A non-political thread on the warming of the planet

[Mac1958]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

 

[there4eyeM]

Given that 'progress' is so misunderstood, there is little hope of constructive discussion. People would have to be capable of considering serious alternatives, and interests vested in the status quo prevent that.

 

[Freewill]

I am not sure if it is because of CC but the first ship was able to cross the artic without an ice breaker this year.

Things tend to grow better and in more places when it is warmer.

Considering that Harvey is the first hurricane to touch land in many years the prediction of massive and more bad weather doesn't seem to be happening.

A few degrees rise will be uncomfortable in parts of the world. A few degree lowing will be deadly in a many parts of the world.

If man has caused the problem to the point that man can reverse it. Then why is it that CO2 concentrations have been much higher in the past when life flourished?

 

[TNHarley]

The climate is changing. Its obvious. Its also obvious it always has. Now, we have compounded thousands of years of knowledge and technology.
We should be focusing on how to take advantage, or adapt, instead of focusing on ridiculous partisan ideas that wont solve anything.

 

[Mac1958]

Given that 'progress' is so misunderstood, there is little hope of constructive discussion. People would have to be capable of considering serious alternatives, and interests vested in the status quo prevent that.

Can't argue, but you would think that SOME people have spent at least a LITTLE time thinking about this.
.

 

[martybegan]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

It would be a question of migration. People would have to move to where the land becomes more arable from where the land becomes less arable.

As for rising sea levels, if they are truly occurring and at a level that can threaten some cities, then they will have to either build sea walls or again, re-locate the lower affected neighborhoods.

 

[Freewill]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

It would be a question of migration. People would have to move to where the land becomes more arable from where the land becomes less arable.

As for rising sea levels, if they are truly occurring and at a level that can threaten some cities, then they will have to either build sea walls or again, re-locate the lower affected neighborhoods.

Adapt or die.

As can we see by Harvey, people in the Midwest will be bailing out those who chose to live by the ocean.

 

[Mac1958]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

It would be a question of migration. People would have to move to where the land becomes more arable from where the land becomes less arable.

As for rising sea levels, if they are truly occurring and at a level that can threaten some cities, then they will have to either build sea walls or again, re-locate the lower affected neighborhoods.

Thanks. I have to admit I was thinking/assuming that people would remain where they are and would have to find ways to deal with it.

I can see migration and technology playing a huge role.
.

 

[TNHarley]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

It would be a question of migration. People would have to move to where the land becomes more arable from where the land becomes less arable.

As for rising sea levels, if they are truly occurring and at a level that can threaten some cities, then they will have to either build sea walls or again, re-locate the lower affected neighborhoods.

Thanks. I have to admit I was thinking/assuming that people would remain where they are and would have to find ways to deal with it.

I can see migration and technology playing a huge role.
.

migration will be key, i think. I think its also possible we could do this without losing knowledge. There is no telling what we have lost when our ancestors had to do things like this and similar..
This could possibly open an entire new continent to search, learn from and thrive on. There is no telling what is under all that ice.

 

[Mac1958]

This could possibly open an entire new continent to search, learn from and thrive on. There is no telling what is under all that ice.

Hey, I think we've just come up with an idea for a sci-fi movie!
.

 

[Freewill]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

It would be a question of migration. People would have to move to where the land becomes more arable from where the land becomes less arable.

As for rising sea levels, if they are truly occurring and at a level that can threaten some cities, then they will have to either build sea walls or again, re-locate the lower affected neighborhoods.

Thanks. I have to admit I was thinking/assuming that people would remain where they are and would have to find ways to deal with it.

I can see migration and technology playing a huge role.
.

migration will be key, i think. I think its also possible we could do this without losing knowledge. There is no telling what we have lost when our ancestors had to do things like this and similar..
This could possibly open an entire new continent to search, learn from and thrive on. There is no telling what is under all that ice.

What is interesting is they are finding stuff, like bodies, that was lost under the ice centuries ago. That to means that the Earth was this warm then or at least the ice sheets were not as large.

 

[TNHarley]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

It would be a question of migration. People would have to move to where the land becomes more arable from where the land becomes less arable.

As for rising sea levels, if they are truly occurring and at a level that can threaten some cities, then they will have to either build sea walls or again, re-locate the lower affected neighborhoods.

Thanks. I have to admit I was thinking/assuming that people would remain where they are and would have to find ways to deal with it.

I can see migration and technology playing a huge role.
.

migration will be key, i think. I think its also possible we could do this without losing knowledge. There is no telling what we have lost when our ancestors had to do things like this and similar..
This could possibly open an entire new continent to search, learn from and thrive on. There is no telling what is under all that ice.

What is interesting is they are finding stuff, like bodies, that was lost under the ice centuries ago. That to means that the Earth was this warm then or at least the ice sheets were not as large.

There is no telling the history of our unsearched lands. Hek, look at TN. We used to be under an ocean. Now look.

 

[JoeB131]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

As usual, you start out with some false premises and expect the rest of us to argue them.

"The planet is warming, for whatever reason."

Okay, the problem with this premise is that the reason why it is warming IS the issue. If it is something humans are doing, we need to knock it off. If it isn't then we have to learn to live with it.

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?

Well, no. If the planet is warming more quickly than life can adapt to that change, then we have a much bigger problem than "Well, we can grow more corn in Canada"

It's not just a matter of changes to the map (Coastal areas where most people live will be flooded, but we will get more land currently under ice). It's that we will see more droughts, more extinctions of species.

Now, we might develop the technology to counter it, but it would probably just be cheaper and better to knock off what we are doing.

 

[Mac1958]

Please don't feed the trolls, folks, this has been interesting so far.

 

[gipper]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

Not possible. AGW is politics.

 

[Mac1958]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

Not possible. AGW is politics.

Well, we've already had some interesting responses.
.

 

[TNHarley]

Now, we might develop the technology to counter it, but it would probably just be cheaper and better to knock off what we are doing.

So, if we stop polluting, natural earth evolution will stop?

 

[Freewill]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

As usual, you start out with some false premises and expect the rest of us to argue them.

"The planet is warming, for whatever reason."

Okay, the problem with this premise is that the reason why it is warming IS the issue. If it is something humans are doing, we need to knock it off. If it isn't then we have to learn to live with it.

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?

Well, no. If the planet is warming more quickly than life can adapt to that change, then we have a much bigger problem than "Well, we can grow more corn in Canada"

It's not just a matter of changes to the map (Coastal areas where most people live will be flooded, but we will get more land currently under ice). It's that we will see more droughts, more extinctions of species.

Now, we might develop the technology to counter it, but it would probably just be cheaper and better to knock off what we are doing.

See that is what mac tried to start a discussion not another thread for your usual rants.

IF you think we need to "knock off what we are doing" the mature response is, what do you think we need to knock off and what would be the effects.

CC is not caused by pollution by any measure.

 

[JoeB131]

Now, we might develop the technology to counter it, but it would probably just be cheaper and better to knock off what we are doing.

So, if we stop polluting, natural earth evolution will stop?

I think that if we stop polluting as much as we are, the natural functions will restore the balance. You see, there are already natural ways to take CO2 out of the atmosphere- Plants, rainfall, the oceans. There are also natural things that put it into the atmosphere, but it normally would balance out.

But you have humans releasing lots of Carbon in a short period of time, the planet can't keep up. That's why we have a problem.

See that is what mac tried to start a discussion not another thread for your usual rants.

Mac is a phony sophist... I treat him as such.

IF you think we need to "knock off what we are doing" the mature response is, what do you think we need to knock off and what would be the effects.

CC is not caused by pollution by any measure.

I think we need to stop burning coal and burn less petroleum.

I think we should also build more nuclear plants. (Sorry, not an environmental hippy. It's the least bad of bad options)

We should require greater fuel efficiency from vehicles and invest more in mass transit.

And we should invest a lot in science and research to find answers. A lot more than we are now.

 

[Mac1958]

Let's (try to) have a discussion that avoids the standard partisan finger-pointing that always pollutes (no pun intended) this topic and instead focuses on the logistics & realities we'll deal with if the planet is actually warming.

So, for the purposes of this thread, let's stipulate to the following:

• The planet is warming, for whatever reason.
• Given the scope and momentum of the warming, it's going to continue warming, as we squabble, and we need to look at how that affects our lives
• We need to look ahead at how the changes can either be mitigated OR how to take advantage of them

So my first question is this: What positives could come from this change? I'm wondering about areas of the planet that might un-freeze and allow for more crops, for example.

Any constructive questions or ideas on how we could deal with this in a positive way?
.

It would be a question of migration. People would have to move to where the land becomes more arable from where the land becomes less arable.

As for rising sea levels, if they are truly occurring and at a level that can threaten some cities, then they will have to either build sea walls or again, re-locate the lower affected neighborhoods.

Thanks. I have to admit I was thinking/assuming that people would remain where they are and would have to find ways to deal with it.

I can see migration and technology playing a huge role.
.

migration will be key, i think. I think its also possible we could do this without losing knowledge. There is no telling what we have lost when our ancestors had to do things like this and similar..
This could possibly open an entire new continent to search, learn from and thrive on. There is no telling what is under all that ice.

What is interesting is they are finding stuff, like bodies, that was lost under the ice centuries ago. That to means that the Earth was this warm then or at least the ice sheets were not as large.

There is no telling the history of our unsearched lands. Hek, look at TN. We used to be under an ocean. Now look.

We'd have to look at the various options for the easiest migration possible, i.e., planning ahead for people to go to the nearest appropriate area rather than letting it happen and later regretting it.

That's a mind-blower. This would involve cooperation (uh oh) between governments.
.