CDZ Could (actual) Conservatives support this kind of single payer?

[PoliticalChic]

No, none of them. They're all as false as the tooth fairy, Peter Pan, jesus, Santa, easter bun, Tinkerbell, Zeus, and etc.

There is evidence from 'Answers in Genesis', or whatever it's called that man rode on the backs of dinosaurs. Along with visual proof in nearly every episode of the Flintstones.
Yabba dabba do you too.

Your side called Hussein Obama god, Jesus and the messiah.

It's a religion, based on faith.


“Rahm Emanuel: Athletes Kneeling During National Anthem Akin to Kneeling at ‘Religious Services’ Rahm Emanuel: Athletes Kneeling During National Anthem Akin to Kneeling at ‘Religious Services’ - Non Perele - News Online


And lots of those who have succumbed practice ‘convert psychology, they ridicule traditional religion while bowing their head to their new religion, Militant Secularism. One denomination of MS religion is the cult of Darwinism. As much as it is trumpeted by Secularists, there is no proof of same, but, as they respond to that complaint….neither is there for God.

Of course real religion supports life, yours embraces death.



None of the totalitarian forms of political plague have the slightest concern for human life: not communism (gulags), not Nazism (concentration camps), not Liberalism (abortion), not Progressivism (eugenics), not socialism (theft), not fascism (murder).

The Democrats check every one of those boxes.



They only differ in the final outcome: slavery, serfdom, or death.

They all follow Trotsky: "We must rid ourselves once and for all of the Quaker-Papist babble about the sanctity of human life."




Faith is the mode for both traditional religion, and for what you profess and proclaim.

 

[Hang on Sloopy]

Licensed health professional since Reagan was shot. I realize most on this thread will know more than I. That is a given, Google Professional Know It All Association

What do you think of this plan..............

Married couple early 50s Non smoker

Premium 1231 per month, Deductible 8500 deduct with a 9500 max out of pocket. $30 doc visit...80 for specialist........30 per prescription

Math. Person incurs 10,000 in bills for a year....................Cost 1231 times 12 is 14,472 premium cost plus 8500 deductible is 23,272 plus 1000 more for out of pocket max, is 24,272

So before first dollar coverage, you pay 24,272 dollars for insurance. Plus 30 or 80 bucks a doctors visit. 30 per prescription

If both people go the max, total yrly cost is 39,774 before first dollar coverage

What do you think of this plan?

 

[Hang on Sloopy]

What would your doctor say to you if you say.......................I want your care at half the cost now, better access and better care, you too nurse Ratchet

Pretend you are the doctor, What would you say to you?

This is a Custer Question

 

[dblack]

Ok

china is a communist country that does not take care of its people

It's not remotely communist. It might share some superficial similarities with a communist state (they're both totalitarian, authoritarian and opposed to individual rights), but that's as far as it goes. China is communist only in the dumbed-down, Trumpster sense, where anyone who opposes them is a "commie".

 

[dblack]

Licensed health professional since Reagan was shot. I realize most on this thread will know more than I. That is a given, Google Professional Know It All Association

What do you think of this plan..............

Married couple early 50s Non smoker

Premium 1231 per month, Deductible 8500 deduct with a 9500 max out of pocket. $30 doc visit...80 for specialist........30 per prescription

Math. Person incurs 10,000 in bills for a year....................Cost 1231 times 12 is 14,472 premium cost plus 8500 deductible is 23,272 plus 1000 more for out of pocket max, is 24,272

So before first dollar coverage, you pay 24,272 dollars for insurance. Plus 30 or 80 bucks a doctors visit. 30 per prescription

If both people go the max, total yrly cost is 39,774 before first dollar coverage

What do you think of this plan?

It blows. And i don't get why people waste money on shit like that. I'm mean, i sort of do - the insurance lobbyists and unions have passed reams of legislation designed to push us in that direction, to try to convince us that we have no choice. But we really need to grow up and just say no.

 

[Donald H]

Your side called Hussein Obama god, Jesus and the messiah.

I have no dog in your fight. You've forgotten that I'm a commie Canadian.

 

[PoliticalChic]

I have no dog in your fight. You've forgotten that I'm a commie Canadian.

No....you're a slave, you're just not smart enough to realize it.



See if the collar fits:

The Dog and the Wolf​

A gaunt Wolf was almost dead with hunger when he happened to meet a House-dog who was passing by. "Ah, Cousin," said the Dog. "I knew how it would be; your irregular life will soon be the ruin of you. Why do you not work steadily as I do, and get your food regularly given to you?"

"I would have no objection," said the Wolf, "if I could only get a place."

"I will easily arrange that for you," said the Dog; "come with me to my master and you shall share my work."

So the Wolf and the Dog went towards the town together. On the way there the Wolf noticed that the hair on a certain part of the Dog's neck was very much worn away, so he asked him how that had come about.

"Oh, it is nothing," said the Dog. "That is only the place where the collar is put on at night to keep me chained up; it chafes a bit, but one soon gets used to it."

"Is that all?" said the Wolf. "Then good-bye to you, Master Dog."

Better starve free than be a fat slave.




Canada is hardly #1 in quality of life if one must live on their knees, begging for the right to think and speak.

 

[YoursTruly]

What would your doctor say to you if you say.......................I want your care at half the cost now, better access and better care, you too nurse Ratchet

You got things messed and aren't accounting for the way things are now.
Example: They bill the insurance company for say $2500 for something, and get paid $100 maybe.

It's pretty much the same thing with Medicare. But Medicare many times pays better than insurance companies. But they still bill higher than what they expect to get paid.

 

[Hang on Sloopy]

You got things messed and aren't accounting for the way things are now.
Example: They bill the insurance company for say $2500 for something, and get paid $100 maybe.

It's pretty much the same thing with Medicare. But Medicare many times pays better than insurance companies. But they still bill higher than what they expect to get paid.

Pondering thoughts

I've been accounting the healthcare industry for 40 years. Year by year

Insurance companies pay by agreed upon costs to a provider. It is known as Usual, Customary, and Reasonable, for a particular area by contract. A 2500 dollar hospital charge will usually pay around 1000 dollars by contract

Medicare also pays a contracted price to providers. Many providers do not accept medicare/medicaid because of cost considerations

 

[Hang on Sloopy]

It blows. And i don't get why people waste money on shit like that. I'm mean, i sort of do - the insurance lobbyists and unions have passed reams of legislation designed to push us in that direction, to try to convince us that we have no choice. But we really need to grow up and just say no.

Always remember one thing about insurance. It is to insure you against severe financial harm or other peril loss. That's it.

 

[Hang on Sloopy]

I don't understand why republicans and most conservatives can't support a single payer system, ran by medical professionals. Although I do understand them not wanting it ran by our government. That's understandable. For the simple fact that the government can't run most things that benefit most of "we the people." A good example of this is the USD value. Now, $10hr is a poverty wage. Where as just south of the border, $10hr is an upper class wage.
But I digress. Fighting against a single payer system is nothing more than fighting in favor of health insurance companies. Who constantly screw the medical professionals out of a lot of money.
Healthcare has to be paid for, no matter who you are. Everyone is going to need medical help. And those that help you, will have to get paid. Insurance companies get paid by us. And they pay the MP (Medical professionals). But where they screw the MP's, is how much they pay the MPs for your care.
Example: When I was with Blue Cross Blue shield, I had an osteotomy on my knee. The hospital and doctor billed the insurance company over $100,000. That included all the doctor visits, surgeon visits, physical therapy & drugs. Blue Cross paid a little less than $3,000 in total. My doctor said that Medicare pays them better than Blue Cross. How sick is that?
Counting my premiums, the insurance company got paid a LOT more than the MP's that actually fixed my knee problem. Thousands more.
Let's be honest about this. Health insurance companies (or all of them) are nothing more than money brokers. We pay them and they pay the MP's what they want to pay them. Then they keep the rest for profits.
As a conservative, I'm always in support of cutting out the middle man.
I think the BEST way to solve this problem, is the MP's starting their own nationwide health insurance company. That way, they can own and operate within their own guidelines, with minimum government oversight. Of course, because there's trillions of dollars and millions of Americans involved, there'd have to be some oversight and regulations. But the ultimate decisions, providing there's no fraud or corruption involved, would remain with the MP's.
But in the end, the MP's (medical professionals) would be able to set their own rules, regs and policies. No more running tests that aren't actually necessary. No more endless doctor visits, being treated for something the doctors knows isn't going to be effective. (so they can get more money) No more fighting with the insurance companies as to why the doctor can't run a certain test.
Example: When my gaul stones were causing a lot of pain, the ER doctor wasn't allowed to do a sonogram because I didn't have fever. A simple test to see for sure that I had gaul stones, was not allowed by the insurance company. Not only would the test confirm the doctors suspicions. But would also show the size and scope of the stones. Which would determine if emergency surgery was needed. Or if I could wait to have the surgery.

Bottom line to this, IMO, health insurance companies are nothing more than money brokers and do nothing to help, treat or cure patients. So the ones getting 100% of the money, should be the MP's. If a single payer system is the only way to abolish insurance companies, then so be it.

Shezus. Could you summarize this novel in 5 sentences pretty please. Please. What insurance company caused you such gall stone grief..........................................One never knows how good their insurance is.............drum roll........................until you frikin need it

 

[YoursTruly]

Pondering thoughts

I've been accounting the healthcare industry for 40 years. Year by year

Insurance companies pay by agreed upon costs to a provider. It is known as Usual, Customary, and Reasonable, for a particular area by contract. A 2500 dollar hospital charge will usually pay around 1000 dollars by contract

Medicare also pays a contracted price to providers. Many providers do not accept medicare/medicaid because of cost considerations

So you're pro-insurance. (money brokers) Got it.

 

[Hang on Sloopy]

Yes, it's still "for profit." Why shouldn't the MP's profit from helping people. It's a free market trade off. The doctors treat and cure people. And the people pay THEM. And not the money brokering insurance companies.


With MP's insurance, I can't see why the premiums would go up. With a system like this, they'd be eliminating billions of dollars in overhead (the entire health insurance industry).
Sure, the MP's could get greedy. And will probably do so in time. But we're already getting greedy insurance companies. Every time they've went before congress and asked for a raise, they got it.
They get a raise and premiums go up.


Great idea. Then anyone who can't afford healthcare, can just die. C'mon man. That's no good.

About 88% of the population is covered by employer health insurance.well pre china virus made in a lab

 

[Hang on Sloopy]

So you're pro-insurance. (money brokers) Got it.

Yes I am pro insurance against severe financial peril. Not every arse ache imaginable

I'm your friend pal. My lifes work is to help people navigate all kinds of personal financial issues. I treat every client like it was my cherished loved one. My mom would haunt me from the grave for anything less

 

[YoursTruly]

Yes I am pro insurance against severe financial peril. Not every arse ache imaginable

I'm your friend pal. My lifes work is to help people navigate all kinds of personal financial issues. I treat every client like it was my cherished loved one. My mom would haunt me from the grave for anything less

Sorry bub, but pointing the good points of health insurance doesn't mean health insurance from insurance companies is the ONLY way to achieve the same goal.
I think Americans, especially business owners who pay for most of their employee's health insurance premiums, would LOVE to see a drastic reduction in their healthcare cost.
And since health insurance companies are just money brokers, then cutting them out would save a lot of money.

What's the absolute answer to the problem? I don't have a clue. But a free market system, ran by the medical profession itself, has never been tried before. It may be a total disaster. They may end up hiring a lot of crooks in the health insurance business now and turn it into the same BS. Where the CEO's are getting huge salaries and bonuses, and ripping the actual doctors off.

If it was ran like a coop is supposed to be ran, as in the members having a say so in prices (and not just a BoD's, That would be a HUGE check and balance.

 

[Staidhup]

I respect numerous opinions expressed, however, under the ACA I have been kicked in the teeth, Medicare and the VA don’t cover squat, my supplemental costs an arm and leg, and in all honesty the last thing I need or want is the government having anything to do with my health or quality of life. As for Canadian Healthcare, maybe you should spend some time in Canada and find out for yourself.
In closing GDP does not reflect individual standard of living or quality of life. As for the comment on Milton Friedman, Friedman advocated for one to have the freedom to choose from a broad open and free market, work, and live where they so chose. He was not an advocate of government manipulation or control of market places. The employee has the right to work wherever they wish which is power in itself in that employers cost of replacing and training productive employee’s mandates fair and just compensation packages.

 

[dblack]

Always remember one thing about insurance. It is to insure you against severe financial harm or other peril loss. That's it.

Right. And the core of the problem is that people think it is, or should be, something else. They think of it as a club you join to get free healthcare. But it doesn't work that way. It can't work that way.

 

[YoursTruly]

I respect numerous opinions expressed, however, under the ACA I have been kicked in the teeth, Medicare and the VA don’t cover squat, my supplemental costs an arm and leg, and in all honesty the last thing I need or want is the government having anything to do with my health or quality of life. As for Canadian Healthcare, maybe you should spend some time in Canada and find out for yourself.
In closing GDP does not reflect individual standard of living or quality of life. As for the comment on Milton Friedman, Friedman advocated for one to have the freedom to choose from a broad open and free market, work, and live where they so chose. He was not an advocate of government manipulation or control of market places. The employee has the right to work wherever they wish which is power in itself in that employers cost of replacing and training productive employee’s mandates fair and just compensation packages.

FYI, my ole friend dropped his supplemental and his care hasn't changed. He still see's his doctors.

 

[dblack]

Sorry bub, but pointing the good points of health insurance doesn't mean health insurance from insurance companies is the ONLY way to achieve the same goal.

But what IS the goal? That's where everyone assumes we have consensus - but we don't. Which is why we can't formulate consistent, useful healthcare policy.

Some people want to beef up the safety net. Some people want to force everyone into the "safety net". Some people think health care prices are too high. Some people think healthcare should be "free". Views are divergent, and largely incompatible.

I think Americans, especially business owners who pay for most of their employee's health insurance premiums, would LOVE to see a drastic reduction in their healthcare cost.
And since health insurance companies are just money brokers, then cutting them out would save a lot of money.

So, we really don't need any policy changes, right? Cutting out the insurance companies is as simple as canceling your policy.

What's the absolute answer to the problem? I don't have a clue. But a free market system, ran by the medical profession itself, has never been tried before.

That seems awfully vague. What is a "free market system, ran by the medical profession"? Free markets aren't "ran" by anyone. That's sort of the point.

 

[YoursTruly]

But what IS the goal? That's where everyone assumes we have consensus - but we don't. Which is why we can't formulate consistent, useful healthcare policy.

Some people want to beef up the safety net. Some people want to force everyone into the "safety net". Some people think health care prices are too high. Some people think healthcare should be "free". Views are divergent, and largely incompatible.

One thing would help us all is to know the truth. That would put us, the insurance companies, the government and the MP's on the same page. No lies. No secrets. Then we could all make an informed decision. And I'll betcha $1 to a hole in a donut, that a lot more of us would agree on something.

So, we really don't need any policy changes, right? Cutting out the insurance companies is as simple as canceling your policy.

True enough. But for a TON of people, that's just not possible. And within a week for another ton, would've been a bad decision.

That seems awfully vague. What is a "free market system, ran by the medical profession"? Free markets aren't "ran" by anyone. That's sort of the point.

Of course it's vague. Without the facts and honestly, any conversation about this, including congressional critters and 90% of the insurance employees, would be nothing more than a guessing game.