Should anorexics/bulemics and bullied gay teens be deprived of constitutional rights?

[novasteve]

Holy shit. It is difficult to knock off enough brain voltage to deal with this kind of ignorance.

The legislature defines the process whereby someone can be denied a gun permit.

If the whackjob is unhappy with his doctor's assessment of his proneness to violence, he can contest it, and then a judge will determines whether a doctor's assessment of a patient's volatility was properly done.

See? I don't have to define violent danger. That's the professional's job based on his experience. "Gee, every time we let a patient have a gun who says they want to shoot everyone, it turns out badly. Now this guy says he wants to shoot everyone. I wonder if we should give him a gun?"




You have legal and medical recourse. And you pay for it. Just like you pay for a lawyer if you are accused of a crime you did not commit.

Got a better system? You seem to want violent whackjobs to be able to get guns.

DEFINE VIOLENT. Do you not admit the word doesn't have a clear meaning? Surely it would cover if you stabbed yourself, but would it include making yourself vomit? Would it cover someone who is a cutter? The judicial system clarifies legislation with unclear words by helping to define the words. So now it's YOUR job to find how they define violent for purposes of people with mental illnesses who were involutarily committed. Seriously, if someone had a sexual addiction and was committed because they did that Carradine thing, woudl that constitute violence? Unless you find me an answer to my question, you don't know what you are talking about.

The definition of violent crime suggests that violence is a behavior by persons, against persons or property that intentionally threatens, attempts, or actually inflicts physical harm. The seriousness of the injuries to the victim(s), whether or not guns or other weapons were used and/or whether or not the alleged perpetrator has a criminal record will alter the crime's seriousness.

Often times, violent crimes against individuals and their property are typically infused with hatred, or at the very least an incredible disregard for the worth and rights of another human being which may also alter the crimes severity in the eyes of a judge or jury. The most common violent crimes are aggravated assault, arson, assault and battery, domestic violence, hate crimes, homicide, manslaughter, mayhem, murder, terrorism and theft/larceny.

Violent Crimes Law & Legal Definition

vomiting causes physical harm, especially when it's not biologically necessary. Ever seen what happens to the throats and teeth of bulemics?

 

[Michelle420]

DEFINE VIOLENT. Do you not admit the word doesn't have a clear meaning? Surely it would cover if you stabbed yourself, but would it include making yourself vomit? Would it cover someone who is a cutter? The judicial system clarifies legislation with unclear words by helping to define the words. So now it's YOUR job to find how they define violent for purposes of people with mental illnesses who were involutarily committed. Seriously, if someone had a sexual addiction and was committed because they did that Carradine thing, woudl that constitute violence? Unless you find me an answer to my question, you don't know what you are talking about.

The definition of violent crime suggests that violence is a behavior by persons, against persons or property that intentionally threatens, attempts, or actually inflicts physical harm. The seriousness of the injuries to the victim(s), whether or not guns or other weapons were used and/or whether or not the alleged perpetrator has a criminal record will alter the crime's seriousness.

Often times, violent crimes against individuals and their property are typically infused with hatred, or at the very least an incredible disregard for the worth and rights of another human being which may also alter the crimes severity in the eyes of a judge or jury. The most common violent crimes are aggravated assault, arson, assault and battery, domestic violence, hate crimes, homicide, manslaughter, mayhem, murder, terrorism and theft/larceny.

Violent Crimes Law & Legal Definition

vomiting causes physical harm, especially when it's not biologically necessary. Ever seen what happens to the throats and teeth of bulemics?

If you put your finger down my throat forcefully I will take it as a threat sure

 

[novasteve]

Violent Crimes Law & Legal Definition

vomiting causes physical harm, especially when it's not biologically necessary. Ever seen what happens to the throats and teeth of bulemics?

If you put your finger down my throat forcefully I will take it as a threat sure

Vomiting damages your esophagus and it damages teeth, which causes medical costs

 

[Michelle420]

vomiting causes physical harm, especially when it's not biologically necessary. Ever seen what happens to the throats and teeth of bulemics?

If you put your finger down my throat forcefully I will take it as a threat sure

Vomiting damages your esophagus and it damages teeth, which causes medical costs

read the legal definition I posted you have to "intentionally" do harm to other persons.

I can't make you acknowledge something if you just don' want to steve.

 

[novasteve]

If you put your finger down my throat forcefully I will take it as a threat sure

Vomiting damages your esophagus and it damages teeth, which causes medical costs

read the legal definition I posted you have to "intentionally" do harm to other persons.

I can't make you acknowledge something if you just don' want to steve.

Ah, then clearly by that definition suicidal people or people who cause harm against themselves aren't covered, DESPITE the definition in the statute we are talking about.

 

[Michelle420]

Vomiting damages your esophagus and it damages teeth, which causes medical costs

read the legal definition I posted you have to "intentionally" do harm to other persons.

I can't make you acknowledge something if you just don' want to steve.

Ah, then clearly by that definition suicidal people or people who cause harm against themselves aren't covered, DESPITE the definition in the statute we are talking about.

Steve, didn't you read where I said that in some states people who attempt suicide and get hospitalized are not allowed a drivers license without a doctor's note saying they are better?

 

[novasteve]

read the legal definition I posted you have to "intentionally" do harm to other persons.

I can't make you acknowledge something if you just don' want to steve.

Ah, then clearly by that definition suicidal people or people who cause harm against themselves aren't covered, DESPITE the definition in the statute we are talking about.

Steve, didn't you read where I said that in some states people who attempt suicide and get hospitalized are not allowed a drivers license without a doctor's note saying they are better?

So why did you provide a definition of violence that was defined as impacting OTHER people?

 

[Michelle420]

Ah, then clearly by that definition suicidal people or people who cause harm against themselves aren't covered, DESPITE the definition in the statute we are talking about.

Steve, didn't you read where I said that in some states people who attempt suicide and get hospitalized are not allowed a drivers license without a doctor's note saying they are better?

So why did you provide a definition of violence that was defined as impacting OTHER people?

It is the legal definition.

Legal definitions are sometimes different then personal definitions.
If someone has been hospitalized because they are dangerous or could bring harm to others they have to have a note to from a doctor to own a firearm or drive a vehicle.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

A link to the actual law would be helpful.

It is too bad we don't have something where people could look up things when they have questions, maybe we should call it the Internet, if anyone ever figures out how to build it.

 

[Michelle420]

Okay. Found it: http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/2013RS/bills/sb/sb0281t.pdf

The ALL CAPS is in the actual bill. The bolding is mine.

(b) A firearm application shall contain:
(2) the date and time that the firearm applicant delivered the 10 completed firearm application to the prospective seller or transferor; [and]
(3) a statement by the firearm applicant under the penalty of perjury 12 that the firearm applicant:
(i) is at least 21 years old;
(ii) has never been convicted of a disqualifying crime;
(iii) has never been convicted of a violation classified as a common law crime and received a term of imprisonment of more than 2 years;
(iv) is not a fugitive from justice;
(v) is not a habitual drunkard;
(vi) is not addicted to a controlled dangerous substance or is not a habitual user;
(VII) DOES NOT SUFFER FROM A MENTAL DISORDER AS DEFINED IN § 10–101(F)(2) OF THE HEALTH – GENERAL ARTICLE AND HAVE A HISTORY OF VIOLENT BEHAVIOR AGAINST THEMSELVES OR ANOTHER, UNLESS THE PERSON HAS A PHYSICIAN’S CERTIFICATE THAT THE PERSON IS CAPABLE OF POSSESSING A REGULATED FIREARM WITHOUT UNDUE DANGER TO THE PERSON OR TO ANOTHER;

Okay, novasteve? Your fears are misplaced.

An anorexic is not going to be denied a firearm based on their anorexia. The physician just needs to provide a certificate the anorexic is capable of possessing a regulated firearm without undue danger to themselves or another person.

Only the violently mentally ill would be denied if this becomes law.

A link to the actual law would be helpful.

It is too bad we don't have something where people could look up things when they have questions, maybe we should call it the Internet, if anyone ever figures out how to build it.

g5000 provided the link, instead of just rhetoric

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Okay. Found it: http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/2013RS/bills/sb/sb0281t.pdf

The ALL CAPS is in the actual bill. The bolding is mine.

(b) A firearm application shall contain:
(2) the date and time that the firearm applicant delivered the 10 completed firearm application to the prospective seller or transferor; [and]
(3) a statement by the firearm applicant under the penalty of perjury 12 that the firearm applicant:
(i) is at least 21 years old;
(ii) has never been convicted of a disqualifying crime;
(iii) has never been convicted of a violation classified as a common law crime and received a term of imprisonment of more than 2 years;
(iv) is not a fugitive from justice;
(v) is not a habitual drunkard;
(vi) is not addicted to a controlled dangerous substance or is not a habitual user;
(VII) DOES NOT SUFFER FROM A MENTAL DISORDER AS DEFINED IN § 10–101(F)(2) OF THE HEALTH – GENERAL ARTICLE AND HAVE A HISTORY OF VIOLENT BEHAVIOR AGAINST THEMSELVES OR ANOTHER, UNLESS THE PERSON HAS A PHYSICIAN’S CERTIFICATE THAT THE PERSON IS CAPABLE OF POSSESSING A REGULATED FIREARM WITHOUT UNDUE DANGER TO THE PERSON OR TO ANOTHER;

Okay, novasteve? Your fears are misplaced.

An anorexic is not going to be denied a firearm based on their anorexia. The physician just needs to provide a certificate the anorexic is capable of possessing a regulated firearm without undue danger to themselves or another person.

Only the violently mentally ill would be denied if this becomes law.

It turns out someone actually did invent the Internet, and it turns out that Section 10 - 101 of the Maryland Health Code defines mental disorder as

(f) (1) "Mental disorder" means a behavioral or emotional illness that results from a psychiatric or neurological disorder.
(2) "Mental disorder" includes a mental illness that so substantially impairs the mental or emotional functioning of an individual as to make care or treatment necessary or advisable for the welfare of the individual or for the safety of the person or property of another.

(3) "Mental disorder" does not include mental retardation.

Section 10-101 :: Maryland Health - General :: 2005 :: Maryland Code :: US Codes and Statutes :: US Law :: Justia

That, in case you are challenged in English, means that anyone who is hospitalized for an eating disorder is actually covered under the law unless they get a doctor's certificate. Why, exactly, should someone who has anorexia need clearance from a doctor to buy a gun?

Ever get tired of being wrong?

 

[Unkotare]

So you are calling bullied gay teens whackjobs?

I'm calling YOU a whackjob. Based on this thread alone I wouldn't want you to have access to a firearm, or an automobile, or dinnerware, or shoes with laces, or...

 

[Chassit]

We leave these decision to professionals and let them determine if giving you a gun is a good idea.

Why should we trust them, as you put it?

Because they have the education and experience in the relevant spheres. Duh.

Sorry I missed this response until now. As someone that's been on this planet for a while now I can attest that just because someone knows, thinks they know or should know something doesn't mean that they do and even IF they do there is no guarantee that they will make the correct choice. Especially seeing how this kind of choice is more opinion than anything else.