be life different in Alabama?

[oldfart]

Explain why the unemployment rate in Alabama is 7.2% while the national average is 7.6% and California is 9.4%.
Airbus is spending billions to locate it's US manufacturing facility in Mobile, Hyundai has a $1.7 billion plant in Montgomery. Our dry-dock and ship building facilities are buzzing, but you'd rather push stereotypes.

First, Alabama has been good at recruiting heavy manufacturing (there's a big auto plant near Tuscaloosa in addition to the Hyundai plant going in and the associated parts suppliers). Mobile--Pascagoula are a major shipbuilding operation as well as the source of most Gulf oil rig construction and maintenance. Airbus was a nice catch, although there was more politics involved in that than in the other industries. So Alabama has done very well the last twenty years or so in recruiting heavy industry to replace the declining influence of the Birmingham steel complexes and the north Alabama heavy industry. This has been at the expense of higher labor, land, and energy costs in Washington State, and Detroit.

As to the stereotypes; you need to lighten up. I'll give the South it's due for the progress that has been made. Just remember that some of that progress (like textiles) was won away from New England, and twenty years later was lost to Mexico, which has subsequently lost it to Bangladesh where they pay labor a minimum wage of $0.14 per hour before killing them a thousand at a time in unsafe buildings, so we can buy cheap clothes. Remember twenty or thirty years ago when Walmart had a "Buy American" campaign? We can lay that on the marketing, banking and retailing industries instead of the southern workers who briefly benefited as the clothing industry passed through.

And if you think the stereotypical South no longer exists, and you are in Alabama, you must live a very sheltered life with the wine and cheese set. It's changed, but it's still there.

Jamie

 

[Sunshine]

Ahoy, MeadHallPirate!
Why is there more violent crime in inner-city areas? Why is a certain segment of our population 6 times as likely to commit murder? Why is a certain segment 6 times as likely to be on welfare?

ahoy Ernie S,

'nother former swabby from the decks 'o USPO, good to see ye matey.

regardin' yer post, imma not sure 'o the answer.

Asian americans hath the lowest rate 'o divorce, the lowest rate 'o incarceration, and be the most upwardly mobile ethnic subset (financially) 'o our bountiful and Christian land.

perhaps then, thar aren't enough Asian americans livin' in them areas like Hale County, Alabama?

*frowns*

'tis hard to say, me friend.

- MeadHallPirate

There are several of us here. Mudwhistle, Ernie S., California Girl was for a while, not sure where she is. Rakkasan isn not here unless under a different name. But he's a FB friend, he spends a lot of time fishing KY Lake and smoking cigars.

 

[Sunshine]

the Southern economy still hasn't completely recovered fromt he stupendous loss of capitalization it suffered when slaves became free.

Seriously...the southern economy lost 75% of it capitalization when they lost their right to own slaves.

that loss of that magnitude is still resonating 150+ years later to make southern economy less vibrant.

Atlanta certainly has.

 

[Sunshine]

No, they couldn't be spent elsewhere. In Alabama they only have football. There's nothing else to spend money and resources on.

ahoy OoHPooPahDoo,

i'd first heard 'o this story on a radio show, "This American Life".

if i recall correctly, one 'o the residents 'o Hale County said that a huge number 'o thar folks be on disability because they "just do things harder in Hale County".

like, they work harder and play harder and just plain 'ol live harder. thar be alot 'o hardness goin' on in Hale County. as a result 'o this hardness, they end up livin' off taxes culled from NJ, Massachusetts, New York, etc, etc.

perhaps Alabama should have more football teams? if that be the state's best economic engine, i guess that be an option...

*frowns*

- MeadHallPirate

That is likely an accurate observation. There are a lot of young people who ar disabled from things like 4 wheeler accidents. Motocross racing is big in the south. Living 'hard' and living 'smart' do not seem to go together.

 

[Sunshine]

Almost 60% black, hmmm...I wonder if that's what you would call a Republican county?

ahoy Meathead,

well met, matey. the voters 'o Hale County picked Mr. Obama to thar POTUS.

the thing is, though, only a doctor put someone up fer disability. ye can't just wake up with the idear and do it on yer own.

i figure most 'o the MDs be white in Hale County, aye?

- MeadHallPirate

MHP, I have to add here that disability is generally NOT the doctor's idea. And most do not do those disability forms quickly. Rather, they just get so fed up with the patients hassling them, lawyers calling, etc. that they grudgingly fill them out. It has happened to me, but I hold out if I don't think the person is disabled. And when the lawyers call with their threats, I have a few of my own, like reporting them to their board of professional responsibility if they don't stop harassing me. There are very few I have done disabilty papers for, and those really deserved it.

When I was diagnosed with pulmonary hypertension in 2011, my doctor told me to quit work and sign up for disability. One of the few times I have ever known it to be the doctor's idea. But I refused. And in May, I will be retiring on SS and drawing my 3 other pensions AND keeping my company insurance. Working was a better deal for me but I had to defy the doctor.

 

[Sunshine]

does this forum have folks from the land 'o Alabama? i was wonderin' why this Southern, conservative, "personal responsibility" state hosts such a large armada 'o injured americans?

Well, I spent about 36 years in Mississippi and had a favorite aunt in a rural part of Alabama, so I guess I'm qualified.

Frankly I'm surprised the rate isn't higher. Begin with the fact of an aging population. When a lot of your younger (especially college-educated) workers move out-of-state, the median of the workforce in a county can easily get to 55 or older. And most disabled workers become unable to work in their 50's.

Then there's the type of work. Agriculture is not only literally back-breaking, it is incredibly dangerous. The kind of factory labor in the South is also typically lower-paid, more dangerous, and more prone to "use people up" than industries in the country as a whole. Add to that weaker worker safety laws and enforcement and lack of access to health care and you have a problem. Bad diet and obesity often lead to heart disease and diabetes which is far more prevalent in the South than the national average.

Mississippi resembles a Third World nation in many respects and Louisiana, Alabama, and Arkansas join it in workforce problems. Ironically these red states are showing the rest of the country what awaits them when big business Republicans get rid of unions, workplace regulation, and can let unfettered capitalism drive up earnings.

ahoy OldFart and well met,

*bows*

thank ye fer yer insight, matey.

if what ye state be true - that Alabama has weak workplace safety laws, and that local economic policy be causin' youthful folk to leave the area and unions (which at least in theory would boost both worker safety, worker pension plans and worker salaries), why do states like Alabama hew to conservative dogma?

is the belief amongst Alabamians that they get too much monies from the Federal Government and if they staunch this flow 'o taxpayer largesse, they'll be on better footin'?

- MeadhallPirate

According to Abraham Maslow, people will give up freedom for security. Once someone goes on disability, they rarely ever go back to work.

 

[Sunshine]

Being 350+ lbs on a diet of fried food probably counts as a disability for them.

ahoy Bodecea,

thats an interestin' point, matey.

Mississippi is the fattest state for 6th straight year, Colorado still leanest, Rhode Island getting fatter, Alaska slimmer.

For 2011 Mississippi has claimed the title of fattest state for the sixth consecutive year, while Colorado continues its streak as the leanest. Florida rose the most places in the rankings over last year, while Oregon dropped the most, according to a new analysis by CalorieLab, Inc.

Alabama remained in second place, while Tennessee dropped from last year’s tie with Alabama down to fourth place.

Mississippi is the fattest state for 6th straight year, Colorado still leanest, Rhode Island getting fatter, Alaska slimmer

do ye think 'tis fair to say that folks in Alabama willfully test our nation's Federal healthcare safety nets by purposefully and heedlessly sailin' deep into the perilous seas 'o heart disease and diabetes?

why be Alabama such a peculiar land, matey?

- MeadHallPirate

People are fat all over American, and diabetes is a national epidemic because of it.

 

[Sunshine]

Huntsville for those that don't know

Rocket City, USA

It's where we developed and built most of our rockets

ahoy Two Thumbs,

but wouldn't that be an example 'o "bad industry", since its primarily driven from Federal spendin'?

Alabama be a very, very conservative state, matey. they probably would wish to rid themselves 'o trappings that come tethered to "Rocket City", nay?

- MeadHallPirate

DoD spending

The main buyer is the government as well as other governments and other private industries.

aside from that, you are using a factless base for trolling.

I think if you give MHP a chance, you will come to enjoy his posts.

 

[Sunshine]

Almost 60% black, hmmm...I wonder if that's what you would call a Republican county?

ahoy Meathead,

well met, matey. the voters 'o Hale County picked Mr. Obama to thar POTUS.

the thing is, though, only a doctor put someone up fer disability. ye can't just wake up with the idear and do it on yer own.

i figure most 'o the MDs be white in Hale County, aye?

- MeadHallPirate

That may not be the case. Meharry Medical School is in Nashville. That is a large predominately black school. Most of the grads from their medical school are black. There are a fair number of them throughout the south.

 

[Sunshine]

does this forum have folks from the land 'o Alabama? i was wonderin' why this Southern, conservative, "personal responsibility" state hosts such a large armada 'o injured americans?

Well, I spent about 36 years in Mississippi and had a favorite aunt in a rural part of Alabama, so I guess I'm qualified.

Frankly I'm surprised the rate isn't higher. Begin with the fact of an aging population. When a lot of your younger (especially college-educated) workers move out-of-state, the median of the workforce in a county can easily get to 55 or older. And most disabled workers become unable to work in their 50's.

Then there's the type of work. Agriculture is not only literally back-breaking, it is incredibly dangerous. The kind of factory labor in the South is also typically lower-paid, more dangerous, and more prone to "use people up" than industries in the country as a whole. Add to that weaker worker safety laws and enforcement and lack of access to health care and you have a problem. Bad diet and obesity often lead to heart disease and diabetes which is far more prevalent in the South than the national average.

Mississippi resembles a Third World nation in many respects and Louisiana, Alabama, and Arkansas join it in workforce problems. Ironically these red states are showing the rest of the country what awaits them when big business Republicans get rid of unions, workplace regulation, and can let unfettered capitalism drive up earnings.

Explain why the unemployment rate in Alabama is 7.2% while the national average is 7.6% and California is 9.4%.
Airbus is spending billions to locate it's US manufacturing facility in Mobile, Hyundai has a $1.7 billion plant in Montgomery. Our dry-dock and ship building facilities are buzzing, but you'd rather push stereotypes.

And then there is Gulf Shores, which I am in love with and where I plan to spend 2 months in 2014.

 

[MeadHallPirate]

Ahoy, MeadHallPirate!
Why is there more violent crime in inner-city areas? Why is a certain segment of our population 6 times as likely to commit murder? Why is a certain segment 6 times as likely to be on welfare?

ahoy Ernie S,

'nother former swabby from the decks 'o USPO, good to see ye matey.

regardin' yer post, imma not sure 'o the answer.

Asian americans hath the lowest rate 'o divorce, the lowest rate 'o incarceration, and be the most upwardly mobile ethnic subset (financially) 'o our bountiful and Christian land.

perhaps then, thar aren't enough Asian americans livin' in them areas like Hale County, Alabama?

*frowns*

'tis hard to say, me friend.

- MeadHallPirate

There are several of us here. Mudwhistle, Ernie S., California Girl was for a while, not sure where she is. Rakkasan isn not here unless under a different name. But he's a FB friend, he spends a lot of time fishing KY Lake and smoking cigars.

ahoy Sunshine,

Dblack and Hoosier88 be here too...along with Iamwhatiseem.

i hope Rakkasan doesn't see me here, i feel he had just 'bout enough 'o MeadHallPirate from me final tour 'o USPO.

'tis good to see yer alive 'n well, lass!

- MeadHallPirate

 

[MeadHallPirate]

People are fat all over American, and diabetes is a national epidemic because of it.

ahoy Sunshine,

i can't dispute that, lass, and to be honest i make me home in North Carolina (charlotte) and i haven't seen an outbreak 'o o'erweight folks - but i live in the city proper.

apparently thar be an issue in Alabama regardin' havin' a healthy diet. perhaps this be the reason so many folks in the county i cited be on disability?

*wonders*

- MeadHallPirate

 

[Sunshine]

ahoy Ernie S,

'nother former swabby from the decks 'o USPO, good to see ye matey.

regardin' yer post, imma not sure 'o the answer.

Asian americans hath the lowest rate 'o divorce, the lowest rate 'o incarceration, and be the most upwardly mobile ethnic subset (financially) 'o our bountiful and Christian land.

perhaps then, thar aren't enough Asian americans livin' in them areas like Hale County, Alabama?

*frowns*

'tis hard to say, me friend.

- MeadHallPirate

There are several of us here. Mudwhistle, Ernie S., California Girl was for a while, not sure where she is. Rakkasan isn not here unless under a different name. But he's a FB friend, he spends a lot of time fishing KY Lake and smoking cigars.

ahoy Sunshine,

Dblack and Hoosier88 be here too...along with Iamwhatiseem.

i hope Rakkasan doesn't see me here, i feel he had just 'bout enough 'o MeadHallPirate from me final tour 'o USPO.

'tis good to see yer alive 'n well, lass!

- MeadHallPirate

Yes, I knew there were others, I just couldn't recall them. LOL @ Rakkasan. He and Pete (OSB) are actually friends on FB. Can you believe it? I haven't seen him on the forums, but I think in the years since his return from Iraq, Rak has found true peace. If not, it doesn't show IRL. We so love our lake here (and in that part of TN) that IRL nothing much from the outside world truly matters! You can stir things up, though. There are friends to be had here, and some surprising ones at that.

 

[Sunshine]

People are fat all over American, and diabetes is a national epidemic because of it.

ahoy Sunshine,

i can't dispute that, lass, and to be honest i make me home in North Carolina (charlotte) and i haven't seen an outbreak 'o o'erweight folks - but i live in the city proper.

apparently thar be an issue in Alabama regardin' havin' a healthy diet. perhaps this be the reason so many folks in the county i cited be on disability?

*wonders*

- MeadHallPirate

"Disability" covers a lot of territory from the serious 'you have been ambushed' diseases like I have to the cancers so prevalent where we have nuclear plants like Oak Ridge, TN, to the lifestyle related ones like Type II Diabetes. I think a breakdown of the data could carry more of the answer.

 

[editec]

the Southern economy still hasn't completely recovered fromt he stupendous loss of capitalization it suffered when slaves became free.

Seriously...the southern economy lost 75% of it capitalization when they lost their right to own slaves.

that loss of that magnitude is still resonating 150+ years later to make southern economy less vibrant.

[MENTION=11278]editec[/MENTION] LINK?

I'll take your failure to support your claim as proof that you lied.

I guess I could look for it, Lone.

That stat isn't one I found on the net but perhaps I can find supporting links.

But before I do that let me ask you why you doubt it.

Do you realize how much slaves were worth in those days compared to other things?

The value of a strong field hand was about equivalent to the value of a small farm back in the years leading up to the Civil War.

Their capitalization value really took off after Eli Whiney invented the cotton gin and vast plantations in MI and AL formed from about 1820 - 1860.

Ironically this was IN PART because American had made it illegal to import slaves so the value of them as means of production was rapidly rising in the first half of the 19th century.

This site may give you some idea of just how many slaves there were and help you to understand why losing them as CAPITALIZED ASSETS so thorughly destroyed the southern plantation economy.

This site Measuring Worth - Measuring the Value of a Slave will help you get a grasp of just how much VALUE was being held in the form of human beings.

Now AFTER you check that link to get an idea of the value of a SLAVE back then.

COMPARE those numbers to the value of say A FAMILY FARM. back then.

What you see is that a slave was worth about as much as a small farm!

Now multiply the number of slaves times the average value and you have the CAPITALIZATION numbers for all slaves held in the south.

My souirce for that startling statistic was some economic history, I read.

I'm sorry but I read so much I have no idea what book I am recalling that stat.

But fwiw, no studnet of economic history would much argue the point I was making even if their capitalization estimate was somewhat different.

MOST of the CSA's capitalization was not in land, or factories, or equipment, either,

Most of the Souths CAPITAL was tied up in the its SLAVES.

 

[oldfart]

There are several of us here. Mudwhistle, Ernie S., California Girl was for a while, not sure where she is. Rakkasan isn not here unless under a different name. But he's a FB friend, he spends a lot of time fishing KY Lake and smoking cigars.

If you could break away from your private chitchat long enough to read the rules you would find that negging is a violation on this forum. I'll assume your behavior is due to laziness in not reading the rules and ignorance rather than malevolent intent.

 

[Barb]

ahoy Two Thumbs,

but wouldn't that be an example 'o "bad industry", since its primarily driven from Federal spendin'?

Alabama be a very, very conservative state, matey. they probably would wish to rid themselves 'o trappings that come tethered to "Rocket City", nay?

- MeadHallPirate

DoD spending

The main buyer is the government as well as other governments and other private industries.

aside from that, you are using a factless base for trolling.

ahoy Two Thumbs,

actually, me facts be solid, me hearty.

i've checked'm.

in Hale County, Alabama, one outta four residents represent whats been called on other threads, "the lazy poor".

'tis also true that Rocket City hath the wind in its sails provided more or less by deficit spendin' by the Federal Government (this also be an accurate fact and isn't in dispute), somethin' i'd imagine the denizens 'o Alabama take a dim view of.

to return to the OP, why is it that Hale County has an armada 'o folks livin' on disability?

is life harder in Alabama? one poster mentioned this to be the case, and perhaps its true. i don't know alot 'bout Alabama.

*bows*

- MeadHallPirate

"the lazy poor" only refers to the "inner city" poor. CLEARLY you missed the memeO

'cause there's no meth heads in the cities, and no crack heads in the country.

 

[Circe]

And then there is Gulf Shores, which I am in love with and where I plan to spend 2 months in 2014.

Gulf Shores! I know it intimately from Maps on the iPad from following the setting of a novel. The novel "Elementals" by Michael McDowell has the most wonderful descriptions of that area and much of Alabama; it's a Southern Gothic. His others, Cold Moon over Babylon and Blackwater also are set there. Well worth reading if you love the area; he did, too.

 

[Ernie S.]

Well, I spent about 36 years in Mississippi and had a favorite aunt in a rural part of Alabama, so I guess I'm qualified.

Frankly I'm surprised the rate isn't higher. Begin with the fact of an aging population. When a lot of your younger (especially college-educated) workers move out-of-state, the median of the workforce in a county can easily get to 55 or older. And most disabled workers become unable to work in their 50's.

Then there's the type of work. Agriculture is not only literally back-breaking, it is incredibly dangerous. The kind of factory labor in the South is also typically lower-paid, more dangerous, and more prone to "use people up" than industries in the country as a whole. Add to that weaker worker safety laws and enforcement and lack of access to health care and you have a problem. Bad diet and obesity often lead to heart disease and diabetes which is far more prevalent in the South than the national average.

Mississippi resembles a Third World nation in many respects and Louisiana, Alabama, and Arkansas join it in workforce problems. Ironically these red states are showing the rest of the country what awaits them when big business Republicans get rid of unions, workplace regulation, and can let unfettered capitalism drive up earnings.

Explain why the unemployment rate in Alabama is 7.2% while the national average is 7.6% and California is 9.4%.
Airbus is spending billions to locate it's US manufacturing facility in Mobile, Hyundai has a $1.7 billion plant in Montgomery. Our dry-dock and ship building facilities are buzzing, but you'd rather push stereotypes.

And then there is Gulf Shores, which I am in love with and where I plan to spend 2 months in 2014.

When you make it to Gulf Shores, you best post up. I'm 15 minutes away!

see red dot upper right.

 

[Mertex]

Explain why the unemployment rate in Alabama is 7.2% while the national average is 7.6% and California is 9.4%.

Could the type of work and amount of pay have anything to do with it? There may be plenty of jobs, but low-paying jobs that only benefit non-professionals.

Alabama's economy creating wrong kind of jobs, labor experts say | al.com

Airbus is spending billions to locate it's US manufacturing facility in Mobile, Hyundai has a $1.7 billion plant in Montgomery. Our dry-dock and ship building facilities are buzzing, but you'd rather push stereotypes.

That's great, but unless they improve on public education, only the wealthier will be able to get the type of education necessary to apply for some of these jobs. Alabama is a red state and Republicans seem to want to get rid of public education, that won't help Alabama raise its standard of living.