pro or contra Israel today?

i … feel …


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how do you feel?

I'm not totally unsympathetic to the plight of the Palestinians and would never suggest Israel to be totally blameless in their long conflict, but this was not a solution and cannot be justified as an attack on civilians that will only escalate tensions leading to more blood spilled.
 
I'm not totally unsympathetic to the plight of the Palestinians and would never suggest Israel to be totally blameless in their long conflict, but this was not a solution and cannot be justified as an attack on civilians that will only escalate tensions leading to more blood spilled.
This invasion does more than that. It demonstrates that the whole concept of border security with the Palestinian terrorists in control of Gaza is simply not viable. If you recall, Sharon ordered the IDF to withdraw from Gaza as a part of an effort that was supposed to lead to a peace treaty with the Palestinian Authority, but Abbas quickly lost control of Gaza to Hamas, making a peace treaty with the PA meaningless.

Clearly, Israel will not be able to protect its citizens unless it reoccupies Gaza and eliminates the terrorists there, but this will be met with harsh responses from Israel's presumed allies in the US and Europe, and the Israeli left will join Israel's critics to oppose this reoccupation of Gaza, and it remains to be seen if the Israeli government can rally enough popular support to follow through or if it will be forced to continue the present failed security policy of leaving the Gaza terrorist in charge of Gaza and only try to defend Israel's border with Gaza and fight new wars every few years with higher and higher casualties each time.
 
The time has come to put that to the test...
If they try it, Europe will stop trading with them, and pretty much the end of their economy.


Immaterial to the point that "Palestine" has never, EVER been a "country" in its own right.

It doesn't mean they don't exist as a people, which is what you Zionist apologists try to claim.

And now they're paying the price for that folly of theirs.

Are they, though? They've been putting up with 70 years of constant Zionist abuse. The Zionists will blow up a few empty buildings, but they don't have enough ordnance to level the place.

Nope. Forced population transfer. Like the Russians did to the Cossacks. Or the Czechs to the Sudatenland Germans. Or the Poles to the Silesian Germans. REAL genocide is the slaughter-to-extinction of a people. Population transfer is different.

This has become a matter of removing a prove-able existential threat to the Jews of Israel. At least the Jews would be shifting people around rather than driving them into the sea and slaughtering them like the Muslims have often proposed.

What you are proposing is Ethnic Cleansing. This is considered a war crime in most of the world.

All it takes is a 4-5 day advance notice to leave or suffer death by bombardment. They'll move.
And if they don't the Zionists will commit war crimes.

Let's be blunt, Hamas has already achieved it's objective, to make Bibi's government look incompetent.
 
This invasion does more than that. It demonstrates that the whole concept of border security with the Palestinian terrorists in control of Gaza is simply not viable. If you recall, Sharon ordered the IDF to withdraw from Gaza as a part of an effort that was supposed to lead to a peace treaty with the Palestinian Authority, but Abbas quickly lost control of Gaza to Hamas, making a peace treaty with the PA meaningless.

Clearly, Israel will not be able to protect its citizens unless it reoccupies Gaza and eliminates the terrorists there, but this will be met with harsh responses from Israel's presumed allies in the US and Europe, and the Israeli left will join Israel's critics to oppose this reoccupation of Gaza, and it remains to be seen if the Israeli government can rally enough popular support to follow through or if it will be forced to continue the present failed security policy of leaving the Gaza terrorist in charge of Gaza and only try to defend Israel's border with Gaza and fight new wars every few years with higher and higher casualties each time.

The problem the Zionist Entity has is that reoccupying Gaza and the West Bank means they have to institute a form of Apartheid to keep the Palistinians under control. That is equally unacceptable to the world community.

The Two-State solution WOULD work if the Zionists were actually FAIRLY redistributing the land.

There are 6 million Jews in Israel. There are 2 million Palestinians in Gaza. there are three million in the west bank. There are 1 million within the 1967 boundaries. Only this one million have any political rights in the Knesset. The Two-state solution allows the Zionists to pretend they are a democracy when they really aren't.
 
The problem the Zionist Entity has is that reoccupying Gaza and the West Bank means they have to institute a form of Apartheid to keep the Palistinians under control. That is equally unacceptable to the world community.

The Two-State solution WOULD work if the Zionists were actually FAIRLY redistributing the land.

There are 6 million Jews in Israel. There are 2 million Palestinians in Gaza. there are three million in the west bank. There are 1 million within the 1967 boundaries. Only this one million have any political rights in the Knesset. The Two-state solution allows the Zionists to pretend they are a democracy when they really aren't.
First off, there is no Palestinian leader who can credibly offer peace to Israel, so there is no diplomatic solution to this problem, and that means Israel will have only as much peace from the Palestinians as the IDF can get. The only relevant question for Israel is whether the Israeli government can adequately protect the people by only defending the border with Gaza or does it have to reoccupy Gaza to protect the Israeli people, and recent experience clearly shows Israel must reoccupy Gaza to protect the Israeli people.
 
Sure I do. A terrorist is a freedom fighter who we don't like.

One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.
Actually, a person can be both a freedom fighter and a terrorist at the same time. A terrorist is defined by his actions, not by his motivation. If a person targets civilians in the hope of creating panic that will cause his enemy to give him what he wants, he is a terrorist regardless of the cause he is fighting for. Clearly, Israel is being attacked by terrorists from Gaza.
 
One Man's Terrorist is Another Man's Freedom Fighter.
That is 100% incorrect. "Freedom" is a goal, while "terrorism" is a means to a goal. They are completely different things. You can fight for freedom, but if you use terrorism in that fight, you are a terrorist.
 
Sure I do. A terrorist is a freedom fighter who we don't like.

One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.
You really need to find a dictionary. You are confused about basic word definitions.
 
The problem the Zionist Entity has is that reoccupying Gaza and the West Bank means they have to institute a form of Apartheid to keep the Palistinians under control. That is equally unacceptable to the world community.

The Two-State solution WOULD work if the Zionists were actually FAIRLY redistributing the land.

There are 6 million Jews in Israel. There are 2 million Palestinians in Gaza. there are three million in the west bank. There are 1 million within the 1967 boundaries. Only this one million have any political rights in the Knesset. The Two-state solution allows the Zionists to pretend they are a democracy when they really aren't.
Hamas DOES NOT want half they want it all and have refused for years any deal no matter how sweet, you are delusional as are most Islam supporters in the west ignoring the atrocities and provocations of Islam while blaming everyone but the Arabs for their behavior.
 
how do you feel?
There are no good guys there.

Each side wants to destroy the other.
Each side wants the other to live in slavery.

The people are the victims but they the ones responsible for allowing all this and they are the only ones who can stop it.

The US should tell both sides to pound sand and when the sides realize the world isn't going to stop this lunacy perhaps clearer minds will finally prevail.
 
If they try it, Europe will stop trading with them, and pretty much the end of their economy.
Doubtful... especially in the face of the Ukraine precedent, where Europe is beginning to show backbone once again.

And even if that happens, the United States will prop-up the Israelis until things cool down... a few years at best.

It doesn't mean they don't exist as a people, which is what you Zionist apologists try to claim.
But they do NOT exist as a people... they are the rag-tag remnants of several tribes, some old residents, some fairly new.
Are they, though? They've been putting up with 70 years of constant Zionist abuse.
Then it's time to shove them forcibly over to the East Bank of the Jordan... permanently.
The Zionists will blow up a few empty buildings, but they don't have enough ordnance to level the place.
I suspect that we are about to learn whether that is true.
What you are proposing is Ethnic Cleansing. This is considered a war crime in most of the world.
Better to "cleanse" an area and yet leave the former inhabitants alive, rather than slaughtering them, yes?
And if they don't the Zionists will commit war crimes.
This is going to end with an Israeli "Win".
Let's be blunt, Hamas has already achieved it's objective, to make Bibi's government look incompetent.
And now they're about to learn the price of that idiocy... it is not going to tally-up as a "fair trade" for Hamas.
 
First off, there is no Palestinian leader who can credibly offer peace to Israel, so there is no diplomatic solution to this problem, and that means Israel will have only as much peace from the Palestinians as the IDF can get.
Well, since no one wants peace with the Zionist Entity, that's just as well.


The only relevant question for Israel is whether the Israeli government can adequately protect the people by only defending the border with Gaza or does it have to reoccupy Gaza to protect the Israeli people, and recent experience clearly shows Israel must reoccupy Gaza to protect the Israeli people.

Occupations don't work. If they did, the Zionist Entity wouldn't have withdrawn to start with.

Actually, a person can be both a freedom fighter and a terrorist at the same time. A terrorist is defined by his actions, not by his motivation.

Not at all.

If a person targets civilians in the hope of creating panic that will cause his enemy to give him what he wants, he is a terrorist regardless of the cause he is fighting for.

There's a great movie, called "THe Battle of Algiers" about the French war in Algeria. And the French catch a rebel leader and ask him why they put bombs in women's baskets, and the leader replies, "Why do you drop bombs from planes?"

The Zionists have been bombing Gaza, the West Bank, Lebanon for years "terrorizing' those people. I just ain't seeing a moral "high ground".

Clearly, Israel is being attacked by terrorists from Gaza.
No, they are being attacked by Palestinians who don't want Zionists on their land.
 
Well, since no one wants peace with the Zionist Entity, that's just as well.




Occupations don't work. If they did, the Zionist Entity wouldn't have withdrawn to start with.



Not at all.



There's a great movie, called "THe Battle of Algiers" about the French war in Algeria. And the French catch a rebel leader and ask him why they put bombs in women's baskets, and the leader replies, "Why do you drop bombs from planes?"

The Zionists have been bombing Gaza, the West Bank, Lebanon for years "terrorizing' those people. I just ain't seeing a moral "high ground".


No, they are being attacked by Palestinians who don't want Zionists on their land.
No one wants peace with Israel? what fucking world do you live in? Israel has made peace with most all her neighbors except the stupid ones.
 
Doubtful... especially in the face of the Ukraine precedent, where Europe is beginning to show backbone once again.
Europe doesn't care for the Zionists that much. If anything, the "Ukraine precedent' would obligate them to take the side of the Palestinians.
And even if that happens, the United States will prop-up the Israelis until things cool down... a few years at best.
If the Zionist try to ethnically cleanse 5 million people, it won't "blow over in a few years".

But they do NOT exist as a people... they are the rag-tag remnants of several tribes, some old residents, some fairly new.

If you need to tell yourself that to feel better about yourself, go ahead. I'm sure the Hall monitor at Dachau try to tell himself the same thing.

Then it's time to shove them forcibly over to the East Bank of the Jordan... permanently.

Again, ethnically cleansing 5 million people would be an outrage the world wouldn't stand for.

I suspect that we are about to learn whether that is true.
More likely, the Zionists will do what they always do... they'll overreach. Just like they did after 9/11 and AIPAC used that get us to take out Saddam.
Better to "cleanse" an area and yet leave the former inhabitants alive, rather than slaughtering them, yes?

Uh, no, either one would be a complete atrocity. I suspect even decent minded Jews in Israel will object, especially when they start discussing how Bibi missed this to start with.

This is going to end with an Israeli "Win".
Any minute now. This has been going on for 70 years. But any minute now, they are going to "win". I know you really need to believe that.
And now they're about to learn the price of that idiocy... it is not going to tally-up as a "fair trade" for Hamas.
Actually, the Palestinians have already gotten what they want. The Saudis certainly won't go forward with the peace deal with the Zionist Entity.
 

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