Obamanuts: Are you happy about the Obamacare delay?

[usmcstinger]

I hope we can fix any problems in this bill.

Any legislative problems won't be fixed because the "loyal opposition" won't let that happen. If they weren't a bunch of RW extremist shitbags maybe they would, but they are, so they won't.


That's ok, though. The employer mandate wasn't the biggest part of this and people will still get helped by the parts that will still go into effect. IOW, unless something else happens, "Obamacare" is still set to go on schedule.

Please provide a viable source to back up you statement..

If you are happy with your present Health Care Plan you can keep it.
Not going to happen!

 

[Flopper]

If everyone complies to the mandate in obtaining insurance in 2014, there will be no need to mandate the employers in 2015.

Most companies over 50 employees already offer health insurance. Only 4% of the large employer, over 50 employees, are effected. For small businesses with fewer than 50 full-time employees, this change doesn't directly impact them. That’s because businesses with under 50 employees were not subject to the employer mandate provisions in the first place. This delay does not have a major impact on the implementation of ACA. The major impact is political.

 

[EriktheRed]

All of this is a result of a majority of the American people believe Obamacare is very bad for the country and was rammed down their throats.

Izzat a fact.

Yeah...it's a fact...Take some time to go outside your circle of liberal friends and ask around.

I'm sure you can back that up, right?

 

[hortysir]

Izzat a fact.

Yeah...it's a fact...Take some time to go outside your circle of liberal friends and ask around.

I'm sure you can back that up, right?

Is RealClearPolitics a "reliable source" for you?

RealClearPolitics - Election Other - Public Approval of Obama's Health Care Law

 

[hortysir]

Sorry, Erik that poll was from 2012

Here ya go:
(this one's Kaiser, tho)

 

[Flopper]

I know a man and woman who have conditions which preclude coverage at any price. Beginning next January they will be able to finally get health insurance at a reasonable price -- all thanks to Obamacare.

Your friends do not have to wait until January, anyone with a pre-existing condition can sign up for Obamacare right now. A friend of mind already has it.

Has WHAT?
Sorry, what they 'have' is nothing to do with Obamacare. It does not implement until 2014. AND it may be delayed. It is not fully funded yet.
And there is no way a 'carte blanche' unregulated coverage of pre-existing conditions is possible...
In its present form, ACA is going to cost working middle and upper income people tons of money. That is an inescapable truth. And the most criminal issue with it is that the government will 'hide' the cost in payroll deductions and confiscation of tax refunds.
People will be writing big checks to the IRS every April.
This thing SUCKS.

The exchanges open in Oct. so you can choose a policy but it does not go into effect until 2014. Essentially anyone will be able to use the exchanges if you don't can't get coverage through your employer.

You can still get individual insurance if need the coverage this year. If you have minor pre-existing conditions you may qualify. If you have more serious pre-existing condition, then your only option is a state operated high risk pool, which is problematic.

 

[Flopper]

I bet the ObamaCare delay for employers also covers Congress and government employees...who were all hyperventilating about being forced onto the exchanges.

Congress members and staffers will be required to buy insurance through the exchanges. The delay has no effect on them. Government employees are treated just like businesses over 50 employees so technically the delay applies. However, since the polices offered by the federal government meet essentially all requirements of ACA it's a mute point.

FactCheck.org : Congress and an Exemption from ?Obamacare??

 

[Flopper]

I bet the ObamaCare delay for employers also covers Congress and government employees...who were all hyperventilating about being forced onto the exchanges.

The order delays the requirement that employers with over 50 employees must offer health insurance. That's it. The rest of ACA, health insurance exchanges, elimination of pre-existing conditions, lifetime maximums, extended Medicaid coverage, and other provisions continue as scheduled.

It sounds like the delay is warranted.

For political reasons for sure.

So tell me.....INDIVIDUALS are REQUIRED to comply through the Exchanges jan 1, correct?

That's my understanding. However, since most of these business would opt to pay the $2,000 fee so their employees can buy through the exchanges. The looser in this delay is going be the government, not the employer or the employee. The business will not have to offer health insurance in 2014 and won't have to pay the fee.

Starting in 2015, an employer with more than 50 full-time employees without affordable insurance may be required a $2,000 fee per full-time employee after the first 30 employees. The delay means employers now have more time to determine if they must provide insurance to their employees for various reasons or if it's better to pay the fee and send employees to the government's health care exchanges.\
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/07/03/how-hc-delay-will-affect-budget/2486499/

 

[EriktheRed]

Sorry, Erik that poll was from 2012

Here ya go:
(this one's Kaiser, tho)

More up-to-date than the first source, but neither breaks down the reasons for negative feelings.

It's been pointed out many times in the past that if one looked at the reasons why people disapproved of "Obamacare", it would show that a subset of them didn't like it because it didn't go far enough in the direction of single-payer. Couple that with those who approve of the ACA and you actually have a majority that don't agree with the Republican view of it. I'm gonna go out on a limb, too, and say I don't believe a lot of those who disapprove of it because it's not "socialist" enough want to go backwards and repeal it.

 

[Flopper]

Sorry, Erik that poll was from 2012

Here ya go:
(this one's Kaiser, tho)

More up-to-date than the first source, but neither breaks down the reasons for negative feelings.

It's been pointed out many times in the past that if one looked at the reasons why people disapproved of "Obamacare", it would show that a subset of them didn't like it because it didn't go far enough in the direction of single-payer. Couple that with those who approve of the ACA and you actually have a majority that don't agree with the Republican view of it. I'm gonna go out on a limb, too, and say I don't believe a lot of those who disapprove of it because it's not "socialist" enough want to go backwards and repeal it.

I think you're right. There is something for just about everyone to hate in the ACA, employer mandates, employee mandates, lack of single payer, lack of true universal coverage, more government regulations, fear of higher premiums, fear of doctor shortage, fear of rising cost, and more profits for insurance companies. However, I seriously doubt that very many people really want to return to 2008 with 50 million people without health insurance and the number rising yearly, people being denied coverage for pre-existing converge, and insurance companies refusing to pay because you got too sick.

Just repealing the ACA is nearly impossible. If it was repealed, it would have to be replaced and that would be the problem. The Republican Healthcare plan was a plan to transition form the 2008 healthcare system. A Republican replacement plan could not ignore the ACA. It would have to transition from the ACA to a replacement plan which would be much harder than going from the 2008 system.

I do believe the ACA is going to be amended. There are things that are not going to work, and things that are going have to be changed plus there's going to be needed enhancements that will become obvious. This is what happened with Social Security and Medicare and it will happen with the ACA.

 

[EriktheRed]

Sorry, Erik that poll was from 2012

Here ya go:
(this one's Kaiser, tho)

More up-to-date than the first source, but neither breaks down the reasons for negative feelings.

It's been pointed out many times in the past that if one looked at the reasons why people disapproved of "Obamacare", it would show that a subset of them didn't like it because it didn't go far enough in the direction of single-payer. Couple that with those who approve of the ACA and you actually have a majority that don't agree with the Republican view of it. I'm gonna go out on a limb, too, and say I don't believe a lot of those who disapprove of it because it's not "socialist" enough want to go backwards and repeal it.

I think you're right. There is something for just about everyone to hate in the ACA, employer mandates, employee mandates, lack of single payer, lack of true universal coverage, more government regulations, fear of higher premiums, fear of doctor shortage, fear of rising cost, and more profits for insurance companies. However, I seriously doubt that very many people really want to return to 2008 with 50 million people without health insurance and the number rising yearly, people being denied coverage for pre-existing converge, and insurance companies refusing to pay because you got too sick.

Just repealing the ACA is nearly impossible. If it was repealed, it would have to be replaced and that would be the problem. The Republican Healthcare plan was a plan to transition form the 2008 healthcare system. A Republican replacement plan could not ignore the ACA. It would have to transition from the ACA to a replacement plan which would be much harder than going from the 2008 system.

I do believe the ACA is going to be amended. There are things that are not going to work, and things that are going have to be changed plus there's going to be needed enhancements that will become obvious. This is what happened with Social Security and Medicare and it will happen with the ACA.

I don't see any kind of amending with the current makeup of Congress, myself. These guys have shown they have no interest in making the law better nor do they seem to really give a shit what the fallout might be from the total repeal that they're salivating over if they actually got it.

 

[thereisnospoon]

If everyone complies to the mandate in obtaining insurance in 2014, there will be no need to mandate the employers in 2015.

Most companies over 50 employees already offer health insurance. Only 4% of the large employer, over 50 employees, are effected. For small businesses with fewer than 50 full-time employees, this change doesn't directly impact them. That’s because businesses with under 50 employees were not subject to the employer mandate provisions in the first place. This delay does not have a major impact on the implementation of ACA. The major impact is political.

And most employers of small size will stop offering health insurance and send their employees to the exchanges because the fines cost less than providing insurance.
That provision was inserted deliberately. It was done to encourage people to look to government for insurance. The precursor to single payer.

 

[EriktheRed]

If everyone complies to the mandate in obtaining insurance in 2014, there will be no need to mandate the employers in 2015.

Most companies over 50 employees already offer health insurance. Only 4% of the large employer, over 50 employees, are effected. For small businesses with fewer than 50 full-time employees, this change doesn't directly impact them. That’s because businesses with under 50 employees were not subject to the employer mandate provisions in the first place. This delay does not have a major impact on the implementation of ACA. The major impact is political.

And most employers of small size will stop offering health insurance and send their employees to the exchanges because the fines cost less than providing insurance.
That provision was inserted deliberately. It was done to encourage people to look to government for insurance. The precursor to single payer.

Yeah, ain't it great?

 

[thereisnospoon]

Most companies over 50 employees already offer health insurance. Only 4% of the large employer, over 50 employees, are effected. For small businesses with fewer than 50 full-time employees, this change doesn't directly impact them. That’s because businesses with under 50 employees were not subject to the employer mandate provisions in the first place. This delay does not have a major impact on the implementation of ACA. The major impact is political.

And most employers of small size will stop offering health insurance and send their employees to the exchanges because the fines cost less than providing insurance.
That provision was inserted deliberately. It was done to encourage people to look to government for insurance. The precursor to single payer.

Yeah, ain't it great?

Yer kidding, right?
Just how do you intend on funding a 100% on demand free of out of pocket expense medical system for 315 million people?
This is 30% of the US economy.. Over $4 trillion dollars. More than the entire budget of the federal government.
Income taxes would have to quadruple just to break even. All medical professionals would have to become defacto federal employees.
In a few words.It ain't happenin'.

 

[Interpol]

I don't think the delay is very troubling. The Chamber of Commerce isn't very troubled by it either. In fact they support the President's one year delay.

I highly support the healthcare exchanges in Obamacare. They are already proving effective in states.

I think the naysayers have been wrong about all of their predictions so far. In the last 5 years they've told us that healthcare spending would go up, but in fact it has slowed some because of the cost-control measures and other cuts the President implemented.

As a practical issue, I think a public option would eliminate there even having to be an employer mandate. Why even get employers involved in healthcare administration stuff?

In some ways, I don't think Obamacare went far enough. A totally private healthcare system has given us the most expensive system on the planet and with no better results than countries that spend half the amount as we do. I rather like the idea that employers and insurance companies are not even players on the scene. Just you, your healthcare provider, and a healthcare plan that is made affordable by laws that make sure healthcare is about getting people healthy instead of being about the profit motive.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I don't think the delay is very troubling. The Chamber of Commerce isn't very troubled by it either. In fact they support the President's one year delay.

I highly support the healthcare exchanges in Obamacare. They are already proving effective in states.

I think the naysayers have been wrong about all of their predictions so far. In the last 5 years they've told us that healthcare spending would go up, but in fact it has slowed some because of the cost-control measures and other cuts the President implemented.

As a practical issue, I think a public option would eliminate there even having to be an employer mandate. Why even get employers involved in healthcare administration stuff?

In some ways, I don't think Obamacare went far enough. A totally private healthcare system has given us the most expensive system on the planet and with no better results than countries that spend half the amount as we do. I rather like the idea that employers and insurance companies are not even players on the scene. Just you, your healthcare provider, and a healthcare plan that is made affordable by laws that make sure healthcare is about getting people healthy instead of being about the profit motive.

"Totally private"? Really?

 

[Stephanie]

too bad for Obama he isn't a dictator and can say we won't follow OUR OWN RULES written whenever WE FUCKING feel it..you people are lame you won't hold this man to account

if he is going to do anything like a dictator then TRASH this whole piece of socialist shit legislation

 

[Synthaholic]

Yup....
It's the "law of the land". Deal with it!!!


UnitedHealth to exit individual insurance market in California - latimes.com
And that's just the first drop in the proverbial bucket!

Do you even read your own links?

Both companies will keep a major presence in California, focusing instead on large and small employers.

UHC, alone, is severing ties with 8,000 people. Leaving them high and dry.

Remember that whole, "If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it" part?

Fucking tool

They must have figured it was 8,000 people who they weren't going to be able to screw over any longer.

 

[Synthaholic]

Do you like having to rely on low information voters to win elections?

You tell us, Sparky.

Fact...Most uninformed or low info voters vote democrat.
They also avoid challenges( which are viewed by them as problems) by taking the path of least resistance. And because the democrat party is the home of the social safety net, people who are uninformed will vote for those who provide that safety net which to them represents the path of least resistance.

Fact. You're full of shit.

 

[Synthaholic]

That was precisely my point in a health care system where the individual chose a provider and a plan over the employer providing it. This way it would be a part of their individual coverage when they travel from employer to employer. How often do people have to wait until they acquired a certain amount of hours first, simply because they have signed on with a new employer? I have not heard Obamacare changing THAT policy standard. Individual plans would require less paperwork, as you take it with you, unless you opt to change coverages.

OK. It's a solution to problem but that's not our world and it's not likely to be in the near future.

As long as we're dreaming, though, let's dream of universal, single-payer. The government provides health insurance to everyone. Call it Medicare Part E because Everyone is covered whether employed or not, rich or poor or anything else. It never lapses, never is cancelled and covers everything. That would be the best possible solution.

One man's dream is another man's nightmare, eh? On this July 4th, I'm going to suggest we remain free to decide for ourselves how to manage our healthcare costs.

^^^the right wing thought process revealed!

You are not managing your costs - corporations and their death panels are deciding your costs. And when they decide to raise their costs they do it together. You have no "choice". Just the choice to keep paying more.