'Evil little thing' or defender of the constitution?

[hortysir]

If they want to keep their Christian prayer at a secular public school...fine...as long as prayers from all the world religions are given equal wall space.

I'm cool with that

 

[Truthmatters]

the founders werent

 

[Charles_Main]

Madison clearly said he that that is WHAT he intended to be in the constitution

He wanted a Separation of Government and Organized Churches, he did not want a Nation where the meer Mention of god Was illegal. The Founders desire for Separation was Targeted at keeping Organized Churches from Playing a Roll, or A State Church being Established. They clearly saw nothing wrong with Religious Symbols, and Prayers in Public Places as their world, including Federal Property was FULL OF THEM!!

 

[Charles_Main]

the founders werent

Are you an Idiot. There was Prayer in School for Generations AFTER the Founders, The Founders had the 10 Commandments on the walls of the Capital. The Founders clearly were ok with Kids Praying in school. Your own Liberal Interpretation aside.

 

[Truthmatters]

Madison clearly said he that that is WHAT he intended to be in the constitution

He wanted a Separation of Government and Organized Churches, he did not want a Nation where the meer Mention of god Was illegal. The Founders desire for Separation was Targeted at keeping Organized Churches from Playing a Roll, or A State Church being Established. They clearly saw nothing wrong with Religious Symbols, and Prayers in Public Places as their world, including Federal Property was FULL OF THEM!!

this does not make it illegal you fool.

It keeps it out of government.

public schools are government

 

[Charles_Main]

Madison clearly said he that that is WHAT he intended to be in the constitution

He wanted a Separation of Government and Organized Churches, he did not want a Nation where the meer Mention of god Was illegal. The Founders desire for Separation was Targeted at keeping Organized Churches from Playing a Roll, or A State Church being Established. They clearly saw nothing wrong with Religious Symbols, and Prayers in Public Places as their world, including Federal Property was FULL OF THEM!!

this does not make it illegal you fool.

It keeps it out of government.

public schools are government

I simply do not believe a non denominational Prayer in a public School Violates the Constitution TM. It does in effect make it illegal to display a Prayer in a Public School.

I again point to the fact the for Generations in this country there was Prayer in school, and Religious Symbols all over our Federal Institutions. So your argument that our Founders intended a Nation with no Religions Symbols or Religious Speech allowed on any Public Property is simply not true.

Liberals in Recent times have taken the Interpretation of the Separation and Non Establishment Clauses to an Extreme, and in Many Cases actually Violate the Vast Majorities Right to Free Expression of Religion in the Name of not offended a Minority.

You can not claim what Liberals want today, Is what the Founders Intended, because it is not what the Founders did in Practice, nor anyone, For over 200 years before Progressives Decided To Push the Interpretation to the extreme.

 

[Truthmatters]

how long has the part of the pledge contained the word God?

 

[Truthmatters]

Pledge of Allegiance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Addition of "under God"

Louis A. Bowman (1872–1959) was the first to initiate the addition of "under God" to the Pledge. The National Society of the Daughters of the American Revolution gave him an Award of Merit as the originator of this idea.[10][11] He spent his adult life in the Chicago area and was Chaplain of the Illinois Society of the Sons of the American Revolution. At a meeting on February 12, 1948,[citation needed] Lincoln's Birthday, he led the Society in swearing the Pledge with two words added, "under God." He stated that the words came from Lincoln's Gettysburg Address. Though not all manuscript versions of the Gettysburg Address contain the words "under God", all the reporters' transcripts of the speech as delivered do, as perhaps Lincoln may have deviated from his prepared text and inserted the phrase when he said "that the nation shall, under God, have a new birth of freedom." Bowman repeated his revised version of the Pledge at other meetings.[10]

 

[Rat in the Hat]

Yeap your a fool.

You wnat to pretend jyou have not lost the argument in the face of facts.

Me and the father of the constituion agree you are wrong

What the fuck is a "constituion"??

 

[Truthmatters]

James Madison's Veto Messages by Gene Garman

Madison knows more about the constitution than any of you

 

[Rat in the Hat]

Madison clearly said he that that is WHAT he intended to be in the constitution

He wanted a Separation of Government and Organized Churches, he did not want a Nation where the meer Mention of god Was illegal. The Founders desire for Separation was Targeted at keeping Organized Churches from Playing a Roll, or A State Church being Established. They clearly saw nothing wrong with Religious Symbols, and Prayers in Public Places as their world, including Federal Property was FULL OF THEM!!

this does not make it illegal you fool.

It keeps it out of government.

public schools are government

Really? What laws do they pass? What public services do they administer? How do they provide for the public welfare and defense?

 

[Ernie S.]

James Madison's Veto Messages by Gene Garman


June 3, 1811



I have recd. fellow Citizens your address, approving my Objection to the Bill contain[in]g a grant of public land, to the Baptist Church at Salem Meeting House Missippi Terry. Having always regarded the practical distinction between Religion & Civil Govt as essential to the purity of both, and as guaranteed by the Constn: of the U.S. I could not have otherwise discharged my duty on the occasion which presented itself. Among the various religious Societies in our Country, none have been more vigilant or constant in maintain[in]g that distinction, than the Society of which you make a part, and it is an honourable proof of your sincerity & integrity, that you are as ready to do so, in a case favoring the interest of your brethren, as in other cases. It is but just, at the same time, to the Baptist Church at Salem Meeting House, to remark that their application to the Natl. Legislature does not appear to have contemplated a grant of the Land in question, but on terms that might be equitable to the public as well as to themselves. Accept my friendly respects


James Madison

That means govenment taxpayer money should not be given to the Church.

NO he is saying the constitution contains a distinction between religion and civil government.

He says its guarenteed in the constitution HE WROTE

The distinction is that the government must remain neutral. Removing a sign that has been there for 49 years is not neutral. It is prohibiting the free exercise there of.
How much plainer can I make it for you?

 

[Ernie S.]

you make no sense

LO fucking L!

 

[whitehall]

Show me where the Constitution actually uses the words "separation of church and state". The dirty little secret is that an FDR appointed justice who was a former KKK member and hated and feared Papists wrote the majority opinion that outlines the modern version of "SCS". The 1st Amendment was intended to take government out of religion not regulate Christian beliefs.

 

[peach174]

Madison wrote most of the constitution.

You just going to pretend he didnt say it?

No Madison did not write most of the Constitution.

There were fifty-five individuals directly involved in framing the Constitution at the Constitutional Convention, and an additional ninety in the first federal Congress that framed the First Amendment and Bill of Rights. Allowing for the overlap of nineteen individuals who were both at the Constitutional Convention and a part of the first Congress, there were one hundred and twenty-six individual participants in the framing of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. The records of the Constitutional Convention demonstrate that James Madison was often out of step with these Founders. The other delegates rejected Madison's Virginia plan in preference for Roger Sherman's Connecticut plan and voted down 40 of Madison's 71 proposals (60 percent). Nevertheless, today Madison is cited as if he is the only authority among the Founding Fathers and the only expert on the First Amendment and the Bill of Rights.

 

[rightwinger]

Didn't we go through this two weeks ago?

You are not allowed to have a prayer posted in a school

 

[Ernie S.]

they lie and continue to spew talking points in the face of historical facts, its so sick

Please show us where we are lying. The clause in the 1st amendment regarding religion states "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
Is not making a law outlawing a prayer on a wall prohibiting "the free exercise, there of?

 

[Truthmatters]

James Madison - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

James Madison, Jr. (March 16, 1751 (O.S. March 5) – June 28, 1836) was an American statesman and political theorist. He was the fourth President of the United States (1809–1817) and is hailed as the “Father of the Constitution” for being instrumental in the drafting of the United States Constitution and as the key champion and author of the United States Bill of Rights.[1] He inherited tobacco land and owned slaves although he spent his entire adult life as a career politician.

 

[Truthmatters]

Madison knew more about the constitution than any of you people

 

[bodecea]

He wanted a Separation of Government and Organized Churches, he did not want a Nation where the meer Mention of god Was illegal. The Founders desire for Separation was Targeted at keeping Organized Churches from Playing a Roll, or A State Church being Established. They clearly saw nothing wrong with Religious Symbols, and Prayers in Public Places as their world, including Federal Property was FULL OF THEM!!

this does not make it illegal you fool.

It keeps it out of government.

public schools are government

Really? What laws do they pass? What public services do they administer? How do they provide for the public welfare and defense?

Um...free education to the public. See also "public welfare".


Wait....are you saying that public schools are not government?