Josh Josh Josh....

[BluePhantom]

Do you have any link showing that when a 14 year old molests 4 sisters, some while sleeping, some while awake, he usually outgrows this behavior without any professional counseling? I'd like to see that bit of information.

"Myth:
"Juvenile sex offenders typically are victims of child sexual abuse and grow up to be adult sex offenders."

Fact:
Multiple factors, not just sexual victimization as a child, are associated with the development of sexually offending behavior in youth.

Myth:
"Most sex offenders reoffend."

Fact:
Reconviction data suggest that this is not the case. Further, reoffense rates vary among different types of sex offenders and are related to specific characteristics of the offender and the offense."

CSOM Publications


"In fact, research has demonstrated that juveniles who commit sexual offenses are more likely to recidivate in a nonsexual rather than a sexual manner....

A relatively small percentage of juveniles who commit a sexual offense will sexually reoffend as adults. The message for policymakers is that juveniles who commit sexual offenses are not the same as adult sexual offenders, and that all juveniles who commit a sexual offense do not go on to sexually offend later in life."

Chapter 3: Recidivism of Juveniles Who Commit Sexual Offenses | Sex Offender Management Assessment and Planning Initiative

How Often Do Juvenile Sex Offenders Reoffend?

Juvenile sex offenders appear to respond better to treatment and reoffend less frequently than adult sex offenders. Sexual reoffense rates for youth over several years are estimated at approximately 10%. In addition, if juvenile sex offenders reoffend, they are far more likely to engage in other types of delinquent behavior than to commit new sex crimes.

http://www.csom.org/pubs/needtoknow_fs.pdf


Josh never got any professional treatment.

Josh and his wife are committed to plopping out babies every chance they get, and are planning to have as many as Gawd will allow. Even after all the public humiliation of his juvenile perversions, having to resign from his job, losing the reality show (the bread and butter for the family) Josh has recently been busted for pornography and signing up on a web site to help married people cheat on their spouse, and the dummy used his real name.

So tell me, would you let him babysit your children...your grandchildren?

Where do you get your information that he never received professional counseling? You seem to spread rumors you hear instead of finding out facts.

Well I take the info from the parents and they told exactly what they did in an interview. Criticize on that which you will but I didn't read tabloid about it I watched the interview with the parents

TrinityPower

I'm curious as to why anyone would defend and support this guy?

You're not the only one who is ever so terribly concerned for this predator. A lot of RWs are as well as some Republicans, including Mike The Huckster Huckabee.

What about the little girls he molested? Where is the RW caring for them?

For that matter, where are the supposed "family values" nutters? Molesting little girls, porn addiction and cheating on your wife are the family values.

No one is defending this guy. No one is saying that what he did was acceptable. We are merely analyzing the situation to determine what the probable causes for his actions were. Whatever we determine those causes to be, it doesn't make it ok. Molestation, porn addiction, and cheating on your wife are not family values. They are examples of the destructive effects of force and repression. A basic Taoist principle states hat the more you try to force something to happen the less likely it is to happen in the manner you are hoping to achieve. This is a perfect example of that principle. By using extreme methods to repress sexual activities essentially by force, the family in effect created the very thing they were trying to avoid.

That doesn't mean what he did was ok. It's merely an observation of a specific situation wherein the effects of forceful and repressive action resulted in in opposite desired effect. It's a great lesson for everyone, no matter their political affiliation

 

[BluePhantom]

I think this kid has been unfairly labeled a child molester

Yeah, poor Josh.........at 15 you are still considering him a kid? Most 15 year old boys know about sex, or surely he wouldn't have been doing what he did considering he was brought up in such an archaic environment.

And again you miss the point. Most 15 year old boys do know something about sex. The children of this family almost certainly do not. let me try to establish some things for you.

1) The kid was 15, right in the age range for puberty which mean his curiosity and hormones were raging like all boys at that age.

2) The Duggar children are homeschooled by the ultra-religious whack job mother. Do you really think sex education is part of that curriculum?

3) The kid was raised in a socially isolated, ultra-religious, repressive environment. Where are the friends of his age to help him understand what he is experiencing? They don't exist. What about older siblings? Well I think Josh is the oldest, but even if he isn't they are in the same situation he was in. What are they going to offer?

4) He lived in a crowded house where there was probably very little, if any, privacy. He was probably taught that healthy activities such as masturbation would send him to hell, and even if he said "to hell with it, I am going to have a wank" when was he going to find the privacy to do it? A family that large doesn't get the bathroom to themselves when they shower. The other kids are brushing their teeth, blah, blah, blah while he is in there. No opportunity for even a quick wank.

5) His parents forbid even hand-holding with a member of the opposite sex until they are engaged and all dates are strictly chaperoned. Where was his opportunity to engage in normal and healthy sexual exploration with a girl? There wasn't any.

So put all this together and what do you expect to be the result? he no outlet at all so one day he sees his sister asleep and brushed his fingers over her breasts for a few seconds. Given the situation, would you really be surprised? As I said before, when there are no healthy or natural outlets, one will resort to unhealthy and unnatural outlets. That doesn't make it ok, but I sure as hell understand it.

Now take his infidelity. He gets married immediately, probaby to a girl from his family's church circle who is just as fucked up and ignorant about sex as he is. But now he has some freedom from his overbearing parents and he sees some porn and thinks "is this what mom and dad were trying to shield me from?" It looks pretty interesting actually....far different from the missionary, keep your mind pure during the act, and don't give in to the sinful feelings of lust kind of sex he and his wife were probably having. Maybe he thinks "wow...you can do it from behind? You can do it against the wall? You can hang from the ceiling like a monkey?" The guy has probably never had a blow job in his life and suddenly he sees he can get blown from two girls at once. Well son of a bitch! How about that!

So what is he to do with all this? Go to his ultra-conservative wife and say "honey, I want you to dress up like Wonder Woman, tie me up with your magic lasso, and beat my ass with wet rhubarb" Is he supposed to come home and say "SURPRISE, HONEY! I stopped off at the adult store on the way home from work and bought you a 12" rubber dick! Let's have some fun!" Pffft...good luck with that! (although in reality that's probably exactly what he should have done as if she came from the same sort of environment, she is probably struggling with the same urges and desires as he is - but neither of them are going to feel comfortable telling the other because they have been taught all their life that stuff like that is sinful).

So what does he do? He fucks up and decides to do it in secret. Is it right? NO! Is it ok? NO! Does it makes sense? Oh yeah, it makes perfect fucking sense. It happens every day with couples who got married too young and reached a point in their life where they regret all the things they missed out on and decide they are going to experience them while they still have time. It happens all the damned time.

So would this kind have done those things if he was raised in an environment that provided healthy outlets for sexual exploration and healthy opportunities for experimentation with girls his age (that he was not related to)? I HIGHLY doubt it. You know, one of my daughters lives with my ex-wife in another state. My daughter just turned dating age and my ex told her she is not allowed to date black boys. I told my ex to prepare for her to marry a black man. My ex was shocked and asked why. I said "because you told her she can't so that is exactly what she is going to do." That's the lesson we should be taking from this entire situation....I wish more people would learn it.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

TrinityPower

"No one is defending this guy. No one is saying that what he did was acceptable. We are merely analyzing the situation to determine what the probable causes for his actions were. Whatever we determine those causes to be, it doesn't make it ok...."

Several here have defended and supported him. Some have said he should be "forgiven".

You're not "analyzing" much of anything. You're making excuses for him and from all you've written, it looks like you've read very few facts about this case.

What YOU determine the cause to be means less than nothing.

And again, not one word about his victims.



"...So put all this together and what do you expect to be the result? he no outlet at all so one day he sees his sister asleep and brushed his fingers over her breasts for a few seconds..."

While I agree their cult is extremely dysfunctional and toxic, pedophilia is not the result of fundie cults.

He did not "brush his fingers over their breasts for a few seconds"!!!

Where the hell did you get that? In all the articles I've read about this, I don't remember anything even remotely like that. Two were apparently asleep and yet they 'tattled' to mom. Doesn't sound very asleep to me. Later molestation were of them awake and included others outside the family.

Mom and dad put locks on the daughter's door (why not the pedo's door instead? Because their cult says it was the victims' fault), they stopped letting babysitters come to their home and they sent him to live with a known child pornographer.

And STILL, not a word about his victims who he started on when the youngest was 4 and continued past his 17-18th birthday.

Are you aware that one of his victims is suing him?

IMO, crimes against children should be taken a lot more seriously than they are.

As for his serial adultery - heck, that's just the usual fundie hypocrisy of telling others how to live while you screw anything, of any age, that moves, and then lie about it until you get caught.

 

[Mertex]

No one is defending this guy.

I don't think you can truthfully say that, unless you just came into this thread about him and haven't read the other threads out there about him.

 

[hortysir]

I defended this kid and still defend his family because they did all they really could but what he is doing now has nothing to do with his parents. I feel sympathy for his wife who just had child #4 in 5 years while he is paying websites to find some strange and stupid enough to use his real name. Good Grief Charlie Brown!!

Josh Duggar of 19 Kids and Counting Paid Nearly $1,000 for Ashley Madison Accounts: Report

Check out this commentary......
I'll copy a couple of the most condemning remarks......remarks that TRUE Christians should stand behind.
Josh Duggar: Talk Is Cheap

****I could understand if Josh's Internet browsing history was exposed and occasional pornography use was discovered. Hey, I could maybe even understand if Josh had a one-time, unpremeditated affair with his secretary (after which he immediately came clean to his wife, without having to be exposed). These transgressions are deplorable, but struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins.****

****
This is not an example of struggling with sin or stumbling into it. "Struggle" is totally absent from this scenario. There was no fight or resistance, but only perpetual unrepentant sin with no remorse (you maybe could argue we don't know if he fought his desires or not, but I would think if he did, he would've cancelled his subscription once or twice in those 27 months).

Josh said all the right things. He named the name of Jesus, articulated the Gospel correctly, and embraced Christ's forgiveness from a seemingly humble heart. But what Josh didn't do was show his faith authentic by putting his sin to death by the power of the Spirit. Those who are led by the Spirit are sons and daughters of God, and those who are children of God don't go on in perpetual, premeditated, unrepentant sin (1 John 3:6-10). I'm not going to heap judgment on myself by declaring Josh unsaved, but I will say he is in imminent danger. His life seems to be on the wide path that leads to destruction and not on the narrow Way that leads to life.****
(my bold)

 

[Carla_Danger]

About there being 37 million Americans signed up to cheat on Ashley Madison ... That's about half of the total number of married couples.

Proof there is no "sanctity of marriage".

And I am sure the liberals of the world are overjoyed to hear it

What an ignorant remark.

That's about as dumb as if I were to say, liberals love their animals more than republican's.

 

[Mertex]

And again you miss the point. Most 15 year old boys do know something about sex. The children of this family almost certainly do not. let me try to establish some things for you.

I'm not missing the point, you are. You are trying to explain away the reason for his behavior.....I really don't much care about the reason for his behavior....what I have been pointing out is that some of us realized that this dude was sick (regardless of what caused him to be sick) and really needed to be investigated (because we really don't have any proof that he has been rehabilitated from his crime of pedophilia). Some conservatives on another Josh Duggar thread were claiming that they were sure that he was okay, had been healed and posed no danger to other children and were reprimanding some of us for criticizing the fact that he got away with a crime. Those that defended him and vouched for his repentant attitude have not come forth to defend him this time, because his new scandal proves that those of us that weren't convinced of his redemption, were right.

Now you and some others are trying to inform us that he grew up in a whacky environment........hello! We already knew that. As if that is an excuse from being held accountable for the crime he committed before. How he was raised doesn't excuse him from obeying the law. Josh Duggar is a lying scoundrel and the truth has finally come out. However, he has learned that all he has to do is act penitent and everyone in his family and others who were duped by his contrite behavior will be quick to forgive and forget. Probably the same people that are still holding Bill Clinton in low regard for his indiscretion some time back ......one that wasn't criminal and involved two consenting adults. If that's not hypocrisy, I don't know what is.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

I defended this kid and still defend his family because they did all they really could but what he is doing now has nothing to do with his parents. I feel sympathy for his wife who just had child #4 in 5 years while he is paying websites to find some strange and stupid enough to use his real name. Good Grief Charlie Brown!!

Josh Duggar of 19 Kids and Counting Paid Nearly $1,000 for Ashley Madison Accounts: Report

Check out this commentary......
I'll copy a couple of the most condemning remarks......remarks that TRUE Christians should stand behind.
Josh Duggar: Talk Is Cheap

****I could understand if Josh's Internet browsing history was exposed and occasional pornography use was discovered. Hey, I could maybe even understand if Josh had a one-time, unpremeditated affair with his secretary (after which he immediately came clean to his wife, without having to be exposed). These transgressions are deplorable, but struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins.****

****
This is not an example of struggling with sin or stumbling into it. "Struggle" is totally absent from this scenario. There was no fight or resistance, but only perpetual unrepentant sin with no remorse (you maybe could argue we don't know if he fought his desires or not, but I would think if he did, he would've cancelled his subscription once or twice in those 27 months).

Josh said all the right things. He named the name of Jesus, articulated the Gospel correctly, and embraced Christ's forgiveness from a seemingly humble heart. But what Josh didn't do was show his faith authentic by putting his sin to death by the power of the Spirit. Those who are led by the Spirit are sons and daughters of God, and those who are children of God don't go on in perpetual, premeditated, unrepentant sin (1 John 3:6-10). I'm not going to heap judgment on myself by declaring Josh unsaved, but I will say he is in imminent danger. His life seems to be on the wide path that leads to destruction and not on the narrow Way that leads to life.****
(my bold)

To me, this is a very bizarre attitude or belief.

One thing christians have in common is that they repeat and recite their blather by rote without ever really understanding what they're saying.

Josh has done a lot more than a 'fling with his secretary' but then to go one with this "... struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins..."

I don't "trip and fall into sin". Nor do I "struggle with sins". What's wrong with christians that living an ethical moral life is so hard for them? Why do they constantly have to seek "forgiveness" from their imaginary fairy? Through all their mumbo jumbo, its obvious they can't just stop screwing over others.

The only thing that has changed for Josh is that he keeps getting caught.

When we first learned he molests little girls, I said we had not heard the last of him and I was right. I'll say it again - He will go deeper underground but he WILL be caught again and he WILL make the news again.

This cheating pedo can't and won't change.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

And again you miss the point. Most 15 year old boys do know something about sex. The children of this family almost certainly do not. let me try to establish some things for you.

I'm not missing the point, you are. You are trying to explain away the reason for his behavior.....I really don't much care about the reason for his behavior....what I have been pointing out is that some of us realized that this dude was sick (regardless of what caused him to be sick) and really needed to be investigated (because we really don't have any proof that he has been rehabilitated from his crime of pedophilia). Some conservatives on another Josh Duggar thread were claiming that they were sure that he was okay, had been healed and posed no danger to other children and were reprimanding some of us for criticizing the fact that he got away with a crime. Those that defended him and vouched for his repentant attitude have not come forth to defend him this time, because his new scandal proves that those of us that weren't convinced of his redemption, were right.

Now you and some others are trying to inform us that he grew up in a whacky environment........hello! We already knew that. As if that is an excuse from being held accountable for the crime he committed before. How he was raised doesn't excuse him from obeying the law. Josh Duggar is a lying scoundrel and the truth has finally come out. However, he has learned that all he has to do is act penitent and everyone in his family and others who were duped by his contrite behavior will be quick to forgive and forget. Probably the same people that are still holding Bill Clinton in low regard for his indiscretion some time back ......one that wasn't criminal and involved two consenting adults. If that's not hypocrisy, I don't know what is.

Some seem to be saying their cult is an excuse for him molesting little girls, lying to his family and the nation and just being an all around slime while preaching to others how they should live.

But not to worry, he's "forgiven" and is free to keep on with his sick behavior.

 

[Vandalshandle]

The following website can be used to find names and addresses of anyone convicted of sexual crimes:

http://www.familywatchdog.us/Search.asp

Better yet, here is a site belonging to the DOJ doing the same thing:

Request Rejected

It exists because they are routinely repeat offenders. There is no such web site for tracking convicted thieves, or even murderers.

 

[koshergrl]

I think this kid has been unfairly labeled a child molester

Yeah, poor Josh.........at 15 you are still considering him a kid? Most 15 year old boys know about sex, or surely he wouldn't have been doing what he did considering he was brought up in such an archaic environment.

And again you miss the point. Most 15 year old boys do know something about sex. The children of this family almost certainly do not. let me try to establish some things for you.

1) The kid was 15, right in the age range for puberty which mean his curiosity and hormones were raging like all boys at that age.

2) The Duggar children are homeschooled by the ultra-religious whack job mother. Do you really think sex education is part of that curriculum?

3) The kid was raised in a socially isolated, ultra-religious, repressive environment. Where are the friends of his age to help him understand what he is experiencing? They don't exist. What about older siblings? Well I think Josh is the oldest, but even if he isn't they are in the same situation he was in. What are they going to offer?

4) He lived in a crowded house where there was probably very little, if any, privacy. He was probably taught that healthy activities such as masturbation would send him to hell, and even if he said "to hell with it, I am going to have a wank" when was he going to find the privacy to do it? A family that large doesn't get the bathroom to themselves when they shower. The other kids are brushing their teeth, blah, blah, blah while he is in there. No opportunity for even a quick wank.

5) His parents forbid even hand-holding with a member of the opposite sex until they are engaged and all dates are strictly chaperoned. Where was his opportunity to engage in normal and healthy sexual exploration with a girl? There wasn't any.

So put all this together and what do you expect to be the result? he no outlet at all so one day he sees his sister asleep and brushed his fingers over her breasts for a few seconds. Given the situation, would you really be surprised? As I said before, when there are no healthy or natural outlets, one will resort to unhealthy and unnatural outlets. That doesn't make it ok, but I sure as hell understand it.

Now take his infidelity. He gets married immediately, probaby to a girl from his family's church circle who is just as fucked up and ignorant about sex as he is. But now he has some freedom from his overbearing parents and he sees some porn and thinks "is this what mom and dad were trying to shield me from?" It looks pretty interesting actually....far different from the missionary, keep your mind pure during the act, and don't give in to the sinful feelings of lust kind of sex he and his wife were probably having. Maybe he thinks "wow...you can do it from behind? You can do it against the wall? You can hang from the ceiling like a monkey?" The guy has probably never had a blow job in his life and suddenly he sees he can get blown from two girls at once. Well son of a bitch! How about that!

So what is he to do with all this? Go to his ultra-conservative wife and say "honey, I want you to dress up like Wonder Woman, tie me up with your magic lasso, and beat my ass with wet rhubarb" Is he supposed to come home and say "SURPRISE, HONEY! I stopped off at the adult store on the way home from work and bought you a 12" rubber dick! Let's have some fun!" Pffft...good luck with that! (although in reality that's probably exactly what he should have done as if she came from the same sort of environment, she is probably struggling with the same urges and desires as he is - but neither of them are going to feel comfortable telling the other because they have been taught all their life that stuff like that is sinful).

So what does he do? He fucks up and decides to do it in secret. Is it right? NO! Is it ok? NO! Does it makes sense? Oh yeah, it makes perfect fucking sense. It happens every day with couples who got married too young and reached a point in their life where they regret all the things they missed out on and decide they are going to experience them while they still have time. It happens all the damned time.

So would this kind have done those things if he was raised in an environment that provided healthy outlets for sexual exploration and healthy opportunities for experimentation with girls his age (that he was not related to)? I HIGHLY doubt it. You know, one of my daughters lives with my ex-wife in another state. My daughter just turned dating age and my ex told her she is not allowed to date black boys. I told my ex to prepare for her to marry a black man. My ex was shocked and asked why. I said "because you told her she can't so that is exactly what she is going to do." That's the lesson we should be taking from this entire situation....I wish more people would learn it.

So you maintain cheating and watching porn I caused by Christianity?

Lololol...the funny thing is he didn't even do anything illegal. If this were a liberal the progs would be howling over how prudish it is to criticize, how it's nobody's business how he and his wife explore their sexuality, and how porn is a healthy sex life pickmeup that reduces aggression. Then they'd blame the wife for not aborting her children so she could better serve her man....

 

[hortysir]

I defended this kid and still defend his family because they did all they really could but what he is doing now has nothing to do with his parents. I feel sympathy for his wife who just had child #4 in 5 years while he is paying websites to find some strange and stupid enough to use his real name. Good Grief Charlie Brown!!

Josh Duggar of 19 Kids and Counting Paid Nearly $1,000 for Ashley Madison Accounts: Report

Check out this commentary......
I'll copy a couple of the most condemning remarks......remarks that TRUE Christians should stand behind.
Josh Duggar: Talk Is Cheap

****I could understand if Josh's Internet browsing history was exposed and occasional pornography use was discovered. Hey, I could maybe even understand if Josh had a one-time, unpremeditated affair with his secretary (after which he immediately came clean to his wife, without having to be exposed). These transgressions are deplorable, but struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins.****

****
This is not an example of struggling with sin or stumbling into it. "Struggle" is totally absent from this scenario. There was no fight or resistance, but only perpetual unrepentant sin with no remorse (you maybe could argue we don't know if he fought his desires or not, but I would think if he did, he would've cancelled his subscription once or twice in those 27 months).

Josh said all the right things. He named the name of Jesus, articulated the Gospel correctly, and embraced Christ's forgiveness from a seemingly humble heart. But what Josh didn't do was show his faith authentic by putting his sin to death by the power of the Spirit. Those who are led by the Spirit are sons and daughters of God, and those who are children of God don't go on in perpetual, premeditated, unrepentant sin (1 John 3:6-10). I'm not going to heap judgment on myself by declaring Josh unsaved, but I will say he is in imminent danger. His life seems to be on the wide path that leads to destruction and not on the narrow Way that leads to life.****
(my bold)

To me, this is a very bizarre attitude or belief.

One thing christians have in common is that they repeat and recite their blather by rote without ever really understanding what they're saying.

Josh has done a lot more than a 'fling with his secretary' but then to go one with this "... struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins..."

I don't "trip and fall into sin". Nor do I "struggle with sins". What's wrong with christians that living an ethical moral life is so hard for them? Why do they constantly have to seek "forgiveness" from their imaginary fairy? Through all their mumbo jumbo, its obvious they can't just stop screwing over others.

The only thing that has changed for Josh is that he keeps getting caught.

When we first learned he molests little girls, I said we had not heard the last of him and I was right. I'll say it again - He will go deeper underground but he WILL be caught again and he WILL make the news again.

This cheating pedo can't and won't change.

The point is, people screw up and do stupid shit sometimes.
The majority of us learn from it and vow not to repeat it.

Josh, on the other hand,made a habit and a pattern out of it and, apparently, felt no remorse

 

[koshergrl]

I defended this kid and still defend his family because they did all they really could but what he is doing now has nothing to do with his parents. I feel sympathy for his wife who just had child #4 in 5 years while he is paying websites to find some strange and stupid enough to use his real name. Good Grief Charlie Brown!!

Josh Duggar of 19 Kids and Counting Paid Nearly $1,000 for Ashley Madison Accounts: Report

Check out this commentary......
I'll copy a couple of the most condemning remarks......remarks that TRUE Christians should stand behind.
Josh Duggar: Talk Is Cheap

****I could understand if Josh's Internet browsing history was exposed and occasional pornography use was discovered. Hey, I could maybe even understand if Josh had a one-time, unpremeditated affair with his secretary (after which he immediately came clean to his wife, without having to be exposed). These transgressions are deplorable, but struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins.****

****
This is not an example of struggling with sin or stumbling into it. "Struggle" is totally absent from this scenario. There was no fight or resistance, but only perpetual unrepentant sin with no remorse (you maybe could argue we don't know if he fought his desires or not, but I would think if he did, he would've cancelled his subscription once or twice in those 27 months).

Josh said all the right things. He named the name of Jesus, articulated the Gospel correctly, and embraced Christ's forgiveness from a seemingly humble heart. But what Josh didn't do was show his faith authentic by putting his sin to death by the power of the Spirit. Those who are led by the Spirit are sons and daughters of God, and those who are children of God don't go on in perpetual, premeditated, unrepentant sin (1 John 3:6-10). I'm not going to heap judgment on myself by declaring Josh unsaved, but I will say he is in imminent danger. His life seems to be on the wide path that leads to destruction and not on the narrow Way that leads to life.****
(my bold)

To me, this is a very bizarre attitude or belief.

One thing christians have in common is that they repeat and recite their blather by rote without ever really understanding what they're saying.

Josh has done a lot more than a 'fling with his secretary' but then to go one with this "... struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins..."

I don't "trip and fall into sin". Nor do I "struggle with sins". What's wrong with christians that living an ethical moral life is so hard for them? Why do they constantly have to seek "forgiveness" from their imaginary fairy? Through all their mumbo jumbo, its obvious they can't just stop screwing over others.

The only thing that has changed for Josh is that he keeps getting caught.

When we first learned he molests little girls, I said we had not heard the last of him and I was right. I'll say it again - He will go deeper underground but he WILL be caught again and he WILL make the news again.

This cheating pedo can't and won't change.

The point is, people screw up and do stupid shit sometimes.
The majority of us learn from it and vow not to repeat it.

Josh, on the other hand,made a habit and a pattern out of it and, apparently, felt no remorse

He appears remorseful to me. Ps, watching porn and cheating on your wife and getting caught once doesn't really establish a pattern of behavior...

 

[hortysir]

I defended this kid and still defend his family because they did all they really could but what he is doing now has nothing to do with his parents. I feel sympathy for his wife who just had child #4 in 5 years while he is paying websites to find some strange and stupid enough to use his real name. Good Grief Charlie Brown!!

Josh Duggar of 19 Kids and Counting Paid Nearly $1,000 for Ashley Madison Accounts: Report

Check out this commentary......
I'll copy a couple of the most condemning remarks......remarks that TRUE Christians should stand behind.
Josh Duggar: Talk Is Cheap

****I could understand if Josh's Internet browsing history was exposed and occasional pornography use was discovered. Hey, I could maybe even understand if Josh had a one-time, unpremeditated affair with his secretary (after which he immediately came clean to his wife, without having to be exposed). These transgressions are deplorable, but struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins.****

****
This is not an example of struggling with sin or stumbling into it. "Struggle" is totally absent from this scenario. There was no fight or resistance, but only perpetual unrepentant sin with no remorse (you maybe could argue we don't know if he fought his desires or not, but I would think if he did, he would've cancelled his subscription once or twice in those 27 months).

Josh said all the right things. He named the name of Jesus, articulated the Gospel correctly, and embraced Christ's forgiveness from a seemingly humble heart. But what Josh didn't do was show his faith authentic by putting his sin to death by the power of the Spirit. Those who are led by the Spirit are sons and daughters of God, and those who are children of God don't go on in perpetual, premeditated, unrepentant sin (1 John 3:6-10). I'm not going to heap judgment on myself by declaring Josh unsaved, but I will say he is in imminent danger. His life seems to be on the wide path that leads to destruction and not on the narrow Way that leads to life.****
(my bold)

To me, this is a very bizarre attitude or belief.

One thing christians have in common is that they repeat and recite their blather by rote without ever really understanding what they're saying.

Josh has done a lot more than a 'fling with his secretary' but then to go one with this "... struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins..."

I don't "trip and fall into sin". Nor do I "struggle with sins". What's wrong with christians that living an ethical moral life is so hard for them? Why do they constantly have to seek "forgiveness" from their imaginary fairy? Through all their mumbo jumbo, its obvious they can't just stop screwing over others.

The only thing that has changed for Josh is that he keeps getting caught.

When we first learned he molests little girls, I said we had not heard the last of him and I was right. I'll say it again - He will go deeper underground but he WILL be caught again and he WILL make the news again.

This cheating pedo can't and won't change.

The point is, people screw up and do stupid shit sometimes.
The majority of us learn from it and vow not to repeat it.

Josh, on the other hand,made a habit and a pattern out of it and, apparently, felt no remorse

He appears remorseful to me. Ps, watching porn and cheating on your wife and getting caught once doesn't really establish a pattern of behavior...

At no time, however, during the entire debacle of his past being brought back to haunt him, did he cancel his Ashley Madison account.
He continued his deceptive practices and even paid the extra "guaranteed to get laid" premium price.

 

[koshergrl]

I defended this kid and still defend his family because they did all they really could but what he is doing now has nothing to do with his parents. I feel sympathy for his wife who just had child #4 in 5 years while he is paying websites to find some strange and stupid enough to use his real name. Good Grief Charlie Brown!!

Josh Duggar of 19 Kids and Counting Paid Nearly $1,000 for Ashley Madison Accounts: Report

Check out this commentary......
I'll copy a couple of the most condemning remarks......remarks that TRUE Christians should stand behind.
Josh Duggar: Talk Is Cheap

****I could understand if Josh's Internet browsing history was exposed and occasional pornography use was discovered. Hey, I could maybe even understand if Josh had a one-time, unpremeditated affair with his secretary (after which he immediately came clean to his wife, without having to be exposed). These transgressions are deplorable, but struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins.****

****
This is not an example of struggling with sin or stumbling into it. "Struggle" is totally absent from this scenario. There was no fight or resistance, but only perpetual unrepentant sin with no remorse (you maybe could argue we don't know if he fought his desires or not, but I would think if he did, he would've cancelled his subscription once or twice in those 27 months).

Josh said all the right things. He named the name of Jesus, articulated the Gospel correctly, and embraced Christ's forgiveness from a seemingly humble heart. But what Josh didn't do was show his faith authentic by putting his sin to death by the power of the Spirit. Those who are led by the Spirit are sons and daughters of God, and those who are children of God don't go on in perpetual, premeditated, unrepentant sin (1 John 3:6-10). I'm not going to heap judgment on myself by declaring Josh unsaved, but I will say he is in imminent danger. His life seems to be on the wide path that leads to destruction and not on the narrow Way that leads to life.****
(my bold)

To me, this is a very bizarre attitude or belief.

One thing christians have in common is that they repeat and recite their blather by rote without ever really understanding what they're saying.

Josh has done a lot more than a 'fling with his secretary' but then to go one with this "... struggling with or stumbling into sin is a universal sickness in the Christian life that no believer can claim they're immune to. We all trip and fall into sin, even the very worst of sins..."

I don't "trip and fall into sin". Nor do I "struggle with sins". What's wrong with christians that living an ethical moral life is so hard for them? Why do they constantly have to seek "forgiveness" from their imaginary fairy? Through all their mumbo jumbo, its obvious they can't just stop screwing over others.

The only thing that has changed for Josh is that he keeps getting caught.

When we first learned he molests little girls, I said we had not heard the last of him and I was right. I'll say it again - He will go deeper underground but he WILL be caught again and he WILL make the news again.

This cheating pedo can't and won't change.

The point is, people screw up and do stupid shit sometimes.
The majority of us learn from it and vow not to repeat it.

Josh, on the other hand,made a habit and a pattern out of it and, apparently, felt no remorse

He appears remorseful to me. Ps, watching porn and cheating on your wife and getting caught once doesn't really establish a pattern of behavior...

At no time, however, during the entire debacle of his past being brought back to haunt him, did he cancel his Ashley Madison account.
He continued his deceptive practices and even paid the extra "guaranteed to get laid" premium price.

Meh.

 

[BluePhantom]

TrinityPower

"No one is defending this guy. No one is saying that what he did was acceptable. We are merely analyzing the situation to determine what the probable causes for his actions were. Whatever we determine those causes to be, it doesn't make it ok...."

Several here have defended and supported him. Some have said he should be "forgiven".

You're not "analyzing" much of anything. You're making excuses for him and from all you've written, it looks like you've read very few facts about this case.

What YOU determine the cause to be means less than nothing.

And again, not one word about his victims.

I don't know how you can interpret me saying over and over that his actions were not acceptable as "making excuses for him". And the topic of discussion is not about his victims. if you want to talk about them start a different thread. I prefer to stay on topic.

Where the hell did you get that? In all the articles I've read about this, I don't remember anything even remotely like that. Two were apparently asleep and yet they 'tattled' to mom. Doesn't sound very asleep to me. Later molestation were of them awake and included others outside the family.

Provide the links to support that they were awake and ratted on him. According to his sisters' own statements on televised interviews they were not even aware of it happening. What articles did you read? Shit from the Daily Kos?

Are you aware that one of his victims is suing him?

IMO, crimes against children should be taken a lot more seriously than they are.

As for his serial adultery - heck, that's just the usual fundie hypocrisy of telling others how to live while you screw anything, of any age, that moves, and then lie about it until you get caught.

yeah and? Great....sue him. Take him for every dime he has. I couldn't care less about this guy so I really don't give a damn if he gets sued or not. And now we are jumping to "serial adultery"? Pfft....we don't even know what he did. He may not have ever met a girl from that site. This is a hyper-sensitive family. We don't know what they define as "cheating". I know women who say that if their husband watches porn it is adultery. I don't want to speak for Koshergrl, but I bet she would agree with that. Maybe all he did was exchange a few pics and according to their definition that is cheating. Maybe according to their definition just signing up to the website is cheating. We don't know any details at all. You are just jumping to conclusions and my guess is that it's because you see an opportunity to hammer the conservative religious nut jobs and thus, who gives a shit about facts or having all the information required to make an informed decision?

 

[BluePhantom]

And again you miss the point. Most 15 year old boys do know something about sex. The children of this family almost certainly do not. let me try to establish some things for you.

I'm not missing the point, you are. You are trying to explain away the reason for his behavior.....I really don't much care about the reason for his behavior....what I have been pointing out is that some of us realized that this dude was sick (regardless of what caused him to be sick) and really needed to be investigated (because we really don't have any proof that he has been rehabilitated from his crime of pedophilia). Some conservatives on another Josh Duggar thread were claiming that they were sure that he was okay, had been healed and posed no danger to other children and were reprimanding some of us for criticizing the fact that he got away with a crime. Those that defended him and vouched for his repentant attitude have not come forth to defend him this time, because his new scandal proves that those of us that weren't convinced of his redemption, were right.

Dude....a lot of Christians who post here are just as nuts as that family is. You are surprised that ultra-religious nut cases would defend other ultra-religious nut cases? Really?

Now you and some others are trying to inform us that he grew up in a whacky environment........hello! We already knew that. As if that is an excuse from being held accountable for the crime he committed before. How he was raised doesn't excuse him from obeying the law. Josh Duggar is a lying scoundrel and the truth has finally come out. However, he has learned that all he has to do is act penitent and everyone in his family and others who were duped by his contrite behavior will be quick to forgive and forget. Probably the same people that are still holding Bill Clinton in low regard for his indiscretion some time back ......one that wasn't criminal and involved two consenting adults. If that's not hypocrisy, I don't know what is.

Not once did I ever say that his environment excused his behavior. In fact I have said the very opposite several times? My God, you are thick. Do you even bother to read what is written or do you just continue to pound your shoe on the table and completely ignore inconvenient points? If it's the latter I would like to introduce you to Carla Danger. You two will get along just fine.

 

[koshergrl]

Good grief lefties are tedious.And insane. All these fruit loops have defended sexual depravity, up to and including the sexualization of VERY young children under the heading of "sex education", and the distribution of porn at colleges. It's truly hilarious to watch them suddenly decide that oh yeah...in SOME instances, sexual exploration and rule bending is a heinous offense.

 

[koshergrl]

Sexual exploration is the term they use to mainstream sex amongst the very young or non traditional, btw.

 

[koshergrl]

And how many times have we heard that sex between one youngster and one older kid is just a matter of "normal exploration" and should be dealt with via condoms and no judgement. Not if it's the Duggars, though. That's different and their glee that one of PPL boys looked at his sisters with lust in his heart ISN'T TO BE TOLERATED