government attorneys argued Saturday as they urged an appeals court to suspend the ruling.

U.S. District Judge Paula Xinis on Friday ordered the administration to “facilitate and effectuate” Kilmar Abrego Garcia's return to the U.S. by late Monday night. Justice Department lawyers asked the 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals to immediately pause the judge's order.

“A judicial order that forces the Executive to engage with a foreign power in a certain way, let alone compel a certain action by a foreign sovereign, is constitutionally intolerable,” they wrote.

Trump administration argues judge can't order return of man mistakenly deported to El Salvador

The Trump administration is asking an appeals court to suspend a judge's order for the government to broker the return of a Maryland man who was mistakenly deported from the U.S. to an El Salvador prison.

apnews.com

The idea this is "constitutionally intolerable” is a disingenuous smokescreen for the simple fact that the regime does not want to ask El Salvador to return Garcia. Which it easily could. Because it does not want to set a precedent allowing for the return of other men who were deported without due process.