A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

[Carl in Michigan]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

If I lived there for about a year I might be able to discern what the issues are.
But i don't.
I do know a Black man or Black woman can not jog at night in Uniondale, Hempstead or Roosevelt, NY...3 Black neighborhoods.

There are entire state full of all white towns we can't be caught driving at night in. Drop the white boy bullshit.

Works both ways

I'd be caught DEAD driving through most of Detroit. it's that way in most large cities where blacks are the majority.

That a lie. Whites live in Detroit.

The population of Detroit, MI is 77.3% Black or African American Alone, 10.8% White Alone, and 7.84% Hispanic or Latino

 

[Carl in Michigan]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

If I lived there for about a year I might be able to discern what the issues are.
But i don't.
I do know a Black man or Black woman can not jog at night in Uniondale, Hempstead or Roosevelt, NY...3 Black neighborhoods.

How many inner-cities could a white dude go jogging through safely ?

That is why most of us really dont care too much about this story.

I have no idea if the guy was innocent. May have been, but blacks are FAR safer in white neighborhoods than a white person in a black neighborhood. I wouldn't think of spending a single hour in an all black area.

 

[Eric Arthur Blair]

Funny how about 90 percent of whites who are killed are killed by another white and idiots like this are blind to it.

Why not cite that statistic?

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

Crime. Shooters will be in jail for life.

Very possible. Why not arrested, though?

Good question. Maybe there is more to the story?

 

[Marion Morrison]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

Crime. Shooters will be in jail for life.

Very possible. Why not arrested, though?

Good question. Maybe there is more to the story?

Time may or may not tell.

 

[Dr Grump]

They had a legal reason to stop and question him, according to state law.

I've been banging away on this board for years laughing at American's ridiculous claim that you are the land of the free. Thanks for backing me up on this one, Skippy...

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Why was there a struggle over the shotgun?

Who gives a fuck. What was the shotgun out there for when the man was jogging. Why were they following him? They ain't police.

From another source:

Greg McMichael saw it differently. He would later tell police he recognized Arbery, who was black, from surveillance video that captured a recent burglary in his neighborhood. McMichael, 64, grabbed his .357 Magnum, called out to his son, Travis, and jumped into his pick-up truck in pursuit of Arbery, 25.

They caught up to him a few blocks away and said Arbery became violent when confronted, according to a police report. Two shots were fired by Travis McMichael, 34. Arbery, clad in shorts and a T-shirt, died at the scene

Brunswick shooting death prompts questions, anger

Ahmaud Arbery never stopped training. Dreams of a football career had long ago fizzled, but staying in shape was not an option for the well-sculpted Brunswick native, said a close friend.

www.ajc.com

 

[Muhammed]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

No charges?!

Seems like it was self defense, they white guys wanted to ask him a question, and the black Violently attacked the two guys

Waiting for the jogger to be called a thug.

What if he attacked you?

He didn't attack anyone.

How did you come to that conclusion?

 

[MarathonMike]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

This used to be when the Feds would step in. But that's not going to happen with a mentally ill babyman puppet in the White house being controlled by Steven Miller, the white supremist.

Sure didn't take you long to connect the dots of this tragedy back to President Trump. Chomp Chomp little goldfish.

 

[Muhammed]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

Yeah, "Ahmaud Arbery" sounds like such a Black Christian American name. He was spottin' steel.

Spot it in the daytime and steal it at night. Guess where I heard that? From a black man that knows about 200 more old-time gospel songs than your ass does (If still alive).

Try again, racebait. Why did he not turn on the afterburners and get the hell outta Dodge?

So, guilty until proven innocent....unless you’re white

Why is this a race thing?

You tell me, racetard

The black attacked the whites, i’m not sure how anybody sees anything wrong with this. We have the right to first amendment and we have a right to self-defense with a gun

Your first amendment right doesn’t excuse you from doing stupid shit that lead to somebody’s death. I sure as hell would fight for my life if two yahoos drove up on me pointing guns.

You would fight two guys pointing guns are you?

If I felt threatened and feared for my life? Absolutely.

Here’s the thing — don’t run up on somebody with a gun unless you have a very good reason. You don’t know how somebody is going to react.

They had a legal reason to stop and question him, according to state law.

No they didn't.

Georgia Code Title 17. Criminal Procedure § 17-4-60:

"A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge. If the offense is a felony and the offender is escaping or attempting to escape, a private person may arrest him upon reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion. "

Saying "Come here, I want to talk to you" to someone, isn't arresting them. They were withing their legal right until the jogger tried to disarm them, then it becomes a problem.

You don't think I'd shoot some fool who tried to disarm me?

What offense did he commit? He was jogging so why would he need to escape? There isn't one law that says you have a right to walk up on me with a gun.

Home invasion.. why was he running?

He was jogging idiot.

He was running from the scene of the crime.

 

[flacaltenn]

That story was more vague than a whores morals.

You can't make much of it until you know details, not supposition.

Damn girl -- you're just making too much sense.. Whatcha doin in a place like this anyways?? LOL....

 

[flacaltenn]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

Seems pretty easy to figure out.. The ex-cop that was chasing him CLAIMS he recognized from cam video at several neighborhood break-ins.. Either they HAVE that evidence or they don't.. If he SAW the vids and didn't SAVE THEM -- like an ex-cop should -- then "his bad" and should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law if he's gonna PLAY cop but not follow the procedures..

 

[flacaltenn]

Why was there a struggle over the shotgun?

Who gives a fuck. What was the shotgun out there for when the man was jogging. Why were they following him? They ain't police.

Ex cop claims he saw that man in several neighborhood break-in vids.. Produce the damn vids or get prosecuted... Or get prosecuted if you misidentified him.. See my post above..

 

[flacaltenn]

Update - sort of..,. I think.,. Haven't read the whole thread..

Ahmaud Arbery case: Man killed in Brunswick in February, shooter not arrested

It’s been more than two months since Ahmaud Arbery was shot and killed in a suburban Brunswick, Georgia, neighborhood.

www.actionnewsjax.com

 

[Dr Grump]

Why was there a struggle over the shotgun?

Who gives a fuck. What was the shotgun out there for when the man was jogging. Why were they following him? They ain't police.

Ex cop claims he saw that man in several neighborhood break-in vids.. Produce the damn vids or get prosecuted... Or get prosecuted if you misidentified him.. See my post above..

Er, that's been his whole point. Nobody has produced the vids. Looking like a whitewash.

 

[theHawk]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

What about this?

Man, 22, found guilty of murder and rape of woman killed jogging home in New York

The convicted killer now faces a life prison sentence without parole

www.google.com

 

[Meathead]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

I'm calling for mass protests in Atlanta, DC, Baltimore, NYC, Chicago and St. Louis to protest this unjust killing of a black man! The more people, the better! BLM bro!

 

[Superbadbrutha]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

If I lived there for about a year I might be able to discern what the issues are.
But i don't.
I do know a Black man or Black woman can not jog at night in Uniondale, Hempstead or Roosevelt, NY...3 Black neighborhoods.

How many inner-cities could a white dude go jogging through safely ?

Whites operate in the inner-city everyday and they aren't harmed.

 

[Superbadbrutha]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

What about this?

Man, 22, found guilty of murder and rape of woman killed jogging home in New York

The convicted killer now faces a life prison sentence without parole

www.google.com

View attachment 329921

Found GUILTY AND SENTENCED, these 2 clowns haven't even been CHARGED.

 

[Superbadbrutha]

A black man jogging in an affluent suburban Georgia neighborhood was shot dead by neighbors on February 23, who thought he was a robber, setting off online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling, The New York Times reported.

Ahmaud Arbery was jogging around Brunswick, Georgia, before he was killed in nearby Satilla Shores. Arbery ran by Gregory McMichael who called to his son Travis McMichael before grabbing their .357 magnum revolver and shotgun and followed Arbery in a truck, according to The Times.

"Stop, stop," they shouted at Mr. Arbery, according to The Times, "we want to talk to you."

Gregory McMichael told police he thought Arbery was the suspect in a string of break-ins. Arbery died after being shot twice in after "a struggle over the shotgun," according to The Times.

According to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the elder McMichael, who is a former police officer, was the only source quoted in the police report and that led critics to suspect that "his influence played a role in authorities' decision not to bring charges."

"There's a lot of suspicion of law enforcement down here," Akeem Baker, a friend of Arbery told AJC.

Neither the father nor son have been charged with Arbery's killing.

A 25-year-old black man was shot dead in Georgia while jogging, prompting online protests labeling the incident as racial profiling

So now you can't jog while black.

How is it that you can just grab your gun and chase someone down the block, kill them and then return home for dinner.

Oh that's right there is no more racism in the South anymore.

If I lived there for about a year I might be able to discern what the issues are.
But i don't.
I do know a Black man or Black woman can not jog at night in Uniondale, Hempstead or Roosevelt, NY...3 Black neighborhoods.

How many inner-cities could a white dude go jogging through safely ?

That is why most of us really dont care too much about this story.

I have no idea if the guy was innocent. May have been, but blacks are FAR safer in white neighborhoods than a white person in a black neighborhood. I wouldn't think of spending a single hour in an all black area.

You don't care because the victim is black, it's just another ni..................dead.