Will austerity destroy England?

[Bern80]

Why is it there are those who presume that living within ones means is impossible and will destroy them?

Who is saying that? It's a question of how you define one's means.

By omission most polticians. Living within your 'means', means spending equal to or less than you take in. This isn't subjective bud. www.usdebtclock.org Admittedly going into debt or financing somethig is not neccessarily not living within your means, but when what you owe continues to grow as the national debt is, government is clearly not living within it's means. This is not about philosophical disagreements on what governments spends money on. Even if 100% of us agreed that everything the goverment is currently spending money on are things they should be spending on, the fact would STILL remain that government isn't living within its means.

One of two things has to change for the government to objectively live within it's means, it's 'living' and/or its 'means'; 1) the 'living', that is government can drastically cut back on what it spends such that it spends money equal to or less than what it takes in in receipts or is somehow able to finance things such that it starts paying down the debt (which would still require major cuts), or 2) the 'means', government raises taxes such that it collects in tax revenue what it spends AND pay down the debt. Right now we aren't doing either.

 

[Sallow]

All that is happening in England, along with most of Europe, is that they are trying to recover from a decade of left wing dishonest handling of their economies.

Spain had a left-wing prime minister and a budget surplus and low debt before the financial crisis. Italy had a right-wing prime minister and a low budget deficit (but high debt) before the crisis. Both countries are in trouble right now, despite being in a very different situation than Greece or even England.

Spain's in trouble almost exclusively because people have decided that Spain is in trouble. There is very little balance sheet problem in Spain relative to other nations - what's killing them is primarily the national equivalent of bank panic.

I get the sneaking suspicion that much of the industrialized world's economic woes are manufactured. Seems to be a screwup in the book keeping coupled with insatiable greed.

 

[ekrem]

The Big Shrink Begins In Britain
The biggest cuts will occur in the army, which will lose 16 percent of their personnel. Thus by the end of the decade the army will be reduced to 84,000 troops. The British Army has not been that small since 1900.

Attrition: The Big Shrink Begins In Britain

 

[8537]

Why is it there are those who presume that living within ones means is impossible and will destroy them?

Who is saying that? It's a question of how you define one's means.

By omission most polticians. Living within your means spending equal to or less than you take in. This isn't subjective bu

Well of course it is. By this definition every family that takes a mortgage is living beyond its means. And people accumulate more debt on top of that! Every company that issues bonds is living beyond their means?

One of two things has to change for the government to objectively live within it's means, it's 'living' and/or its 'means'; 1) the 'living', that is government can drastically cut back on what it spends such that it spends mony equal to or less than what it takes in in receipts or is somehow able to finance things such that it starts paying down the debt (which would still require major cuts), or 2) the 'means', government raises taxes such that it collects in tax revenue what it spends AND pay down the debt. Right now we aren't doing either.

But your just reciting an accounting identity. Countries like Spain aren't collapsing because they took on too much debt.

 

[Moonglow]

Spain had a left-wing prime minister and a budget surplus and low debt before the financial crisis. Italy had a right-wing prime minister and a low budget deficit (but high debt) before the crisis. Both countries are in trouble right now, despite being in a very different situation than Greece or even England.

Spain's in trouble almost exclusively because people have decided that Spain is in trouble. There is very little balance sheet problem in Spain relative to other nations - what's killing them is primarily the national equivalent of bank panic.

Yes.

My point is that Europe is not in trouble because of years of leftist rule. Europe is in trouble because you have many diverse countries with diverse problems and causes of problems trying to unify on under a single system.

Italy is also in a situation that is essentially a bank run. It's in worse fiscal shape and Berlusconi's record has been pretty laughable, but it was nowhere near default until investors started demanding high interest rates.

Italy has a historical problem with their economy.

 

[ekrem]

All that is happening in England, along with most of Europe, is that they are trying to recover from a decade of left wing dishonest handling of their economies.

The crash in Europe happened when most of Europe was governed by "Right / Conservative" Parties. Look at Berlusconi, Sarkozy, Merkel and Karamanlis in Greece.

 

[Bern80]

Well of course it is. By this definition every family that takes a mortgage is living beyond its means. And people accumulate more debt on top of that! Every company that issues bonds is living beyond their means?

Why did you skip over the second part of that? You know the part where is said having debt is not neccessarily living beyond your means?

But your just reciting an accounting identity. Countries like Spain aren't collapsing because they took on too much debt.

Yes I am and yes they are. In terms of their entitlement spending, they are, where we're going to be. France already is going into debt on it's government health care alone.

 

[Ravi]

The Big Shrink Begins In Britain
The biggest cuts will occur in the army, which will lose 16 percent of their personnel. Thus by the end of the decade the army will be reduced to 84,000 troops. The British Army has not been that small since 1900.

Attrition: The Big Shrink Begins In Britain

Pretty soon Ireland will be able to take over.

 

[L.K.Eder]

All that is happening in England, along with most of Europe, is that they are trying to recover from a decade of left wing dishonest handling of their economies.

The crash in Europe happened when most of Europe was governed by "Right / Conservative" Parties. Look at Berlusconi, Sarkozy, Merkel and Karamanlis in Greece.

yeah, and norway has a great credit rating, despite their left wing policies.

maybe there are other factors besides left wing policies.

nah, it must be those leftists.

 

[idb]

The Big Shrink Begins In Britain
The biggest cuts will occur in the army, which will lose 16 percent of their personnel. Thus by the end of the decade the army will be reduced to 84,000 troops. The British Army has not been that small since 1900.

Attrition: The Big Shrink Begins In Britain

Pretty soon Ireland will be able to take over.

More likely a pincer movement from Wales and Scotland...at least they won't need boats.

 

[OODA_Loop]

If public expenditures are a must universal dental is a great place to start, yeah ?

 

[OODA_Loop]

Then the mandatory socialized unfucking of English cuisine is good second.

 

[idb]

Then the mandatory socialized unfucking of English cuisine is good second.

I love fish and chips

 

[8537]

Yes I am and yes they are. In terms of their entitlement spending, they are, where we're going to be. France already is going into debt on it's government health care alone.

SPAIN took on too much debt and are therefore collapsing? Seriously, some cursory research would prove the folly of that claim.

 

[Polk]

Yes I am and yes they are. In terms of their entitlement spending, they are, where we're going to be. France already is going into debt on it's government health care alone.

SPAIN took on too much debt and are therefore collapsing? Seriously, some cursory research would prove the folly of that claim.

You mean Spain wasn't able to predict a collapse in demand? I'm shocked.

 

[Claudette]

Great Britain has dealt things way worse than austerity over the centuries.

The country has always come back strong.

It will again.

 

[California Girl]

All that is happening in England, along with most of Europe, is that they are trying to recover from a decade of left wing dishonest handling of their economies.

The crash in Europe happened when most of Europe was governed by "Right / Conservative" Parties. Look at Berlusconi, Sarkozy, Merkel and Karamanlis in Greece.

 

[California Girl]

Great Britain has dealt things way worse than austerity over the centuries.

The country has always come back strong.

It will again.

Yep.

 

[Bern80]

Yes I am and yes they are. In terms of their entitlement spending, they are, where we're going to be. France already is going into debt on it's government health care alone.

SPAIN took on too much debt and are therefore collapsing? Seriously, some cursory research would prove the folly of that claim.

Umm, no I think it says France up there bud.

 

[8537]

Yes I am and yes they are. In terms of their entitlement spending, they are, where we're going to be. France already is going into debt on it's government health care alone.

SPAIN took on too much debt and are therefore collapsing? Seriously, some cursory research would prove the folly of that claim.

Umm, no I think it says France up there bud.

But France is in much better shape than Spain, Bud. What is causing Spain to collapse?