The U.S. Tax Code

[P@triot]

Honestly - no, they really don't. If you would stop hating what you perceive to be "rich" people and open your mind you would see that people lose their parents businesses because of this nonsense.

When it comes to a business, $5 million in assets is nothing. You'd be hard pressed to find a small business that doesn't have at least that much (it would have to be a really small business out of someone's home or something). But having that much in a building, materials, products, etc. doesn't always mean that they have that type of liquidity as well. Some certainly would. But others that are not quite as successful do not. In America, a person should be able to leave their children a small business without the government taking it and selling it off so that they can tax everything a second time.

If they are getting hit with the tax, then check that up to poor estate planning .

Same wh Prince . Now wil!? That's fucking crazy when he owns so much .

Ok - I completely agree with you on Prince and the will. However, that doesn't change the Death Tax. Will or no will, the Death Tax is still in affect. Are you under the impression that the Death Tax magically becomes null and void with a will? If you are, I can assure you that it doesn't. The only thing a will does is avoid forcing the assets to go through probate (where the government will in fact take even more).

As far as "estate planning" - again that doesn't make much sense. I've got a thriving car dealership. 2008 and 2009 hit and I take quit a beating. I use all of my savings to keep my business afloat (which also keeps all of my people in jobs - a very admirable thing to do when I could have simply cashed out and lived as a greedy, rich person). Then I suddenly pass away in 2010 and my son doesn't have the $2.5 million liquidity to pay Uncle Sam to cover the $5 million dealership that is suddenly his. Considering every single cent on that dealership has already been taxed by Uncle Sam - I simply do not see how that is just. If we have double-jeopardy to prevent people for being tried multiple times for the same crime, we should most definitely have double-jeopardy to prevent people for being taxed multiple times for the same income and assets.

Let me ask, can't you utilize trusts to shield from the tax burden? Is your biz incorporated ?

Well let me clarify - I don't have a "business" in the traditional sense. I am self-employed but what I was saying above was in a hypothetical sense. I've read several articles about farmers, car dealerships, etc. where this is occurring. Their assets are in the millions but the family doesn't have the money to cover the death tax. So that's what I was referring to.

I just don't understand why the government gets to tax everything a second time. And even if they should get to (which is bizarre to me and would require one heck of a justification), they should at least make it significantly more than $5 million. Or, at the very least, look at the true financial records and establish what would be "fair" and "equitable". Instead of making it 50% of total assets, what about 50% of cash only. That way people wouldn't be forced to produce what they don't have. So using the car dealership example again, maybe both dealerships have $5 million in assets but one has $2 million in cash and the other has $190,000 in cash. Then the first dealership is taxed $1 million and the other is taxed $95,000. I'd still find this criminal, but at least the government wouldn't be demanding that the survivors pay the government what they don't have.

Join the world . Who doesn't get taxed multiple times ? I work for a living , and I commute . My income gets taxed, then I get taxed again when I buy gas to drive to work. (For example ).

No one gives a shit about that . But princes sister walks into a bazzillion dollars she did nothing to earn and I'm supposed to cry over her tax hit?

But that's me entire point. Let me take that a step further for you. Here is literally my tax burden:

First I am hit by the federal government with income tax on my income
Then I am hit a second time by the state government with income tax on my income
Then I am hit a third time by the local government with income tax on my income

Now, after three rounds of taxes on my income, in theory what is left I should have to live off of. But nope....

After that, the house I pay for with what's left after three rounds of taxing on my income, they hit me a fourth time with property tax. If that weren't enough, everything I purchase to survive (clothing, household supplies, basic hygiene supplies like soap and deodorant) are taxed a fifth time with sales tax. But wait - that's still not enough for the government. Then when I fill up my automobile, I get hit a sixth time with a gas tax. And then there are capital gains tax for a seventh round of taxes on the exact same income. Then comes one of my favorites - despite paying property tax and sales tax and local income tax (all of which goes to local government), I then get a tax on my cell phone bill which says "911 tax" for an eighth tax (how the frick are 911 services not already covered in all of those other taxes?!?). And after all of that greed by the government, they hit me when I die with an ninth (and most despicable) round with a death tax.

And yet despite that extraordinary greed, the federal government is $19 trillion in debt and states such as California ($80 billion) are billions in debt. How is that possible except for waste, fraud, abuse, and irresponsible government greed?

Finally, I don't understand your point Prince's sister. You're claim that she did "nothing to earn" Prince's assets is nonsensical. For starters, how many liberal parasites across America receive Medicare, Medicaid, food stamps, government housing, and more - all of which they (and I quote you) "did nothing to earn"? Second, Prince did earn every dime and if he wants his family to have it, tell me why again he doesn't have that right in America? I mean, I realize that greedy and selfish liberals can't comprehend this, but most of us don't work for ourselves. We work for our children, our spouses, etc. I could care less if I wake up Christmas morning and there wasn't a single present under the tree for me (in fact, that has happened and it didn't make me even think twice). But my children care very much whether or not Santa comes Christmas Eve and it means the world to me to make sure that there is stuff there to make them happy.

Here is the crux of your argument: "I'm jealous of people with wealth - so fuck 'em. Lets use the government to torment and harass them 24x7". I mean....come on. And again, you're trying to act like the Prince situation is the norm instead of the exception. I get that Prince is not only quite liquid, but that his intellectual property means near endless income. But that's not the case for farmers and small business owners across the land that are getting crushed by taxes as if they were fabulously wealthy pop stars like Michael Jackson and Prince. How many farmers do you know ride around in limo's drinking Cristal? There are tons of people across American brining in very modest incomes from the small businesses that they built - even though those assets may have surpassed $5 million over the decades (farming equipment after all is extremely expensive - which means if the farmer spent the money on that equipment, he doesn't have that money in the bank).

Your punishing people just like yourself simply because you hate people like Prince (which in itself is pretty disgusting - to hate someone just because they were successful and made a lot of money).

 

[P@triot]

Join the world . Who doesn't get taxed multiple times ? I work for a living , and I commute . My income gets taxed, then I get taxed again when I buy gas to drive to work. (For example ).

You've given me no reason to doubt you, so I'm going to take you at your word. And this begs the question then - why don't you care? You have to wake up day in and day out, prepare for work, commute to work, deal with all of the headaches, pressures, and stress of work, then commute back home where you're lucky to get 2 or 3 hours with your family before everyone needs to be in bed for the next day to do it all over again - and you're happy to do that just so the government can take it all from you? Really?

Instead of being an obedient liberal who says "this is how I was trained like a dog", why don't you think for yourself and say "this is unacceptable - lets change this". Why should each check you receive be taxed 9 times? Why should you get up and labor like a slave for someone else's benefit? You do realize that slavery was outlawed, don't you?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I didn't say it was right or wrong. I was once a life insurance agent and that is a great selling point for people to buy life insurance to pay the IRS death tax.

Ok. Fair enough. But it's ridiculous that our federal government would cause people to purchase something unnecessary just to attempt to make up what the government is going to steal for a second time.

We have a "double jeopardy" law to prevent people from being prosecuted over and over for the same crime. I think we need a "double jeopardy" law for taxes as well - to prevent people from being taxed over and over on the same income and assets.

You mean like health insurance?

Uh.....what? I'm not following you hear? Can you clarify?

Not following? Are you unaware that the federal government uses tax laws to punish people who do not purchase health insurance which some people consider unnecessary?

Does the same what people who decide not to have children also. What's your point?

OK, where is the federal law that says I have to have kids? If there was such a law, you might have a point, but you didn't think. Epic failure.

 

[P@triot]

It's funny to listen to liberals complain about jobs, "evil" corporations, "living wages", etc. - and then they go and implement government regulations which makes the worker pay to get a job. I swear, only liberalism...

(And here is the best part - in their rush to defend the indefensible, I know exactly what their nonsensical response to this is going to be....and it's going to make them look so silly)

The Hidden Tax That Costs Households Up to $1,600 a Year

 

[P@triot]

It's pretty bad when even the IRS itself says the tax code is so complicating it can't be enforced. The direct result of more liberal "brilliance". So frustrating how the left keeps pulling this country down...

IRS Admits Tax Code Is Too Complex to Enforce

 

[P@triot]

The data is overwhelming...liberal policy (especially liberal tax policies and liberal spending policies) are a spectacular failure. And conservative tax policies and conservative spending policies result in prosperity.

With Income Tax Eliminated, $85 Million Flows Into Kansas

 

[P@triot]

So much for the liberal false narrative that high taxes do not harm business and low taxes do not stimulate the economy or create jobs. Even radical left-wing San Francisco has accepted reality and their mayor created what was dubbed as the "Twitter Tax" - offering tax breaks to tech companies to bring their businesses (and subsequently the jobs that come with them) to the city. The results have been spectacular.

S.F. hails 'Twitter tax break’ as rousing success

 

[P@triot]

Jobs and increased revenue for the city by cutting taxes. Simply no disputing that tax cuts generate prosperity and tax increase generate poverty.

So-Called “Twitter Tax Break” Netted City More In Mid-Market Tax Revenue

 

[g5000]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

The reason tax rates are so high is because we spend $1.2 trillion on tax expenditures every year. And do you know who puts the most, by far, tax expenditures in the tax code?

Republicans. Because it is a way to hike spending without you noticing they are doing it.

Imagine what we could do if we eliminated a trillion dollars of tax expenditures. We'd have a HUGE surplus with which we could lower tax rates for EVERYONE. And we could pay down the debt. And once the debt was paid off, we could lower tax rates for everyone even more.

If you want to know who is to blame for our $19 trillion debt, go look in the mirror.

 

[hazlnut]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

You really believe the lower class benefits the most from our current tax code?

You must be stupid beyond words.

Why do you think Donald Dump won't release his taxes? He pays only a tiny percentage of his income...

 

[bendog]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

That is why you have life insurance.

And it's why we have this magical tool called "incorporation" which apparently the car dealership owner failed to utilize.

 

[g5000]

If a feudal lord had 20 serfs under him, and his annual expenditures came to $1000, he would have to tax each serf $50 to achieve a balanced budget.

If he then took $200 of this money and returned it to 5 of his favorite serfs, he would have $800 left. Not enough to cover his $1000 in expenses. And so he needs to tax everyone an additional $10 to balance his books. In short, he would have to raise the tax rates by 20 percent on everyone to come out even and to give the $200 gift to his five favorites. Or else he would have to borrow $200 (deficit spend) to give to his five favorites.

This is the system we have today.

Those 5 inner circle serfs tell themselves, "Woo hoo! I get to keep more of my money! Yay!", completely oblivious to the fact everyone is paying higher tax rates because of them, including themselves.

Instead of paying $50 in taxes, the other 15 serfs who are carrying them are paying $60 in taxes.

Bad for the economy. And wealth begins to unnaturally concentrate up to the favored five.

 

[P@triot]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

The reason tax rates are so high is because we spend $1.2 trillion on tax expenditures every year. And do you know who puts the most, by far, tax expenditures in the tax code?

Republicans.

Imagine what we could do if we eliminated a trillion dollars of tax expenditures. We'd have a HUGE surplus with which we could lower tax rates for EVERYONE. And we could pay down the debt. And once the debt was paid off, we could lower tax rates for everyone even more.

If you want to know who is to blame for our $19 trillion debt, go look in the mirror.

Cute story junior. But it's the Dumbocrats who are responsible for the overwhelming majority. It's Obama's reckless spending that took the U.S. from $10 trillion in 232 years to $19 trilling (and climbing) in 8 years.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

That is why you have life insurance.

And it's why we have this magical tool called "incorporation" which apparently the car dealership owner failed to utilize.

Please explain how giving up your rights to a company through incorporation will help you keep your assets. It just muddies the waters beyond belief.

 

[g5000]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

The reason tax rates are so high is because we spend $1.2 trillion on tax expenditures every year. And do you know who puts the most, by far, tax expenditures in the tax code?

Republicans.

Imagine what we could do if we eliminated a trillion dollars of tax expenditures. We'd have a HUGE surplus with which we could lower tax rates for EVERYONE. And we could pay down the debt. And once the debt was paid off, we could lower tax rates for everyone even more.

If you want to know who is to blame for our $19 trillion debt, go look in the mirror.

Cute story junior. But it's the Dumbocrats who are responsible for the overwhelming majority. It's Obama's reckless spending that took the U.S. from $10 trillion in 232 years to $19 trilling (and climbing) in 8 years.

It's a fact. A fact which our politicians are very careful to avoid you figuring out.

$1.2 trillion in tax expenditures. A scheme which you have been fooled into going along with, bleeving you are "getting to keep more of my own money" while oblivious to the fact it is paid for by higher tax rates and deficit spending.

Tax expenditures are literally TWICE AS MUCH as what we spend on welfare.

 

[bendog]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

That is why you have life insurance.

And it's why we have this magical tool called "incorporation" which apparently the car dealership owner failed to utilize.

Please explain how giving up your rights to a company through incorporation will help you keep your assets. It just muddies the waters beyond belief.

You can incorporate any small biz into family ownership. In fact, only idiots don't.

 

[g5000]

There Are Over $1.2 Trillion of Tax Expenditures

After the Tax Reform Act of 1986, there were 119 tax preferences. By 2013, there were 169. In real dollar terms, the growth of tax expenditures has been entirely on the individual side of the tax system since 1986. According to Treasury estimates, the tax expenditure budget grew from $844 billion (2013 dollars) in 1986 to $1.2 trillion in 2013, an increase of 44 percent. Over the same period, individual tax expenditures grew from $685 billion to $1.1 trillion.

 

[P@triot]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

The reason tax rates are so high is because we spend $1.2 trillion on tax expenditures every year. And do you know who puts the most, by far, tax expenditures in the tax code?

Republicans.

Imagine what we could do if we eliminated a trillion dollars of tax expenditures. We'd have a HUGE surplus with which we could lower tax rates for EVERYONE. And we could pay down the debt. And once the debt was paid off, we could lower tax rates for everyone even more.

If you want to know who is to blame for our $19 trillion debt, go look in the mirror.

Cute story junior. But it's the Dumbocrats who are responsible for the overwhelming majority. It's Obama's reckless spending that took the U.S. from $10 trillion in 232 years to $19 trilling (and climbing) in 8 years.

It's a fact. A fact which our politicians are very careful to avoid you figuring out.

$1.2 trillion in tax expenditures. A scheme which you have been fooled into going along with, bleeving you are "getting to keep more of my own money" while oblivious to the fact it is paid for by higher tax rates and deficit spending.

Tax expenditures are literally TWICE what we spend on welfare.

g-string...you wouldn't know a fact if it smacked you in the face. You're one of the most ignorant posters on USMB. I'm the biggest advocate for a complete overhaul of our tax system. But that's not the problem and the fact that you think it is shows astounding stupidity. Our biggest problem is high taxes causing low employment. Our second biggest problem is unconstitutional social entitlements. And our third biggest problem is deficit spending (due to the first two). Deductions don't even remotely become an issue until you reach number four.

 

[g5000]

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

It's so tragic that the parasite class (liberals, progressives, Democrats, etc.) feel that they have a right to take what other people have earned. You have to be sick, callous, and really greedy to find current tax rates acceptable. You have to be even worse to find the "death tax" acceptable. Taxing the assets of dead people is a special kind of libtard sick. Every asset that person has was already tax before. What right do liberals have to double-tax it? What right to liberals have to do something like this to a person...

"When the man passed away, his business was passed along to his only child who wanted to continue in his father’s footsteps. After the funeral, while still in grief, the IRS came to collect 55% of the value of the business from the son. He nearly declared bankruptcy."

Rep. Williams: My plan to help victims of our nation’s disastrous tax policies | Fox News

That is why you have life insurance.

And it's why we have this magical tool called "incorporation" which apparently the car dealership owner failed to utilize.

Please explain how giving up your rights to a company through incorporation will help you keep your assets. It just muddies the waters beyond belief.

You can incorporate any small biz into family ownership. In fact, only idiots don't.

I think you need lessons on estate planning.