CDZ Squatter Rights

[Anathema]

This is what I am against. This screwed up idea that human beings can claim ownership over something when they have no substantive backing, outside a government contracted recognition of property.

Ah, but my family's right to the property I mentioned earlier is backed up by more than just a deed.... its,backed up by GUNS and a significant willingness to use them on other human beings when necessary.

 

[Onyx]

no people don't

scumbag pieces of shit criminals do

So no one would back your claim?

Okay, so either you are contradicting your own position or you did not understand what I just said.

 

[Onyx]

Argue all you want if I have the deed it is my land

not only would I have your mooching ass arrested I would then sue you for all my legal costs

Right, so if I had a piece of paper that said you were my property....

 

[Onyx]

Ah, but my family's right to the property I mentioned earlier is backed up by more than just a deed.... its,backed up by GUNS and a significant willingness to use them on other human beings when necessary.

Okay, now that brings up a question of ethics.

If your family has been siting on unused land hundreds of miles away since 1788, that makes you guys dicks. Period.

 

[Onyx]

So you support stealing what belongs to someone else?

It isn't stealing if you do not own it. You cannot claim ownership over something that you have abandoned.

The only relevant question is how long it takes before something can be considered abandoned.

 

[Skull Pilot]

no people don't

scumbag pieces of shit criminals do

So no one would back your claim?

Okay, so either you are contradicting your own position or you did not understand what I just said.

My claim?

I would never take someone else's property or use it without their permission

 

[Skull Pilot]

So you support stealing what belongs to someone else?

It isn't stealing if you do not own it. You cannot claim ownership over something that you have abandoned.

The only relevant question is how long it takes before something can be considered abandoned.

If you pay taxes on the land you have not abandoned it

 

[Skull Pilot]

Ah, but my family's right to the property I mentioned earlier is backed up by more than just a deed.... its,backed up by GUNS and a significant willingness to use them on other human beings when necessary.

Okay, now that brings up a question of ethics.

If your family has been siting on unused land hundreds of miles away since 1788, that makes you guys dicks. Period.

that's not my quote

 

[Skull Pilot]

So you support stealing what belongs to someone else?

It isn't stealing if you do not own it. You cannot claim ownership over something that you have abandoned.

The only relevant question is how long it takes before something can be considered abandoned.

If own property and pay property taxes on it whether or not I live on that land or even visit it once in a while is irrelevant

 

[Skull Pilot]

Argue all you want if I have the deed it is my land

not only would I have your mooching ass arrested I would then sue you for all my legal costs

Right, so if I had a piece of paper that said you were my property....

It's illegal to own another human being

Land in case you haven't realized it is in another class.

 

[Onyx]

If you pay taxes on the land you have not abandoned it

That only works if the state is the authority on property rights, which I still disagree with.

 

[Onyx]

It's illegal to own another human being

So the law is the ultimate moral authority in the universe?

Land in case you haven't realized it is in another class.

Other class? Not sure what that means.

I find the idea that you can own pieces of the earth just as ridiculous as the idea that you can own another human being.

 

[Onyx]

that's not my quote

My bad. It is a bug that has been reported to the moderation in the past.

 

[Jarlaxle]

You are a Grade A kookburger, dude.

 

[Onyx]

You are a Grade A kookburger, dude.

Thanks mate, but remember we are in the CDZ.

Squatter rights is a signifigant modern day issue, and different countries have varying degrees of squatter rights. While I take a hardline stance on the rights of squatters, it is understandable that you may have disagreements.

I invite you to debate the arguments rather than insulting me.

 

[jillian]

So you support stealing what belongs to someone else?

It isn't stealing if you do not own it. You cannot claim ownership over something that you have abandoned.

The only relevant question is how long it takes before something can be considered abandoned.

If own property and pay property taxes on it whether or not I live on that land or even visit it once in a while is irrelevant

to have someone assert squatters right, you basically have to abandon all interest in the property for a very long time without enforcing your rights to the premises.

but yes, if you own property, pay the taxes etc, no one should be able to steal it. but...a proviso, if someone moves their butt onto your property, you need to know so you can get them off and bring whatever legal action you need to in order to preserve your rights.

because there are always thieves who think what you own should belong to them.

 

[Skull Pilot]

If you pay taxes on the land you have not abandoned it

That only works if the state is the authority on property rights, which I still disagree with.

It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree

you cannot claim someone else's property as your own

 

[The Professor]

The term “squatters rights” generally applies in situations whereby those who occupy a residence without paying rent and without the owners permission can remain – at least temporarily - until they are removed by legal process. Here is a good article dealing with squatters rights:
http://money.howstuffworks.com/squatting.htm
How Squatting Works

In order to obtain legal title to a piece of property by squatting, one must follow the rules for a process called “adverse possession.” The following are excerpts from a great article on the subject:

“[Advese possession is]A method of gaining legal title to real property by the actual, open, hostile, and continuous possession of it to the exclusion of its true owner for the period prescribed by state law.”

“An adverse possessor must possess land openly for all the world to see, as a true owner would. Secretly occupying another's land does not give the occupant any legal rights. Clearing, fencing, cultivating, or improving the land demonstrates open and notorious possession, while actual residence on the land is the most open and notorious possession of all. The owner must have actual knowledge of the adverse use, or the claimant's possession must be so notorious that it is generally known by the public or the people in the neighborhood. The notoriety of the possession puts the owner on notice that the land will be lost unless he or she seeks to recover possession of it within a certain time.”

Squatters rights

Different states have different time periods for establishing a claim to title by adverse possession. In California it's only 5 years, in West Virginia it's 10 years and in Texas it's 30 years.

 

[Andylusion]

Here's the problem. We have a clear cut case study of this ideological position. You know where?

Haiti.

Haiti has an extensive squatter rights laws. If you leave your home, and someone comes and claims it, it is virtually impossible to remove them.

This is just pointing out the stupidity of Haitian law. If your house is invaded and you are kicked to the curb, then you could make the case that that was an unreasonable hostile action taken against you.

That is not really what we are talking about either. The city I live in has hundreds of abandoned buildings that have been that way for decades, but if a group of people try to take them as a squat, they get driven out by the police. There are realtors that have owned thousands of acres of land for ages that nobody is allowed to create a livelihood on.

Obviously there is a fine line between squatting in an abandoned building and being a bunch of douche bags that seize someones home while they are away. You are a big boy, so learn to start solving minor civil disputes using your general principles.

Squatter rights, is a great way to damage your entire society. Why would I ever build anything, if a squatter can just claim it?

Actually squatter rights are working quite well in most American cities that have them. Squatters usually renovate the buildings they are in and maintain them for long periods of time, and pay the taxes that would normally paid were the building operational to the city. This is a win-win-win-win for the squatters, realtors, community, and city government.

The idea is that if you are going to build something, you had better planned on using it. If you are not using it, then you cannot fault an element of society that will.

Interesting claims. Given that in the last 10 years, I have yet to come across even one single reputable article showing this positive outcome.

But it's possible I just happen to miss those articles.

How Seattle plans to get rid of houses with squatters

By simply doing another random google search, the first article I came across, was yet another showing the damage and problems caused by squatters, and how the city was moving to curb squatting.

It's ironic that you talk about realtors that own land no one can use, when the largest land owner in the entire country, is the Federal Government, which prevents people from create a livelihood. The moment someone tries to argue with that, people call them crazy criminals in Nevada.

While you say there is a difference between taking over an abandon build, and taking someone's home while they are away, I highly doubt squatters are checking out the property history before taking over.

Lastly, buildings are usually abandoned for a reason. The endless regulations and insane corporate tax code, causes some buildings to be worth more to a company empty, than to be rebuilt, or fixed up, or demolished.

Moreover, since the building is still owned by the company, if a person goes into the building to live there, and is injured or killed by the building, our retarded legal system can hold the company liable.

So yes, they are going to call the police and have squatters removed, and they should.

If you want to solve this problem, you need to look to fixing the legal, regulatory and tax incentives that cause it.

 

[Andylusion]

Ah, but my family's right to the property I mentioned earlier is backed up by more than just a deed.... its,backed up by GUNS and a significant willingness to use them on other human beings when necessary.

Okay, now that brings up a question of ethics.

If your family has been siting on unused land hundreds of miles away since 1788, that makes you guys dicks. Period.

We don't care stupid. Can I just claim anything you own, that you haven't used? I know people who bought land in their 30s to retire on when they get old. It's their land. The fact they are not using it, and have not used it in decades, doesn't mean anything.

What part of "it's not yours" do you not get? Real easy to say "You can steal whatever others are not using" until it's your stuff stolen.

Moron.