Better to lean Libertarian

[Doubletap]

The Repubs & Dems are just 2 gangs fighting over the same territory-the control over one's life & property (earnings). They differ only in degree. Both want big government.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

How do you know small government cannot work, do you have empirical data on the subject?

 

[Steven_R]

I tend to favor small government and fewer regulations. Where I have issues with e-Libertarians is in the notion that no government is somehow preferable to overmanaging government. There are simply too many historical examples of unrestrained business doing unethical things to assume that the Free Market will somehow police itself. An unrestricted marketplace is just as horrific as unrestricted top down regulations and laws.

Beyond that, e-Libertarians tend to think long dead philosophers and economists have all the answers and spout their catch phrases with the greatest of ease without ever thinking about the real life applications. Open borders and isolationism are great in theory, but importing unlimited third worlders with no skills hasn't really worked in our favor as anyone living in the Southwest can attest. Isolationism was put to bed after WW2 for good reason.

Libertarianism works great on paper, but so does Communism and whatever political system we have in DC now. Unfortunately on paper just doesn't work in reality. I have great sympathy towards the libertarian stance, but I do think there is a happy medium between what they want and what the big state types want. Neither side has the complete answer.

 

[bripat9643]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

Small government works better than big government every time for the simple reason that government doesn't work, period.

 

[Old Rocks]

Problem is the libertarians are long on ideology, and short on history.

 

[Old Rocks]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

Small government works better than big government every time for the simple reason that government doesn't work, period.

Hey, dumb fuck, does the water come out of your fawcets when you turn them on? Unless you have your own well, that is government. The railroads were thrown across this continent because of government. Ditto the Corp of Discovery that blazed the path for the pioneers that settled the West Coast. Our food is far safer because of government regulations on it, the CDC has done much to prevent the kind of disease outbreaks that used to happen on a regular basis.

People like you spewing idiocy like that demostrate how incredibly stupid some people truly are.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

Problem is the libertarians are long on ideology, and short on history.

History? Son, let me show you some "history" of big government; it is guaranteed that all Big Governments will eventually go through this phase.

Pol Pott had kids be taught that family and religion were not needed and that they should love the communist party instead.

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[Steven_R]

Can we also show the free market success stories like the conditions of coal mines and miners before 1933 or child labor or snake oil salesmen or contaminated food or factory fires? Government sucks. Wall Street sucks. The only way to keep any of it in line is with checks and balances and for some reason the Libertarian thinks power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely, but people are some how immune to being assholes if they have a ledger in front of them instead of a law book.

 

[Pete7469]

The Repubs & Dems are just 2 gangs fighting over the same territory-the control over one's life & property (earnings). They differ only in degree. Both want big government.

True, but people in the republican camp should be at least more inclined to adopt pro-constitutional libertarian ideas.

That way they can at least promote their moral legislation at the state/local levels.

The democrook collectivist parasites must be defeated, and it will take a combined effort of those who just want a moral nanny state run with a lower cost, and those of us who don't need the nanny.

 

[bripat9643]

Problem is the libertarians are long on ideology, and short on history.

We are only short on the bogus history the left has invented.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

Can we also show the free market success stories like the conditions of coal mines and miners before 1933 or child labor or snake oil salesmen or contaminated food or factory fires? Government sucks. Wall Street sucks. The only way to keep any of it in line is with checks and balances and for some reason the Libertarian thinks power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely, but people are some how immune to being assholes if they have a ledger in front of them instead of a law book.

I was under the impression that the Progressive T.R and Woodrow Wilson were in power long before 1933.

No, the fucking problem was 1913, when we created the Federal Reserve, the Progressive Holy Grail (unlimited fiat funding for their shit)

It's like someone drew the equation y = a^x on the damn fucking graph, with 1913 as the origin of that graph.

 

[Pete7469]

Can we also show the free market success stories like the conditions of coal mines and miners before 1933 or child labor or snake oil salesmen or contaminated food or factory fires? Government sucks. Wall Street sucks. The only way to keep any of it in line is with checks and balances and for some reason the Libertarian thinks power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely, but people are some how immune to being assholes if they have a ledger in front of them instead of a law book.

You're confusing libertarians with anarchists. Libertarians understand the need for restrained regulations. The thing about giving government power to regulate too much is because it can be used by corrupt people.

Centralizing the power of regulation so that some tool in DC can dictate to the entire country gives one man too much power , and too little accountability. At the state level it's much easier to contain the beast since it's head is so much closer to the ground.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I tend to favor small government and fewer regulations. Where I have issues with e-Libertarians is in the notion that no government is somehow preferable to overmanaging government. There are simply too many historical examples of unrestrained business doing unethical things to assume that the Free Market will somehow police itself. An unrestricted marketplace is just as horrific as unrestricted top down regulations and laws.

Beyond that, e-Libertarians tend to think long dead philosophers and economists have all the answers and spout their catch phrases with the greatest of ease without ever thinking about the real life applications. Open borders and isolationism are great in theory, but importing unlimited third worlders with no skills hasn't really worked in our favor as anyone living in the Southwest can attest. Isolationism was put to bed after WW2 for good reason.

Libertarianism works great on paper, but so does Communism and whatever political system we have in DC now. Unfortunately on paper just doesn't work in reality. I have great sympathy towards the libertarian stance, but I do think there is a happy medium between what they want and what the big state types want. Neither side has the complete answer.

Are they examples of "unrestrained" businesses doing unethical things, or are they actually examples of businesses with government granted privileges doing unethical things? An important distinction.

"Isolationism" was put to bed long before WWII, and there's a case to be made that that fact led to WWII.

Communism doesn't work great on paper. On paper it still fails on the basis that without prices there is no way to rationally allocate resources, and would thus inevitably collapse.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

Small government works better than big government every time for the simple reason that government doesn't work, period.

Hey, dumb fuck, does the water come out of your fawcets when you turn them on? Unless you have your own well, that is government. The railroads were thrown across this continent because of government. Ditto the Corp of Discovery that blazed the path for the pioneers that settled the West Coast. Our food is far safer because of government regulations on it, the CDC has done much to prevent the kind of disease outbreaks that used to happen on a regular basis.

People like you spewing idiocy like that demostrate how incredibly stupid some people truly are.

James J. Hill would disagree that railroads needed government to cross the country, and don't forget the corruption and bankruptcies that went along with the government subsidized railroads.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

And you claim to be a conservative?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

 

[JakeStarkey]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

Small government works better than big government every time for the simple reason that government doesn't work, period.

And we see that your argument is not working.

 

[bripat9643]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

Small government works better than big government every time for the simple reason that government doesn't work, period.

And we see that your argument is not working.

It's not an "argument." It's a simple fact. Government fucks up everything it touches. Obama's entire sorry Administration is proof of that.

 

[Crackerjaxon]

Both are statist, yes, in an age when small government cannot work at the national and state levels.

Tough that, liberts.

Small government works better than big government every time for the simple reason that government doesn't work, period.

Hey, dumb fuck, does the water come out of your fawcets when you turn them on? Unless you have your own well, that is government. The railroads were thrown across this continent because of government. Ditto the Corp of Discovery that blazed the path for the pioneers that settled the West Coast. Our food is far safer because of government regulations on it, the CDC has done much to prevent the kind of disease outbreaks that used to happen on a regular basis.

People like you spewing idiocy like that demostrate how incredibly stupid some people truly are.

Since land grants were good, welfare is good. Since libraries are good, socialized medicine is good.

I could go on.

The bigger government becomes, the more the potential for abuse increases.

Note, too, that all the "good" things you sometimes mistakenly allude to as government happened under a much smaller government.

Oh, and learn how to spell faucet. Farrah is not on the radar any more.

 

[National Socialist]

Ya ever wonder why libertardinism is pushed by rich assholes like the Koch Brothers? Because they can exploit the workers easier under tiny government than they can under what we have now...Libertarianism is just capitalism on caffeine...it would be absolutely horrific.