Muhammad al- Dura

[SherriMunnerlyn]

What a joke the article in the OP is, the human rights groups already documented the killing. Israels committees have no credibility, they are formed to simply whitewash Israels war crimes !

 

[sealadaigh]

can someone cite a link for that denial by Israel that she
used white phosphorus?as I recall----Israel said it used white
phosphorous to illuminate targets ---which is a legal
use of the stuff------at issue was whether one should use it in
densely populated areas since it may cause bodily injury---
--therefore many people condements its use
as it was used in Gaza. Of course many of those who condemn
the use of white phosphorous because of the remote possibility
that it can harm a person----are fervent supporters of
poison nail bombs hurled sometimes by the thousands at the heads
of Israeli infants-----with clear intent that such bombs do the job
they do best---smash the brains of children

White phosphorus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In its early statements the Israeli military repeatedly denied using white phosphorus, saying "We categorically deny the use of white phosphorus", and "The IDF acts only in accordance with what is permitted by international law and does not use white phosphorus." It eventually admitted its use and stopped using the shells, however, saying that a "media buzz" led to its decision to do so.[29]​

As far as "remote possibility" that it can harm a person - when you use it in densely populated areas, chances are it will harm people - as horribly as any nail bomb. It burns and can not be put out by water.

On 5 January the Times reported that telltale smoke associated with white phosphorus had been seen in areas of a shelling. On 12 January it was reported that more than 50 phosphorus burns victims were in Nasser Hospital. On 16 January the UNRWA headquarters was hit with phosphorus munitions.[41] As a result of the hit, the compound was set ablaze.[42]​

Oh, and some of the victims were children. Gaza burn victims exhibit possible signs of white phosphorous wounds - Israel News | Haaretz Daily Newspaper

Horrible way to die.

We are talking about Pallywood here not phosphorous!

We are talking about the lies of the Palestinians! the cheating of the Palestinians to get world attention!

Shame on them!

i think we are talking about the credibility of israel investgating themselves, and particularly, IDF investigations of the IDF.

 

[Coyote]

Deach's comparison of nail bombs and
WP ---is far too obscene to even address-----
he is disgusting however---let us assume
that his statement is TRUE then I certainly
hope that given a choice between a pellet of
WP --landing 15 feet from a child near and
dear to him and a nail bomb
landing 15 feet from that child-----that
is the nail bomb that does the landing.

Source: White phosphorus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Effects on people
White phosphorus can cause injuries and even death in three ways: by burning deep into tissue, by being inhaled as a smoke, and by being ingested. Extensive exposure by burning and ingestion is fatal.

Burning
Injuries from white phosphorus.[85][86]
Incandescent particles of WP cast off by a WP weapon's initial explosion can produce extensive, deep second and third degree burns. One reason why this occurs is the tendency of the element to stick to the skin. Phosphorus burns carry a greater risk of mortality than other forms of burns due to the absorption of phosphorus into the body through the burned area, resulting in liver, heart and kidney damage, and in some cases multiple organ failure.[87] These weapons are particularly dangerous to exposed people because white phosphorus continues to burn unless deprived of oxygen or until it is completely consumed. In some cases, burns are limited to areas of exposed skin because the smaller WP particles do not burn completely through personal clothing before being consumed.
Smoke inhalation.[89]​

WP is not a "banned weapon---in
fact in the manner used by israel,
it is not a weapon at all.

Technically legal, however the manner in which it WAS used was highly controversial and made it a de-facto weapon since it was used in heavily populated civilian areas when other, less lethal, options were available.

From Wikipedia:

There are multiple international laws that could be seen to regulate white phosphorus use.[90] Article 1 of Protocol III of the Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons defines an incendiary weapon as 'any weapon or munition which is primarily designed to set fire to objects or to cause burn injury to persons through the action of flame, heat, or combination thereof, produced by a chemical reaction of a substance delivered on the target'. The same protocol prohibits the use of said incendiary weapons against civilians (already forbidden by the Geneva Conventions) or in civilian areas.

However, the use against military targets outside civilian areas is not explicitly banned by any treaty. There is a debate[who?] on whether white phosphorus should be considered a chemical weapon and thus be outlawed by the Chemical Weapons Convention (CWC) which went into effect in April 1997. The convention is meant to prohibit weapons that are "dependent on the use of the toxic properties of chemicals as a method of warfare" (Article II, Definitions, 9, "Purposes not Prohibited" c.).​

Someone
denied its use initially--shortly
thereafter ---that error was corrected
and the use of the stuff was stopped
even though it is not actually illegal
to use it

That "error". You mean like a verbal typo or something?

The "correction" occurred in January - after intense media reporting. Jan 5 - Israel categorially denied it's use. Jan 21st they finally admitted to it.

That's not "shortly thereafter".

Deach's implication that
he saw WP being used as an anti-
personnel weapon-----is a joke

No. Actually, I think Seal's right-on given several salient features:

• it was used in densly populated areas (contraindicated)
• it was used during the daylight when less lethal and equally effective smoke bombs (which Israel had available) could have been used
• yet they used the highly damaging WP

The joke is this.

We have folks making claims about how the Palestinians lie, murder and steal yet, here we have a situation where Israel acts no better.

We're expected to be outraged at the Palestinian's use of faked murders to try and make Israel look bad.

Well, in my opinion - I'm not outraged. I'm not outraged because of two reasons. Outrage is reserved for truly horrendous acts - for example, the Jordanian soldier who felt it was his "religious and moral duty" to open fire on a group of Israeli school children.

What the Palestinians do, when they pull these kind of charades, is descredit themselves and make people doubt the veracity of future claims. That makes me sad and disgusted more than outraged because they do have legitimate grievances but they persist in shooting themselves in the foot with these stunts.

Outrage is when a nation uses WP, lies about it, and then attempts to justify it after exposure. Outrage is for nail bombs not Pallywood.

 

[Coyote]

White phosphorus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In its early statements the Israeli military repeatedly denied using white phosphorus, saying "We categorically deny the use of white phosphorus", and "The IDF acts only in accordance with what is permitted by international law and does not use white phosphorus." It eventually admitted its use and stopped using the shells, however, saying that a "media buzz" led to its decision to do so.[29]​

As far as "remote possibility" that it can harm a person - when you use it in densely populated areas, chances are it will harm people - as horribly as any nail bomb. It burns and can not be put out by water.

On 5 January the Times reported that telltale smoke associated with white phosphorus had been seen in areas of a shelling. On 12 January it was reported that more than 50 phosphorus burns victims were in Nasser Hospital. On 16 January the UNRWA headquarters was hit with phosphorus munitions.[41] As a result of the hit, the compound was set ablaze.[42]​

Oh, and some of the victims were children. Gaza burn victims exhibit possible signs of white phosphorous wounds - Israel News | Haaretz Daily Newspaper

Horrible way to die.

We are talking about Pallywood here not phosphorous!

We are talking about the lies of the Palestinians! the cheating of the Palestinians to get world attention!

Shame on them!

i think we are talking about the credibility of israel investgating themselves, and particularly, IDF investigations of the IDF.

And that's long been a problem with these issues.

 

[Lipush]

Does Hamas investigate itself?....

 

[Roudy]

can someone cite a link for that denial by Israel that she
used white phosphorus?as I recall----Israel said it used white
phosphorous to illuminate targets ---which is a legal
use of the stuff------at issue was whether one should use it in
densely populated areas since it may cause bodily injury---
--therefore many people condements its use
as it was used in Gaza. Of course many of those who condemn
the use of white phosphorous because of the remote possibility
that it can harm a person----are fervent supporters of
poison nail bombs hurled sometimes by the thousands at the heads
of Israeli infants-----with clear intent that such bombs do the job
they do best---smash the brains of children

White phosphorus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In its early statements the Israeli military repeatedly denied using white phosphorus, saying "We categorically deny the use of white phosphorus", and "The IDF acts only in accordance with what is permitted by international law and does not use white phosphorus." It eventually admitted its use and stopped using the shells, however, saying that a "media buzz" led to its decision to do so.[29]​

As far as "remote possibility" that it can harm a person - when you use it in densely populated areas, chances are it will harm people - as horribly as any nail bomb. It burns and can not be put out by water.

On 5 January the Times reported that telltale smoke associated with white phosphorus had been seen in areas of a shelling. On 12 January it was reported that more than 50 phosphorus burns victims were in Nasser Hospital. On 16 January the UNRWA headquarters was hit with phosphorus munitions.[41] As a result of the hit, the compound was set ablaze.[42]​

Oh, and some of the victims were children. Gaza burn victims exhibit possible signs of white phosphorous wounds - Israel News | Haaretz Daily Newspaper

Horrible way to die.

We are talking about Pallywood here not phosphorous!

We are talking about the lies of the Palestinians! the cheating of the Palestinians to get world attention!

Shame on them!

Pali supporters make it their business to use false comparisons to justify their support for Palestinian terrorism. The Al Dura incident, which was totally fake, became a battle cry for many Islamists and anti Zionist nutjobs throughout the middle east and elsewhere, and was often used to vilify Israel. Once it proved to be false, not one of those organizations came out to apologize to at least clarify. In fact there are those who still claim it to be the truth, even on this board.

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

Deach's comparison of nail bombs and
WP ---is far too obscene to even address-----
he is disgusting however---let us assume
that his statement is TRUE then I certainly
hope that given a choice between a pellet of
WP --landing 15 feet from a child near and
dear to him and a nail bomb
landing 15 feet from that child-----that
is the nail bomb that does the landing.

Source: White phosphorus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Effects on people
White phosphorus can cause injuries and even death in three ways: by burning deep into tissue, by being inhaled as a smoke, and by being ingested. Extensive exposure by burning and ingestion is fatal.

Burning
Injuries from white phosphorus.[85][86]
Incandescent particles of WP cast off by a WP weapon's initial explosion can produce extensive, deep second and third degree burns. One reason why this occurs is the tendency of the element to stick to the skin. Phosphorus burns carry a greater risk of mortality than other forms of burns due to the absorption of phosphorus into the body through the burned area, resulting in liver, heart and kidney damage, and in some cases multiple organ failure.[87] These weapons are particularly dangerous to exposed people because white phosphorus continues to burn unless deprived of oxygen or until it is completely consumed. In some cases, burns are limited to areas of exposed skin because the smaller WP particles do not burn completely through personal clothing before being consumed.
Smoke inhalation.[89]​

WP is not a "banned weapon---in
fact in the manner used by israel,
it is not a weapon at all.

Technically legal, however the manner in which it WAS used was highly controversial and made it a de-facto weapon since it was used in heavily populated civilian areas when other, less lethal, options were available.

From Wikipedia:

There are multiple international laws that could be seen to regulate white phosphorus use.[90] Article 1 of Protocol III of the Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons defines an incendiary weapon as 'any weapon or munition which is primarily designed to set fire to objects or to cause burn injury to persons through the action of flame, heat, or combination thereof, produced by a chemical reaction of a substance delivered on the target'. The same protocol prohibits the use of said incendiary weapons against civilians (already forbidden by the Geneva Conventions) or in civilian areas.

However, the use against military targets outside civilian areas is not explicitly banned by any treaty. There is a debate[who?] on whether white phosphorus should be considered a chemical weapon and thus be outlawed by the Chemical Weapons Convention (CWC) which went into effect in April 1997. The convention is meant to prohibit weapons that are "dependent on the use of the toxic properties of chemicals as a method of warfare" (Article II, Definitions, 9, "Purposes not Prohibited" c.).​

Someone
denied its use initially--shortly
thereafter ---that error was corrected
and the use of the stuff was stopped
even though it is not actually illegal
to use it

That "error". You mean like a verbal typo or something?

The "correction" occurred in January - after intense media reporting. Jan 5 - Israel categorially denied it's use. Jan 21st they finally admitted to it.

That's not "shortly thereafter".

Deach's implication that
he saw WP being used as an anti-
personnel weapon-----is a joke

No. Actually, I think Seal's right-on given several salient features:

• it was used in densly populated areas (contraindicated)
• it was used during the daylight when less lethal and equally effective smoke bombs (which Israel had available) could have been used
• yet they used the highly damaging WP

The joke is this.

We have folks making claims about how the Palestinians lie, murder and steal yet, here we have a situation where Israel acts no better.

We're expected to be outraged at the Palestinian's use of faked murders to try and make Israel look bad.

Well, in my opinion - I'm not outraged. I'm not outraged because of two reasons. Outrage is reserved for truly horrendous acts - for example, the Jordanian soldier who felt it was his "religious and moral duty" to open fire on a group of Israeli school children.

What the Palestinians do, when they pull these kind of charades, is descredit themselves and make people doubt the veracity of future claims. That makes me sad and disgusted more than outraged because they do have legitimate grievances but they persist in shooting themselves in the foot with these stunts.

Outrage is when a nation uses WP, lies about it, and then attempts to justify it after exposure. Outrage is for nail bombs not Pallywood.

Palestinians did not pull any charades, all this is is Israel trying to whitewash their unlawful killing of a Palestinian child.

 

[Roudy]

Deach's comparison of nail bombs and
WP ---is far too obscene to even address-----
he is disgusting however---let us assume
that his statement is TRUE then I certainly
hope that given a choice between a pellet of
WP --landing 15 feet from a child near and
dear to him and a nail bomb
landing 15 feet from that child-----that
is the nail bomb that does the landing.

Source: White phosphorus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Effects on people
White phosphorus can cause injuries and even death in three ways: by burning deep into tissue, by being inhaled as a smoke, and by being ingested. Extensive exposure by burning and ingestion is fatal.

Burning
Injuries from white phosphorus.[85][86]
Incandescent particles of WP cast off by a WP weapon's initial explosion can produce extensive, deep second and third degree burns. One reason why this occurs is the tendency of the element to stick to the skin. Phosphorus burns carry a greater risk of mortality than other forms of burns due to the absorption of phosphorus into the body through the burned area, resulting in liver, heart and kidney damage, and in some cases multiple organ failure.[87] These weapons are particularly dangerous to exposed people because white phosphorus continues to burn unless deprived of oxygen or until it is completely consumed. In some cases, burns are limited to areas of exposed skin because the smaller WP particles do not burn completely through personal clothing before being consumed.
Smoke inhalation.[89]​

Technically legal, however the manner in which it WAS used was highly controversial and made it a de-facto weapon since it was used in heavily populated civilian areas when other, less lethal, options were available.

From Wikipedia:

There are multiple international laws that could be seen to regulate white phosphorus use.[90] Article 1 of Protocol III of the Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons defines an incendiary weapon as 'any weapon or munition which is primarily designed to set fire to objects or to cause burn injury to persons through the action of flame, heat, or combination thereof, produced by a chemical reaction of a substance delivered on the target'. The same protocol prohibits the use of said incendiary weapons against civilians (already forbidden by the Geneva Conventions) or in civilian areas.

However, the use against military targets outside civilian areas is not explicitly banned by any treaty. There is a debate[who?] on whether white phosphorus should be considered a chemical weapon and thus be outlawed by the Chemical Weapons Convention (CWC) which went into effect in April 1997. The convention is meant to prohibit weapons that are "dependent on the use of the toxic properties of chemicals as a method of warfare" (Article II, Definitions, 9, "Purposes not Prohibited" c.).​

That "error". You mean like a verbal typo or something?

The "correction" occurred in January - after intense media reporting. Jan 5 - Israel categorially denied it's use. Jan 21st they finally admitted to it.

That's not "shortly thereafter".

Deach's implication that
he saw WP being used as an anti-
personnel weapon-----is a joke

No. Actually, I think Seal's right-on given several salient features:

• it was used in densly populated areas (contraindicated)
• it was used during the daylight when less lethal and equally effective smoke bombs (which Israel had available) could have been used
• yet they used the highly damaging WP

The joke is this.

We have folks making claims about how the Palestinians lie, murder and steal yet, here we have a situation where Israel acts no better.

We're expected to be outraged at the Palestinian's use of faked murders to try and make Israel look bad.

Well, in my opinion - I'm not outraged. I'm not outraged because of two reasons. Outrage is reserved for truly horrendous acts - for example, the Jordanian soldier who felt it was his "religious and moral duty" to open fire on a group of Israeli school children.

What the Palestinians do, when they pull these kind of charades, is descredit themselves and make people doubt the veracity of future claims. That makes me sad and disgusted more than outraged because they do have legitimate grievances but they persist in shooting themselves in the foot with these stunts.

Outrage is when a nation uses WP, lies about it, and then attempts to justify it after exposure. Outrage is for nail bombs not Pallywood.

Palestinians did not pull any charades, all this is is Israel trying to whitewash their unlawful killing of a Palestinian child.

So let me get this straight...Palestinians "DID NOT PULL CHARADES"?! Ha ha ha.