"Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts"

[Flopper]

I can't breath with a mask on. I couldn't stand oxygen masks when i WENT in for an operation, I tolerate the mask less than those. I have problems breathing. I'll stay home until whenever. I don't want to live in a world where everyone wears a mask.

Since that Uterus holds a life and removing it would cause it's death.
Not wearing a mask will not cause me to die and even so, I'm an adult able to make my own choices but the child isn't.

A growing body of evidence supports the idea that wearing face masks in public, even when you feel well, can help curb the spread of the coronavirus — since people can spread the virus even without showing symptoms. That's the main reason to wear a mask: to protect other people from you.

However that's not written in stone, it's what the left wishes to believe. While you can find studies and such to show they work, I can find studies that say they don't. It's subjective, just like man made global warming, or the effects of hydroxychloroquine.

Because there is no consensus, then it should be the individuals choice whether to wear a mask or not.

I think there is a huge consensus among just everybody in the healthcare field in regard to mask wearing. Of course it probably does not include your local bartender who is out of work, Sam the Surfer, and my granddaughter that thinks wearing a mask makes her look ugly. And there is a lot evidence coming contact tracing that shows that people that are asymptomatic are spreading the virus.

I read the opposite from the CDC just a few weeks ago. This tells you how everything changes. First a mask was no good, now it's mandated in cities and states across the country. Before asymptomatic people were low risk for spreading, now the risk of spreading is the same.

I think there is a difference between going to a restaurant and going to a doctors office. Doctors are exposed to ill people day in day out. For most of us, we will probably never be around a person with Covid unless you are a socialite, or your business relies on personal contact with people all day long. Although our antibody testing is far from perfected, some are suggesting that we are already in the herd process and there's no stopping it.

The problem with this thing is we've never experienced anything like it; at least with the technology we have today. Who knows......next year at this time, they may be telling us what a waste of time and money it was for us to wear a mask. We simply don't know.

Early on CDC said that masks would not protect you which was true then and is basically true today. Actually, there is a very small amount of protection for the wearer but not much. Herd immunity as defined by the scientist is a calculated estimate based on transmission rate and reproductive numbers for the virus. For this virus herd immunity is 70% of the population having been exposed, that is they have antibodies. That can be off by 10 or 15%. If the scientists definition of herd immunity is used, there should not be much difference in the calculation.

We may not have all the details of a virus but we know a lot about epidemics and how to control them. For example any airborne virus or a virus whose most common transmission is through the air, the key to stopping transmission is preventing the virus from reaching a host. Masks, plastic shields, staying away from the source of virus, staying at home, etc prevents the spread, a really easy to understand concept but pretty hard to implement in a large population.

We also know a lot about a virus based on the characteristics of the family. There are 6 types of coronavirus that can infect humans which includes Mers and SARS. They have many of the same characteristic but there are some differences. It's really fortunate that there was work done developing the SARS vaccine because this gave researchers a starting point in developing the vaccine for this member of the family. Making changes to the vaccine can be very simple. However, every time you change the vaccine you start over in testing. This is why it takes so long to develop a vaccine. The fact that we are willing to accept a vaccine which has is not very effective, 40% makes it more likely we will get one sooner rather later.

It's wishful thinking, but there certainly is no guarantee a vaccine can be developed. We still don't have vaccines for HIV, flu, even the common cold.

If a new vaccine came out and was approved by September, many Americans would be hesitant to take it including myself. It reminds me of when I bought my first computer and read up on it. It was a Dummy's book. The author warned his readers to never buy software 2.0. 2.0 software is the original version. When thousands of people use it problem free in trials, it's different than when you start passing it out to millions of people. That's when they discover the hidden flaws and imperfections. It's why you always wait until version 2.2. or 2.3 to come out. Those are the versions where the flaws have been corrected.

It's the same with new medications. Yes, it undergoes intense testing, but we won't know the results or drawbacks until it's been used on tens of millions of people. Even then, it could take years to find out if it has any long-term negative effects.

Before I take it, I would need 100% guarantee from my doctor that it won't have any harmful effects on me, corroborated by my cousin, who is a retired research doctor that supervised the laboratory where she worked. Until I get that, I may wait for a while if and when a vaccine comes out.

I agree with your assessment of a vaccine with a few exceptions.
We do have a vaccine for the flu. I get one every year. A vaccine to prevent the common cold has been difficult to make, primarily because there are more than 200 different varieties of viruses that can cause colds. Also, if there were such a vaccine, you would have to get a new one every year like the flu vaccine, plus it would probably be not very effective due to the rate these viruses mutate.

The HIV is nothing like the coronations family of viruses. The problem developing a vaccine for HIV lies in genetic makeup of the virus. Unlike coronavirus, HIV has an incredibly fast replication cycle, less than 24 hour. However, the real show stopper is that HIV is prone to frequent replication errors, churning out mutated copies of itself which recombine into new strains as the virus is passed from person to person.

This coronavirus is very similar to SARS which we have developed a vaccine. Also most of the organizations developing vaccines have already proved in the lab that their vaccine kills the virus and is so far harmless to humans. The big question market is how effective the vaccine will be. Typically vaccines like these are 40% to 70% effective. The CDC has implied that a 40% effective vaccine would be acceptable. Think about what this really means. If we are able to produce enough of the vaccine to make it available like the flu vaccine at every primary care doctors office, every pharmacy, hospital, and public health clinic, we might be able to get the same inoculation numbers as the flu vaccine which is 45% of the population by the end of next year. So we might just have have 148 million vaccinated with 40% less chance of getting the virus and the remainder no protection since they were not vaccinated. After a year or so we get more effective vaccines and thus more protection. My guess is we will reach herd immunity about the time of 2024 election.

I don't think we're going see an unemployment rate of less than 5% for at least a year or so and people will dying from coronavirus for many years, hopefully at a greatly reduced rate.

BTW You will never get a 100% guarantee that a vaccine will not harm you. Deaths caused by vaccines are less than 2 per million and in almost all of those cases the person had a compromised immune system or had other conditions. You're probably more likely to get killed by a lightening strike than a vaccine.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I can't breath with a mask on. I couldn't stand oxygen masks when i WENT in for an operation, I tolerate the mask less than those. I have problems breathing. I'll stay home until whenever. I don't want to live in a world where everyone wears a mask.

Since that Uterus holds a life and removing it would cause it's death.
Not wearing a mask will not cause me to die and even so, I'm an adult able to make my own choices but the child isn't.

A growing body of evidence supports the idea that wearing face masks in public, even when you feel well, can help curb the spread of the coronavirus — since people can spread the virus even without showing symptoms. That's the main reason to wear a mask: to protect other people from you.

However that's not written in stone, it's what the left wishes to believe. While you can find studies and such to show they work, I can find studies that say they don't. It's subjective, just like man made global warming, or the effects of hydroxychloroquine.

Because there is no consensus, then it should be the individuals choice whether to wear a mask or not.

I think there is a huge consensus among just everybody in the healthcare field in regard to mask wearing. Of course it probably does not include your local bartender who is out of work, Sam the Surfer, and my granddaughter that thinks wearing a mask makes her look ugly. And there is a lot evidence coming contact tracing that shows that people that are asymptomatic are spreading the virus.

I read the opposite from the CDC just a few weeks ago. This tells you how everything changes. First a mask was no good, now it's mandated in cities and states across the country. Before asymptomatic people were low risk for spreading, now the risk of spreading is the same.

I think there is a difference between going to a restaurant and going to a doctors office. Doctors are exposed to ill people day in day out. For most of us, we will probably never be around a person with Covid unless you are a socialite, or your business relies on personal contact with people all day long. Although our antibody testing is far from perfected, some are suggesting that we are already in the herd process and there's no stopping it.

The problem with this thing is we've never experienced anything like it; at least with the technology we have today. Who knows......next year at this time, they may be telling us what a waste of time and money it was for us to wear a mask. We simply don't know.

Early on CDC said that masks would not protect you which was true then and is basically true today. Actually, there is a very small amount of protection for the wearer but not much. Herd immunity as defined by the scientist is a calculated estimate based on transmission rate and reproductive numbers for the virus. For this virus herd immunity is 70% of the population having been exposed, that is they have antibodies. That can be off by 10 or 15%. If the scientists definition of herd immunity is used, there should not be much difference in the calculation.

We may not have all the details of a virus but we know a lot about epidemics and how to control them. For example any airborne virus or a virus whose most common transmission is through the air, the key to stopping transmission is preventing the virus from reaching a host. Masks, plastic shields, staying away from the source of virus, staying at home, etc prevents the spread, a really easy to understand concept but pretty hard to implement in a large population.

We also know a lot about a virus based on the characteristics of the family. There are 6 types of coronavirus that can infect humans which includes Mers and SARS. They have many of the same characteristic but there are some differences. It's really fortunate that there was work done developing the SARS vaccine because this gave researchers a starting point in developing the vaccine for this member of the family. Making changes to the vaccine can be very simple. However, every time you change the vaccine you start over in testing. This is why it takes so long to develop a vaccine. The fact that we are willing to accept a vaccine which has is not very effective, 40% makes it more likely we will get one sooner rather later.

It's wishful thinking, but there certainly is no guarantee a vaccine can be developed. We still don't have vaccines for HIV, flu, even the common cold.

If a new vaccine came out and was approved by September, many Americans would be hesitant to take it including myself. It reminds me of when I bought my first computer and read up on it. It was a Dummy's book. The author warned his readers to never buy software 2.0. 2.0 software is the original version. When thousands of people use it problem free in trials, it's different than when you start passing it out to millions of people. That's when they discover the hidden flaws and imperfections. It's why you always wait until version 2.2. or 2.3 to come out. Those are the versions where the flaws have been corrected.

It's the same with new medications. Yes, it undergoes intense testing, but we won't know the results or drawbacks until it's been used on tens of millions of people. Even then, it could take years to find out if it has any long-term negative effects.

Before I take it, I would need 100% guarantee from my doctor that it won't have any harmful effects on me, corroborated by my cousin, who is a retired research doctor that supervised the laboratory where she worked. Until I get that, I may wait for a while if and when a vaccine comes out.

I agree with your assessment of a vaccine with a few exceptions.
We do have a vaccine for the flu. I get one every year. A vaccine to prevent the common cold has been difficult to make, primarily because there are more than 200 different varieties of viruses that can cause colds. Also, if there were such a vaccine, you would have to get a new one every year like the flu vaccine, plus it would probably be not very effective due to the rate these viruses mutate.

The HIV is nothing like the coronations family of viruses. The problem developing a vaccine for HIV lies in genetic makeup of the virus. Unlike coronavirus, HIV has an incredibly fast replication cycle, less than 24 hour. However, the real show stopper is that HIV is prone to frequent replication errors, churning out mutated copies of itself which recombine into new strains as the virus is passed from person to person.

This coronavirus is very similar to SARS which we have developed a vaccine. Also most of the organizations developing vaccines have already proved in the lab that their vaccine kills the virus and is so far harmless to humans. The big question market is how effective the vaccine will be. Typically vaccines like these are 40% to 70% effective. The CDC has implied that a 40% effective vaccine would be acceptable. Think about what this really means. If we are able to produce enough of the vaccine to make it available like the flu vaccine at every primary care doctors office, every pharmacy, hospital, and public health clinic, we might be able to get the same inoculation numbers as the flu vaccine which is 45% of the population by the end of next year. So we might just have have 148 million vaccinated with 40% less chance of getting the virus and the remainder no protection since they were not vaccinated. After a year or so we get more effective vaccines and thus more protection. My guess is we will reach herd immunity about the time of 2024 election.

I don't think we're going see an unemployment rate of less than 5% for at least a year or so and people will dying from coronavirus for many years, hopefully at a greatly reduced rate.

BTW You will never get a 100% guarantee that a vaccine will not harm you. Deaths caused by vaccines are less than 2 per million and in almost all of those cases the person had a compromised immune system or had other conditions. You're probably more likely to get killed by a lightening strike than a vaccine.

I happen to be one of those people. I am 60 years old, and one of my two major medical conditions is the number one condition associated with death. It's one of the reasons I'd be so hesitant to take it.

If we (or others) do develop a vaccine for this thing, it should be able to wipe it out. Unlike the flu, it won't mutate so rapidly or differently, if it does at all. Experts have said if it would, then a weaker much less deadly strain would take it's place, unlike the flu. And if it does again, the next strain will be weaker yet.

Plus I think careless people have become more conscious of cleanliness now. You still can't find hand sanitizer or liquid soap in some stores. Fortunately for me, one of my tenants works at a store where they had and abundance of it because of customer limitations. She brought home some sanitizer for me and I was grateful she did. I should have plenty for while, at least until the shelves get fully stocked again. In addition, GoJo, the people who make Purell, are opening up a factory in my suburb. With some luck, they will let the citizens buy direct from them. And thanks to President Trump, there is this:

US bets on small, untested company to deliver COVID vaccine

When precious vats of COVID-19 vaccine are finally ready, jabbing the lifesaving solution into the arms of Americans will require hundreds of millions of injections.

fox8.com

 

[Cecilie1200]

I bet ANYTHING Trump was one of them who was against them, too, just like he is masks.

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

"There was a libertarian streak among resistors," Ralph Nader told Business Insider.

www.businessinsider.com

• A small but vocal minority of people in the US are protesting face-mask mandates.
• In the early 1980s, the public-safety battle was over seat belts. Most Americans didn't use them, and 65% opposed them being enforced by law.
• "There was a libertarian streak among resistors," car-safety pioneer Ralph Nader told Business Insider. "They took the stance that 'you're not going to tie the American people up in seat belts.'"
• More than 50 years after "Unsafe at Any Speed," Nader said, "We are a very hard society to change cognitively.""""

So let's take the politics out of this mask thing and get healthy again!
Protect yourself, protect your friends and take your tip from the scientists and docs!

Ralph Nader was a lying hack, so it's not surprising you'd pick him to try to bolster your argument.

Tell you what, Spanky. You tell me why the entire nation needs to wear face masks in the middle of summer for something that's barely even an epidemic now, let alone a pandemic, and then we'll see. I fail to see why your hypochondria should be my problem.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I can't breath with a mask on. I couldn't stand oxygen masks when i WENT in for an operation, I tolerate the mask less than those. I have problems breathing. I'll stay home until whenever. I don't want to live in a world where everyone wears a mask.

Since that Uterus holds a life and removing it would cause it's death.
Not wearing a mask will not cause me to die and even so, I'm an adult able to make my own choices but the child isn't.

A growing body of evidence supports the idea that wearing face masks in public, even when you feel well, can help curb the spread of the coronavirus — since people can spread the virus even without showing symptoms. That's the main reason to wear a mask: to protect other people from you.

However that's not written in stone, it's what the left wishes to believe. While you can find studies and such to show they work, I can find studies that say they don't. It's subjective, just like man made global warming, or the effects of hydroxychloroquine.

Because there is no consensus, then it should be the individuals choice whether to wear a mask or not.

I think there is a huge consensus among just everybody in the healthcare field in regard to mask wearing. Of course it probably does not include your local bartender who is out of work, Sam the Surfer, and my granddaughter that thinks wearing a mask makes her look ugly. And there is a lot evidence coming contact tracing that shows that people that are asymptomatic are spreading the virus.

I read the opposite from the CDC just a few weeks ago. This tells you how everything changes. First a mask was no good, now it's mandated in cities and states across the country. Before asymptomatic people were low risk for spreading, now the risk of spreading is the same.

I think there is a difference between going to a restaurant and going to a doctors office. Doctors are exposed to ill people day in day out. For most of us, we will probably never be around a person with Covid unless you are a socialite, or your business relies on personal contact with people all day long. Although our antibody testing is far from perfected, some are suggesting that we are already in the herd process and there's no stopping it.

The problem with this thing is we've never experienced anything like it; at least with the technology we have today. Who knows......next year at this time, they may be telling us what a waste of time and money it was for us to wear a mask. We simply don't know.

Early on CDC said that masks would not protect you which was true then and is basically true today. Actually, there is a very small amount of protection for the wearer but not much. Herd immunity as defined by the scientist is a calculated estimate based on transmission rate and reproductive numbers for the virus. For this virus herd immunity is 70% of the population having been exposed, that is they have antibodies. That can be off by 10 or 15%. If the scientists definition of herd immunity is used, there should not be much difference in the calculation.

We may not have all the details of a virus but we know a lot about epidemics and how to control them. For example any airborne virus or a virus whose most common transmission is through the air, the key to stopping transmission is preventing the virus from reaching a host. Masks, plastic shields, staying away from the source of virus, staying at home, etc prevents the spread, a really easy to understand concept but pretty hard to implement in a large population.

We also know a lot about a virus based on the characteristics of the family. There are 6 types of coronavirus that can infect humans which includes Mers and SARS. They have many of the same characteristic but there are some differences. It's really fortunate that there was work done developing the SARS vaccine because this gave researchers a starting point in developing the vaccine for this member of the family. Making changes to the vaccine can be very simple. However, every time you change the vaccine you start over in testing. This is why it takes so long to develop a vaccine. The fact that we are willing to accept a vaccine which has is not very effective, 40% makes it more likely we will get one sooner rather later.

It's wishful thinking, but there certainly is no guarantee a vaccine can be developed. We still don't have vaccines for HIV, flu, even the common cold.

If a new vaccine came out and was approved by September, many Americans would be hesitant to take it including myself. It reminds me of when I bought my first computer and read up on it. It was a Dummy's book. The author warned his readers to never buy software 2.0. 2.0 software is the original version. When thousands of people use it problem free in trials, it's different than when you start passing it out to millions of people. That's when they discover the hidden flaws and imperfections. It's why you always wait until version 2.2. or 2.3 to come out. Those are the versions where the flaws have been corrected.

It's the same with new medications. Yes, it undergoes intense testing, but we won't know the results or drawbacks until it's been used on tens of millions of people. Even then, it could take years to find out if it has any long-term negative effects.

Before I take it, I would need 100% guarantee from my doctor that it won't have any harmful effects on me, corroborated by my cousin, who is a retired research doctor that supervised the laboratory where she worked. Until I get that, I may wait for a while if and when a vaccine comes out.

I agree with your assessment of a vaccine with a few exceptions.
We do have a vaccine for the flu. I get one every year. A vaccine to prevent the common cold has been difficult to make, primarily because there are more than 200 different varieties of viruses that can cause colds. Also, if there were such a vaccine, you would have to get a new one every year like the flu vaccine, plus it would probably be not very effective due to the rate these viruses mutate.

The HIV is nothing like the coronations family of viruses. The problem developing a vaccine for HIV lies in genetic makeup of the virus. Unlike coronavirus, HIV has an incredibly fast replication cycle, less than 24 hour. However, the real show stopper is that HIV is prone to frequent replication errors, churning out mutated copies of itself which recombine into new strains as the virus is passed from person to person.

This coronavirus is very similar to SARS which we have developed a vaccine. Also most of the organizations developing vaccines have already proved in the lab that their vaccine kills the virus and is so far harmless to humans. The big question market is how effective the vaccine will be. Typically vaccines like these are 40% to 70% effective. The CDC has implied that a 40% effective vaccine would be acceptable. Think about what this really means. If we are able to produce enough of the vaccine to make it available like the flu vaccine at every primary care doctors office, every pharmacy, hospital, and public health clinic, we might be able to get the same inoculation numbers as the flu vaccine which is 45% of the population by the end of next year. So we might just have have 148 million vaccinated with 40% less chance of getting the virus and the remainder no protection since they were not vaccinated. After a year or so we get more effective vaccines and thus more protection. My guess is we will reach herd immunity about the time of 2024 election.

I don't think we're going see an unemployment rate of less than 5% for at least a year or so and people will dying from coronavirus for many years, hopefully at a greatly reduced rate.

BTW You will never get a 100% guarantee that a vaccine will not harm you. Deaths caused by vaccines are less than 2 per million and in almost all of those cases the person had a compromised immune system or had other conditions. You're probably more likely to get killed by a lightening strike than a vaccine.

I happen to be one of those people. I am 60 years old, and one of my two major medical conditions is the number one condition associated with death. It's one of the reasons I'd be so hesitant to take it.

If we (or others) do develop a vaccine for this thing, it should be able to wipe it out. Unlike the flu, it won't mutate so rapidly or differently, if it does at all. Experts have said if it would, then a weaker much less deadly strain would take it's place, unlike the flu. And if it does again, the next strain will be weaker yet.

Plus I think careless people have become more conscious of cleanliness now. You still can't find hand sanitizer or liquid soap in some stores. Fortunately for me, one of my tenants works at a store where they had and abundance of it because of customer limitations. She brought home some sanitizer for me and I was grateful she did. I should have plenty for while, at least until the shelves get fully stocked again. In addition, GoJo, the people who make Purell, are opening up a factory in my suburb. With some luck, they will let the citizens buy direct from them. And thanks to President Trump, there is this:

US bets on small, untested company to deliver COVID vaccine

When precious vats of COVID-19 vaccine are finally ready, jabbing the lifesaving solution into the arms of Americans will require hundreds of millions of injections.

fox8.com

The owner of my company has a friend with a micro-brewery. The friend converted his brewery to producing hand sanitizer at the beginning of this whole fiasco, and hooked our company up with boxes full of bottled hand sanitizer. Smells pretty good, too.

 

[Cecilie1200]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

Everyone? Not hardly. Be a bit more of a drama queen, can you?

 

[Cecilie1200]

I bet ANYTHING Trump was one of them who was against them, too, just like he is masks.

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

"There was a libertarian streak among resistors," Ralph Nader told Business Insider.

www.businessinsider.com

• A small but vocal minority of people in the US are protesting face-mask mandates.
• In the early 1980s, the public-safety battle was over seat belts. Most Americans didn't use them, and 65% opposed them being enforced by law.
• "There was a libertarian streak among resistors," car-safety pioneer Ralph Nader told Business Insider. "They took the stance that 'you're not going to tie the American people up in seat belts.'"
• More than 50 years after "Unsafe at Any Speed," Nader said, "We are a very hard society to change cognitively.""""

So let's take the politics out of this mask thing and get healthy again!
Protect yourself, protect your friends and take your tip from the scientists and docs!

Driving a car is not a Constitutional right, you blithering idiot.

Nor is going to work or the store without a mask on you fucking retard.

I can choose not to go to a store, and if my employer mandates it that is his right.

The Govt has no authority to force people to wear a mask, idiot.

Unfortunately it's not quite THAT simple.

They CAN force you to wear a mask on all gov't owned property, like courthouses, DMV's, even roads and bridges. But NOT private homes, businesses, etc.

I don't think Nostra is objecting to them making rules on the property they actually control, any more than he's objecting to a business owner insisting on masks in his business. I think it's forcing you to do it elsewhere.

 

[Cecilie1200]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

There is really no evidence to prove that. It was only a few months ago where we were told wearing a mask isn't going to solve anything.

I do wear a mask because it was advised to me by my care givers. But it is my option as it should be with any American. Covid cases are up because we have more testing ability now, and because it's summer, more people are exposed to each other. However the death rate didn't grow.

See, YOU have a good reason for asking me to wear a mask around you, and I would have no problem complying with that. Agit, on the other hand, has no good reason beyond, "You're a bad person if you don't give me my way!" and that makes me want to tell him to fuck off.

 

[buttercup]

I bet ANYTHING Trump was one of them who was against them, too, just like he is masks.

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

"There was a libertarian streak among resistors," Ralph Nader told Business Insider.

www.businessinsider.com

• A small but vocal minority of people in the US are protesting face-mask mandates.
• In the early 1980s, the public-safety battle was over seat belts. Most Americans didn't use them, and 65% opposed them being enforced by law.
• "There was a libertarian streak among resistors," car-safety pioneer Ralph Nader told Business Insider. "They took the stance that 'you're not going to tie the American people up in seat belts.'"
• More than 50 years after "Unsafe at Any Speed," Nader said, "We are a very hard society to change cognitively.""""

So let's take the politics out of this mask thing and get healthy again!
Protect yourself, protect your friends and take your tip from the scientists and docs!

This very well could be the dumbest thread of the year. And that's quite an accomplishment on USMB!

And no, I'm not a Trump supporter. I'm just sick of useful idiots who regurgitate whatever propaganda their mainstream talking heads spoon-feed them.

 

[Agit8r]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

Everyone? Not hardly. Be a bit more of a drama queen, can you?

More Than 20 Percent Of People At Risk For Severe COVID Due To Underlying Medical Conditions - KFF Health News

About 1.7 billion people fall into that vulnerable category. While the numbers can be startling, it also allows doctors to pinpoint those patients who are at the highest risk for having a negative, or even fatal, outcome once infected. In other scientific news: mutations, demographics and longevity.

khn.org

So if you encountered 50 people with you not taking any precautions and them wearing a mask, you potentially killed or seriously injured 7 of them. Is that precise enough for you?

 

[Cecilie1200]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

There is really no evidence to prove that. It was only a few months ago where we were told wearing a mask isn't going to solve anything.

I do wear a mask because it was advised to me by my care givers. But it is my option as it should be with any American. Covid cases are up because we have more testing ability now, and because it's summer, more people are exposed to each other. However the death rate didn't grow.

the death rate has decreased because treatments have improved. Antibody therapy and corticosteroids have been saving lives. It isn't clear for how long though, because many of those who got seriously ill now have potentially long term lingering affects. So the final death toll attributable to this outbreak may not ever be fully tallied, or even known.

And no, cases are up mostly in the states that didn't get hit as hard by the first wave. Mostly in the Sun Belt.

The death rate has decreased because treatments have improved, AND because the age of the people largely being infected now has gone down. Also, people who are vulnerable have learned to protect themselves better. So it IS pretty clear "for how long", unless the elderly and sickly are going to give up on self-isolating and social distancing all of a sudden.

The final death toll probably will never be known, for the simple reason that leftists have been cooking the books this whole time, and adding in deaths that didn't belong in the category.

 

[Agit8r]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

There is really no evidence to prove that. It was only a few months ago where we were told wearing a mask isn't going to solve anything.

I do wear a mask because it was advised to me by my care givers. But it is my option as it should be with any American. Covid cases are up because we have more testing ability now, and because it's summer, more people are exposed to each other. However the death rate didn't grow.

the death rate has decreased because treatments have improved. Antibody therapy and corticosteroids have been saving lives. It isn't clear for how long though, because many of those who got seriously ill now have potentially long term lingering affects. So the final death toll attributable to this outbreak may not ever be fully tallied, or even known.

And no, cases are up mostly in the states that didn't get hit as hard by the first wave. Mostly in the Sun Belt.

The death rate has decreased because treatments have improved, AND because the age of the people largely being infected now has gone down. Also, people who are vulnerable have learned to protect themselves better. So it IS pretty clear "for how long", unless the elderly and sickly are going to give up on self-isolating and social distancing all of a sudden.

The final death toll probably will never be known, for the simple reason that leftists have been cooking the books this whole time, and adding in deaths that didn't belong in the category.

Ok, Lemming

 

[Cecilie1200]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

Everyone? Not hardly. Be a bit more of a drama queen, can you?

More Than 20 Percent Of People At Risk For Severe COVID Due To Underlying Medical Conditions - KFF Health News

About 1.7 billion people fall into that vulnerable category. While the numbers can be startling, it also allows doctors to pinpoint those patients who are at the highest risk for having a negative, or even fatal, outcome once infected. In other scientific news: mutations, demographics and longevity.

khn.org

View attachment 361831

So if you encountered 50 people with you not taking any precautions and them wearing a mask, you potentially killed or seriously injured 7 of them. Is that precise enough for you?

"Look, I found someone who said what I wanted to hear! Now, accept that I'm right, and answer these questions based on accepting that."

Fuck you, pal. Five minutes ago, you didn't give a rat's fat, furry ass about Covid infections while you were busy focusing on "It's really okay to riot and loot and burn for the causes I like!" But now that THAT little bit of fun is over, you want to swing back to your previous agenda. Piss off.

 

[Cecilie1200]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

There is really no evidence to prove that. It was only a few months ago where we were told wearing a mask isn't going to solve anything.

I do wear a mask because it was advised to me by my care givers. But it is my option as it should be with any American. Covid cases are up because we have more testing ability now, and because it's summer, more people are exposed to each other. However the death rate didn't grow.

the death rate has decreased because treatments have improved. Antibody therapy and corticosteroids have been saving lives. It isn't clear for how long though, because many of those who got seriously ill now have potentially long term lingering affects. So the final death toll attributable to this outbreak may not ever be fully tallied, or even known.

And no, cases are up mostly in the states that didn't get hit as hard by the first wave. Mostly in the Sun Belt.

The death rate has decreased because treatments have improved, AND because the age of the people largely being infected now has gone down. Also, people who are vulnerable have learned to protect themselves better. So it IS pretty clear "for how long", unless the elderly and sickly are going to give up on self-isolating and social distancing all of a sudden.

The final death toll probably will never be known, for the simple reason that leftists have been cooking the books this whole time, and adding in deaths that didn't belong in the category.

Ok, Lemming

Oh, noes!!! Mr. Fainting Couch doesn't think I'm smart because I'm not echoing the propaganda his masters have told him is "what smart people think"! HOWEVER shall I live without the approval of someone I wouldn't piss on if he were on fire?!

Do you need some smelling salts for that attack of the vapors?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

There is really no evidence to prove that. It was only a few months ago where we were told wearing a mask isn't going to solve anything.

I do wear a mask because it was advised to me by my care givers. But it is my option as it should be with any American. Covid cases are up because we have more testing ability now, and because it's summer, more people are exposed to each other. However the death rate didn't grow.

See, YOU have a good reason for asking me to wear a mask around you, and I would have no problem complying with that. Agit, on the other hand, has no good reason beyond, "You're a bad person if you don't give me my way!" and that makes me want to tell him to fuck off.

Not really. I have no objection to you not wearing a mask. You're an American, you do what you think is best for you. My job is to worry about myself.

We still have people in stores or other public places with no mask on. Recently, our so-called Republican Governor Mike DeRINO, instituted a mask mandate, but it's not going to solve anything in my opinion.

When it comes to people who are wearing masks, I have seen some of them rubbing their eyes in the store, or touching their nose. Masks won't do any good if you are a person not taking associated precautions.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I bet ANYTHING Trump was one of them who was against them, too, just like he is masks.

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

"There was a libertarian streak among resistors," Ralph Nader told Business Insider.

www.businessinsider.com

• A small but vocal minority of people in the US are protesting face-mask mandates.
• In the early 1980s, the public-safety battle was over seat belts. Most Americans didn't use them, and 65% opposed them being enforced by law.
• "There was a libertarian streak among resistors," car-safety pioneer Ralph Nader told Business Insider. "They took the stance that 'you're not going to tie the American people up in seat belts.'"
• More than 50 years after "Unsafe at Any Speed," Nader said, "We are a very hard society to change cognitively.""""

So let's take the politics out of this mask thing and get healthy again!
Protect yourself, protect your friends and take your tip from the scientists and docs!

all your doing is proving youre more of a fascist than trump,,,

And all you're doing is proving him right. Not just seat belts, but motor cycle helmets, bicycle helmets.

Tell me, when you have sex, do you wear a condom to protect yourself from disease, or do you stand on your right to go bareback? If yes, when did you start doing that? Before AIDS or after?

Are you aware that condoms are only the "smart" thing to do during sex if you're a slut who fucks around? Personally, I go the REAL smart route, and only have sex with my husband of 25 years. And no, you don't want to make the snotty remark about him that you're thinking will be a clever put-down. Back away from it very carefully.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I bet ANYTHING Trump was one of them who was against them, too, just like he is masks.

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

"There was a libertarian streak among resistors," Ralph Nader told Business Insider.

www.businessinsider.com

• A small but vocal minority of people in the US are protesting face-mask mandates.
• In the early 1980s, the public-safety battle was over seat belts. Most Americans didn't use them, and 65% opposed them being enforced by law.
• "There was a libertarian streak among resistors," car-safety pioneer Ralph Nader told Business Insider. "They took the stance that 'you're not going to tie the American people up in seat belts.'"
• More than 50 years after "Unsafe at Any Speed," Nader said, "We are a very hard society to change cognitively.""""

So let's take the politics out of this mask thing and get healthy again!
Protect yourself, protect your friends and take your tip from the scientists and docs!

Driving a car is not a Constitutional right, you blithering idiot.

Nor is going to work or the store without a mask on you fucking retard.

No law has been passed in the house and signed into law requiring you to wear a mask. It's an edict that overrides personal freedom.

Not yet. You are not personally free to infect someone else with a potentially dangerous disease you fucking retard.

Im personally free to walk around without a mask. There is no law requiring that I wear a mask. I give people their space but I will not wear a mask.

I've said it before. I wear them when I go into businesses with signs up saying they require them. I do it out of respect for the business. I wear them when I'm going to be around people who have expressed health concerns, also out of courtesy. But the absolute instant I step outside of the business or away from that acquaintance, that stupid mask is GONE. It's hard enough to breathe in a Phoenix summer without suffocating myself just to please a bunch of hypochondriac leftist sheep.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I bet ANYTHING Trump was one of them who was against them, too, just like he is masks.

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

"There was a libertarian streak among resistors," Ralph Nader told Business Insider.

www.businessinsider.com

• A small but vocal minority of people in the US are protesting face-mask mandates.
• In the early 1980s, the public-safety battle was over seat belts. Most Americans didn't use them, and 65% opposed them being enforced by law.
• "There was a libertarian streak among resistors," car-safety pioneer Ralph Nader told Business Insider. "They took the stance that 'you're not going to tie the American people up in seat belts.'"
• More than 50 years after "Unsafe at Any Speed," Nader said, "We are a very hard society to change cognitively.""""

So let's take the politics out of this mask thing and get healthy again!
Protect yourself, protect your friends and take your tip from the scientists and docs!

all your doing is proving youre more of a fascist than trump,,,

And all you're doing is proving him right. Not just seat belts, but motor cycle helmets, bicycle helmets.

Tell me, when you have sex, do you wear a condom to protect yourself from disease, or do you stand on your right to go bareback? If yes, when did you start doing that? Before AIDS or after?

The intentions of our founders were never government mandating what we do for our own protection. They left that up to us. We "should" wear motorcycle helmets, bicycle helmets, seat belts.......yet when we strap on a gun for the protection of ourselves and others, you on the left have a heart attack stating were are prepared for something that will never likely happen to us.

Of course, the leftists themselves make it MORE likely to happen to us, as witness their beloved riots.

 

[Cecilie1200]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

There is really no evidence to prove that. It was only a few months ago where we were told wearing a mask isn't going to solve anything.

I do wear a mask because it was advised to me by my care givers. But it is my option as it should be with any American. Covid cases are up because we have more testing ability now, and because it's summer, more people are exposed to each other. However the death rate didn't grow.

See, YOU have a good reason for asking me to wear a mask around you, and I would have no problem complying with that. Agit, on the other hand, has no good reason beyond, "You're a bad person if you don't give me my way!" and that makes me want to tell him to fuck off.

Not really. I have no objection to you not wearing a mask. You're an American, you do what you think is best for you. My job is to worry about myself.

We still have people in stores or other public places with no mask on. Recently, our so-called Republican Governor Mike DeRINO, instituted a mask mandate, but it's not going to solve anything in my opinion.

When it comes to people who are wearing masks, I have seen some of them rubbing their eyes in the store, or touching their nose. Masks won't do any good if you are a person not taking associated precautions.

Masks are mandated around here, at least if you're going to be indoors somewhere other than your house. I've mentioned this before. Literally half the people I see in stores are wearing the masks carefully tucked under their noses, "to allow them to still breathe easily". *eye roll* They might as well just wear them around their waists as a belt.

I wear them around people who have valid health concerns. And I wear them in businesses, because they have every right to make the rules on their property, and I know they really have no choice but to comply with the mandate. They're all having enough trouble right now, without me making their day more difficult. But the absolute instant I step outside their store, that stupid mask is outta here. Anyone who wants to get pissy at me for not wearing it on the sidewalk had better have packed an extra ass, for after I kick their primary one.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

There is actually a fundamental difference here. Seatbelts have a minimal effect on those who are not the person wearing the seatbelt and their dependence.

The people refusing to wear masks are putting everyone--but especially medical professional--at risk of death or lifelong disability. They are acting with depraved indifference.

There is really no evidence to prove that. It was only a few months ago where we were told wearing a mask isn't going to solve anything.

I do wear a mask because it was advised to me by my care givers. But it is my option as it should be with any American. Covid cases are up because we have more testing ability now, and because it's summer, more people are exposed to each other. However the death rate didn't grow.

See, YOU have a good reason for asking me to wear a mask around you, and I would have no problem complying with that. Agit, on the other hand, has no good reason beyond, "You're a bad person if you don't give me my way!" and that makes me want to tell him to fuck off.

Not really. I have no objection to you not wearing a mask. You're an American, you do what you think is best for you. My job is to worry about myself.

We still have people in stores or other public places with no mask on. Recently, our so-called Republican Governor Mike DeRINO, instituted a mask mandate, but it's not going to solve anything in my opinion.

When it comes to people who are wearing masks, I have seen some of them rubbing their eyes in the store, or touching their nose. Masks won't do any good if you are a person not taking associated precautions.

Masks are mandated around here, at least if you're going to be indoors somewhere other than your house. I've mentioned this before. Literally half the people I see in stores are wearing the masks carefully tucked under their noses, "to allow them to still breathe easily". *eye roll* They might as well just wear them around their waists as a belt.

I wear them around people who have valid health concerns. And I wear them in businesses, because they have every right to make the rules on their property, and I know they really have no choice but to comply with the mandate. They're all having enough trouble right now, without me making their day more difficult. But the absolute instant I step outside their store, that stupid mask is outta here. Anyone who wants to get pissy at me for not wearing it on the sidewalk had better have packed an extra ass, for after I kick their primary one.

Agreed. I get such a kick out of people when I see them in their car or jogging on the sidewalk all alone wearing the stupid mask. I feel like saying "You do know why you're wearing that, don't you?" I try to find comedy in most anything.

I can't tell you or expect you to wear a mask on my account. Whatever God's plans for me are, nobody will be able to change. My hair looks like all hell, I really need serious dental work, but I'm staying home as much as possible, and only go out to help my mother, drive her somewhere, help my father, or do necessary shopping. That's what I'm doing to protect myself.

I seriously doubt that anybody will catch this virus outside unless you are standing right next to a person that has this virus and no wind that day. I think we are getting too carried away with all this and even too protective at times. I've seen one person who was wearing the face shield along with the mask.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

I bet ANYTHING Trump was one of them who was against them, too, just like he is masks.

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

Before face masks, Americans went to war against seat belts

"There was a libertarian streak among resistors," Ralph Nader told Business Insider.

www.businessinsider.com

• A small but vocal minority of people in the US are protesting face-mask mandates.
• In the early 1980s, the public-safety battle was over seat belts. Most Americans didn't use them, and 65% opposed them being enforced by law.
• "There was a libertarian streak among resistors," car-safety pioneer Ralph Nader told Business Insider. "They took the stance that 'you're not going to tie the American people up in seat belts.'"
• More than 50 years after "Unsafe at Any Speed," Nader said, "We are a very hard society to change cognitively.""""

So let's take the politics out of this mask thing and get healthy again!
Protect yourself, protect your friends and take your tip from the scientists and docs!

Driving a car is not a Constitutional right, you blithering idiot.

Nor is going to work or the store without a mask on you fucking retard.

No law has been passed in the house and signed into law requiring you to wear a mask. It's an edict that overrides personal freedom.

Not yet. You are not personally free to infect someone else with a potentially dangerous disease you fucking retard.

Im personally free to walk around without a mask. There is no law requiring that I wear a mask. I give people their space but I will not wear a mask.

I've said it before. I wear them when I go into businesses with signs up saying they require them. I do it out of respect for the business. I wear them when I'm going to be around people who have expressed health concerns, also out of courtesy. But the absolute instant I step outside of the business or away from that acquaintance, that stupid mask is GONE. It's hard enough to breathe in a Phoenix summer without suffocating myself just to please a bunch of hypochondriac leftist sheep.

I respect that. If the business that I frequent asks, I'll abide and, like you, it comes off when Im out the door.