Obama Plans to Scrap Missle Defense Shield?

[PubliusInfinitum]

nice cherry picked setup of countries to fit your little analogy.

There is no 'cherry picking' those are the nations involved.

And no, NATO has no 'say' in DEFENSIVE PASSIVE defenses nor should they.

Only an idiot would argue otherwise.

So again, tell us with the Pols and the Czechs should let a Frenchman or an Englishmen tell them they can't be protected because it makes Russians upset.

Obama fucked up royally here and it will have serious consequences in foreign relations.

there are more nations involved than france and britain. but those were the two nations who had a pact with poland before wwii. yawn, try to be not so transparent.

the poles and the czechs were not going to be protected by the missile shield from the russians, hello?

but the missile shield angered the bear, so the net balance for poles and czechs is negative.

and what do poles and czechs have to say about that, you know the opinion of who you pretend to care about?

In Warsaw, Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk said Obama assured him in a phone call Thursday that U.S. plans to alter the missile defense project will not hurt Poland's security.

Tusk quoted Obama as saying the "proposal of an alternative strategy should not affect the security of Poland" or of Europe. He refused to elaborate.

i am interested in hearing what tusk says when he elaborates.
but scrapping this plan does not mean feeding poland and the czech republic to the bear.
and not to IRAN either, haha.

oh noes, obama has fucked up royally, no spin just fact. humphh.

here is more about polish reaction to the MDS

A Majority of Poles Oppose Shield

Unlike its conservative predecessor, the Tusk government hasn't made the weapons system a central foreign policy issue. In fact, Tusk may even support Obama's decision. Ultimately, Tusk wants to get re-elected as president, and the missile shield has proven extremely unpopular with voters. More than half of Poles surveyed say they are against it, with only 29 percent supporting the shield.

ROFLMNAO... Echos of Chamberlain...

 

[Si modo]

Poland and Check Republic are not happy.

We still do have a NAVY, right?

SO far ...

I'll go on record now. The Office of the Director of Intelligence and the admin have gone on record that they will combine the National Intelligence Program (NIP - supporting national policy makers) concerned with with the Military Intelligence Program (MIP - supporting military operations and activities) as they see both charges overlapping in today's world.

However, statements from the administration about an increase in budget are for this combined mentality yet compared to either the NIP or the MIP, sometimes presented even as a doubling.

I can see the combination and the ratioanle for it, but don't tell me something has doubled when you've combined two areas and compared it to just one of those areas - non-comparable. The IC is getting set up for a major cut...just a prediction. I can't imagine that anyone would think that's a good idea.

 

[L.K.Eder]

There is no 'cherry picking' those are the nations involved.

And no, NATO has no 'say' in DEFENSIVE PASSIVE defenses nor should they.

Only an idiot would argue otherwise.

So again, tell us with the Pols and the Czechs should let a Frenchman or an Englishmen tell them they can't be protected because it makes Russians upset.

Obama fucked up royally here and it will have serious consequences in foreign relations.

there are more nations involved than france and britain. but those were the two nations who had a pact with poland before wwii. yawn, try to be not so transparent.

the poles and the czechs were not going to be protected by the missile shield from the russians, hello?

but the missile shield angered the bear, so the net balance for poles and czechs is negative.

and what do poles and czechs have to say about that, you know the opinion of who you pretend to care about?





i am interested in hearing what tusk says when he elaborates.
but scrapping this plan does not mean feeding poland and the czech republic to the bear.
and not to IRAN either, haha.

oh noes, obama has fucked up royally, no spin just fact. humphh.

here is more about polish reaction to the MDS

A Majority of Poles Oppose Shield

Unlike its conservative predecessor, the Tusk government hasn't made the weapons system a central foreign policy issue. In fact, Tusk may even support Obama's decision. Ultimately, Tusk wants to get re-elected as president, and the missile shield has proven extremely unpopular with voters. More than half of Poles surveyed say they are against it, with only 29 percent supporting the shield.

ROFLMNAO... Echos of Chamberlain...

i guess it is too late to tell you to wear a helmet. this constant rolling on the floor has left obvious damage.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

It's NOT about being SOFT but allcating fund towards PROVEN weapons systems.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Once again guys.....MIRV IS THE WORD!

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

there are more nations involved than france and britain. but those were the two nations who had a pact with poland before wwii. yawn, try to be not so transparent.

the poles and the czechs were not going to be protected by the missile shield from the russians, hello?

but the missile shield angered the bear, so the net balance for poles and czechs is negative.

and what do poles and czechs have to say about that, you know the opinion of who you pretend to care about?





i am interested in hearing what tusk says when he elaborates.
but scrapping this plan does not mean feeding poland and the czech republic to the bear.
and not to IRAN either, haha.

oh noes, obama has fucked up royally, no spin just fact. humphh.

here is more about polish reaction to the MDS

ROFLMNAO... Echos of Chamberlain...

i guess it is too late to tell you to wear a helmet. this constant rolling on the floor has left obvious damage.

Well, as concessions go, that one isn't unique... but it was inevitable.

Ya did the best ya could.

 

[Si modo]

It's NOT about being SOFT but allcating fund towards PROVEN weapons systems.

Being against technology development, especially when that technology addresses new issues, is unwise at best - negligent is more likely.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Once again learn the acronym MIRV........There is NO WAY what-so-ever that a missile defense will protect ANYONE from a full scale ballistic missile attack. NEVER!!!! Get used to that fact and you will recognise that we have wasted BILLIONS on a DREAM!

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Tell me Si how does our missile defense work? Do you know?

 

[Si modo]

You need two posts for this drivel?

Once again learn the acronym MIRV........There is NO WAY what-so-ever that a missile defense will protect ANYONE from a full scale ballistic missile attack. NEVER!!!! Get used to that fact and you will recognise that we have wasted BILLIONS on a DREAM!

What are you going on about?

Tell me Si how does our missile defense work? Do you know?

As I haven't the inclination to describe it again or link to better descriptions than I already have, just read the thread.

Or continue posting your ramblings - they are marginally entertaining in a pathetic way. It matters not to me.

 

[Neser Boha]

Pentagon Confirms Major Adjustments to European Missile Shield - Political News - FOXNews.com

U.S. Senate Republican Whip Jon Kyl released a statement Thursday morning accusing the administration of caving to Russia.

"The decision announced today by the administration is dangerous and short-sighted," the Arizona Republican said. "Not only does this decision leave America vulnerable to the growing Iranian long-range missile threat, it also turns back the clock to the days of the Cold War, when Eastern Europe was considered the domain of Russia. This will be a bitter disappointment, indeed, even a warning to the people of Eastern Europe."

Obama's top military adviser, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Adm. Mike Mullen, told The Associated Press on Wednesday that the administration was "very close" to the end of a seven-month review of a missile defense shield proposal, an idea that was promoted by the George W. Bush administration. Mullen would not divulge its results.

NATO Secretary-General Anders Fogh Rasmussen called the U.S. decision "a positive step."

First off, the title of the OP is misleading. President Obama is not scrapping the defense shield, President Obama is scrapping - or rather - decided to not go further with building the Easter European Defense Shield, which doesn't have anything to do with the one on the US territory.

Secondly, since - as the article states - about 80% of the Czech population is against one of the components of the shield being built on their sovereign territory, I say hurr-fucking-ay for democracy in CZ. (my country of birth and citizenship) I believe that majority of European population is indeed against the US European defense shield.

Thirdly. I applaud Obama, it is a tough move that certainly takes balls. Is it a smart move? That remains to be seen as nobody can foretell for sure. However, I think it's time for a fresh new approach and I hope its effects will be positive.

Fourthly, Russia is a scary place with some ruthless sons of bitches in control - well, one in particular - Putin. However, they are in deep economical troubles and will be for a long time to come. I do not see any immediate or short-term danger coming from that part of the world. They've actually been very cooperative when it comes to the issue of Iran and a few others. What Russia now wants is mainly respect and that is what Obama is giving them. I don't see anything wrong with that.

The Cold War is over, Russia is not about to paint the White House red, climb out of your shelters and try to be a little - tiny little bit - Christian.

When it comes to Iran, I believe US has enough offensive power in place to bomb the crap out of that place whenever they want already. Everything else is up to diplomacy. So, let's try it on for a size.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

There are three phases of a balistic missile that you can target.....Boost which would require immediate interception by missiles very near the launch point.


Mid course which has the longest intercept phase but requires large scal missiles. Basically an ICBM but with a conventional war head to knock out an ICBM.


Reentry phase which is where MIRVS become VERY effective. Limited time to intercept and likely radio active fall out from the ICBM over large areas.

Reentry Phase

 

[Si modo]

There are three phases of a balistic missile that you can target.....Boost which would require immediate interception by missiles very near the launch point.


Mid course which has the longest intercept phase but requires large scal missiles. Basically an ICBM but with a conventional war head to knock out an ICBM.


Reentry phase which is where MIRVS become VERY effective. Limited time to intercept and likely radio active fall out from the ICBM over large areas.

Reentry Phase

And your point is what?

 

[Si modo]

Pentagon Confirms Major Adjustments to European Missile Shield - Political News - FOXNews.com

U.S. Senate Republican Whip Jon Kyl released a statement Thursday morning accusing the administration of caving to Russia.

"The decision announced today by the administration is dangerous and short-sighted," the Arizona Republican said. "Not only does this decision leave America vulnerable to the growing Iranian long-range missile threat, it also turns back the clock to the days of the Cold War, when Eastern Europe was considered the domain of Russia. This will be a bitter disappointment, indeed, even a warning to the people of Eastern Europe."

Obama's top military adviser, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Adm. Mike Mullen, told The Associated Press on Wednesday that the administration was "very close" to the end of a seven-month review of a missile defense shield proposal, an idea that was promoted by the George W. Bush administration. Mullen would not divulge its results.

NATO Secretary-General Anders Fogh Rasmussen called the U.S. decision "a positive step."

First off, the title of the OP is misleading. President Obama is not scrapping the defense shield, President Obama is scrapping - or rather - decided to not go further with building the Easter European Defense Shield, which doesn't have anything to do with the one on the US territory.

Secondly, since - as the article states - about 80% of the Czech population is against one of the components of the shield being built on their sovereign territory, I say hurr-fucking-ay for democracy in CZ. (my country of birth and citizenship) I believe that majority of European population is indeed against the US European defense shield.

Thirdly. I applaud Obama, it is a tough move that certainly takes balls. Is it a smart move? That remains to be seen as nobody can foretell for sure. However, I think it's time for a fresh new approach and I hope its effects will be positive.

Fourthly, Russia is a scary place with some ruthless sons of bitches in control - well, one in particular - Putin. However, they are in deep economical troubles and will be for a long time to come. I do not see any immediate or short-term danger coming from that part of the world. They've actually been very cooperative when it comes to the issue of Iran and a few others. What Russia now wants is mainly respect and that is what Obama is giving them. I don't see anything wrong with that.

The Cold War is over, Russia is not about to paint the White House red, climb out of your shelters and try to be a little - tiny little bit - Christian.

The defense systems on US soil are different from these. These are being scrapped.

 

[Neser Boha]

BBC NEWS | Europe | Q&A: US missile defence

Awesome article describing the history of the Eastern European defense shield and also going slightly into the technicalities of its function.

I honestly don't see why should the US public get their panties in a wad about it. I think it is completely unnecessary and if US is really and truly only afraid of N. Korea and Iran as it claims, why don't they use the Russia-rented radar in Azerbaijan - something that Russia repeatedly offered US, but US didn't bother to even as much as react on it.

 

[Si modo]

BBC NEWS | Europe | Q&A: US missile defence

Awesome article describing the history of the Eastern European defense shield and also going slightly into the technicalities of its function.

I honestly don't see why should the US public get their panties in a wad about it. I think it is completely unnecessary and if US is really and truly only afraid of N. Korea and Iran as it claims, why don't they use the Russia-rented radar in Azerbaijan - something that Russia repeatedly offered US, but US didn't bother to even as much as react on it.

Two reasons: (1) This system has two functions - detection AND intereception - the Azerbaijan system addresses only one of those functions. (2) The Russian radar is too broad and is decent for early detection. That's helpful to Russia for missiles directed at Russia, however. Our radar is more narrow-focused as is needed for mid-flight interception, which is helpful to the USA in missiles directed at us from these new nuclear weapons players. The Azerbaijan radar is of no use in that.

 

[Neser Boha]

Obama junks Bush's European missile defense plan - washingtonpost.com

Article from Washington Post.

"Our new missile defense architecture in Europe will provide stronger, smarter, and swifter defenses of American forces and America's allies," Obama said in announcing the shift, which U.S. officials said was based mainly on a May U.S. intelligence assessment that Iran's program to build a nuclear-capable long-range missile would take three years to five years longer than originally expected.

The replacement system would link smaller radar systems with a network of sensors and missiles that could be deployed at sea or on land. Some of the weaponry and sensors are ready now, and the rest would be developed over the next 10 years.

You see? No reason to go for the jugular or get your panties in a wad ... it will happen eventually, it just won't be as offensive to Russia.

The Pentagon contemplates a system of perhaps 40 missiles by 2015, at two or three sites across Europe. That would augment a larger stockpile aboard ships. The replacement system would cost an estimated $2.5 billion, compared with $5 billion over the same timeframe under the old plan. The cost savings would be less, however, because the Pentagon is locked into work on some elements of the old system.

Now, those more fiscally CONSERVATIVE of you, should be yipeeing about this.

The change comes days before Obama is to meet with Russian President Dmitry Medvedev at the United Nations and the Group of 20 economic summit. Medvedev reacted positively, calling it a "responsible move."

"The U.S. president's decision is a well-thought-out and systematic one," said Konstantin Kosachev, head of the foreign affairs committee in the State Duma, the lower house of the Russian Parliament. "Now we can talk about restoration of the strategic partnership between Russia and the United States."

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Well Si if you don't know how missile defense works or more precisely DOESN'T work then you really don't have an opinion worth taking seriously.

 

[Neser Boha]

Well Si if you don't know how missile defense works or more precisely DOESN'T work then you really don't have an opinion worth taking seriously.

If you want to convince him, maybe find a link for him - to a reliable source - where it is detailed for him. By simply repeating something over and over you wouldn't convince me either. I've read about it a couple of years back, so I know what you're talking about ...

Just sayin' ...

 

[Si modo]

Well Si if you don't know how missile defense works or more precisely DOESN'T work then you really don't have an opinion worth taking seriously.

Tell ya what. Why don't you link to a post of mine in this thread or the other that demonstrates any misunderstanding on my part about how this functions and I'll do the same for you. K, sport? You game?