Civil Disobedience

[rightwinger]

And the goalpost has been moved. Uh . . . we're talking about smoking, rw.

Its the same principle. Your establishment/ your rules

Its why blacks were prohibited from eating in white establishments for generations

"Management reserves the right to refuse service to anyone"

Oh, my bad. Discrimination is ok if you're in agreement with what's being discriminated. Got it.

Cry me a river...

Smokers are not being discriminated against.

What a bunch of babies

 

[Zoom-boing]

Its the same principle. Your establishment/ your rules

Its why blacks were prohibited from eating in white establishments for generations

"Management reserves the right to refuse service to anyone"

Oh, my bad. Discrimination is ok if you're in agreement with what's being discriminated. Got it.

Cry me a river...

Smokers are not being discriminated against.

What a bunch of babies

You're black, we won't let you in here. (OMG, that's awful! You're not letting someone in because of the color of their skin?? Discriminator.)

You smoke, we won't let you in here. (OMG, this is great! Smokers smell and I hate that! Yeah!! Discriminator.)



Just keep

 

[Anguille]

What prevents you (or anyone) from asking the smoker to put the butt out or take it outside or move to a different area? No guarantees but . . . .

I do that all the time. Still have to do it even in areas that are well posted as non smoking areas!! As I said in an above post, if smokers were considerate they'd put their cigarettes out without even having to be asked. But too many are not considerate, too many are bullies that refuse to accommodate requests. That's why laws finally had to be enacted to stop them. You can blame the smokers for this unnecessary intrusion by the government. Thay are the ones who brought it on themselves and are wasting taxpayer money.

maybe people should practice civility towards one another rather than just bash smokers vs. non-smokers.

Do you consider it practicing civility to light up where someone else has to breathe in your smoke? If you want to lecture on civility you need to start with the smokers. They are the ones not being civil.

 

[Anguille]

Oh, my bad. Discrimination is ok if you're in agreement with what's being discriminated. Got it.

Cry me a river...

Smokers are not being discriminated against.

What a bunch of babies

You're black, we won't let you in here. (OMG, that's awful! You're not letting someone in because of the color of their skin?? Discriminator.)

You smoke, we won't let you in here. (OMG, this is great! Smokers smell and I hate that! Yeah!! Discriminator.)



Just keep

Hello!! Smokers are not being denied entrance to any public space.

 

[Anguille]

Quote: Originally Posted by Anguille
If any bar owner does not wish to respect workplace safety laws concerning secondhand smoke then they are free to relocate to a country that does not have such laws.
So it's too much to ask for an employee or customer to switch bars if the smoke bothers them but it's perfectly ok to tell bars that they should change countries?

All this is moot.

It is the smoker who now has to make the hard choices not the non-smoker.

If smoking is more important than going to a movie....stay home and smoke.
If smoking is more important than going with your friends to a bar.....stay home and smoke
If smoking is more important than going to work.....stay home and smoke

Easy isn't it?

Yes, it is. And when the bars and restuarants start to close, be sure and blame the smokers for not patronizing these establishments. When the workers and owners start claiming unemployment, be sure to blame the smokers.

It certainly is easy.

And you can follow the UK, Ireland and the host of other countries who have seen massive closures in pubs and restaurants since the ban.

Enjoy the new America - where we are all told how to live by the Nanny State and remember, you wanted it.

Smokers are a small minority that is losing numbers because smokers are either quitting smoking or they are dying. No one is losing business because an even smaller minority of smokers is supposedly now boycotting bars and restaurants. You can blame the economic crises for any loss in revenues.

 

[Anguille]

Maybe the solution should be for restaurants and bars to get licensed to have indoor smoking just as establishments seek liquor licenses, so only a certain number would be allowed within each jurisdiction. That way workers have a choice, patrons have a choice, restaurant/bar business owners have a choice. If you don't like being around drunk people then don't go to bars and if you don't like being around smokers then don't go to smoking establishments. (And if you don't like breathing in coal particles you have every right to not work in a coal mine.)

Unless you are going to force employees in all types of working establishments to chose between working in a smoking or a non smoking establishment, then you can't single out bar and restaurant employees and say you are just going to deny them workplace safety protection in certain workplaces. Bar and restaurant workers were the last to get this kind of protection because they are considered by some people, certainly some in this thread. to be second class citizens not deserving of all the same rights as white collar workers.

 

[Anguille]

Maybe the solution should be for restaurants and bars to get licensed to have indoor smoking just as establishments seek liquor licenses, so only a certain number would be allowed within each jurisdiction. That way workers have a choice, patrons have a choice, restaurant/bar business owners have a choice. If you don't like being around drunk people then don't go to bars and if you don't like being around smokers then don't go to smoking establishments. (And if you don't like breathing in coal particles you have every right to not work in a coal mine.)

The big thing now is hookah bars...I don't know if they serve alcohol or not but they do get licensed to allow smokers to smoke there.

Angie...are you going to crusade against hookah bars?

My crusade is over. We've won the war.

It's you fringe element smokers who are on some kind of jihad to force smoking where nobody else wants it.

 

[California Girl]

Maybe the solution should be for restaurants and bars to get licensed to have indoor smoking just as establishments seek liquor licenses, so only a certain number would be allowed within each jurisdiction. That way workers have a choice, patrons have a choice, restaurant/bar business owners have a choice. If you don't like being around drunk people then don't go to bars and if you don't like being around smokers then don't go to smoking establishments. (And if you don't like breathing in coal particles you have every right to not work in a coal mine.)

The big thing now is hookah bars...I don't know if they serve alcohol or not but they do get licensed to allow smokers to smoke there.

Angie...are you going to crusade against hookah bars?

My crusade is over. We've won the war.

It's you fringe element smokers who are on some kind of jihad to force smoking where nobody else wants it.

No they don't. They want to be free to make their own decisions regarding their own personal life. Why is that so offensive to you?

Remember your comments when the government decides to legislate away something that you enjoy.

 

[Anguille]

The big thing now is hookah bars...I don't know if they serve alcohol or not but they do get licensed to allow smokers to smoke there.

Angie...are you going to crusade against hookah bars?

My crusade is over. We've won the war.

It's you fringe element smokers who are on some kind of jihad to force smoking where nobody else wants it.

No they don't. They want to be free to make their own decisions regarding their own personal life. Why is that so offensive to you?

Remember your comments when the government decides to legislate away something that you enjoy.

Since I don't enjoy poisoning people, I'm not worried.

 

[Ravi]

Maybe the solution should be for restaurants and bars to get licensed to have indoor smoking just as establishments seek liquor licenses, so only a certain number would be allowed within each jurisdiction. That way workers have a choice, patrons have a choice, restaurant/bar business owners have a choice. If you don't like being around drunk people then don't go to bars and if you don't like being around smokers then don't go to smoking establishments. (And if you don't like breathing in coal particles you have every right to not work in a coal mine.)

The big thing now is hookah bars...I don't know if they serve alcohol or not but they do get licensed to allow smokers to smoke there.

Angie...are you going to crusade against hookah bars?

My crusade is over. We've won the war.

It's you fringe element smokers who are on some kind of jihad to force smoking where nobody else wants it.

I'm disappointed in you. What about those employees that are working in hookah bars...should they not receive the same consideration as bar employees?

 

[Anguille]

The big thing now is hookah bars...I don't know if they serve alcohol or not but they do get licensed to allow smokers to smoke there.

Angie...are you going to crusade against hookah bars?

My crusade is over. We've won the war.

It's you fringe element smokers who are on some kind of jihad to force smoking where nobody else wants it.

I'm disappointed in you. What about those employees that are working in hookah bars...should they not receive the same consideration as bar employees?

I have no idea what goes on in hookah bars. Of course they deserve the same protections. And they will get them, if they are being denied any.

 

[Father Time]

What prevents you (or anyone) from asking the smoker to put the butt out or take it outside or move to a different area? No guarantees but . . . .

I do that all the time. Still have to do it even in areas that are well posted as non smoking areas!! As I said in an above post, if smokers were considerate they'd put their cigarettes out without even having to be asked. But too many are not considerate, too many are bullies that refuse to accommodate requests. That's why laws finally had to be enacted to stop them. You can blame the smokers for this unnecessary intrusion by the government. Thay are the ones who brought it on themselves and are wasting taxpayer money.

Because punishing the many for the sins of the few is completely fair eh?

Also I love this crap, they refuse to cater to your whim and now all of a sudden they're selfish? Ha.

You don't see going into a bar and demanding everyone put out their smokes just for you as being really selfish?

Oh and how in all holy fuck were smokers wasting taxpayers money? I'd love to hear your BS reasoning for that. Here's a little bit of info for you, laws cost money to enforce, so when you make a law that's hard to enforce and is not needed, you are the one wasting tax money.

Do you consider it practicing civility to light up where someone else has to breathe in your smoke? If you want to lecture on civility you need to start with the smokers. They are the ones not being civil.

If you honestly think all smokers act alike you are a moron.

 

[Zoom-boing]

What prevents you (or anyone) from asking the smoker to put the butt out or take it outside or move to a different area? No guarantees but . . . .

I do that all the time. Still have to do it even in areas that are well posted as non smoking areas!! As I said in an above post, if smokers were considerate they'd put their cigarettes out without even having to be asked. But too many are not considerate, too many are bullies that refuse to accommodate requests. That's why laws finally had to be enacted to stop them. You can blame the smokers for this unnecessary intrusion by the government. Thay are the ones who brought it on themselves and are wasting taxpayer money.

maybe people should practice civility towards one another rather than just bash smokers vs. non-smokers.

Do you consider it practicing civility to light up where someone else has to breathe in your smoke? If you want to lecture on civility you need to start with the smokers. They are the ones not being civil.

Bullies? More like addicts. No doubt some are assholes . . . .

I've encountered people who ask first if it's ok and if I said no, they didn't.

Would you be ok if the government just banned cigarettes altogether?

 

[Zoom-boing]

All this is moot.

It is the smoker who now has to make the hard choices not the non-smoker.

If smoking is more important than going to a movie....stay home and smoke.
If smoking is more important than going with your friends to a bar.....stay home and smoke
If smoking is more important than going to work.....stay home and smoke

Easy isn't it?

Yes, it is. And when the bars and restuarants start to close, be sure and blame the smokers for not patronizing these establishments. When the workers and owners start claiming unemployment, be sure to blame the smokers.

It certainly is easy.

And you can follow the UK, Ireland and the host of other countries who have seen massive closures in pubs and restaurants since the ban.

Enjoy the new America - where we are all told how to live by the Nanny State and remember, you wanted it.

Smokers are a small minority that is losing numbers because smokers are either quitting smoking or they are dying. No one is losing business because an even smaller minority of smokers is supposedly now boycotting bars and restaurants. You can blame the economic crises for any loss in revenues.

Then how are they going to fund SCHIP?

Are they all quitting because of the $75million toward smoking cessation programs uncle provided in the stimuless bill?

 

[Anguille]

Oh and how in all holy fuck were smokers wasting taxpayers money? I'd love to hear your BS reasoning for that. Here's a little bit of info for you, laws cost money to enforce, so when you make a law that's hard to enforce and is not needed, you are the one wasting tax money.

I'll explain it one more time. In real simple terms. If you don't get it this time, I suggest you just accept being a dimwit and live with it.

Smokers with no regard for the safety and comfort of others around them light up despite requests not to. People who are offended and physically harmed by this behavior give up trying to get them to stop on their own and find their only recourse is to appeal to their legislators. Lots of time and money is spent discussing this issue and the best and fairest course of action. Laws have to be enacted and enforced. The bureaucracy grows in order to deal with the recalcitrant and anti-social smokers.

These smokers created the problem, with the help of the tobacco industry, and the rest of us have to pay to clean it up.

 

[Anguille]

Would you be ok if the government just banned cigarettes altogether?

I would not object. But I think people have the right to do quite a few unhealthy things, they just don't have the right to do them where they infringe on other people's rights not to be part of their behavior.

A smoker will never be harmed by not smoking, but a person in the presence of a smoker has a very high chance of being harmed. Therefore the rights of a person with more to lose health wise trumps the rights of a person with nothing to lose.

 

[Ravi]

Oh and how in all holy fuck were smokers wasting taxpayers money? I'd love to hear your BS reasoning for that. Here's a little bit of info for you, laws cost money to enforce, so when you make a law that's hard to enforce and is not needed, you are the one wasting tax money.

I'll explain it one more time. In real simple terms. If you don't get it this time, I suggest you just accept being a dimwit and live with it.

Muslims with no regard for the safety and comfort of others around them blow up despite requests not to. People who are offended and physically harmed by this behavior give up trying to get them to stop on their own and find their only recourse is to appeal to their legislators. Lots of time and money is spent discussing this issue and the best and fairest course of action. Laws have to be enacted and enforced. The bureaucracy grows in order to deal with the recalcitrant and anti-Christian bombers.

These Muslims created the problem, with the help of the Mohammed industry, and the rest of us have to pay to clean it up.

 

[Anguille]

Oh and how in all holy fuck were smokers wasting taxpayers money? I'd love to hear your BS reasoning for that. Here's a little bit of info for you, laws cost money to enforce, so when you make a law that's hard to enforce and is not needed, you are the one wasting tax money.

I'll explain it one more time. In real simple terms. If you don't get it this time, I suggest you just accept being a dimwit and live with it.

Muslims with no regard for the safety and comfort of others around them blow up despite requests not to. People who are offended and physically harmed by this behavior give up trying to get them to stop on their own and find their only recourse is to appeal to their legislators. Lots of time and money is spent discussing this issue and the best and fairest course of action. Laws have to be enacted and enforced. The bureaucracy grows in order to deal with the recalcitrant and anti-Christian bombers.

These Muslims created the problem, with the help of the Mohammed industry, and the rest of us have to pay to clean it up.

 

[Ringel05]

Oh and how in all holy fuck were smokers wasting taxpayers money? I'd love to hear your BS reasoning for that. Here's a little bit of info for you, laws cost money to enforce, so when you make a law that's hard to enforce and is not needed, you are the one wasting tax money.

I'll explain it one more time. In real simple terms. If you don't get it this time, I suggest you just accept being a dimwit and live with it.

Muslims with no regard for the safety and comfort of others around them blow up despite requests not to. People who are offended and physically harmed by this behavior give up trying to get them to stop on their own and find their only recourse is to appeal to their legislators. Lots of time and money is spent discussing this issue and the best and fairest course of action. Laws have to be enacted and enforced. The bureaucracy grows in order to deal with the recalcitrant and anti-Christian bombers.

These Muslims created the problem, with the help of the Mohammed industry, and the rest of us have to pay to clean it up.

I agree with you cuckoo. Your analogy is just a tad on the extreme end of the scale. Just a tad.

 

[Father Time]

Oh and how in all holy fuck were smokers wasting taxpayers money? I'd love to hear your BS reasoning for that. Here's a little bit of info for you, laws cost money to enforce, so when you make a law that's hard to enforce and is not needed, you are the one wasting tax money.

I'll explain it one more time. In real simple terms. If you don't get it this time, I suggest you just accept being a dimwit and live with it.

Smokers with no regard for the safety and comfort of others around them light up despite requests not to. People who are offended and physically harmed by this behavior give up trying to get them to stop on their own and find their only recourse is to appeal to their legislators. Lots of time and money is spent discussing this issue and the best and fairest course of action. Laws have to be enacted and enforced. The bureaucracy grows in order to deal with the recalcitrant and anti-social smokers.

I'll explain it once more for you. You can simply leave, or walk away, you choose not to. You have no right to demand others put out their smokes wherever you go. Yes that means you would have to avoid places where smoking is permitted but that's just too damn bad.

All this money and effort is a complete waste because a free solution all ready exists. Don't go to places where the owners allow smoking
Realize the Earth does not revolve around you.

These smokers created the problem, with the help of the tobacco industry, and the rest of us have to pay to clean it up.

There is no problem. Lots of places would ban smoking on their own, there's absolutely no need to get the government involved.

What's next, a bar plays music you can't stand, they won't turn it off so you go cry to the legislators because you expect everyone to try to appease you.