George Zimmerman's bloody head

[KissMy]

What I infer from the commentary, is that blood at the crime scene is where the basis of this inconstancy lies.

That's pretty important, wouldn't you say?

How would the location of GZ head striking the ground be "pretty important" for the prosecution?

If GZ head was pounded on the grass, it means that TM was slamming his head with even greater force to cause the marks in the photo. This will help the defense IMHO. It will also show just how disoriented GZ was due to his head being pounded.

Zimmerman was NOT disoriented minutes later, he was able to walk unaided, be interviewed and did not even get checked out at a hospital. It looks as though Zimmerman could not have been in fear of his life actually. How can the defense turn these boo boos into fear of deadly force?

Boxers get knocked to the ground disoriented all the time. It takes many up to 10 seconds just to get back on their feet. They are then good enough to continue the fight & still not go to the hospital. I have been completly knocked out a couple of times & was fine 30 seconds later. Never even went to the doctor.

The punch that broke GZ nose must have knocked him out for a second in order for him to fall to the ground from it.

You GZ haters bias has been exposed.

Zimmerman following Martin is enough to make Martin fear for his life.

BUT

Martin punching Zimmerman breaking his nose knocking him to the ground, pounding his head on the ground is not enough for Zimmerman to fear for his life.

BIAS MUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Peach]

It's open to possibilities. It could have been on the tree, even as he was standing up (and knowing he had to show an injury, quick) - it could have been self-inflicted with his flashlight, (to me, it was curious as to why they brought that flashlight up)-- it could have been found a number of places.

These are just meandering postulations, of course. Until we see exactly what is "not consistent with the evidence we found" regarding the story he gave police.

"The injuries are consistent with a harder object striking the back of his head than his head was" leaves many possibilities, and I do believe the prosecution was beiing careful with not showing their hand right now, but enough to give us an indication it wasn't the concrete sidewalk.

The fact remains he never lost consciousness, was walking minutes later, the police felt no need to get him to a hospital, and he was able to be interviewed for HOURS. The cut on the head might have been him falling after he shot Trayvon Martin. The shooter appears much better right after the killing than a man who had been in fear of his life; in fact he appears calm, and at first, from reports, standing over the body, PROUD. Almost like a hunter who has bagged his prey............................

You're out of your fucking mind.

You are claiming he didn't walk unassisted, and was not questioned for HOURS after the killing? Where does THIS come from? HE TESTIFIED just yesterday, and remembered what he was thinking: HINT, that equals CAPACITY.

 

[dilloduck]

It must have been Martin's blood.

nah latest theory is that it was self inflicted.

that still reqiures a wound.

yes----and GZ has one. What's your point?

 

[Truthseeker420]

nah latest theory is that it was self inflicted.

that still reqiures a wound.

yes----and GZ has one. What's your point?

I didn't see one.

 

[rdean]

Class!!!..... Class!!!..... Pay attention now Class!!!!!.......

Trails of blood going in two directions not affected by gravity? Seen better on Halloween.

 

[dilloduck]

Class!!!..... Class!!!..... Pay attention now Class!!!!!.......

Trails of blood going in two directions not affected by gravity? Seen better on Halloween.

centrifugal force--don't you know shit about science?

 

[KissMy]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wW9TIduSV8"]Boxing Knock Down First Punch[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zl_kE8U-gys"]100 One Punch Knockouts[/ame]

 

[Peach]

Note also; Zimmerman's testimony in Court also showed a clear memory of events. He stated what he was thinking at the time, not "I CAN'T REMEMBER". I do not see any of the facts helping with self defense, outside of possible grass stains on the back of his jacket, and the unseen blood on his clothes. He looked neat, clean, and not disheveled when going into the station.

Are you pretending there is no head wound at all now ?

A wound was present, it did not require hospital treatment to check for a concussion, and it did prevent him from walking unassisted, nor the police from questioning him that night. FEAR OF DEADLY force will require more than, "I hurt my head". The idea the police had a change of clothes available is ABSURD. He was neat, clean, and ambulatory when he reached the police station; get a grasp on reality. This wasn't the Shootout at the OK Corral; an armed teenager was shot by a free lance WANNABE cop.

 

[toomuchtime_]

How would the location of GZ head striking the ground be "pretty important" for the prosecution?

If GZ head was pounded on the grass, it means that TM was slamming his head with even greater force to cause the marks in the photo. This will help the defense IMHO. It will also show just how disoriented GZ was due to his head being pounded.

Zimmerman was NOT disoriented minutes later, he was able to walk unaided, be interviewed and did not even get checked out at a hospital. It looks as though Zimmerman could not have been in fear of his life actually. How can the defense turn these boo boos into fear of deadly force?

Boxers get knocked to the ground disoriented all the time. It takes many up to 10 seconds just to get back on their feet. They are then good enough to continue the fight & still not go to the hospital. I have been completly knocked out a couple of times & was fine 30 seconds later. Never even went to the doctor.

The punch that broke GZ nose must have knocked him out for a second in order for him to fall to the ground from it.

You GZ haters bias has been exposed.

Zimmerman following Martin is enough to make Martin fear for his life.

BUT

Martin punching Zimmerman breaking his nose knocking him to the ground, pounding his head on the ground is not enough for Zimmerman to fear for his life.

BIAS MUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just because I like to argue.

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

 

[dilloduck]

Note also; Zimmerman's testimony in Court also showed a clear memory of events. He stated what he was thinking at the time, not "I CAN'T REMEMBER". I do not see any of the facts helping with self defense, outside of possible grass stains on the back of his jacket, and the unseen blood on his clothes. He looked neat, clean, and not disheveled when going into the station.

Are you pretending there is no head wound at all now ?

A wound was present, it did not require hospital treatment to check for a concussion, and it did prevent him from walking unassisted, nor the police from questioning him that night. FEAR OF DEADLY force will require more than, "I hurt my head". The idea the police had a change of clothes available is ABSURD. He was neat, clean, and ambulatory when he reached the police station; get a grasp on reality. This wasn't the Shootout at the OK Corral; an armed teenager was shot by a free lance WANNABE cop.

Fear of deadly force doesn't even require an injury.
Peach schnapps ? put it away.

 

[dilloduck]

Zimmerman was NOT disoriented minutes later, he was able to walk unaided, be interviewed and did not even get checked out at a hospital. It looks as though Zimmerman could not have been in fear of his life actually. How can the defense turn these boo boos into fear of deadly force?

Boxers get knocked to the ground disoriented all the time. It takes many up to 10 seconds just to get back on their feet. They are then good enough to continue the fight & still not go to the hospital. I have been completly knocked out a couple of times & was fine 30 seconds later. Never even went to the doctor.

The punch that broke GZ nose must have knocked him out for a second in order for him to fall to the ground from it.

You GZ haters bias has been exposed.

Zimmerman following Martin is enough to make Martin fear for his life.

BUT

Martin punching Zimmerman breaking his nose knocking him to the ground, pounding his head on the ground is not enough for Zimmerman to fear for his life.

BIAS MUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just because I like to argue.

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Then by all means---bring it on. If we can get passed the race baiting and the poor little black kid we might have a fair trial.

 

[Peach]

Zimmerman was NOT disoriented minutes later, he was able to walk unaided, be interviewed and did not even get checked out at a hospital. It looks as though Zimmerman could not have been in fear of his life actually. How can the defense turn these boo boos into fear of deadly force?

Boxers get knocked to the ground disoriented all the time. It takes many up to 10 seconds just to get back on their feet. They are then good enough to continue the fight & still not go to the hospital. I have been completly knocked out a couple of times & was fine 30 seconds later. Never even went to the doctor.

The punch that broke GZ nose must have knocked him out for a second in order for him to fall to the ground from it.

You GZ haters bias has been exposed.

Zimmerman following Martin is enough to make Martin fear for his life.

BUT

Martin punching Zimmerman breaking his nose knocking him to the ground, pounding his head on the ground is not enough for Zimmerman to fear for his life.

BIAS MUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just because I like to argue.

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Zimmerman, the failed police trainee, had guns & ammo but never a chance to use them LIKE a police officer, until that night. Probably spent a lot of time target shooting......then he sees his chance to "save" the community from PERCEIVED danger.....................and an unarmed teen paid for it with his LIFE.

 

[Ariux]

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Trayvon's ho didn't say anything about Trayvon saying Zimmerman had a gun. All the evidence is against the hypothetical situation you suggest. However, there is evidence that Trayvon intended to intimidate Zimmerman, and then later assaulted him.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Boxers get knocked to the ground disoriented all the time. It takes many up to 10 seconds just to get back on their feet. They are then good enough to continue the fight & still not go to the hospital. I have been completly knocked out a couple of times & was fine 30 seconds later. Never even went to the doctor.

The punch that broke GZ nose must have knocked him out for a second in order for him to fall to the ground from it.

You GZ haters bias has been exposed.

Zimmerman following Martin is enough to make Martin fear for his life.

BUT

Martin punching Zimmerman breaking his nose knocking him to the ground, pounding his head on the ground is not enough for Zimmerman to fear for his life.

BIAS MUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just because I like to argue.

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Zimmerman, the failed police trainee, had guns & ammo but never a chance to use them LIKE a police officer, until that night. Probably spent a lot of time target shooting......then he sees his chance to "save" the community from PERCEIVED danger.....................and an unarmed teen paid for it with his LIFE.

That was a TV movie,wasn't it?

 

[dilloduck]

Just because I like to argue.

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Zimmerman, the failed police trainee, had guns & ammo but never a chance to use them LIKE a police officer, until that night. Probably spent a lot of time target shooting......then he sees his chance to "save" the community from PERCEIVED danger.....................and an unarmed teen paid for it with his LIFE.

That was a TV movie,wasn't it?

no--just Peach schnapps drama.

 

[KissMy]

Just because I like to argue.

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Florida Statutes 776.041 - Use of force by aggressor. - The justification described in the preceding sections of this chapter is not available to a person who:

(1) Is attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of, a forcible felony; or

(2) Initially provokes the use of force against himself or herself, unless:

- (a) Such force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant; or

- (b) In good faith, the person withdraws from physical contact with the assailant and indicates clearly to the assailant that he or she desires to withdraw and terminate the use of force, but the assailant continues or resumes the use of force.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Trayvon's ho didn't say anything about Trayvon saying Zimmerman had a gun. All the evidence is against the hypothetical situation you suggest. However, there is evidence that Trayvon intended to intimidate Zimmerman, and then later assaulted him.

The evidence seems to support Zimmerman's account, but suppose the prosecutor can find some one in whom Zimmerman confided that he was sick to death of these punks getting away with all these burglaries and if he ever got the chance to talk to one of them he would scare him straight, or something to that effect. It might just have been loose talk, but it could also provide a basis for claiming Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to intimidate him.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Just because I like to argue.

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Florida Statutes 776.041 - Use of force by aggressor. - The justification described in the preceding sections of this chapter is not available to a person who:

(1) Is attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of, a forcible felony; or

(2) Initially provokes the use of force against himself or herself, unless:

- (a) Such force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant; or

- (b) In good faith, the person withdraws from physical contact with the assailant and indicates clearly to the assailant that he or she desires to withdraw and terminate the use of force, but the assailant continues or resumes the use of force.

Yes, but if Zimmerman's actions constituted a felony, it's a whole new ballgame. If you kill some one in the course of committing a felony, even accidentally, you've committed murder.

 

[dilloduck]

Just because I like to argue.

Suppose the prosecutor can find evidence that Zimmerman followed Martin with the intent to do him some harm, not kill him but intimidate him with threatening words or actions, such as flashing his gun - such actions could rise to the level of a felony - then regardless of the circumstances at the moment the shot was fired, Zimmerman would have killed Martin in the course of committing a felony and be guilty of murder.

Florida Statutes 776.041 - Use of force by aggressor. - The justification described in the preceding sections of this chapter is not available to a person who:

(1) Is attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of, a forcible felony; or

(2) Initially provokes the use of force against himself or herself, unless:

- (a) Such force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant; or

- (b) In good faith, the person withdraws from physical contact with the assailant and indicates clearly to the assailant that he or she desires to withdraw and terminate the use of force, but the assailant continues or resumes the use of force.

Yes, but if Zimmerman's actions constituted a felony, it's a whole new ballgame. If you kill some one in the course of committing a felony, even accidentally, you've committed murder.

If Zimmerman's actions constitute a felony they will have to disband every neighborhood watch in the country.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I didn't say Zimmerman didn't have a right to defend himself, what is true is that under Florida Law (Statute 776.041) **IF** Zimmerman was the aggressor and was found to be in the commission of a forcible felony, then Zimmerman would not qualify under the Self Defense statutes from immunity from prosecution and a determination of justifiable homicide. A subtle but important distinction.

Probably too subtle for some. The statute you are trying to use to defend your argument would only apply if Zimmerman was committing a felony, or trying to feel from the site of a felony, and Martin was trying to stop him.

In other words, it doesn't apply to this situation, but thanks for letting me know that I am not talking to an actual lawyer.

This case will be argued under Florida law, not Wisconsin law and I've noted the applicable statutes under Florida Law (776.041) which specifically notes that self defense IS NOT a defense when certain conditions apply and I noted them.

No you didn't, you just think you did.

I didn't say that the State didn't have a burden of proof to show the conditions existed which nullifies the affirmative defense of - well - self defense.

I was simply pointing out that under Florida law there are certain conditions were if you are identified as the aggressor and the hostilities escalate to the point where you - as the aggressor - fear of imminent death or great bodily harm, that you are not exempt from prosecution under the guise of "Self Defense" if someone uses force in return because you have created a situation where the non-aggressor fears death or great bodily harm.


Sorry, that's Florida Law.

>>>>

It might be Florida law, but it doesn't apply here, and doesn't help the state at all. If the law you are trying to apply here actually applied Zimmerman would be facing the death penalty and multiple charges.

He isn't.

That, sir, is Florida law.