Bakery Owners Refuse to Pay Gay Extortionists

[Syriusly]

Liberals rush in to vilify civil disobedience in 3...2...1...

I have no problem with people using civil disobedience.

If they are willing to go to jail for doing so.

 

[Billy_Kinetta]

The fascist "gag order" is political overreach at its worst.

Did you feel the same way when years before Oregon used the same PA law to fine a business over 300K for refusing to serve a Christian couple?

I do. I believe any business should refuse to be enslaved.

i agree. having to obey the laws against discrimination isn't slavery.

thanks for your input.

Being forced by law to work for someone you choose not to work for is slavery under any definition.

 

[mudwhistle]

Liberals rush in to vilify civil disobedience in 3...2...1...

Oh they can civily disobey all they want. What happens next? Are you saying that Oregon's PA law is unjust?

Yes.

Did you feel the same way when years before Oregon used the same PA law to fine a business over 300K for refusing to serve a Christian couple?

To be honest, I never heard of that.
Actually I would have supported their right to refuse service on religious grounds. Sometimes what is right, feels wrong.
The First Amendment makes it clear that the government should place no limits on anyone's right to practice their religion.
If, for the sake of argument, a Muslim owned business refused service to a Christian based on some tenet of his faith, I would stand behind him.

Kind of like the quote mis-attributed to Voltaire: "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"

Actually, nothing a Christian believes would cause them to refuse service.....so your hypothetical doesn't fit.

But, if the Christians went to a Muslim butcher and demanded 50 lbs of pulled-pork....that's different.

 

[paddymurphy]

Good for them!!

The owners of an Oregon bakery are refusing to pay $135,000 in state-ordered damages to a same-sex couple who were denied service.

Melissa and Aaron Klein, owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, cited religious beliefs when they refused to bake a wedding cake for Laurel and Rachel Bowman-Cryer more than two years ago.

The couple were awarded the damages in July by Labor Commissioner Brad Avakian for emotional suffering, saying the owners had violated the women’s civil rights by discriminating on the basis of their sexual orientation. They were also slapped with a gag order that prohibited them from speaking publicly about their refusal to participate in or bake wedding cakes for same-sex marriages.

Oregon bakery owners refuse to pay damages in gay wedding cake case
​

so they'll be held in contempt and interest will keep accruing. gee, that'll show 'em

Maybe, maybe not. They are planning on fighting this in court. Personally, I have no issue with same sex marriage. But I do have a problem with the excessive fine and the fascist "gag order" in this case.

I also have a problem with a potentially serious conflict of interest that exists.

The Daily Signal has exclusively learned that the government agency responsible for enforcing Oregon’s anti-discrimination law appears to be working closely with a powerful gay rights advocacy group in its case against Aaron and Melissa Klein, owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa.

Communications between the agency, the Oregon Bureau of Labor and Industries, and the LGBT organization, Basic Rights Oregon, raise questions about potential bias in the state’s decision to charge the Kleins with discrimination for refusing to make a cake for a same-sex wedding.

In April, a judge for the agency recommended the Kleins be fined $135,000.

Communications obtained through a public records request show employees of the Oregon Bureau of Labor and Industries—which pursued the case against the Kleins—participating in phone calls, texting, and attending meetings with Basic Rights Oregon, the largest LGBT advocacy group in the state.

Emails Raise Questions About Bias in Sweet Cakes Ruling
​

How is the fine "excessive" when a Christian couple in Oregon got over 100K more for the same kind of business discrimination.

Both fines were excessive. Did the commission issue a "gag order" in the other case too?

They issued no gag order in this case.

 

[TheOldSchool]

I'm gonna take trip to Oregon, find me a gay baker, and have them bake me a wedding cake that says "the religious sacrament of marriage is between a man and a woman". Think I'll get a $135k pay day when they refuse?

Go ahead. No one is stopping you, are they?

Actually written words can be refused by any baker.

 

[paddymurphy]

A court never ordered it. A commission did

Great point. Petty bureaucrooks have no business extorting fines.

Avakian, the left loon that ordered it is a jackass. He looks like a little beady eyed weasel

You do, understand, that the law required that he order the damages? That the law in Oregon, passed by the people's representatives, bans discrimination in public accommodation based on sexual orientation.

He still looks like a beady eyed weasel. Now go away, you'll end up getting all butt hurt and then start your attacks. I'm not in the mood

So, you don't understand that he followed the law. Thought as much. Odd you complaining about attacks when all you can add to this discussion is an attack on the looks of the commissioner.

 

[irosie91]

Good for them!!

The owners of an Oregon bakery are refusing to pay $135,000 in state-ordered damages to a same-sex couple who were denied service.

Melissa and Aaron Klein, owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, cited religious beliefs when they refused to bake a wedding cake for Laurel and Rachel Bowman-Cryer more than two years ago.

The couple were awarded the damages in July by Labor Commissioner Brad Avakian for emotional suffering, saying the owners had violated the women’s civil rights by discriminating on the basis of their sexual orientation. They were also slapped with a gag order that prohibited them from speaking publicly about their refusal to participate in or bake wedding cakes for same-sex marriages.

Oregon bakery owners refuse to pay damages in gay wedding cake case
​

I support their right not to bake the cake if they were asked to write stuff on
it--------such a law suit is STUPID------if a same sex couple wants a cake and
the cake maker does not want to write------HAPPY HOLY WEDDING JANE AND
JILL------then they should buy a cake with no writing on it and get the writing
done by another person or themselves. Suing for a situation that TRIVIAL
is OBSCENE

 

[Billy_Kinetta]

The whole thing is pretty silly.

As a businessman I work for profit. I would never turn down legal money. I'd make a wedding cake for a weirdo and a Cabbage Patch Kid any day of the week.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

A court never ordered it. A commission did

Great point. Petty bureaucrooks have no business extorting fines.

Avakian, the left loon that ordered it is a jackass. He looks like a little beady eyed weasel

You do, understand, that the law required that he order the damages? That the law in Oregon, passed by the people's representatives, bans discrimination in public accommodation based on sexual orientation.

He still looks like a beady eyed weasel. Now go away, you'll end up getting all butt hurt and then start your attacks. I'm not in the mood

So, you don't understand that he followed the law. Thought as much. Odd you complaining about attacks when all you can add to this discussion is an attack on the looks of the commissioner.

Go away....or I shall simply ignore you....it's no loss as you offer nothing of substance

 

[Anathema]

Oh they can civily disobey all they want. What happens next? Are you saying that Oregon's PA law is unjust?

ALL Public Accommodation laws are u just and improper.

 

[paddymurphy]

Great point. Petty bureaucrooks have no business extorting fines.

Avakian, the left loon that ordered it is a jackass. He looks like a little beady eyed weasel

You do, understand, that the law required that he order the damages? That the law in Oregon, passed by the people's representatives, bans discrimination in public accommodation based on sexual orientation.

He still looks like a beady eyed weasel. Now go away, you'll end up getting all butt hurt and then start your attacks. I'm not in the mood

So, you don't understand that he followed the law. Thought as much. Odd you complaining about attacks when all you can add to this discussion is an attack on the looks of the commissioner.

Go away....or I shall simply ignore you....it's no loss as you offer nothing of substance

Right. The fact that he followed the law is not substance but his looks are. Are you getting dumber by the day?

 

[martybegan]

Did you feel the same way when years before Oregon used the same PA law to fine a business over 300K for refusing to serve a Christian couple?

don't be ridiculous. *shakes head*

That's just as dumb as this case.

hi marty. I don't think its silly for a business to be forced not to discriminate. but no one was forcing the bakers to write "I love gay people". they had to bake a cake. that's what was silly about the proposed counter-example.

it's using a neutron bomb to kill a gnat.

PA laws were designed to fight pervasive widespread discrimination that took a whole class of people and made them 2nd class citizens. It wasn't designed to punish people for hurting other people's feelings, and what we have here is nothing but that.

i don't think people who lived through jim crow would agree with you, marty. embarrassing people and forcing them out of your business does the same thing as it did back in the day.

if you go into a service business you can't refuse to serve people for discriminatory reasons. in fact, i'd apply the same standards as i would apply to employment discrimination ..... .you can refuse to serve someone for any reason or no reason but not for a discriminatory/illegal reason.

You can't compare Jim Crow, which WAS systemic, mandated discrimination with a single bakery not wanting to supply a wedding cake for a gay wedding.

So the response to this, by your standard, is ruining people via government action, because you don't like their viewpoints? And spare me the "fairness" crap.

Embarrassment is not harm. If it seems that way, then go grow a freaking spine.

 

[bodecea]

What happens to any person or business who doesn't pay court ordered damages?

They become political prisoners because liberals decided there is no first amendment.

you might want to bone up on what political prisoners are. because that isn't it.

Kim was a political prisoner. So will these people if forced to go to jail too.

No she was not...but we appreciate your drama.

 

[paddymurphy]

Oh they can civily disobey all they want. What happens next? Are you saying that Oregon's PA law is unjust?

ALL Public Accommodation laws are u just and improper.

Right. It is much more just and proper to allow a business to benefit from all of the protections society gives it, for which every member of that society pays, and let that business refuse service to some of those in society.

 

[bodecea]

The fascist "gag order" is political overreach at its worst.

Did you feel the same way when years before Oregon used the same PA law to fine a business over 300K for refusing to serve a Christian couple?

I do. I believe any business should refuse to be enslaved.

And your protests? Where are they? What did you do to show your outrage when that happened?

 

[Dan Daly]

I'm gonna take trip to Oregon, find me a gay baker, and have them bake me a wedding cake that says "the religious sacrament of marriage is between a man and a woman". Think I'll get a $135k pay day when they refuse?

No. Because they are not discriminating against you on the basis of your sexual orientation or for any other reason prohibited by law.

So basically the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment means nothing...certain classes of people get more or less protection under the law.

 

[martybegan]

Did you feel the same way when years before Oregon used the same PA law to fine a business over 300K for refusing to serve a Christian couple?

don't be ridiculous. *shakes head*

That's just as dumb as this case.

And where were the protests? The GoFundMe accounts? The outrage? Who has been working actively to get PA laws appealed in that state?

Some of us have real jobs, not the time to "rabble rabble rabble" that progressives seem to have in spades.

Interesting how you seem to think that the military and being retired military isn't a "real job".

I never said that. Notice I said "progressives".

 

[irosie91]

The whole thing is pretty silly.

As a businessman I work for profit. I would never turn down legal money. I'd make a wedding cake for a weirdo and a Cabbage Patch Kid any day of the week.

---well-----I am referring to ABUSE OF THE PUBLIC LEGAL SYSTEM-----
the "problem" was so easily curable--------by the idiots who brought the
suit-----were I the judge I would have thown the petition in their faces and
yelled----GROW UP---jerks

 

[Ernie S.]

Liberals rush in to vilify civil disobedience in 3...2...1...

Oh they can civily disobey all they want. What happens next? Are you saying that Oregon's PA law is unjust?

Yes.

Did you feel the same way when years before Oregon used the same PA law to fine a business over 300K for refusing to serve a Christian couple?

To be honest, I never heard of that.
Actually I would have supported their right to refuse service on religious grounds. Sometimes what is right, feels wrong.
The First Amendment makes it clear that the government should place no limits on anyone's right to practice their religion.
If, for the sake of argument, a Muslim owned business refused service to a Christian based on some tenet of his faith, I would stand behind him.

Kind of like the quote mis-attributed to Voltaire: "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"

Actually, nothing a Christian believes would cause them to refuse service.....so your hypothetical doesn't fit.

But, if the Christians went to a Muslim butcher and demanded 50 lbs of pulled-pork....that's different.

Not knowing anything about the case, I'm somewhat baffled why anyone would refuse service to a Christian myself. Perhaps we will get a link.

 

[daws101]

Great point. Petty bureaucrooks have no business extorting fines.

Avakian, the left loon that ordered it is a jackass. He looks like a little beady eyed weasel

You should share your picture so we can see what kind of animal YOU look like.

Whatever you do don't share yours...our children may be present

Well yes. I would expect your children might then be disappointed with the genes they were dealt.....since you bring it up. Strictly for comparison, of course.

Our children knew Pope John Paul was canonized

And lots of other useless shit.