The end of the rabid right and the tea partiers?

[ayiakri]

Nixon: re-elected
Carter*: Not
Reagan: re-elected
Bush I: Not
Clinton: re-elected
Bush II: re-elected

I didn't count Ford, as he was never elected to the office in the first place. So out of the last six elected Presidents, four of them were re-elected, while two were not.

And one of those two - Bush Senior - lost re-election in an atypical election, where a 3rd-party candidate got 20% of the votes nationwide (plus, Bush himself had been VP for eight years, so there was a bit of voter-fatigue going on too).

So just given history, it's clear that Americans tend to re-elect the incumbent, going back to Nixon.... Obama doesn't have any mortal lock on re-election, but defeating him will require a reasonably "centrist" Republican who can peel away big slices of independent voters, and also a very motivated Republican base.

Given the current near-war between the Republican "moderates" (centrists), and the far-right, I'm not sure what kind of candidate can bring them both out in huge numbers. Especially if Obama *does* get the health-care bill passed - which seems likely - since polls consistently show that most Americans want that reform.

Anything can happen, but if Bush proved anything, it's that re-election is possible no matter how bad you fu*k up.

 

[DiamondDave]

And if healthcare reform gets passed AND works, the GOP will be doomed for how many additional years?

Like so many other government run things work efficiently???? Like so many other government run healthcare systems in other countries run smooth, timely, efficient, and at the absolute highest quality of service?

I don't think we have to worry about your stipulation.. at least not with the types of plans the DEMs want....

Now if true reform is passed that keeps government out of it except in regulation, law, and legislation... keeps it in the private sector... keeps it that no non-contributor is getting their insurance at the expense of a contributor.... that eliminates competition regulations and restrictions so more options are available and prices reduce... that puts in place regulation that ensures no refusal of coverage.. etc.. then yes, that would be trouble for the GOP (unless the GOP has more of it's imprint on the reform than the DEMs do)... but that is not what the DEMs want, and we all know this

This is where you could be wrong. I see the government run public option as a very small portion of this reform movement. IMHO, it WILL force private insurers to be more competitive and because the public option is not going to be "great" health insurance, it will only be used by those who have no other options. There is way too much money to be made in the private insurance business for the public option to make private insurers close up shop. I respectfully disagree with your assertions that the public option will eliminate competition.

But where you are wrong is that it is competition for the private ensurers.. it is not competition when each person's premium is paid for ONLY by that person and is not subsidized one cent by taxation... and where the department running it is supported by the premiums and not tax monies.... you do not compete with forced financial support and contribution from government and taxpayers

And lest ye forget the 'punishments' that the left has tried to put into place for non-participation or the choice not to have insurance.. and the punishments that would hurt small business participation in the private plans over the public plan... and the punishments on those who choose to purchase the best and most expensive plans money can buy... which all hurt the private companies

But nice try

Public option is a hindrance on private insurance, and there is no real argument that shows otherwise

 

[Ravi]

Nixon: re-elected
Carter*: Not
Reagan: re-elected
Bush I: Not
Clinton: re-elected
Bush II: re-elected

I didn't count Ford, as he was never elected to the office in the first place. So out of the last six elected Presidents, four of them were re-elected, while two were not.

And one of those two - Bush Senior - lost re-election in an atypical election, where a 3rd-party candidate got 20% of the votes nationwide (plus, Bush himself had been VP for eight years, so there was a bit of voter-fatigue going on too).

So just given history, it's clear that Americans tend to re-elect the incumbent, going back to Nixon.... Obama doesn't have any mortal lock on re-election, but defeating him will require a reasonably "centrist" Republican who can peel away big slices of independent voters, and also a very motivated Republican base.

Given the current near-war between the Republican "moderates" (centrists), and the far-right, I'm not sure what kind of candidate can bring them both out in huge numbers. Especially if Obama *does* get the health-care bill passed - which seems likely - since polls consistently show that most Americans want that reform.

Anything can happen, but if Bush proved anything, it's that re-election is possible no matter how bad you fu*k up.

If the economy is strong for the next presidential election Obama will win again. Other than that, I agree with what you are saying...and the reasonably centrist Republican is not someone Palin, Rush, et al will back.

Which is why I asked my questions.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Rather than figure out a strategy of how republicans can appeal to moderates, they are intent on trying to force moderates to buy their message.
The idea that they can develop an inflexible, monolythic message and force everyone to buy it, guarantees continued republican failure.

The lesson from NY 23 is that you must conform to the people, not force them to conform to you

How much irony is there in the teabaggers functioning as a big central national organization descending on a local/district election and trying to impose their will on the people of that district??

 

[Si modo]

Rather than figure out a strategy of how republicans can appeal to moderates, they are intent on trying to force moderates to buy their message.
The idea that they can develop an inflexible, monolythic message and force everyone to buy it, guarantees continued republican failure.

The lesson from NY 23 is that you must conform to the people, not force them to conform to you

How much irony is there in the teabaggers functioning as a big central national organization descending on a local/district election and trying to impose their will on the people of that district??

ZOMG!!!! The People imposing their will!!!!!!

 

[GHook93]

Does the election in NY mean that the Republicans will look in their party and realize that right wing loons such as Palin, Beck and Rush are doing serious damage?

Or does it mean that the right wing loons will become more shrill?

Are you fucking serious? They took a train wreck of a pick in Dede and almost made a 3rd party candidate win in ultra-libtard land! If anything you should be afraid of the power Palin, Beck and Rush are yielding!

Amazing how quickly you forget VA (what was it a 20 pt win!) and NJ (this is libtard land)!

 

[Ravi]

Does the election in NY mean that the Republicans will look in their party and realize that right wing loons such as Palin, Beck and Rush are doing serious damage?

Or does it mean that the right wing loons will become more shrill?

Are you fucking serious? They took a train wreck of a pick in Dede and almost made a 3rd party candidate win in ultra-libtard land! If anything you should be afraid of the power Palin, Beck and Rush are yielding!

Amazing how quickly you forget VA (what was it a 20 pt win!) and NJ (this is libtard land)!

That seat was held by a Republican for over 100 years. Only an idiot such as yourself would automatically think all of New York is liberal.

 

[Si modo]

Does the election in NY mean that the Republicans will look in their party and realize that right wing loons such as Palin, Beck and Rush are doing serious damage?

Or does it mean that the right wing loons will become more shrill?

Are you fucking serious? They took a train wreck of a pick in Dede and almost made a 3rd party candidate win in ultra-libtard land! If anything you should be afraid of the power Palin, Beck and Rush are yielding!

Amazing how quickly you forget VA (what was it a 20 pt win!) and NJ (this is libtard land)!

That seat was held by a Republican for over 100 years. ....

Linky?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Does the election in NY mean that the Republicans will look in their party and realize that right wing loons such as Palin, Beck and Rush are doing serious damage?

Or does it mean that the right wing loons will become more shrill?

Are you fucking serious? They took a train wreck of a pick in Dede and almost made a 3rd party candidate win in ultra-libtard land! If anything you should be afraid of the power Palin, Beck and Rush are yielding!

Amazing how quickly you forget VA (what was it a 20 pt win!) and NJ (this is libtard land)!

NY23 was held for a decade by John McHugh, a moderate Republican to the left of John McCain. We elect NEW YORK Republicans, not Limbaugh Republicans. This isn't Alabama.

 

[VaYank5150]

Does the election in NY mean that the Republicans will look in their party and realize that right wing loons such as Palin, Beck and Rush are doing serious damage?

Or does it mean that the right wing loons will become more shrill?

Are you fucking serious? They took a train wreck of a pick in Dede and almost made a 3rd party candidate win in ultra-libtard land! If anything you should be afraid of the power Palin, Beck and Rush are yielding!

Amazing how quickly you forget VA (what was it a 20 pt win!) and NJ (this is libtard land)!

Are YOU fucking serious? Did you see the boob the Democrats ran against McDonnell in Virginia? Creigh Deeds could actually give Sarah Palin a run for her money in the bimbo department.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

The saddest thing about this was that the Democratic candidate really was more Conservative than the Republican candidate. That NY 23 election was a big loss for the Republican Party but not for real Conservatives. WTG Newt!

 

[Ravi]

Are you fucking serious? They took a train wreck of a pick in Dede and almost made a 3rd party candidate win in ultra-libtard land! If anything you should be afraid of the power Palin, Beck and Rush are yielding!

Amazing how quickly you forget VA (what was it a 20 pt win!) and NJ (this is libtard land)!

That seat was held by a Republican for over 100 years. ....

Linky?

Look it up yourself, it's common knowledge and all over the news.

Weren't you the one that claimed people shouldn't debate over things that they weren't knowledgeable about.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The saddest thing about this was that the Democratic candidate really was more Conservative than the Republican candidate. This was a big loss for the Republican Party but not for real Conservatives. WTG Newt!

I hear Newt on Hannity last night and he gave good reasons for why he supported SkuzzyLibrul and had a Come to Jesus moment on how the Republican Party needs to pick candidates from here on out

 

[DiamondDave]

Does the election in NY mean that the Republicans will look in their party and realize that right wing loons such as Palin, Beck and Rush are doing serious damage?

Or does it mean that the right wing loons will become more shrill?

Are you fucking serious? They took a train wreck of a pick in Dede and almost made a 3rd party candidate win in ultra-libtard land! If anything you should be afraid of the power Palin, Beck and Rush are yielding!

Amazing how quickly you forget VA (what was it a 20 pt win!) and NJ (this is libtard land)!

That seat was held by a Republican for over 100 years. Only an idiot such as yourself would automatically think all of New York is liberal.

And most probably the elections where the REPs won were choices between 2 candidates.. say even a 60-40 20 point spread showing a clear leaning toward republican preference.. but we had a 3 horse race this time which is split evenly would be 40(D) 30(R) 30(C)... and some REPs are going to be split between the candidates for whatever reason.. as shown by the DEM winning with less than 50% of the vote... making it a whole different ball of wax... and there can be others fed with the what was going on all together and staying out of the vote or voting for the opposition in spite or so many other things....

 

[Si modo]

That seat was held by a Republican for over 100 years. ....

Linky?

Look it up yourself, it's common knowledge and all over the news. ....

You brought it up, it's your burden to support it. Annoying shit, that logic.

.... Weren't you the one that claimed people shouldn't debate over things that they weren't knowledgeable about.

Not that I recall. Perhaps you can back up that irrelevant personal accusation, but I doubt it.

 

[Claudette]

Oh yeah, this part of your post simply EXUDES an Independent mindset...

Wonder what you consider an independent mindset?? I vote for the person, never the party. I have voted for Dems and Reps and Independents in the past. Can you say the same?? No. I think not.

 

[Si modo]

Oh yeah, this part of your post simply EXUDES an Independent mindset...

Wonder what you consider an independent mindset?? I vote for the person, never the party. I have voted for Dems and Reps and Independents in the past. Can you say the same?? No. I think not.

Whom are you addressing?

 

[GHook93]

Does the election in NY mean that the Republicans will look in their party and realize that right wing loons such as Palin, Beck and Rush are doing serious damage?

Or does it mean that the right wing loons will become more shrill?

Are you fucking serious? They took a train wreck of a pick in Dede and almost made a 3rd party candidate win in ultra-libtard land! If anything you should be afraid of the power Palin, Beck and Rush are yielding!

Amazing how quickly you forget VA (what was it a 20 pt win!) and NJ (this is libtard land)!

That seat was held by a Republican for over 100 years. Only an idiot such as yourself would automatically think all of New York is liberal.

You mean a Rhino, correct?

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Does the election in NY mean that the Republicans will look in their party and realize that right wing loons such as Palin, Beck and Rush are doing serious damage?

Or does it mean that the right wing loons will become more shrill?

no it just means the left will try and use the victory as a hammer against conservatives.

The conservatives can't help it if the liberal republican scozzafava backed the liberal democrat canidate. NY has more libs than cons and thats just how the ball bounces in a blue state.

Oh wait its ravioli...and I was taking this serious for a min

Whats up Ravs.....mmmm cheeze raviolis...mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

[saveliberty]

GHook93, let them think what they will. Just makes it easier to win in 2010. Your right Ravi, Dede was the poster child of a moderate Republican. Conservatives are no threat to the Democratic party. Carry on.