The Search for Religious Tolerance.

PoliticalChic

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1. During the Enlightenment, Gotthold Ephraim Lessing wrote 'Nathan the Wise,' (1779) which was an attempt to bridge the major religions, Judaism, Islam and Christianity. The play takes place during the Crusades, in Jerusalem. A Jewish merchant, with an adopted Christian daughter, vies with a Templar who wishes her hand in marriage. The problem is settled by Saladin, who sides with the merchant's view of a non-sectarian God. Nathan the Wise - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

2. In that Enlightenment view of the malleability of religion one can see the good intentions, but history has shown the intentions are easily corrupted.

The French Revolution, a direct result of the Enlightenment, produced the slaughter of 600,000 human beings, and the pathway to every totalitarian revolution of the 20th century.





3. That fact aside, one can see the Lessing's idea as based on the monotheism of the three religions, and the three distinct forms can be seen as converging avenues to a single God.

Lest any deny the possibility of same outside of fiction, consider Article 9 of the Lebanese Constitution,(1926):

"There shall be absolute freedom of conscience. The state in rendering homage to the
God Almighty shall respect all religions and creeds and shall guarantees, under its protection the free exercise of all religious rites provided that public order is not disturbed. It shall also guarantees that the personal status and religious interests of the population, to whatever religious sect they belong, shall be respected." http://www.presidency.gov.lb/English/LebaneseSystem/Documents/Lebanese Constitution.pdf

What, in fact, has been Lebanon's history?







4. The premise of the Enlightenment was that millennia of human interactions, condensed into the lessons of the Bible, were no longer necessary. Now, reason, science, should be the basis of human governance.

Perhaps a way to avoid conflict, but less than satisfactory as it reduces God from the realm of the heart to one of the head.

Such is the concept of Lessing, Voltaire, Hume, Kant....removing individuals from the details of specific religion to a background position, a citizenship based on the law, the social contract, and enforced by a secular power.

Good idea or bad idea?

5. Once religion is of this secular variety, morality becomes whatever the government says it is. Fine, unless one objects to the morality of the Nazis, the communists, the American politicians who endorse infanticide, adultery and murder.
But, heck...citizens can still have football, fast food, and food stamps.

Actually.....what does one have to give up?





6. "As God retreated from the world, people reached out for a rival source of membership, and national identity seemed to answer to the need. Although the French revolutionaries paid homage with their heads to the Citizen, the Constitution, and the Republic, their hearts were capture by the Nation,...defined in terms of a visceral membership that demanded one thing above all else- namely, human sacrifice."
Scruton, "The West and the Rest," p.43.

7. "... understand the French Revolution.....as primarily a religious phenomenon. The inner compulsion was to dethrone the gods of the monarchical order, and to erect a new community in its place- but a community demanding sacrifice, devotion, and slaughter, establishing a right to obedience through the spilling of blood."
Ibid, p. 44.

8. Saint Just (1794) more crudely said: “What constitutes a republic is the total destruction of everything opposed to it” (8 Ventôse). Like an echo Lenin repeats, “It would be the greatest stupidity and the most absurd utopia to suppose that the passage from capitalism to socialism would be possible without constraint and dictatorship” (May 28, 1917).

“It is impossible,” he continued, “to defeat and extirpate capitalism without the pitiless repression of the resistance of the exploiters, who cannot accept being suddenly deprived of their fortune, of their advantages in organization and knowledge, and who over a long period of time will consequently and inevitably attempt to shake off the domination of the poor.”
To the Mountain of 1793! To the Pure Socialists, its True Heirs! by Auguste Blanqui 1849





9. We can see exactly what happens when man's 'reason' is put in place of a higher form of morality.

Lenin believed in Utopia, a harmony reached only after certain groups of people are killed: the 'War of Classes'.
'Initially, wherever communists come to power, Russia, Cuba, Poland, Nicaragua, China, it doesn't matter- they destroy about 10% of the people. They are not enemies...best intellectuals, best workers, best engineers...doesn't matter. It is to restructure the fabric of society, a form of social engineering."
Vladimir Bukovsky.


a. "Hang at least 100 hostages, execute the kulaks, do it in such a way that people for hundreds of miles around will see and tremble." Lenin (document shown) He took power in 1917.

b. "Nobody knows how many were people were killed...we're talking about10 million or more..."
Norman Davies, Historian, Cambridge University.




10. There was resistance to the communists, especially in the Ukraine.
September 11, 1932, Stalin wrote to assistant, 'We must take steps so we do not lose the Urkraine.' So, 1932-1933, all food supplies in the Ukraine were confiscated. Those who tried to leave were shot, those who remained, starved to death. Men, women, children. (film footage as proof) They died tortuously slowly. NKVD squads collected the dead. They received 200 grams of bread for every dead body they delivered; often they didn't wait until the victim was dead.
- The Soviet Story (Docu) - Full Movie / English - LivingScoop





None of the above is deniable.

So, what has history taught?

Those capable of learning from history will see that replacing religion with 'reason' is merely instituting a different, more intolerant religion: totalitarianism.

That 'religious tolerance' may not be all that it promises, and allowing man's rationalization of religion, replacing God with reason....has not shown salutary results.
 
It historically true that competing religions will go to war over theological issues.

But godless ideologies like secularism and communism will go to war over anything and murder everyone just because they can. ... :cool:
 
1. During the Enlightenment, Gotthold Ephraim Lessing wrote 'Nathan the Wise,' (1779) which was an attempt to bridge the major religions, Judaism, Islam and Christianity. The play takes place during the Crusades, in Jerusalem. A Jewish merchant, with an adopted Christian daughter, vies with a Templar who wishes her hand in marriage. The problem is settled by Saladin, who sides with the merchant's view of a non-sectarian God. Nathan the Wise - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

2. In that Enlightenment view of the malleability of religion one can see the good intentions, but history has shown the intentions are easily corrupted.

The French Revolution, a direct result of the Enlightenment, produced the slaughter of 600,000 human beings, and the pathway to every totalitarian revolution of the 20th century.





3. That fact aside, one can see the Lessing's idea as based on the monotheism of the three religions, and the three distinct forms can be seen as converging avenues to a single God.

Lest any deny the possibility of same outside of fiction, consider Article 9 of the Lebanese Constitution,(1926):

"There shall be absolute freedom of conscience. The state in rendering homage to the
God Almighty shall respect all religions and creeds and shall guarantees, under its protection the free exercise of all religious rites provided that public order is not disturbed. It shall also guarantees that the personal status and religious interests of the population, to whatever religious sect they belong, shall be respected." http://www.presidency.gov.lb/English/LebaneseSystem/Documents/Lebanese Constitution.pdf

What, in fact, has been Lebanon's history?







4. The premise of the Enlightenment was that millennia of human interactions, condensed into the lessons of the Bible, were no longer necessary. Now, reason, science, should be the basis of human governance.

Perhaps a way to avoid conflict, but less than satisfactory as it reduces God from the realm of the heart to one of the head.

Such is the concept of Lessing, Voltaire, Hume, Kant....removing individuals from the details of specific religion to a background position, a citizenship based on the law, the social contract, and enforced by a secular power.

Good idea or bad idea?

5. Once religion is of this secular variety, morality becomes whatever the government says it is. Fine, unless one objects to the morality of the Nazis, the communists, the American politicians who endorse infanticide, adultery and murder.
But, heck...citizens can still have football, fast food, and food stamps.

Actually.....what does one have to give up?





6. "As God retreated from the world, people reached out for a rival source of membership, and national identity seemed to answer to the need. Although the French revolutionaries paid homage with their heads to the Citizen, the Constitution, and the Republic, their hearts were capture by the Nation,...defined in terms of a visceral membership that demanded one thing above all else- namely, human sacrifice."
Scruton, "The West and the Rest," p.43.

7. "... understand the French Revolution.....as primarily a religious phenomenon. The inner compulsion was to dethrone the gods of the monarchical order, and to erect a new community in its place- but a community demanding sacrifice, devotion, and slaughter, establishing a right to obedience through the spilling of blood."
Ibid, p. 44.

8. Saint Just (1794) more crudely said: “What constitutes a republic is the total destruction of everything opposed to it” (8 Ventôse). Like an echo Lenin repeats, “It would be the greatest stupidity and the most absurd utopia to suppose that the passage from capitalism to socialism would be possible without constraint and dictatorship” (May 28, 1917).

“It is impossible,” he continued, “to defeat and extirpate capitalism without the pitiless repression of the resistance of the exploiters, who cannot accept being suddenly deprived of their fortune, of their advantages in organization and knowledge, and who over a long period of time will consequently and inevitably attempt to shake off the domination of the poor.”
To the Mountain of 1793! To the Pure Socialists, its True Heirs! by Auguste Blanqui 1849





9. We can see exactly what happens when man's 'reason' is put in place of a higher form of morality.

Lenin believed in Utopia, a harmony reached only after certain groups of people are killed: the 'War of Classes'.
'Initially, wherever communists come to power, Russia, Cuba, Poland, Nicaragua, China, it doesn't matter- they destroy about 10% of the people. They are not enemies...best intellectuals, best workers, best engineers...doesn't matter. It is to restructure the fabric of society, a form of social engineering."
Vladimir Bukovsky.


a. "Hang at least 100 hostages, execute the kulaks, do it in such a way that people for hundreds of miles around will see and tremble." Lenin (document shown) He took power in 1917.

b. "Nobody knows how many were people were killed...we're talking about10 million or more..."
Norman Davies, Historian, Cambridge University.




10. There was resistance to the communists, especially in the Ukraine.
September 11, 1932, Stalin wrote to assistant, 'We must take steps so we do not lose the Urkraine.' So, 1932-1933, all food supplies in the Ukraine were confiscated. Those who tried to leave were shot, those who remained, starved to death. Men, women, children. (film footage as proof) They died tortuously slowly. NKVD squads collected the dead. They received 200 grams of bread for every dead body they delivered; often they didn't wait until the victim was dead.
- The Soviet Story (Docu) - Full Movie / English - LivingScoop





None of the above is deniable.

So, what has history taught?

Those capable of learning from history will see that replacing religion with 'reason' is merely instituting a different, more intolerant religion: totalitarianism.

That 'religious tolerance' may not be all that it promises, and allowing man's rationalization of religion, replacing God with reason....has not shown salutary results.

:clap2:
 
None of the above is deniable.

So, what has history taught?

Those capable of learning from history will see that replacing religion with 'reason' is merely instituting a different, more intolerant religion: totalitarianism.

That 'religious tolerance' may not be all that it promises, and allowing man's rationalization of religion, replacing God with reason....has not shown salutary results.


Even the bible teaches that when you mix religion with politics you end up with an intolerant totalitarian beast. That's what 666 is all about.


when no one religious belief can be proven true they all must be permitted.

.... until and except any of them can be proven false. Fraud is fraud. Perpetuating irrational beliefs that fuck up peoples minds for life is criminal and amounts to murder.

Teaching tolerance for religions that promote intolerance and totalitarianism, and can be proven false, only insures that one day our children will have to face another beast bound to rear its ugly head without having the moral ethical and intellectual foundation to defeat it..
 
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I do not believe religion should be involved in politics. I don't believe politics should use religion or religious leaders to gain points either. It should be left out completely. Across the board.
 
I do not believe religion should be involved in politics. I don't believe politics should use religion or religious leaders to gain points either. It should be left out completely. Across the board.

is it even possible for a person of any religion to set aside their religious beliefs, however irrational, and principles, however perverse, when in public office making decisions according to their perceptions of right and wrong and how they define the public good?

What kind of person could do that and what kind of person would even claim to be able to do that?

The entire system is set up to insure that only the most duplicitous and pretentious person out there gets elected.
 
I do not believe religion should be involved in politics. I don't believe politics should use religion or religious leaders to gain points either. It should be left out completely. Across the board.

is it even possible for a person of any religion to set aside their religious beliefs, however irrational, and principles, however perverse, when in public office making decisions according to their perceptions of right and wrong and how they define the public good?

What kind of person could do that and what kind of person would even claim to be able to do that?

The entire system is set up to insure that only the most duplicitous and pretentious person out there gets elected.




I believe you and Jeri may have missed the point of the OP....contained here:

6. "As God retreated from the world, people reached out for a rival source of membership, and national identity seemed to answer to the need. Although the French revolutionaries paid homage with their heads to the Citizen, the Constitution, and the Republic, their hearts were capture by the Nation,...defined in terms of a visceral membership that demanded one thing above all else- namely, human sacrifice."
Scruton, "The West and the Rest," p.43.

7. "... understand the French Revolution.....as primarily a religious phenomenon. The inner compulsion was to dethrone the gods of the monarchical order, and to erect a new community in its place- but a community demanding sacrifice, devotion, and slaughter, establishing a right to obedience through the spilling of blood."
Ibid, p. 44.



Government is always based on one's religion.





From the Enlightenment, and the French Revolution, the religion has been one of 'reason.'

And it has been a mistake that has resulted in over one hundred million humans during the 'Century of Genocide,' far, far more than any other organized religion.


Just as there are several iterations of Christianity, there are many of the religion of 'rationalization,' including communism, socialism, Liberalism, Progressivism, etc.




The proof of the power of the religion of the rational mind is that you, and most folks, don't see it as a religion.
 
I do not believe religion should be involved in politics. I don't believe politics should use religion or religious leaders to gain points either. It should be left out completely. Across the board.

is it even possible for a person of any religion to set aside their religious beliefs, however irrational, and principles, however perverse, when in public office making decisions according to their perceptions of right and wrong and how they define the public good?

What kind of person could do that and what kind of person would even claim to be able to do that?

The entire system is set up to insure that only the most duplicitous and pretentious person out there gets elected.




I believe you and Jeri may have missed the point of the OP....contained here:.


No, I saw your point, I just disagree with your conclusion.

We have had hundreds of years of unrestricted freedom of religion when the ability to differentiate between what is true or false, possible or impossible has not yet been developed.

People can fill their children's heads with any type of perverted and irrational crap they want to and consequently the country is filled with confused people saying and doing stupid things with everyone scratching their collective head completely mystified about what could be wrong and then in their boundless wisdom decide to make more ridiculous laws with mandatory minimums and build more prisons, hire more cops, and raise taxes to fund it all furthering the financial burdens that only create more desperate people who have no choice but to do desperate things in their confusion.

Now we have well known and long established scientific, biological, and historical facts with which the ability to differentiate between true and false and what is possible and impossible has been greatly improved.

Its time to apply it.

If people didn't defile and contaminate the minds of their own children with superstitious garbage that is known to be false many of the social problems that plague us today, poverty, violent crime, hunger, war, etc., would vanish forever from the planet within only a few short years.
 
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Today, in the USA, Separation of church and state means religion has no say in politics, but politics will set rules for religion.
 
Today, in the USA, Separation of church and state means religion has no say in politics, but politics will set rules for religion.

There is only an illusion of a separation between church and state.

if there was such a separation, whatever religious hypocrite that screwed up your mind would be arrested for fraud.
 
is it even possible for a person of any religion to set aside their religious beliefs, however irrational, and principles, however perverse, when in public office making decisions according to their perceptions of right and wrong and how they define the public good?

What kind of person could do that and what kind of person would even claim to be able to do that?

The entire system is set up to insure that only the most duplicitous and pretentious person out there gets elected.




I believe you and Jeri may have missed the point of the OP....contained here:.


No, I saw your point, I just disagree with your conclusion.

We have had hundreds of years of unrestricted freedom of religion when the ability to differentiate between what is true or false, possible or impossible has not yet been developed.

People can fill their children's heads with any type of perverted and irrational crap they want to and consequently the country is filled with confused people saying and doing stupid things with everyone scratching their collective head completely mystified about what could be wrong and then in their boundless wisdom decide to make more ridiculous laws with mandatory minimums and build more prisons, hire more cops, and raise taxes to fund it all furthering the financial burdens that only create more desperate people who have no choice but to do desperate things in their confusion.

with which the ability to differentiate between true and false and what is possible and impossible has been greatly improved.

Its time to apply it.

If people didn't defile and contaminate the minds of their own children with superstitious garbage that is known to be false many of the social problems that plague us today, poverty, violent crime, hunger, war, etc., would vanish forever from the planet within only a few short years.



1. I'm always amused when folks like you regurgitate the atheist propaganda you've imbibed from the secularists.
"... perverted and irrational crap..."
"....confused people saying and doing stupid things..."
"... defile and contaminate the minds of their own children with superstitious garbage..."

Did you get a pat on your head from the government school teachers?
Good boy!



2. "Now we have well known and long established scientific, biological, and historical facts..."

Yet you fail to notice the cognitive dissonance.....
a. History has proven that communism, socialism, collectivism, modern Liberalism are failures....yet you folks cling to them like limpets to the rocks.

b. There is no scientific proof of Darwin's theory...yet, for you it is a fact.






3. David Mamet writes in "The Secret Knowledge":


a. "The Bible is the wisdom of the West. It is from the precepts of the Bible that the legal systems of the West have been developed- systems, worked out over millennia, for dealing with inequality, with injustice, with greed, reducible t that which Christians call the Golden Rule, and the Jews had propounded as “That which is hateful to you, don not do to your neighbor.” It is these rules and laws which form a framework which allows the individual foreknowledge of that which is permitted and that which is forbidden.
The human mind may be worshiped, but it cannot be trusted. That is why we codify laws.

b. To embrace the philosophy of the Left, it is almost imperative that one reject the Bible, and religion in general. The urge of the Left to surrender choice and self government for illusion, to insist on statism and government rule rather than citizens ruling the government, is a rejection of the lesson of the Exodus.

c.The Left says of the Right, “You fools, it is demonstrable that dinosaurs lived one hundred million years ago, I can prove it to you, how can you say the earth was created in 4000 BCE?” But this supposed intransigence on the part of the Religious Right is far less detrimental to the health of the body politic than the Left’s love affair with Marxism, Socialism, Racialism, the Command Economy, all of which have been proven via one hundred years of evidence shows only shortages, despotism and murder."



You've been indoctrinated well.

Too bad you never learned to question, to look at the underpinnings of your less-than-intuitive understanding of eschatological world views.
 
If people didn't defile and contaminate the minds of their own children with superstitious garbage that is known to be false many of the social problems that plague us today, poverty, violent crime, hunger, war, etc., would vanish forever from the planet within only a few short years.



1. I'm always amused when folks like you regurgitate the atheist propaganda you've imbibed from the secularists.
"... perverted and irrational crap..."
"....confused people saying and doing stupid things..."
"... defile and contaminate the minds of their own children with superstitious garbage..."

Did you get a pat on your head from the government school teachers?
Good boy!



2. "Now we have well known and long established scientific, biological, and historical facts..."

Yet you fail to notice the cognitive dissonance.....
a. History has proven that communism, socialism, collectivism, modern Liberalism are failures....yet you folks cling to them like limpets to the rocks.

b. There is no scientific proof of Darwin's theory...yet, for you it is a fact.


I am not advocating atheism you dingbat.

I am asking why allow what are no more than two bit con men to rob the dead under the protection of freedom of religion? How can any Government charged with protecting the people give a free license for any religion to deceive and fleece its own people tax free unless they have a vested interest in keeping the population in la la land.?

Even Jesu said , "any plant that has not been planted by my heavenly Father shall be extirpated."
 
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I do not believe religion should be involved in politics. I don't believe politics should use religion or religious leaders to gain points either. It should be left out completely. Across the board.

Religion and politics CANNOT be separated!

Religion determine how cultures are run meaning it determines the politics of a society.

Governments enact laws based upon religion beliefs bringing politics into the law making process.

And NO religion will ever agree with another.
 
I do not believe religion should be involved in politics. I don't believe politics should use religion or religious leaders to gain points either. It should be left out completely. Across the board.

is it even possible for a person of any religion to set aside their religious beliefs, however irrational, and principles, however perverse, when in public office making decisions according to their perceptions of right and wrong and how they define the public good?

What kind of person could do that and what kind of person would even claim to be able to do that?

The entire system is set up to insure that only the most duplicitous and pretentious person out there gets elected.


I believe you and Jeri may have missed the point of the OP....contained here:

6. "As God retreated from the world, people reached out for a rival source of membership, and national identity seemed to answer to the need. Although the French revolutionaries paid homage with their heads to the Citizen, the Constitution, and the Republic, their hearts were capture by the Nation,...defined in terms of a visceral membership that demanded one thing above all else- namely, human sacrifice."
Scruton, "The West and the Rest," p.43.

7. "... understand the French Revolution.....as primarily a religious phenomenon. The inner compulsion was to dethrone the gods of the monarchical order, and to erect a new community in its place- but a community demanding sacrifice, devotion, and slaughter, establishing a right to obedience through the spilling of blood."
Ibid, p. 44.




Government is always based on one's religion.





From the Enlightenment, and the French Revolution, the religion has been one of 'reason.'

And it has been a mistake that has resulted in over one hundred million humans during the 'Century of Genocide,' far, far more than any other organized religion.


Just as there are several iterations of Christianity, there are many of the religion of 'rationalization,' including communism, socialism, Liberalism, Progressivism, etc.




The proof of the power of the religion of the rational mind is that you, and most folks, don't see it as a religion.

The French Revolution WAS NOT based upon religion!!!!! :eusa_whistle:

For more than six or seven centuries, European weather was most conducive to growing large crops, thus bringing about a large increase in the population. When the Mini Ice Age took effect, it seriously disrupted the growing of herds and crops, thus reducing the availability of foods.

Plagues eased some of the overpopulation but it still left thousands demanding their rulers do something to ease their plight. [Sound familiar? :eusa_whistle:] And, when the people saw their rulers living in luxury, they were ripe for certain forces to lead them into insurrection.

As a matter of fact, as a result of the French Revolution, church leaders were attacked, imprisoned, and even killed. Napoleon took the then Pope into custody and removed him from the Vatican, putting him in a place where he [Napoleon] controlled his activities.
 
1. I'm always amused when folks like you regurgitate the atheist propaganda you've imbibed from the secularists.
"... perverted and irrational crap..."
"....confused people saying and doing stupid things..."
"... defile and contaminate the minds of their own children with superstitious garbage..."

Did you get a pat on your head from the government school teachers?
Good boy!



2. "Now we have well known and long established scientific, biological, and historical facts..."

Yet you fail to notice the cognitive dissonance.....
a. History has proven that communism, socialism, collectivism, modern Liberalism are failures....yet you folks cling to them like limpets to the rocks.

b. There is no scientific proof of Darwin's theory...yet, for you it is a fact.


I am not advocating atheism you dingbat.

I am asking why allow what are no more than two bit con men to rob the dead under the protection of freedom of religion? How can any Government charged with protecting the people give a free license for any religion to deceive and fleece its own people tax free unless they have a vested interest in keeping the population in la la land.?

Even Jesu said , "any plant that has not been planted by my heavenly Father shall be extirpated."




"I am not advocating atheism you dingbat."

How, then, to explain your slander of religious folk.
 
If you were a French person living in France before the revolution you would understand why the French peasants wanted the Church abolished along with the ancient regime that abused it's power and social status.Had the three higher tiers of French society had been more responsive to political reform such as in Britain, there would have been no French Revolution. But as we have seen with ancient regimes in Europe those at the bottom were tired of being exploited and abused. The middle class wanted more power and an assembly for a legislative body that would limit the monarchies power.
 
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I am not advocating atheism you dingbat.

I am asking why allow what are no more than two bit con men to rob the dead under the protection of freedom of religion? How can any Government charged with protecting the people give a free license for any religion to deceive and fleece its own people tax free unless they have a vested interest in keeping the population in la la land.?

Even Jesu said , "any plant that has not been planted by my heavenly Father shall be extirpated."




"I am not advocating atheism you dingbat."

How, then, to explain your slander of religious folk.


Its only slander if untrue.

I'm just giving a neighborly reminder about the truths which ya'll have rejected.
 
is it even possible for a person of any religion to set aside their religious beliefs, however irrational, and principles, however perverse, when in public office making decisions according to their perceptions of right and wrong and how they define the public good?

What kind of person could do that and what kind of person would even claim to be able to do that?

The entire system is set up to insure that only the most duplicitous and pretentious person out there gets elected.


I believe you and Jeri may have missed the point of the OP....contained here:

6. "As God retreated from the world, people reached out for a rival source of membership, and national identity seemed to answer to the need. Although the French revolutionaries paid homage with their heads to the Citizen, the Constitution, and the Republic, their hearts were capture by the Nation,...defined in terms of a visceral membership that demanded one thing above all else- namely, human sacrifice."
Scruton, "The West and the Rest," p.43.

7. "... understand the French Revolution.....as primarily a religious phenomenon. The inner compulsion was to dethrone the gods of the monarchical order, and to erect a new community in its place- but a community demanding sacrifice, devotion, and slaughter, establishing a right to obedience through the spilling of blood."
Ibid, p. 44.




Government is always based on one's religion.





From the Enlightenment, and the French Revolution, the religion has been one of 'reason.'

And it has been a mistake that has resulted in over one hundred million humans during the 'Century of Genocide,' far, far more than any other organized religion.


Just as there are several iterations of Christianity, there are many of the religion of 'rationalization,' including communism, socialism, Liberalism, Progressivism, etc.




The proof of the power of the religion of the rational mind is that you, and most folks, don't see it as a religion.

The French Revolution WAS NOT based upon religion!!!!! :eusa_whistle:

For more than six or seven centuries, European weather was most conducive to growing large crops, thus bringing about a large increase in the population. When the Mini Ice Age took effect, it seriously disrupted the growing of herds and crops, thus reducing the availability of foods.

Plagues eased some of the overpopulation but it still left thousands demanding their rulers do something to ease their plight. [Sound familiar? :eusa_whistle:] And, when the people saw their rulers living in luxury, they were ripe for certain forces to lead them into insurrection.

As a matter of fact, as a result of the French Revolution, church leaders were attacked, imprisoned, and even killed. Napoleon took the then Pope into custody and removed him from the Vatican, putting him in a place where he [Napoleon] controlled his activities.

The Papacy did the same during it's many years of wars. Why the Papacy is responsible for many deaths from it's use of political and military power. I hold no empathy for the backlash when societies had broken their power and revolted against their tyranny.
 
is it even possible for a person of any religion to set aside their religious beliefs, however irrational, and principles, however perverse, when in public office making decisions according to their perceptions of right and wrong and how they define the public good?

What kind of person could do that and what kind of person would even claim to be able to do that?

The entire system is set up to insure that only the most duplicitous and pretentious person out there gets elected.


I believe you and Jeri may have missed the point of the OP....contained here:

6. "As God retreated from the world, people reached out for a rival source of membership, and national identity seemed to answer to the need. Although the French revolutionaries paid homage with their heads to the Citizen, the Constitution, and the Republic, their hearts were capture by the Nation,...defined in terms of a visceral membership that demanded one thing above all else- namely, human sacrifice."
Scruton, "The West and the Rest," p.43.

7. "... understand the French Revolution.....as primarily a religious phenomenon. The inner compulsion was to dethrone the gods of the monarchical order, and to erect a new community in its place- but a community demanding sacrifice, devotion, and slaughter, establishing a right to obedience through the spilling of blood."
Ibid, p. 44.




Government is always based on one's religion.





From the Enlightenment, and the French Revolution, the religion has been one of 'reason.'

And it has been a mistake that has resulted in over one hundred million humans during the 'Century of Genocide,' far, far more than any other organized religion.


Just as there are several iterations of Christianity, there are many of the religion of 'rationalization,' including communism, socialism, Liberalism, Progressivism, etc.




The proof of the power of the religion of the rational mind is that you, and most folks, don't see it as a religion.

The French Revolution WAS NOT based upon religion!!!!! :eusa_whistle:

For more than six or seven centuries, European weather was most conducive to growing large crops, thus bringing about a large increase in the population. When the Mini Ice Age took effect, it seriously disrupted the growing of herds and crops, thus reducing the availability of foods.

Plagues eased some of the overpopulation but it still left thousands demanding their rulers do something to ease their plight. [Sound familiar? :eusa_whistle:] And, when the people saw their rulers living in luxury, they were ripe for certain forces to lead them into insurrection.

As a matter of fact, as a result of the French Revolution, church leaders were attacked, imprisoned, and even killed. Napoleon took the then Pope into custody and removed him from the Vatican, putting him in a place where he [Napoleon] controlled his activities.




"The French Revolution WAS NOT based upon religion!!!!"

You truly need help in reading.

If you understand the term 'religion' to mean Christianity, you've totally missed the point.

The new religion put in place of Christianity is totalitarianism of men's 'reason,' of their understanding of science.


The French Revolution, unlike the American Revolution, was designed to usurp the religion of Christianity by replacing it with an ersatz religion of a totally different sort.




From the novel “Napoleon’ Pyramids,” by William Dietrich

"April 13, 1798, was a Friday. But it was springtime in revolutionary Paris, meaning that under the Directory’s new calendar it was the twenty-forth day of the month of Germinal in the Year Six, and the next day of rest was still six days distant, not two.

Has any reform been more futile? The Government’s arrogant discard of Christianity means that weeks have been extended to ten days instead of seven. The revision’s intent is to supplant the papal calendar with a uniform alternative of twelve months of thirty days each, based on the system of ancient Egypt.

Bibles themselves were torn up to make paper gun cartridges in the grim days of 1793, and now the biblical week has been guillotined, each month instead divided into three decades of ten days, with the year, with the year beginning at the autumn equinox and five to six holidays added to balance idealism with our solar orbit.

Not content with regimenting the calendar, the government has introduced a new metric system for weight and measure. There are even proposals for a new clock of precisely 100,000 seconds each day. Reason, reason!...The new calendar is the kind of logical idea imposed by clever people that completely ignores habit, emotion, and human nature and thus forecasts the Revolution’s doom. "
 

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