Ban Sugary Drinks but Legalize Pot?

[sfcalifornia]

There's no such thing as cannabis "addiction"

OK

1. I AGREE with you we should stick to NATURAL sugars and there is something really unnatural and bad about the PROCESSED sugars (especially the artificial sweeteners) that messes up people's diets, body chemistry, and metabolism. Agree with you there.
But the solution is to revert back to natural sugars which is a consumer and business issue,
not necessarily an issue for govt to regulate.

My friends pushing for all natural sustainable goods pointed out that in some countries, like Denmark I think, the consumers will only buy natural not bleached paper which isn't even sold in stores because they won't buy it. So we need to be that aware and localized if you are going to solve the real problem with people's health and planetary health, instead of depending and waiting on gov to regulate everything which causes the backlash of corporations fighting to deregulate, cheat and bypass whatever laws are passed anyway (such as with dolphin-safe labels that led to cheating because it wasn't even enforceable). Where social and market changes occur because people become educated and make informed choices directly, that level of decisionmaking and influence on consumer and commercial choices CANNOT be manipulated as with govt and politics; so I prefer that level of influencing change which is more direct and lasting, and gives control back to the people of our own policies instead of manipulation of govt or media by corporate or party politics. Are we closer to an understanding on this point? Thanks!

2. As for the addiction, I have friends who have experienced and admit their addictions.
For a couple of friends, who were and are still not Christian, it was very difficult to give up dependence on smoking or addiction that covered up their root problems; but after they went through the spiritual healing prayer to remove the roots of unforgiven issues in their past, then they eventually learned to manage their addictions and gradually wean off them.

So I disagree with you on this.
people in general who use alcohol or pot or other chemicals that alter their brain chemistry in order to "medicate" themselves run into similar problems of distracting themselves from dealing with the root causes in the minds that would have to change INTERNALLY, and also add a level of PHYSICAL and PSYCHOLOGICAL dependence on the chemical usage.

You can get someone off unnatural sugars by switching to other drinks with natural or lower sugars. But getting someone off pot is not so easy. Again I would cite my friends' own testimonies of their personality and relationship disorders and addictions related to the pot-smoking that were not able to be resolved until after they committed to quit the pot.

Sorry but I have never found that soda impairs people's judgments and brains the same way pot does. The issues around pot addiction are hard to deny when I have friends who will testify how much it affected them adversely; and it cannot be compared with sugar addiction.

If I had to think of some disorder related to eating addictions that would be dangerous, clearly more so than pot, I would bring up phobia-related addictions that cost people their lives such as bulimia and anorexia, where the abuse/control issues that these people have, which is expressed as unstoppable "phobia" about gaining weight or getting fat, is on the same spiritual level of addictions of people abusing drugs to cover up their problems or manipulate their impulses. So that is not directly sugar related but it is the addictive disorder driving it that is the root of the danger. With the people who abuse pot or alcohol to manipulate their brain chemistry or moods, they also have underlying issues that are the real problem; and the alcohol/marijuana makes it worse by adding another level of psychological and physical dependency on top of the issues they already weren't resolving.

Sorry but I have too many friends who suffered this to deny there is addiction involved and made worse by adding the chemical manipulation on top which they also get addicted to.

There isn't much difference between sugars whether it is refined sugar, raw sugar, honey or agave syrup. Sugar is sugar. The only difference may be a negligible amount of vitamins and minerals but nothing substantial enough to justify one or the other.

Sugar addiction is very real. Sugar addiction is as bad as any other addiction out there with most people getting hooked at childhood.

 

[Papageorgio]

Over use of anything is bad and can have damaging effects.

The soda size ban is absolutely ridiculous and should not go into law. Government is being overbearing.

Smoking pot is just plain stupid, for anyone to think inhaling smoke into one's lungs can result in a positive, is stupid, you have have to be brain dead to think it otherwise.

All that said, let government legalize pot and tax the hell out of it, just like nuts who smoke tobacco. Let the idiots pay for their stupidity. Make people pay for being just plain stupid.

 

[Pogo]

We'll have to split this in two since there are two different points on which you and I find ourselves in two very different places...

There's no such thing as cannabis "addiction"

OK

1. I AGREE with you we should stick to NATURAL sugars and there is something really unnatural and bad about the PROCESSED sugars (especially the artificial sweeteners) that messes up people's diets, body chemistry, and metabolism. Agree with you there.
But the solution is to revert back to natural sugars which is a consumer and business issue,
not necessarily an issue for govt to regulate.

My friends pushing for all natural sustainable goods pointed out that in some countries, like Denmark I think, the consumers will only buy natural not bleached paper which isn't even sold in stores because they won't buy it. So we need to be that aware and localized if you are going to solve the real problem with people's health and planetary health, instead of depending and waiting on gov to regulate everything which causes the backlash of corporations fighting to deregulate, cheat and bypass whatever laws are passed anyway (such as with dolphin-safe labels that led to cheating because it wasn't even enforceable). Where social and market changes occur because people become educated and make informed choices directly, that level of decisionmaking and influence on consumer and commercial choices CANNOT be manipulated as with govt and politics; so I prefer that level of influencing change which is more direct and lasting, and gives control back to the people of our own policies instead of manipulation of govt or media by corporate or party politics. Are we closer to an understanding on this point? Thanks!

I agree a thousand percent. It's exactly the same point I keep making on the gun culture issue, as here. Motivation by the mores and the social culture in which one lives is always worth more than a thousand attempts to legislate it. So I think consciousness-raising, for lack of a better term, is exactly the right approach.

Good for Denmark, and good for anywhere people look deeply enough into the consequences of their actions. Absolutely no quarrel here; we are of like mind.

2. As for the addiction, I have friends who have experienced and admit their addictions.
For a couple of friends, who were and are still not Christian, it was very difficult to give up dependence on smoking or addiction that covered up their root problems; but after they went through the spiritual healing prayer to remove the roots of unforgiven issues in their past, then they eventually learned to manage their addictions and gradually wean off them.

So I disagree with you on this.
people in general who use alcohol or pot or other chemicals that alter their brain chemistry in order to "medicate" themselves run into similar problems of distracting themselves from dealing with the root causes in the minds that would have to change INTERNALLY, and also add a level of PHYSICAL and PSYCHOLOGICAL dependence on the chemical usage.

You can get someone off unnatural sugars by switching to other drinks with natural or lower sugars. But getting someone off pot is not so easy. Again I would cite my friends' own testimonies of their personality and relationship disorders and addictions related to the pot-smoking that were not able to be resolved until after they committed to quit the pot.

Sorry but I have never found that soda impairs people's judgments and brains the same way pot does. The issues around pot addiction are hard to deny when I have friends who will testify how much it affected them adversely; and it cannot be compared with sugar addiction.

If I had to think of some disorder related to eating addictions that would be dangerous, clearly more so than pot, I would bring up phobia-related addictions that cost people their lives such as bulimia and anorexia, where the abuse/control issues that these people have, which is expressed as unstoppable "phobia" about gaining weight or getting fat, is on the same spiritual level of addictions of people abusing drugs to cover up their problems or manipulate their impulses. So that is not directly sugar related but it is the addictive disorder driving it that is the root of the danger. With the people who abuse pot or alcohol to manipulate their brain chemistry or moods, they also have underlying issues that are the real problem; and the alcohol/marijuana makes it worse by adding another level of psychological and physical dependency on top of the issues they already weren't resolving.

Sorry but I have too many friends who suffered this to deny there is addiction involved and made worse by adding the chemical manipulation on top which they also get addicted to.

I've got several problems with this, first and foremost the idea of "addiction". What I mean by that term, and what I believe it properly means, is something that, when interrupted, causes physical changes. Alcohol and other drugs can surely be addictive under this definition. Cannabis can't. I wholly reject the notion of "psychological addiction" as a BS psychobabble term. Because under that loose definition, anything one likes can be defined as "addiction", and that's just not honest. I might like rice pudding after dinner; I might even make sure I always have it around-- that in no way means I'm "addicted" to rice pudding, because that's not physiologically possible. There's a vast difference between addiction and habit.

And second, whatever one's relationship to cannabis, it's got nothing to do with Christianity. Cannabis exits where Christianity does not. It's irrelevant.

What you go on to describe after this is not addiction but self-discipline (i.e. lack thereof). That's not an addiction. Perhaps it's a fuzzy line for some people but the fact is, if you smoke pot every day and then one day it's gone, there's no physical effect. Other than a hazy hangover gradually going away. Regardless of what that user may desire, there's no physical effect that can only be sated with more marijuana.

Sometimes we use (read: misuse) the word "addiction" as a crutch. An excuse to let ourselves off the hook -- "oh, I can't help it, I'm addicted". Matter of fact I used the exact reverse of this thinking to quit smoking 30 years ago... a friend of mine suggested I think of smoking as a habit rather than an addiction. Once I kept that forefront in my mind, the road became easier-- after all, an addiction is a physical master over a slave, but a habit is a pattern, and patterns can be broken. It worked for me.

So in one sense this boils down to a question of honesty. If these acquaintances speak of "addiction" to cannabis, they're not being honest, and if it's your idea, you're being less than honest in enabling them. Because the scientific fact is there's no such thing. Doesn't exist. Whatever other substances they may add to that, the commonality is their own mental state that makes those substances another object of curiosity.

In truth the only thing cannabis has in common with a truly addictive substance like, say, heroin, is that they're both illegal. That has nothing to do with their nature. It does have everything to do with politics. As does the vast chasm of mythinformation that's been shamelessly sold as propaganda since 1937 (and the fact that we can pinpoint a date just underscores the lack of authenticity therein). But this specious "link" has been, as I said, disproven for decades. Look at the LaGuardia report from 1944, here. And one effect of sharing the underworld is that it puts a harmless natural herb (an herb, not a drug) into the mercantilism of the underworld. That's exactly why proponents of legalization keep pointing out that it undercuts thugs like Mexican drug cartels. By definition they should be dealing in drugs anyway, not cannabis.

The government sold us a pack of lies about cannabis, and the food industry sold us a pack of lies about sugar. Only one of them is actually detrimental to health. Which brings us back to your original point in the OP...

Whether any substance should be banned, or regulated or controlled, is a separate question of political philosophy. If you think no, then neither substance gets controlled, end of story. If you think yes when the public health would be served by such government control, then you can certainly make a case for control of sugar. You cannot make one for cannabis.

Smoking pot can, in a worst case and depending on the user's disposition, lead to indolence, laziness, dearth of critical thought and a withdrawal of ambition. But watching TV does exactly the same thing and we don't ban that. And in any case these are not tendencies that the cannabis or the TV put there; they are tendencies that were already inherent in the user, and the vehicle became the pretext to indulge in them (ultimately that's what both are -- self-indulgence). Because now the user can say "I'm addicted" or "Law and Order is on". Crutches to mask a personal shortcoming.

Sugar, on the other hand, (refined sugar) does what it does to the body involuntarily. It's an autonomic physical reaction of the body to something that is not natural. It isn't addictive either, but its health effects are real, quantifiable, and deadly serious. Ergo your expression of incredulity in the comparison put forth in your OP is, I believe, unwarranted.

Thanks for reading

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

Am I the only person who questions this push to ban sugary drinks while there is a movement to legalize pot?

....When sugary drinks pretty-obviously make you stupid as shit??

​

I see nothing "stupid" about Sarah Palin being credited for
taking on the "good old boy" politics that was corrupting the GOP in her state.
Give credit where credit is due.

Ahahahahaaa.....hahahahaa....'Scuze me. But this is funny. Oh, and it was hilarious when she quit after 18 months, too.

But the socialist thing she pulled when she gave everybody in Alaska a $1200 check so they could afford to buy gas and heating fuel...that was the BEST. Ahahahahahaha

 

[nitroz]

I think new york elected Nanny 911

 

[Harry Dresden]

Am I the only person who questions this push to ban sugary drinks while there is a movement to legalize pot?

....When sugary drinks pretty-obviously make you stupid as shit??​

​

Science is not your strong suit, is it, sweetie. Sugar is the only food the brain accepts.

You should take a course in nutritional science sometime.

Becki.....little kids get way to much Sugar......when i was a little kid there were fat kids on the playground.....but not like there is today....needing something is fine.....but getting way to much is no good....

 

[eagle7_31]

Going after sugar laced drinks, but legalizing pot (and with some maybe more). Going after other tobacco, but legalizing pot.

Something is wrong with this picture.

 

[Meister]

....When sugary drinks pretty-obviously make you stupid as shit??​

​

Science is not your strong suit, is it, sweetie. Sugar is the only food the brain accepts.

You should take a course in nutritional science sometime.

Becki.....little kids get way to much Sugar......when i was a little kid there were fat kids on the playground.....but not like there is today....needing something is fine.....but getting way to much is no good....

Today there is the play stations, xbox, and other technology to keep kids indoors, and not playing outside like when you and I were growing up. Which is it? Lack of exercise or the sugar?

 

[Pogo]

Science is not your strong suit, is it, sweetie. Sugar is the only food the brain accepts.

You should take a course in nutritional science sometime.

Becki.....little kids get way to much Sugar......when i was a little kid there were fat kids on the playground.....but not like there is today....needing something is fine.....but getting way to much is no good....

Today there is the play stations, xbox, and other technology to keep kids indoors, and not playing outside like when you and I were growing up. Which is it? Lack of exercise or the sugar?

Prolly both but more so the sugar, since obesity and diabetes are epidemic among adults as well as kids.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Science is not your strong suit, is it, sweetie. Sugar is the only food the brain accepts.

You should take a course in nutritional science sometime.

Becki.....little kids get way to much Sugar......when i was a little kid there were fat kids on the playground.....but not like there is today....needing something is fine.....but getting way to much is no good....

Today there is the play stations, xbox, and other technology to keep kids indoors, and not playing outside like when you and I were growing up. Which is it? Lack of exercise or the sugar?

since Juvenile Diabetes has increased tremendously since the time we were kids its probably both.....also some schools have either gotten rid of PE or dont have the kids running around for an hour a day....it is to strenuous for the little tykes i guess.....some cereals today are more than 50% sugar ......when i was growing up we had Sugar Frosted Flakes,Sugar Pops,Sugar Smacks and Trix and there might be a few i cant remember.....today go down the Cereal isle and check out how many different Sugar Cereals they have now.....tell me the tykes of today are not being poisoned?....

 

[Pogo]

Becki.....little kids get way to much Sugar......when i was a little kid there were fat kids on the playground.....but not like there is today....needing something is fine.....but getting way to much is no good....

Today there is the play stations, xbox, and other technology to keep kids indoors, and not playing outside like when you and I were growing up. Which is it? Lack of exercise or the sugar?

since Juvenile Diabetes has increased tremendously since the time we were kids its probably both.....also some schools have either gotten rid of PE or dont have the kids running around for an hour a day....it is to strenuous for the little tykes i guess.....some cereals today are more than 50% sugar ......when i was growing up we had Sugar Frosted Flakes,Sugar Pops,Sugar Smacks and Trix and there might be a few i cant remember.....today go down the Cereal isle and check out how many different Sugar Cereals they have now.....tell me the tykes of today are not being poisoned?....

So true, and it's a lot more than cereals. I used to enjoy tomato soup. Can't even buy it any more without ridiculous amounts of sugar. It's been insidiously injected into everything, so much so that you can't even find an alternative product without it. It's enough to make you wish for ....... gummint intervention.

But nooooo, we'd rather lock people up for toking.

It's like ethanol in gasoline. Those who want to sell themselves a story of an alternative biofuel, fine, let 'em have it. Just stop forcing me to use it too. Leave us a choice.

 

[NoNukes]

Becki.....little kids get way to much Sugar......when i was a little kid there were fat kids on the playground.....but not like there is today....needing something is fine.....but getting way to much is no good....

Today there is the play stations, xbox, and other technology to keep kids indoors, and not playing outside like when you and I were growing up. Which is it? Lack of exercise or the sugar?

since Juvenile Diabetes has increased tremendously since the time we were kids its probably both.....also some schools have either gotten rid of PE or dont have the kids running around for an hour a day....it is to strenuous for the little tykes i guess.....some cereals today are more than 50% sugar ......when i was growing up we had Sugar Frosted Flakes,Sugar Pops,Sugar Smacks and Trix and there might be a few i cant remember.....today go down the Cereal isle and check out how many different Sugar Cereals they have now.....tell me the tykes of today are not being poisoned?....

I know so many people who send their kids off to school with a breakfast of cold, sugary cereal instead of a warm breakfast with some protein. This is almost child abuse.

 

[Katzndogz]

A drugged society is an easily manipulated society.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Today there is the play stations, xbox, and other technology to keep kids indoors, and not playing outside like when you and I were growing up. Which is it? Lack of exercise or the sugar?

since Juvenile Diabetes has increased tremendously since the time we were kids its probably both.....also some schools have either gotten rid of PE or dont have the kids running around for an hour a day....it is to strenuous for the little tykes i guess.....some cereals today are more than 50% sugar ......when i was growing up we had Sugar Frosted Flakes,Sugar Pops,Sugar Smacks and Trix and there might be a few i cant remember.....today go down the Cereal isle and check out how many different Sugar Cereals they have now.....tell me the tykes of today are not being poisoned?....

So true, and it's a lot more than cereals. I used to enjoy tomato soup. Can't even buy it any more without ridiculous amounts of sugar. It's been insidiously injected into everything, so much so that you can't even find an alternative product without it. It's enough to make you wish for ....... gummint intervention.

But nooooo, we'd rather lock people up for toking.

It's like ethanol in gasoline. Those who want to sell themselves a story of an alternative biofuel, fine, let 'em have it. Just stop forcing me to use it too. Leave us a choice.

yea but sadly our Govt aint doing shit about it.....and 90% of the food companies aint doing shit about it......and this sugar fix is getting out of control.....there is some form of sugar added to just about everything.....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Today there is the play stations, xbox, and other technology to keep kids indoors, and not playing outside like when you and I were growing up. Which is it? Lack of exercise or the sugar?

since Juvenile Diabetes has increased tremendously since the time we were kids its probably both.....also some schools have either gotten rid of PE or dont have the kids running around for an hour a day....it is to strenuous for the little tykes i guess.....some cereals today are more than 50% sugar ......when i was growing up we had Sugar Frosted Flakes,Sugar Pops,Sugar Smacks and Trix and there might be a few i cant remember.....today go down the Cereal isle and check out how many different Sugar Cereals they have now.....tell me the tykes of today are not being poisoned?....

I know so many people who send their kids off to school with a breakfast of cold, sugary cereal instead of a warm breakfast with some protein. This is almost child abuse.

well its been going on for quite some time.....and those Sugary Cereals can be reduced by 75% of its Sugar and no one would know the difference....

 

[Katzndogz]

Obesity became epidemic when the standards were changed. If the standards were back where they were before the government decided to create more obese people, the number would move back to where they were.

 

[Pogo]

a drugged society is an easily manipulated society.

qed:

obesity became epidemic when the standards were changed. If the standards were back where they were before the government decided to create more obese people, the number would move back to where they were.

 

[Pogo]

Over use of anything is bad and can have damaging effects.

The soda size ban is absolutely ridiculous and should not go into law. Government is being overbearing.

Smoking pot is just plain stupid, for anyone to think inhaling smoke into one's lungs can result in a positive, is stupid, you have have to be brain dead to think it otherwise.

All that said, let government legalize pot and tax the hell out of it, just like nuts who smoke tobacco. Let the idiots pay for their stupidity. Make people pay for being just plain stupid.

Can't help noticing- you pretend to start out evenhanded, and then blast on the one hand government for sugar, but on the other hand the end users for cannabis. Even though there's a million times more gummint regulation on the latter and really nothing on the former. Not a word about the judgement of sugar users, yet cannabis users get "stupid" four times, while all the government gets is an invitation to "tax the hell out of it".

Interesting double standard. And transparent.
Rhetorical air ball.

 

[Papageorgio]

Over use of anything is bad and can have damaging effects.

The soda size ban is absolutely ridiculous and should not go into law. Government is being overbearing.

Smoking pot is just plain stupid, for anyone to think inhaling smoke into one's lungs can result in a positive, is stupid, you have have to be brain dead to think it otherwise.

All that said, let government legalize pot and tax the hell out of it, just like nuts who smoke tobacco. Let the idiots pay for their stupidity. Make people pay for being just plain stupid.

Can't help noticing- you pretend to start out evenhanded, and then blast on the one hand government for sugar, but on the other hand the end users for cannabis. Even though there's a million times more gummint regulation on the latter and really nothing on the former. Not a word about the judgement of sugar users, yet cannabis users get "stupid" four times, while all the government gets is an invitation to "tax the hell out of it".

Interesting double standard. And transparent.
Rhetorical air ball.

Again, the government has no business banning pot, legalize it and tax it.
Government has no business regulating sugar. They can tax refined sugar.
Very consistent.

As far as sugar, you shouldn't put a lot of process crap in your system, that is stupid.
Inhaling smoke into your lungs is stupid.

Not a double standard, more bias, I just think cigarette and pot smokers are disillusioned into thinking that inhaling smoke into your lungs can't be that bad.

 

[Pogo]

Over use of anything is bad and can have damaging effects.

The soda size ban is absolutely ridiculous and should not go into law. Government is being overbearing.

Smoking pot is just plain stupid, for anyone to think inhaling smoke into one's lungs can result in a positive, is stupid, you have have to be brain dead to think it otherwise.

All that said, let government legalize pot and tax the hell out of it, just like nuts who smoke tobacco. Let the idiots pay for their stupidity. Make people pay for being just plain stupid.

Can't help noticing- you pretend to start out evenhanded, and then blast on the one hand government for sugar, but on the other hand the end users for cannabis. Even though there's a million times more gummint regulation on the latter and really nothing on the former. Not a word about the judgement of sugar users, yet cannabis users get "stupid" four times, while all the government gets is an invitation to "tax the hell out of it".

Interesting double standard. And transparent.
Rhetorical air ball.

Again, the government has no business banning pot, legalize it and tax it.
Government has no business regulating sugar.
Very consistent.

As far as sugar, you shouldn't put a lot of process crap in your system, that is stupid.
Inhaling smoke into your lungs is stupid.

Got it, am I clear enough?

Oh you were clear enough the first time. No need for a spin cycle.